So The Independent recently ran a piece by Catherine Murphy of Amnesty International, explaining why the organization is calling for the decriminalization of sex work.
In the comments, someone calling themselves THEMISHMISHEH offers a unique take on the issue.
And by “unique” I mean “seemingly from another planet.”
Shades of Tom Martin, huh?
Men don’t need sex to live. They do need food, though. Goddamn grocers! Charging men for food! Predators, the lot of them!
Edit: I totally missed that LindsayIrene made this very same joke. Great minds?
@LindsayIrene
Yeah, I’ve met these guys on the left. (In my experience, they’ll never admit to holding this belief, but clearly they do.)
Of course, you’ll find these guys on the right, too. (They use fancy language to try to cover up what they really mean.)
And it wasn’t too long ago that this situation was called life. The MRM earnestly desires to return to that way of life. Kinda, sorta. Because Paul Elam, for example, left all his wives — and his kids.
Snort.
@Catalpa
That was my reading of it. I wrote out a long response about the article, but your question here points out the issues with the law much more concisely. The article discussed concerns about women reporting rapes when the perpetrator could just turn the charge around on them. I disagree with the statement that men and women should be treated differently based on physical strength, but this law does not accurately describe rape. By using the words “make possible,” it puts the onus on women to keep themselves from being raped, lest they be charged with rape or another crime.
I’m also thinking about women who are being threatened or physically harmed at the time. They may make penetration possible (to use the wording of the law) in order to protect themselves or loved ones. They could be victimized and then be charged with a crime for it. It’s basically victim blaming written into law.
@EJ
I was wondering about the scare quotes too…
They always ignore me :C
That said, I couldn’t have said it any better than what’s already been said! I guess I will just have to write this paper instead. Sigh…
That was the law that they successfully stopped from passing…
“Until now, the law has only defined rape as an act perpetrated against a woman.”
So now the law in ‘israel’ only applies rape to women and children and not men, regardless of the method of penetration, thanks to feminism.
Do me a favour and …
PERIOD…
Welcome to today’s episode of Not Even Wrong…
@THEMISHMISHEH,
o_o
Your linked article is very clear about why the women wanted the law changed – because, as it’s worded, it would give rapist men the ability to charge their victims with rape if their victims came forward.
Please learn to read, as has been said.
Your opponents are imaginary and the goals of your battles don’t exist. You mis-attribute behaviours and intentions to the people you don’t like instead of looking at their objective actions; you intentionally gloss over points of view which contradict your own and shout loudly about any points which do. You are an exemplar of confirmation bias in action.
You do not have truth, you do not know truth, and you can’t recognize truth when it’s presented to you. You do not recognize the quagmire of self-defense and ego preservation that you’ve flooded your mind with, and even if you do recognize it at moments, you have no means to escape it.
Let me get zen for you on it, if you please.
Discard your opinions, discard your emotions. Discard your desires and your impulses. Let it all go. They hold you down. Start fresh. If not everything, start with one thing. Promise yourself that you will change your mind on one thing, that you will admit your wrongness in one place, and promise to move from that place to somewhere better. This is possibly the most important skill to master.
But then they’d actually have to think critically! And admit a bunch of women, some men, and non-cis peeps were right! And that’s hard hit in the ego!
Your entire argument hinges on the ridiculous idea that a man, upon finding himself inclined to have sex, is suddenly incapable of making adult decisions or being held accountable for them. Forgetting for the moment, as many have pointed out, that not all men have any interest in having sex with women at all, a man who finds himself with a boner has many options. He could go to a bar and try to meet someone. He could take a cold shower. He could wank. If he chooses to have sex with a prostitute, he’s still an adult who has consented to something. If there are consequences to that action, well, he knew the risks going in. (which, by the way, there aren’t necessarily any consequences at all. I don’t know why you’re so convinced that every John has had his life ruined so some scheming wench can make off with his cash, it’s quite bizarre.)
Aren’t you offended, as a man, by the implications of your argument? The implication that you are a dumb beast or a child who has no control over himself the second you have a physiological urge? Do you think so lowly of your own gender? Because I actually think men are intelligent adults that are responsible for themselves. Funny, that.
I mean, for fuck’s sake, I just ate a bag of skittles, knowing they were bad for me and might make me feel a bit sick. I took nutritional science in school, I knew they were bad. I knew my mostly empty stomach might rebel. But I ate the skittles anyway because goddamn, I love me some skittles. I’m biologically programmed to like foods that are high in sugar and fat because they are high in energy, and our ancestors evolved to favour foods that could fuel our big brains. But I’m still not incapable of making decisions for myself just because I had a sugar craving.
Who, in your view, should I sue for exploiting me? The wicked skittles themselves, for seducing me with sugars that I am biologically programmed to crave? The convenience store clerk who sold me the skittles, viciously exploiting my biological urge for a paltry $2.75? That den of villainous exploitation, Skittles Inc!!?? Whose fault is it that I just ate a bag of skittles, please let me know that I might be revenged!!
The equivalence between rape and prostitution that you have drawn is so false it makes my head spin. I know that logic isn’t your strong suit, but surely even you can’t possibly believe that, “Men do a lot of one thing, women do a lot of another thing, therefore those two things are exactly the same but reversed” makes any kind of sense at all. A man that is horny and decides, out of all the options he has to deal with that, that he will engage in a consensual exchange with a prostitute, is somehow the same thing as a woman that was wrestled to the ground and forcibly penetrated? Do you know what “consent” is?
Whilst sex might be able to be viewed as a marketable commodity, women are not. I hate this distortion some call “sex marxism”. All human beings are entitled to equal rights and are not subject to be owned or traded, despite what you guys think, Mishmash. 50% of the population owning 100% of the world’s vaginas does not excuse rape as a ‘redistribution of wealth’. Women are allowed bodily autonomy, they aren’t just products to cheer up your sad boner. If a woman chooses to market her sexual labour, that is up to her, there are plenty of men who choose to do this work as well.
@THEMISHMISHEH
1) Feminism is not a monolith. Even if there were feminist orgs in Israel opposing the addition of female on male rape to the statute, that doesn’t condemn feminism as a whole. Feminism is actually pretty self-critical, which is why you can have feminists here saying “Well, it absolutely is rape” regardless of what other purported feminist groups may have done.
2) Where in that article did you see the word “feminist” or “feminism”? How did you link the groups that protested the law change to feminism?
I second the notion that our new ‘friend’ adopts the name “Mishmash.” It’s more evocative.
How big was that bag of Skittles because almost fucking $3 for a bag of goddamn Skittles is outrageous.
You can get Skittles in Poundland for £1 a bag, but I think the bag is a little smaller. They do the cinema boxes of Reece’s Pieces as well.
I told you, I couldn’t help it! I WAS BEING EXPLOITED!
…Although, it was a bigger bag, and the dollars are Canadian which might explain why it takes a bit more to buy things.
I hope so. I think the bags I’m thinking of are, like, 2 ounces? Maybe? I know you can can get, like, a pound for $5-7, I think?
But now I just want some Skittles.
Most of the skittles I’ve seen in this size of bag are (I think) about 3 bucks, unless you’re at a movie theatre or something where they really gouge you:
http://www.eatfunfoods.com/img-skittles_peg.jpg
There’s are the ones we (Nor Cal, US) usually have near the checkout counters:
We also have this in the candy aisle:
http://c3e308.medialib.glogster.com/media/c5/c5a294002fda0a504c6da94e41eff4487dba70055d66f150ddc3bb31c184e0a3/skittles.jpg
You can make a lot of Skittle burgers with 7 ounces though.
Skittles!
In other news, MISTER CAPS LOCK, you are in charge of yourself. If you (I’m speaking generically of course) decide that having sex with a prostitute is wrong, then if you violate that principle and have sex with a prostitute, you don’t get to blame her.
In secular terms, grow the fuck up and take responsibility for your own actions.
Not possible? Then you need a minder with you at all times.
@Kat:
But don’t you see? He desires sex. That means he deserves to get as much sex as he likes, for free, whenever he wants it, because that’s what should happen with his desires.
(I have the sneaking suspicion that by “sex” he means “sex with conventionally attractive women who have not yet passed an arbitrary expiration date”.)
The fact that he sometimes has to resort to prostitution to achieve this desire is the single greatest injustice in the history of the world, and we are being monsters by not supporting him.
@EJ (The Other One)
I can see now that I’ve been heartless to this poor man, victim of his own desires and plaything of prostitutes.
I predict that I will continue to be heartless to him.
@Jackie
I think I’ve seen Catalpa’s size of skittles bags (and other candies like rollos and M&Ms) at convenience stores like 7/11 and AM/PM. I think they’re specific to convenience stores, and they always have the little hole so they can be hung on hooks. And since those stores mark everything up by 20-50% I can definitely see it costing $2.75.
@Kat:
That sounds like an extremely accurate prediction.
@Dlouwe
No? The comments attempting to justify that article are testament to the fact that this is how the majority of you think.
You sign-up to an ideology that is the definition of the words laudatory and authoritarian. Feminists obstruct and do their best to shut-down any event or person that dares to disagree with feminism. You attend speeches and shout people down so that nobody can hear what they have to say. You ostracise, attack and destroy the lives of feminists who criticise feminism, like Professor Janice Fiamengo, one example of many. You ransack events, destroy placards and physically assault people who don’t support your way thinking, including children. You have gone so far as campaigning to ban criticism and mocking of feminism:..and you tell me that you are ‘pretty self-critical’!?!?
http://translate.google.no/translate?sl=sv&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=no&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.friatider.se%2Fforslag-gor-det-straffbart-kritisera-feminism
This is especially hypocritical given that mockery and hate are the main staples of feminism…
That is perhaps the most telling thought of this thread. It shows how detached you feminist are from your own reality.
I am just going to point something out here about this Israeli rape law article. Prior to this law being passed in Israel, sexual abuse of children by women was not regarded as rape. This law was only passed after a public outcry following a slew of very serious cases, over a short period of time, involving women who raped children one of which involved a woman who had raped over a hundred young boys. This woman’s case was especially antagonising to the public because she thought that she had done nothing wrong. In her statement to the press she expressed that she felt that she had been wronged by being arrested and that she was happy that she had not contracted any diseases from raping the boys.
I quote:
“It’s not nice what you did for me.” (she is talking about her arrest) “I’m an innocent girl. Most important to me is that I’m healthy., I thank God that the test results said I (am) healthy.”
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=765917566786941
To put this whole issue into perspective for you and help you understand how things have gotten so bad in countries where feminism is institutionalised, have a read through this following paragraph. It was written by Barbara Ellen, a feminist, Guardian journalist in an article regarding the imprisonment of pedophile and child rapist Madeline Martin:
“Looking at the case of Madeleine Martin, the 39-year-old RE teacher and mother of two, jailed for 32 months and placed on the sex offenders’ register for sleeping with a 15-year-old male pupil, do we seriously think that a female teacher sleeping with a male pupil is on a par with a male teacher sleeping with a girl pupil? I don’t. And neither, I’d wager, would most 15-year-old boys.”
How you can you align yourself with an ‘ideology’ that drives you to think like this, that drives you to this level of depravity, is beyond me.
@Dlouwe
P.S. I forgot about the second part of your comment.
It’s a bit of a silly question but I will entertain it. The two Knesset members who filed the bills to change the law such that it excluded men from rape are feminists, Ronit Tirosh and Orlev, the latter of the two being well known in Israel for supporting ‘radical feminism’. In the following video he is being challenged by fathers about his views on feminism and father’s rights: