Categories
antifeminism cassie jaye men who should not ever be with women ever MRA oppressed men red pill sexual harassment

Cassie Jaye tells Vocativ she was stalked by an MRA she interviewed for her Red Pill doc

The story of Cassie Jaye and her Red Pill documentary gets curiouser and curiouser. In an interview with Tracy Clark-Flory of Vocativ she admits that she’s actually a bit scared of the MRAs whose cause she now seems to be championing.

As Clark-Flory puts it:

It turns out Jaye understands fear of MRAs. “I luckily moved recently,” she said toward the end of our nearly three-hour-long conversation, explaining that some of the men she interviewed had her home address. “I was really glad to move.”

Indeed, Jaye told Clark-Flory that during the course of her interviews one of her subjects evidently became smitten with her, and, in classic MRA style, treated her to numerous late-night phone calls of an apparently amorous nature.

On nearly a dozen occasions, she received calls in the middle of the night from one of her MRA subjects. (There were multiple emails, too.) Jaye implied that her repeat caller had on the mind what one might charitably call romance … .

She acknowledges to Clark-Flory that with her film “kind of being funded by men’s rights advocates,” she worries a little bit about what they might do if her final product is not to their liking.

“I think any bad seeds would probably want to see the film first before taking me down,” she said with a laugh. What if they do see the film and view it as unfavorable, though? “I guess I could go into hiding,” Jaye said.

But she apparently isn’t too worried that her new MRA fans and financial backers won’t like her film.

“Do I want to have any kind of allegiance to them to make sure I’m not harmed in the end?” She paused, the question lingering, and then explained that her video diaries show her reacting negatively to the MRAs, but that those clips were part of her early “evolution” on the subject. “I think that protects me from people wanting to attack what I said then,” she said.

The implication seemingly being that the position she ultimately came to would not make MRAs angry with her. “I think it’ll be OK,” she said.

You can read the full piece here, and I really suggest that you do. Because WTF.

In related news, the Red Pill lawyer and juice salesman who apparently bought himself an Associate Producer credit for The Red Pill with a $10,000 donation is bragging that he “cuckolded” Seth Rogan … on Twitter. By which I mean not that he’s boasting about this on Twitter, but that he thinks he actually did the cuckolding on Twitter.

Subscribe
Notify of
guest

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.

187 Comments
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
freemage
4 years ago

Honestly, I think she’s going to have problems even if she is totally complimentary to her subjects. The Manosphere is notoriously fractious, as David has documented on many occasions. Hell, even Elam and the RedPill subreddit despise one another. And these folks often take the attitude that the friend of my enemy is my enemy. If she comes off as too fawning over AVfM, I fully expect the Reddit scum to go after her, and vice versa.

BVH
BVH
4 years ago

@AAAtheist

My thoughts exactly.

The other thing that occurs to me is how good of a journalist/documentarian can she be if she’s not checking what she’s been told against readily available information? It’s one thing for a random naive fair-minded feminist to be flimflammed by these people. But Cassie is supposed to know what she’s doing and expect someone to TRY to trick her, then practice due diligence to catch them if they do. And it makes a great doco too.

It’s so weird that she’s afraid of what might happen if MRAs don’t like her documentary.

That is weird. If i didn’t know better I’d think she was in on a con. But I couldn’t find anything implying Cassie is anything else than what she claims to be. Assuming she’s on the level, my guess is that she’s being set up. But no end game I can extrapolate makes sense. Can’t do MRA “logic”.

BVH
BVH
4 years ago

Exactly. It reminds me of what Errol Morris said about his documentary about Fred Leuchter, the Holocaust denier; usually Morris is big on the “just let them talk” method, but he realized that he needed to have experts in the documentary to take apart Leuchter’s sophistries.

Except in this case CJ doesn’t appear to be aware she needs an expert and with Brietbart funding, she very unlikely to do it even if it does occur to her.

i hope she doesn’t turn out to be a Tea Party Zombie Sleeper…..that what her “I was a feminist too, but now i see the light” story sounded like at first.

Bina
Bina
4 years ago

Ugh. My last post looks like I bulldozed right over Autosoma, who showed up in distress while I was still composing. Sorry about that. Hope you’re okay over there. If you want to talk, I’m listening!

autosoma
4 years ago

hey ej, bina & verily

I’ve been having a Barney with my wife over some difficult issues, money, drinkm her narcissistic abusive parents and she crashed me by accusing me of gaslighting. I’ve made many many mistakes in my time, I’ve always held myself accountable, but when the gas light thing popped up, I found myself thinking of all the MTGOW things that gave been talked about here, and for one small moment I thought “yeh!” why not.

sibce I wrote it I’ve throttled back and thought “Auto don’t be like that”

Lady Mondegreen
Lady Mondegreen
4 years ago

The fact that women live longer than men has nothing to do with society or any imagined misandry. Females live longer than males in many species: it’s biology.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-women-live-longer/

(It’s funny to me how manospherians, eager to claim male–and therefor personal–superiority, tell each other men are the stronger sex because muscle strength but ignore other markers, like the fact that women survive extreme emotional and physical stress in greater numbers than men, and live longer overall.)

Anyway. It sounds like Jaye’s just a shallow thinker. She sure doesn’t know how to evaluate evidence.

Catalpa
Catalpa
4 years ago

I’m honestly quite worried about Jaye. She’s waded too far and too deep into this pool and now she’s trying to write off the glimpses of the hordes of piranhas she’s seeing around her as totally harmless fish of some other kind, no, really, they’re totally fine. Everything’s going to be fine.

I don’t think that the MRAs are actually capable of being 100% satisfied with whatever she’s going to produce; the manosphere has a lot of hatred between factions and portraying one favorably will make enemies of the others. And if she somehow manages to avoid that, just showing one of the interview subjects stating one of the manosphere’s more repugnant beliefs (which is most of them, really) will end up making them look bad in front of the world and they will of course blame Jaye for daring to publish it instead of the dude who actually said and believed it. She is going to REALLY need an exit strategy for when this all blows up in her face.

I think her best option right now would probably be to bail ASAP and hope the manosphere gets distracted by another chew toy soon.

anon
anon
4 years ago

When this documentary comes out we should watch it with a morse code book open.

That way we can check to see if she’s blinking for help.

Lady Mondegreen
Lady Mondegreen
4 years ago

“I found myself thinking of all the MTGOW things that gave been talked about here, and for one small moment I thought “yeh!” why not.”

Maybe you need some time alone to sort things out? That doesn’t have to mean “All women are poopyheads and I’m retiring to the hills to kvetch endlessly online with my fellow Oppressed Brethren.” 🙂

Take care. I hope things work out for the best.

autosoma
4 years ago

mrs autosoma has a pretty bad alcohol problem and it manifests itself with those kind of “perception” issues that go along with drinking too much. Now I’m not a brilliant fella by any strech of the imagination but we had one of those weirf arguments where I ended up thinking “OMG what am I like”

Bina
Bina
4 years ago

I’ve been having a Barney with my wife over some difficult issues, money, drinkm her narcissistic abusive parents and she crashed me by accusing me of gaslighting. I’ve made many many mistakes in my time, I’ve always held myself accountable, but when the gas light thing popped up, I found myself thinking of all the MTGOW things that gave been talked about here, and for one small moment I thought “yeh!” why not.

sibce I wrote it I’ve throttled back and thought “Auto don’t be like that”

Well, that’s a relief. I was worried there.

And yeah. Sadly, people with drinking problems do have a funny way of blaming others/projecting onto others what they are doing themselves. I know, because I had a boyfriend like that. And my sister divorced a guy like that, too. When the booze is talking, the person has some very “off” perceptions of others, especially those who are trying to help them get a grip on their drinking problem. Sadly, they won’t acknowledge the problem until they hit bottom. And any attempt to intervene will be read as “you’re all against me!”

Chiomara
Chiomara
4 years ago

How dubious she FORCES herself to sound is ridiculous. It’s like everything published about her is a click bait headline.
No woman with her head more or less in place would ever be impressed by an argument such as “so what that we rule the world? Women live slightly longer”. My guess is, and I place all my bets on that, she is a *DUN-DUN-DUUUUUUUN* con-artist, who is ripping them off, while trying to get some out of feminists too, by remaining ambiguous. But a REAL con artist, not one like *DUN DUN DUUUUUN* Sarkeesian “is”.

Judas Peckerwood
Judas Peckerwood
4 years ago

Not sure how accurate that Vocativ piece is, but Cassie Jaye sure does come off as gullible and none too bright.

Nathan Hevenstone
4 years ago

So I didn’t know about this at all. Looked into it and… I’m legitimately afraid for her.

This will end very, very badly. If she’s overly-fawning of one MRA faction, she’ll get harassed by all the other factions. If she backs out entirely, she’ll be harassed. If they sniff a hint of criticism, she’ll be harassed.

Really, no one should be making a documentary of these people. It’s dangerous.

I really really hope it turns out okay for her… but I’m not expecting it to…

Oh dear this is bad…

Kestrel
Kestrel
4 years ago

@autosama – Internet hugs if you want them.

AnAndrejaPejicBlog (@A_Pejic_Blog)

@weirwoodtreehugger

This abstract goes into the connection between sex chromosomes and lifespan a bit:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2688912/

In short, it looks like having two of the same sex chromosomes (like, say, XX) leads to a longer life than having two different sex chromosomes.

Monzach
Monzach
4 years ago

@autosoma

I hope things get better for you and the missus. Sounds like things are going pretty bad right now, but I’m sure they will get better in a little while. It can’t be easy for either one of you. I’d just urge you to remember the things about your wife that made you fall in love with her. She’s still that person underneath the alcohol talking. I’m sorry to hear that you’re going through a rough patch, I really am. I’d be more than happy to lend a sympathetic male ear, if you need one.

@The OP

It’s really sounding to me like Cassie Jaye has bitten off more than she can chew, as it were. I’m sure that her intentions were good when she started this project, but she has gone too deep, too fast. I just hope that whatever her project turns out to be, that she’s safe and in a good place. I’d also hope that she’s proud of the work that she’s done for the film, as it can’t have been an easy task, all in all.

mockingbird
mockingbird
4 years ago

re: sex differences in lifespan: Isn’t there also something about testosterone being generally hard on the body?
^ Not a biologist

@autosoma – That sucks about her drinking issues.

Haven’t you said something about having had moved yourself away from drinking, etc?

Maybe she’s panicking a bit. Like, you’re bettering yourself, extricating yourself from toxic behaviors, and she sees herself stuck in old patterns.

I can imagine that might be scary – the thought of potentially loosing someone you love as they move forward while you’re standing still.

If that’s the case, might be why she’s lashing out. That doesn’t make her actions any more right, constructive, or healthy, but I know it’d be easier for me to feel compassion for someone who’s acting from a place of love (even if that love’s being warped by pain and fear, twisted into a posture of protection) than someone who’s just acting out of bald malice.

Either way, take care.

If you feel better hashing it out with a bloke, there seem to be a good bunch of guys here offering an ear.

Alice
Alice
4 years ago

I read the original article and it really stood out to me where she said that men live a shorter lifespan so it’s reasonable that they be paid more. This is interesting because the retirement age is the same for both sexes, so really that means that women need the money earned during their career to last 7 years longer than men. So working with that logic women should earn more than men, not less.

Also ethnic men (and women) tend to live a shorter life and earn less than their white counterparts, is this fair? Is the men’s rights movement championing the plight of the black man? Cos i’m pretty sure that the feminist movement is.

I agree with a lot of (some of) their causes, the problem is that they’re all things that the feminist movement already stands for in a more inclusive fashion. The MRA is really just a twisted form of feminism, filtering out the bits that don’t specifically help them personally.

Alice
Alice
4 years ago

@mockingbird – testosterone is a steroid, it’s why men are larger and stronger and why they die earlier. Actually studies have found that Eunuchs live an average of 14 years longer than non-castrated men (I got that last bit from Wikipedia so take with a pinch of salt).

autosoma
4 years ago

thanks kestrel and monzach. I don’t really know how to say a lot of the things I think I want to. I read about the behaviours if the MGTOW and the MRA-ers and I can so easily see myself becoming one. I don’t know how to express the frustration resentment and bitterness that I end up feeling by living with an alcoholic and I feel bad about saying that. I grew up with alcoholic parents and I see so many of their behaviours with my wife drinking.

I don’t know what to do it even where to start, I went though therapy to try to come to terms with my feelings about it all and then there is an evening like this that makes me feel like shit for being angry that she’s pissed up looking after the girls. I wish I knew how to stop these feelings. One would be separation and that scares me because I really think in my isolation I would go MGTOW, which is quite abhorrent. Also, I really do love my wife and daughters, but days like today when the drinks inside her and she speaks to her parents, its like being with Mr. Hyde, a horrible drunken vindictive selfish monster appears and I don’t know how to cope with her or myself and I end up hating myself more.

Thanks again Mammothers for being there for me and stopping me going my own way and just listening.

Chiomara
Chiomara
4 years ago

@Autosoma
Oh,damn,me and my boyfriend have been going through something alike, and I am the problematic one. It’s been a year or so that I digged myself into depression and PTSD… I so often act bad with him, fight with him over small disagreements, and am not there when he needs me, emotionally or physically. We slowly changed into a dynamic of caregiver / caretaker instead of couples. He also began having very MRA ideas which, uh, only worsened my ways with him and my depression. I also accused him of Gaslight, which made complete sense in my mind, but maybe I am not thinking logically, maybe I really AM exaggerating and being too harsh on him. It’s very difficult. I was perfectly sane until a while ago, and now I have no idea what is real or not…
From the other side of the fence, that is, the side of the problematic or even abusive partner, carry on. She is probably very sorry for what she’s doing with you all, she probably misses the person she used to be very much too, and she probably is lost with no idea how to come back. She needs you more than ever, especially if her family is not there. I wish you lots of hope, lots of patience, emotional strength and, more than anything, love. You will need to love her a real huge lot, and remember how and why to love her very often.
Make sure she is seeking help. From a person with lots of alcohol problems in the family, my wishes are with your entire family.
And of course, this all is only valid until she endangers you and your kids.

autosoma
4 years ago

chiomara. Thank you for that, really thank you. A lot of what you said regarding yourself is exactly what my wife says when she’s not “altered”. That’s she’s lost, doesn’t know who she is anymore. So thank you for reminding me that she is in a lot of distress.

but I don’t know how to cope your right that the relationship gas altered to that of me being a caregiver/caretaker and I spend so much time worrying about being a control freak. Then I get confronted with a changed reality, which emotionally batters me and brings out a horrible reaction. it’s made worse when she drinks and speaks to her parents.

I don’t know what to do about it as I end up feeling that she’s avoiding responsibility, avoiding the truth if the situations and it makes me question my own memory and what actually happened.

I feel trapped as I earn the money to support the family, I’d prefer to be the stay at home carer of the children as I just don’t trust her to be sober to look after them. Throw into the mix that I hate my career as a software engineer and that so many of the blokes I work with can’t be arsed spending time with their families or are up front about their shitty attitudes to women.

I dunno what to do, it stressed me and makes me scared, which is an perfect way to become an abuser. Followed on by the fact that I rant when she’s got pissed and rung her parents, I just don’t know how to cope. I’m unhappy she’s unhappy, the kids are unhappy.

It’s nearly three in the morning and I can’t sleep, I’ve got a shitty day to look forward to at work, because the code I’d written was fucked by two of my work colleagues in the afternoon because they don’t do source control properly and we have a delivery tomorrow and I left work shortly after 6pm because my wife rsng ne pissed ip and I had to get home for the kids.

I’d just like her to be a little bit accountable for some of this mess, and exercise a little self control over the drinking. And here comes the MGTOW bit, I;d just like to be listened to by her and things go my way. Meh! I’m gonna call the Samaritans , I need to chat with someone who will go there, there, there… it’ll be alright one day

rick
rick
4 years ago

Seriously, the amount of time and projection Cernovich is putting into that one tweet is pathetic.

Chiomara
Chiomara
4 years ago

@autosoma I am so sorry. I am truly sorry. I wish I could give you a hug. I wish I could watch your kids a bit. From over the Internet and hundreds of kilometers away, have a heartfelt hug and my shoulder.
Has she seeked professional help? DO make sure she seeks it. I don’t know how you are money-wise, or how things are in the US about this, but seek an alcoholics group and seek, if possible, a therapist. A behavioural therapist. I do think she needs some. I mean, aside from chemical dependence, there may be an emotional reason she drinks. She needs to solve that and to enter a different mindset. Let us know if you can’t afford it, maybe we can help.
And a few, uh, tips that will probably sound a bit crazy, but it’s how some people in my family did it: where is she getting the alcohol? If it’s home, grab her bottles, pour some out, and fill with water instead, or water mixed with dissolvable juice if it’s wine or liquor. Every week you increase the water/alcohol ratio. This may lead to an ugly fight when she finds out, but it will help with the chemical dependence. People in my family have used this method with everything, from alcohol to sleeping pills to cocaine. This way, once she seeks help, she will be half way through quitting.

kupo
kupo
4 years ago

@autosoma
Take care of yourself. I’ve been there, feeling stuck in a relationship I knew was abusive but didn’t know how to get out of, and had myself convinced it wasn’t that bad most of the time (and most of the time it wasn’t bad, but the bad parts were bad).

On the gaslighting, I don’t know the situation at all, but I know when my husband goes into problem-solving mode he’ll say things that sound to me like he’s denying or trying to erase the problem, when he’s really just trying to help. I’ve taught him to just be empathetic instead of trying to solve things, and I haven’t felt gaslighted from him since. Again, I don’t know what the actual issues are that caused her to make that accusation, so this advice may be way off, but if you’re trying to resolve issues, just know that most of the time people just want others to hear and understand their problems, not help solving them. And if you really feel like you need to help solve, state that up front after acknowledging the problem. (i.e. “That really sucks, I’m sorry you’re going through that. Do you want my advice?”)

Anyway, that might not be helpful at all, but it sounded like it could possibly help.

autosoma
4 years ago

oh Chiomara, thank you for your kind thoughts, Mrs Autosoma has an initial alcohol rehab group meeting tomorrow, the fourth one in three years. Sadly one of them taught her better ways to hid her boozing. In many respects I find myself being a toxic enabler by saying OK when she “asks” my permission to get booze (I learnt along time ago to “enable” as the fall out emotionally was worse by saying no).

I hate the drinking so much, tonight I entered an alternate reality from the past, where if she hadn’t of lost that job she would have sorted her debt problems out by taking out more debt and it was my fault for finding out.

I had a good long chat with the Samaritans, I don’t feel better for it as I already knew all, the options they were suggesting but it;s good to hear another Human voice at times.

Do you know what’s scary about all this, is that I feel I’m the one to blame. Because I was ranting at her about drinking, my youngest daughter self harmed by sticking a thumbtack in her chest. This is because I’m angry about my wife being drunk in charge of the children, spinning up alternate realities and gaslighting me and being in denial about her “issues”. Y’ just can’t win, dammed if you do dammed if you don’t. I don’t know how to stop this destructiveness.

autosoma
4 years ago

kupo, the gaslighting came about not from problems-solving more like problem denial and me then stupidly correcting the statement.

I have noticed that the gaslighting increases massively when she’s been in contact with her father (a child psychologist and social worker). He’s an evil destructive man and I think he’s out to punish me for not paying off the £5000 she borrowed of him.

ColeYote
ColeYote
4 years ago

Another day, another racist moron not knowing what cuckolding actually is…

Chiomara
Chiomara
4 years ago

Oh my good lord 🙁 Send her to therapy too. Maybe it helps her realize what she is doing. Try being firm with her. Like a father or a figure of authority. It’s outrageous how her father, a psychologist, will drive her further away from the only person who is helping her, and make reason out of her vices. How old are your children? Can’t you put them in full-time schools? If it becomes too bad, which in my honest outsider opinion, it has, maybe take her to a detox in an institution, and while that, if needed, the loud, unhelpful great parents take care of the kids. Is that an option?
However it goes, try pouring water in the drinks. It always worked for the women in my family.

mockingbird
mockingbird
4 years ago

autosoma – My husband will only drink a beer now and then (if I can get 2 in him his Carolina accent comes out 😀 😀 😀 ) but he has a history with substance use (back in his early 20s) and we both have looooong family histories of destructive levels of alcoholism.

Something I told him before we were married: “I know that it’s not an issue now, but if you develop a serious problem with a substance while the children are minors we will not stay. They will not be around that. I will still love you, I won’t seek a divorce, and I’ll do everything that I can to help you – while living seperately with the children. I expect the same from you.”

I’m not about to try to tell you what to do – your situation is your situation and only YOU can read it – but you’ve said that your children are being harmed.

That would not stand with me.

contrapangloss
4 years ago

Autosoma, I’m so sorry for your situation.

I don’t really have any good advice… but hugs and internet shoulder if you need one.

redsilkphoenix
4 years ago

Autosoma:

I don’t know if they’re in your country, but an Al-Anon group might help. Basically they’re a support group for families of alcoholics, with some chapters geared towards younger folk (Al-Teen). Even if they don’t have a chapter in your area/country, they may have information on their website that might be of use for you, even though they’re based out of the US. Can’t hurt to look them up, anyway.

Good luck in getting yourself and the kids through this mess. And hopefully your wife will become healthy again.

DS
DS
4 years ago

@autosoma — My friend, what chiomara has suggested is spot on. I’m married to a social worker who specializes in Cognitive Behavioral Therapy and who focuses on family and children therapy. A 12-step program is definitely a good thing for your wife to join. It would allow her to talk through her problems in a setting where there is no guilting or shaming and therefore no need to lash out or self-destruct to hide from these harmful consequences.

My own spouse has borderline personality disorder and the MRAs and MGTOWs in the crowd will tell you over and over again that the best solution to a woman with BPD is to turn 180º and run like hell, but I’ve found that patience, a little counseling, and managing her symptoms with the lowest adult dose of sertraline and trazodone have helped her get to a better place where she is level, functional, and is starting to build a real personality instead of hiding behind what she thinks everyone else expects of her.

While my spouse has never ever been an alcoholic, I can tell you I do genuinely resonate with the sudden, irrational outbursts of rage and fury. Little did I know when I stood at the altar and said “I do” that I was marrying a Valkyrie. Yet as the first couple of years of our marriage wore on, it started to get to where just about every time we were going to or from church she’d get this cold, silent, stone-wall atmosphere about her where it felt like she was a thousand miles away and unapproachable. (And before someone jumps on religion as the culprit, that wasn’t it, and our church isn’t patriarchal or spouse-abusive; we have a black female pastor and we regularly talk about gender, race, and social justice issues from the pulpit and in small groups. Not all Christians are draconian ne’er-do-wells. Check yoself.)

I was always raised by my parents to be the sort of man who doesn’t just ignore problems but who seizes the bull by the horns, tries to make an effort to extend an olive branch, find out what’s going on, and get back to being friends with people, so I applied that to my marriage. Yikes. I’d draw back an emotional bloody stump. So then I’d try just waiting it out, but she could go on like that for 8, 10, 12 hours and it’s excruciating to be around someone your entire day off from work who is supposed to love you and resonate on the same wavelength as you but who suddenly has the personality of a nailbat.

Anyway, it would go like that until finally she talked it out with me, had a big emotional outburst, would start sobbing–at which point I would think something approximately like “OH GOD THIS IS TERRIBLE WHAT DID I DO WHY WON’T SHE STOP CRYING QUICK DO SOMETHING FUNNY TO MAKE HER FEEL BETTER”–and then would *finally* share with me what was actually eating at her, and invariably it was something that seemed so incredibly mundane to me like she had said something 4 days ago and someone had reacted badly to it and now she was 5million percent certain that person hated her, or something like that. It’s part of BPD and anxiety disorder.

Anyway, I had always assumed that she was just sorting out ‘who she was’ because she had been raised in a family that was pretty WASPy (you know, smiling and chatting chirpily while sliding the knife between your ribs, that sort of thing), but after some years of this and things looking not better but actually WORSE (we had a major death in our family that didn’t help things at all), we finally went to a counselor who then referred her to a psychiatrist for evaluation. That’s when the BPD and anxiety were diagnosed, and I’m telling you, within 48 hours of going on a course of the aforementioned medicine, she was able to be who she intended to be but who the anxiety typically kept her from being.

So there is hope for a spouse who is antagonistic to turn around. Presumably she loves you or wouldn’t have married you. Presumably she does not want to destroy her marriage or her family, and will therefore be willing to seek some form of help. Be gentle, but be firm in telling her that you will no longer help enable her habit. If you’re unfamiliar with the “Love and Logic” system, you might want to check it out on YouTube. It’s typically used for parenting, but if an adult is being particularly irresponsible, it is a form of civil disobedience that doesn’t FORCE her to stop drinking, but does force her to own the consequences of her alcoholism which will perhaps help her realize how bad her problem is and lead her to seek help.

For what it’s worth, I’ll pray for the situation, or send you positive vibrations or whatever format you’d prefer to think of me wishing you the very best in. I truly hope all shall be well for you and that you will find your peace and joy at the end of your journey, my friend.

Warmly,

DS

Orion
4 years ago

Autosoma,

I’m so sorry. Not sure what more I can say, but I hope you all get through this okay.

Chiomara,

” People in my family have used this method with everything, from alcohol to sleeping pills to cocaine. This way, once she seeks help, she will be half way through quitting.”

How would you dilute someone’s pills?

Kat
Kat
4 years ago

@autosoma
I’m really sorry that you and your family are having a rough time of it. Alcohol is quite a wild card.

I like what redsilkphoenix had to say about Al-Anon.

Also appreciated: Mockingbird’s comment about the boundaries she put up with her husband.

Try to get some sleep. You need your rest–seriously. Things will look different in the morning.

We’re here if you need to talk.

newbie
newbie
4 years ago

I must agree with a previous commenter who observed that Jaye comes across as naive and not very bright — IOW, a perfect material for a new MRA recruit. She sounds like someone who’s just awakened to reality, and has not time yet to process much of it in any way.

For example, she seems shocked, shocked by finding out about the higher suicide rates and workplace deaths among men. One wonders if she’s lived on Earth, and if so, what stopped her from having her eyes opened? Or doing some basic research on the subject before delving into the world of hate-driven, but honey-smeared distortions that predictably messed up her inexperienced mind?

And did she really not know about “the tendency to not take male victims of sexual assault as seriously and the ways that men are discouraged from being caretakers”? Really? Feminists have been pounding on those issues for long decades.

She also apparently cannot reason through some basic facts of life, as many noted here wrt gender life and earning discrepancies, nor can she put them in a larger context and understand their meaning.

After watching the trailer, which looks like a Viagra commercial, and reading this interview, I have zero hope that this documentary could be objective.

But I do feel sorry for her. She is going to have a tough lesson to learn from this experience, and it is probably not one that she would ever expect. It is astounding that she cannot grasp what she’s dealing with, even as she acknowledges that she may have to go into hiding as a result of making this movie.

@autosoma:

Sorry to hear about your troubles. Stay strong, man.

Chiomara
Chiomara
4 years ago

@Orion
Well,it’s very easily done with those jelly pills with powder inside, you just open it, empty, and close again. If the compressed powder pills inside a jar, you change some of them for some lookalikes. With my mom it was a little bit harder though, my dad was addicted to sleeping pills that came in a popping sheet. She’d very carefully open it with a sharp knife and replace them one by one with vitamins, closed again, and prayed a lot, haha. Damn, was he mad when he found out. They were expensive pills. But he didn’t even need detox, before he knew, he was no longer taking them, and he was never abusive again. It’s been twenty years ^^ That’s why I say, it’s an excellent strategy.

Chiomara
Chiomara
4 years ago

I am sorry, I don’t know if I made myself understood. I hope you all understand what I mean by “jelly pill with powder inside”, “compressed powder pill” and “popping sheet”. Also, excuse the typos and grammar mistakes. I’m not a native speaker and I am kind of dyslexic.

autosoma
4 years ago

well after a sleepless night and a long chat with the Samaritans and a short bitter conversation with my wife I’ve decided to move out into a hotel for a short while. To get my head together. I’m sorry that I co-opted this thread and I hope to be back soon. I very highly strung and worried about my children and I so don’t want for this to turn me into something David would write about. I’m so unhappy right now.

contrapangloss
4 years ago

Auto, best of luck. Maybe a couple days’ll help you both figure some stuff out.

Are there any friends who can help your wife watch the kidlets?

autosoma
4 years ago

I dropped a letter into the next door neighbours, in going to try to contact my rabbi and shul… I dunno what the gell to do. it’s my fault for being argumentative and wanting certain things regarding parenting that she can’t do for me.

Paradoxical Intention
4 years ago

Best of luck, Autosoma. I know your family’s in a tough spot right now, but I’m hoping things will get better for you. Internet hugs for the moment though, and if it helps, I found a funny thing.
comment image

It’s only slightly relevant, but still hilarious.

autosoma
4 years ago

thanks paradoxical that did make me smile a little bit

EJ (The Other One)
EJ (The Other One)
4 years ago

@autosoma:
My parents relationship was quite similar to what you’ve described yours and Mrs autosoma’s relationship as being like. I don’t like to talk about it but you said a lot of things that resonate for me.

From the sounds of it you’re being an excellent father, caring for your children no matter what. Burning yourself out for them isn’t a good idea though: my father also found it very easy to self-sacrifice, far easier than actually sorting out the issues.

All my best wishes and please let me know if there’s anything I can do to help.

Sheila Crosby
4 years ago

I see a lot of people assuming that Seth Rogan’s wife’s tweet is a typo. That’s possible, of course, but isn’t it more likely to be photoshop or a sockpuppet?

@autosoma: Hugs. You’re in a very difficult situation; you’re allowed to be merely human about it.

All the hugs.

Monzach
Monzach
4 years ago

@autosoma

I do hope that putting a bit of distance between yourself and your wife helps. I can’t imagine what you’re going through. Just stay strong and remember that this too will pass.

Wish there was more I could say and do, but do have some internet hugs from me as well, if you want them. 🙂

EJ (The Other One)
EJ (The Other One)
4 years ago

To add:
It’s not your fault for being argumentative. By the sounds of it you have every right to protest about what’s going on. Confrontation in this situation is the right thing to do, even if there were no children involved. If she’s trying to reframe the situation so that your reasonable concerns are dismissed as just being argumentative, then that’s gaslighting.

You are an intelligent and caring human being. You are not just a machine for looking after other people. Trust yourself and look to your own feelings as well. From the interactions I’ve had with you on here, you’ve come across as a genuinely kind and thoughtful guy who has a strong moral streak. Never let her tell you anything else.

Kootiepatra
4 years ago

@Autosoma:

EJ beat me to it, but I just wanted to chime in that this is not your fault.

Definitely stay in touch with whatever support systems are available to you, and focus on taking care of yourself and your kids. I think it is super honorable that you want to help her, and I sincerely hope that she will cooperate in seeking help for her addiction. But she is an adult with her own free will, so you can’t hold yourself responsible for whether or not she decides she needs to change—or even the fact that she began abusing alcohol in the first place. Some of it’s on her, some of it’s on the addiction, but it’s not within your power to *make* her make good decisions, so it can’t be your fault.

Wishing you all the best.