Last year, I wrote about a repellant little “community” on Reddit: the PhilosophyofRape subreddit, devoted to promoting what it called the corrective rape of “filthy, unmitigated, sluts … [t]hat badly need to be punished. Badly.”
Reddit being what it is, the subreddit remains up to this day. And now the folks behind it have taken their repugnant “philosophy” to the web. Earlier this week, one of the subreddit’s numerous moderators, a veritable cauldron of bigotries who calls himself European88, announced the grand opening of a new Philosophy of Rape website. He urged his fellow “philosophers” to “[s]ubscribe and submit your rape tips … !”
Like the subreddit before it, the site declares war on “harpies,” “hussies,” “[d]ecrepid filth, dressed like hookers and reaking like vodka” and “Belligerent. Entitled. Selfie taking, Tindr-whoring, Teenage-walking-herpes-sores.”
The “philosophers” also take aim at “vain, vile, venemous, femenist, filth,” particularly
[t]he kind who get conferences to talk about mens suicide rates shut down. The type of hussies who have lobbied effectively to remove due process from proceedings against men on college campuses.
In a post titled “Why is Rape Necessary,” the site sets forth its case for “correction.” (I’ve bolded the worst bits.)
1) Rape did serve important, healthy, and natural biological purposes historically in limiting the extent to which female bad behavior can go.
2. Women in many ways are like children, and most can not self-regulate very well, so in the absence of something like parents or a natural limiting force like rape, they just run amok and destroy their selves and everything they touch.
3. Because rape is so completely arm-barred back by the state, and feminism has grown to be this infestation that caused even the social consequences for female behavior to dissappear, we find ourselves in a precarious situation. Unbridled female sluttishness, entitlement, narcissism, vileness and destruction gone viral.
4. Such women need to be Corrected. Humbled. Brought back down to a healthy place and realistic mindset. For their own good as well as that of those around them. That particular corrective action is quite clear, the one that used to naturally limit the behavior: rape.
5. We are here to provide encouragement and advice how to do that and do it safely. Regression analysis to find out which variables make it less likely to get into legal trouble. Very few women report the rapes, what can you do to make it even less likely? Example: remind the victim that “no one will believe them”. When they orgasm (which is actually very common during rape, Google it) speak up and let them know that you are aware of it and that it will come out during trial if they reported it.
Yes, that’s right. After complaining that the feminist “infestation” has enabled “unbridled” female awfulness by drastically reducing the “natural limiting force [of] rape,” the rape “philosophers” acknowledge that most men who rape women face zero consequences for their action. Indeed, in another post, one “philosopher” declares that
We want to teach men that although it may be easier than ever for an innocent man to be convicted of rape when a consensual partner has buyers remorse, it’s also easier than ever for a guilty man to get away Scott free – so long as it’s done the way we advocate: actual rape-rape, as in dark-alley, ski mask, stranger rape.
Emphasis mine. Some of the rape “tips” offered on the site are wholly unoriginal:
Tell the harlot that you come from a rich family and that she will never successfully convict you of raping her in court. Tell her that, if she tries to sue you, you will counter-sue for a huge amount of money that will bankrupt her.
Pretty sure that one’s been used before.
Tell the harlot that, if she tells the police about the rape, you will kill her entire family. If she has children, tell her that you will rape her children before killing them.
That one too.
Other tips are little more than sadistic fantasies:
Put sugar into the harlot’s vagina to give her a yeast infection. This will be a mark of shame on her that she will be unable to forget, and she will have to relive the rape every time she seeks treatment for it. …
After raping the harlot, steal her clothes and write “WHORE” on her chest with a red marker. She will be forced to walk around naked with “WHORE” written on her chest, and it will be extremely humiliating for her.
Whether these rape “philosophers” are actually living out their repellant philosophy, I couldn’t tell you. They insist that they’re quite sincere.
Indeed, in a posting on slutHATE, one rape “philosopher” assured skeptics that
The Philosophy of Rape is as serious as a heart attack. We are a movement of angry, fed-up men – much like you – who have decided to take matters into our own hands. The simple fact of the matter is, simply sitting around and complaining about sluts on the Internet isn’t going to change anything. We need real-world action to correct the slut problem. That’s why The Philosophy of Rape was created. Sluts need real-world punishment, and we want to train an army of holy warriors to dish out that punishment. Your chances of getting caught are already slim, and we will teach you how to make 100% sure that you don’t get caught.
In another comment, he reported that while
I can’t openly admit to how many harlots I’ve corrected, but let’s just say that I do indeed practice what I preach.
He offered this lovely bit of advice to anyone thinking of following in his (alleged) footsteps:
It definitely helps if you build up to the act. Keep edging closer and closer to rape until you’re finally ready to do the deed. For example, send a harlot an anonymous message telling her you’re gonna rape her, then write “HARLOT” on her car, then finally rape her when the moment is right. Build up your courage by first committing smaller acts.
He urged others to take up his peculiar fight for, er, justice:
We are going to build an army of holy warriors to correct harlots and feminazi whores around the world. All it takes is a few Elliot Rodger types to get the ball rolling. What do you have to lose? Enlist in our rape army today, and we will teach you how to correct a new harlot a week and get away with it.
Apparently unafraid of legal consequences, the person posting all this gave what he said was his real name, claiming to be “Brother” Dean Saxton, a campus “activist” of sorts who several years ago caused a stir after holding a one-man protest at the University of Arizona, holding a sign reading “You Deserve Rape.”
In another thread, “Brother Dean” explained why he felt this slogan was so effective in angering feminists: .
NOTHING pisses off feminazis more than reminding them that they are filthy harlots who desperately need to be – and, deep down, WANT TO BE – raped.
He went on to explain why the kind of rape he advocates is the most public-spirited of all the different varieties of rape:
N*ggers rape because they are feral animals who cannot control their primitive biological urges. We rape because we are holy warriors on a mission to correct harlots and purge society of unmitigated female entitlement. The Philosophy of Rape is, ultimately, about fixing society. The only way to correct harlots and feminazis is by raping them.
If “Brother Dean” is European88, he’s kept himself busy since his college protest as a moderator of 157 of Reddit’s most loathsome subreddits, including /r/CoonTown, /r/WhiteRights, /r/nazi, /r/GasTheKikes, /r/Chimpout, /r/StormfrontForums and the lovely /r/N*ggerSafari.
Some of the slutHATE regulars dismissed “Brother Dean” as “disinfo” and “just another frustrated virgin in his basement spreading shit.” frenchy91, for his part, noted that
while i really don’t give a shit who you could rape as long as it’s not my girlfriend, nor familly member, i think you op should get raped by a group of n*ggers, just to know how it feels, then you could objectively speak about who diserve it or not. for now, you just sound like a desperate mysogincel
This is apparently what passes for a “moderate” position on slutHATE. Others there found Brother Dean’s message inspirational. A commenter calling himself mvp wrote that
i definitely support this movement
its time to fight back
“Fuck it,” wrote another. “I’ll rape a bitch for you.”
It would be easy enough to dismiss all of this as nothing more than the ridiculous fantasies of “frustrated virgin[s]” or the work of trolls. I really hope that’s all it is.
But we should remember that slutHATE is essentially a reincarnation of PUAhate, an online forum that was frequented by a young man named, yes, Elliot Rodger, who posted similarly hateful and similarly implausible-sounding comments there before setting out one evening a little over a year ago, intending to “slaughter every single spoiled, stuck-up, blonde slut” in a popular sorority house at the University of California, Santa Barbara.
H/T — MoonMetropolis
What the fuck? Why is this your fantasy? Why is it your fantasy that women are responsible for defending themselves from rape via physical violence?
Why don’t you fantasize about all people (men and women) getting mandatory consent training, so that everyone knows what consent looks like, that it’s important to get it, and it’s rape if you don’t?
Why don’t you fantasize about people knowing how predators behave, so that predatory behavior isn’t written off as “boys will be boys,” and mimicked by lots of others so that the predators have thick cover, but will be recognized as aberrant and called out immediately?
Why don’t you fantasize about teaching boys and men that they have the responsibility to root out rape culture and annihilate it?
These are just as realistic as imagining that all women will walk around with handguns and somehow that can’t possibly go wrong, so why do you default to the idea that women are responsible for defending themselves?
Oh, yeah, that’s right: you’re propagating rape culture yourself.
Why is this thread about a confessed serial rapist and neo-Nazi inciting further rape and murder attracting so many foot-stomping tone cops? Is it because they know there’s no way to defend this?
I’m not going to tolerate the intolerant. I’ve been beaten by my stepdad for being a girl, raped by a paedophile for being naive, picked on by teachers for being autistic, bullied by classmates for being ugly, bashed in the street for being gay. No more.
You can take your holier-than-thou shit and stick it back where it came from.
To piggyback on the “guns for all!!!!” criticism:
Recommending that everyone be armed puts all the onus on the victim to prevent their own attack. There are pacifist women, women with disabilities that keep them from pulling a trigger, women who don’t have the financial resources to buy and maintain a firearm. If one of those women is raped, is it all her fault because she could have a had a gun?
For that matter, since the U.S. is a country with a right to keep and bear arms, what’s to stop a potential rapist from arming themselves, too? All they have to do is draw first.
I don’t think more guns would not result in less rape. It would just result in more guns.
Signed,
Flying Mouse, woman, holder of concealed carry permit
Arming all women probably wouldn’t end well if statistics are anything to go by. Not sure about you but I have been raped, and personally think it could have been much worse if a fucking gun had been introduced to the scenario.
Not only that but if women fail to defend themselves with said gun? I can just hear the talking heads now saying she must have wanted it somehow or didn’t really want it to stop since she didn’t shoot the person. Giving everyone guns does absolutely nothing to help or change the rape culture we are living in. Just…no.
Thinking of the woman in Florida who got thrown in jail for firing warning shots into her wall or ceiling because her abusive husband was on a rampage. I’m sure someone will know the name, it is quite a popular case for good reason. She was thrown in jail while Zimmerman was let off for shooting an unarmed black kid.
I imagine similar things would happen to women attempting to defend themselves from rape. We get raped now and are chased out of our towns and have our homes torched for sullying good guy’s names. Do people honestly think shooting these people will result in victims being praised? I’m not that delusional.
There are no Reddit forums where women talk about how to make false rape accusations and get them to stick. None.
In response to the “give everyone a gun!” crap, just gonna drop this here:
http://www.theonion.com/article/man-always-carries-gun-in-case-he-needs-to-escalat-38374
I might just be an awful person, but I like to fantasise about a world where every woman is prepared to defend herself with lethal force because nothing warms my shriveled heart like the idea of rapists living in fear and then dying at the hands of someone they thought they could victimise.
Guns, however, are just a tool; they don’t use themselves. What’s needed is much more fundamental than handgun training–it’s raising young women from day one to have the aggression and sense of self-worth to decide instantaneously that their right to not be beaten, raped, or murdered is more important than the life of someone who would do those things, whether it’s a stranger on the street or someone they thought they could trust enough to marry. Aggression and self-worth are the key components, and they have to be taught over a lifetime, not simply in a high-school course after 17 years of teaching girls that they are the bricks upon whose backs society is built and that they need to stay put or it all comes crashing down.
Of course, the fantasy part is where the violence itself fixes the problem. What’s more likely is that the credible threat of force would keep would-be attackers from attacking: predators only attack when they believe that their target is prey. They want a *victim*, not a fight where they might actually get hurt. Presently society teaches that women are passive victims, so men who want to abuse women feel confident in doing so. Remove those messages that give them such assurance and create an environment where they have cause to fear women instead, and they no longer have a sense that it’s safe to abuse women–they could get hurt. They could lose. They could die. Many of them will choose to live instead.
Booburry,
I think her name is Marisa Alexander. And yeah, I can easily imagine WOC being prosecuted for defending themselves against rapists. Or worse, just gunned down by the police.
I’m a firm believer that self-defense laws need to be rewritten to account for domestic violence and not just stranger violence. That alone would do a great service to women’s needs where violent encounters are concerned.
Allison W,
Nobody is saying women shouldn’t defend themselves if they can. The thing is, as FM said, some women are disabled or otherwise physically incapable of self defense. Also, neither guns or martial arts protects us from drugs or coercion. The right to bear arms in the US extends to everyone in principle. In reality carrying a weapon can get you shot by the police if your skin isn’t white enough or you’re visibly mentally ill. Then there’s the fact that the US, with its high prevalence of guns has much more violent crime than countries with strict gun control. Maybe the fantasy of kicking rapist ass brings some satisfaction. I liked Kill Bill! But really it’s rape culture we must destroy. It’s much better to think of a world in which we wouldn’t even need to consider self defense essential.
And yet, again, you put the onus onto the “target” to put up a credible defense. Why, exactly, do you want to treat rape like it’s a force of nature, and victims can only avoid it or defend themselves from it? Rape is not like a tornado or a flood. Rape is committed by people. Why do you erase the agency of the rapists and pretend that rapists gonna rape, so ya might as well be prepared!
Rapists choose to rape. Rapists can also choose not to rape. You’re making it the victim’s responsibility to force rapists to change their behaviors. Why the hell is it so hard for you to make it the rapist’s responsibility to change their behaviors?
This is just victim-blaming. You’re blaming women for not being tough enough and armed enough to prevent rape. You’re ignoring the reality that if someone starts to commit a rape, there is literally no telling what else that person is prepared to do. Is that person also prepared to commit murder? Why don’t we pull a gun on ’em and find out!
Men are raped. Big, tough, manly men with big muscles are raped. Why didn’t they fight back? Maybe because once someone starts to commit a rape, the victim realizes that this person is willing to violate extreme social sanction to do this, and who knows what other social sanctions they might be willing to violate as well?
Children are raped. Do you expect them to do karate chops on their parents, teachers, older siblings, etc.?
What the fuck is the difficulty with putting the onus onto rapists for a change? Why is it always victims who are told they need to change their behavior? Why are rapists never told they need to change their behavior?
“Again.” I’m not FE.
Great way to avoid admitting that you are making the same argument as FE.
Allison – rewritten how?
Even if the laws were rewritten, courts would still find a way to find women guilty. Especially women of color or instances in which the assailant is a rich or connected man.
FE: Women should be trained at 18 to shoot guns and defend themselves! I don’t mention anything about stopping people from raping and I ignore a large chunk of people who get raped besides women!
Allison: Women should be raised to be no nonsense fighting machines to defend themselves! I don’t mention anything about stopping people from raping and I ignore a large chunk of people who get raped besides women!
Yep, totally not the same exact point by two different people that are virtually indistinguishable except for the age in which women learn how to defend themselves. Nope.
Not to mention the large percentage of women who would be unwilling to shoot a relative, friend, or SO who turned out to be a rapist.
You know, I’m thinking people that are dismissing this as “trollish” or to just “ignore” it are in real deep denial about human nature.
I’m inclined to agree with you, Pandapool. How many Elliot Rodger’s do we need before people take these threats seriously enough to report even if there’s a chance that they might be satire? (And here, it honestly does not appear to be satirical.)
Very well, then.
When you argue about putting onus on the rapist, what do you mean? Do you mean holding them responsible for their actions? Because I’d agree with that. Hell, I’m fine with them being killed for it. But clearly that’s not what we’re disagreeing about. Thing is, who do we put the onus on when it comes to teaching rapists not to rape (for those that can be taught), or intimidating them into not raping or forcing them not to rape (for those that can’t be taught)?
I’d argue that you’re not actually arguing for onus to be put on the rapist to teach themselves not to rape, to intimidate themselves into not raping, or to use force to prevent themselves from committing a rape they’re attempting to commit–they *shouldn’t* rape, but clearly they’re doing it anyway. I’d argue that you’re arguing for the onus to be put on *society* and its mechanisms, like law enforcement and culture (example: creating a “consent culture” instead of a “rape culture”). So you’re suggesting that instead of fearing the victim, rapists should fear society–that they should fear being arrested or ostracised. I’d actually agree that they should fear being arrested or ostracised. But there are a number of issues here I’m going to get into.
One is culture. You argue that we should teach rapists not to rape. Ordinarily, I’d agree. But how many would-be rapists would give a shit if you taught them? I’m not even arguing “none of them.” In cultures even more rape- and abuse-permissive than the United States, such techniques are actually effective in dramatically *reducing* rape, to levels that are still pretty horrific in any other context. In the United States, on the other hand, rapists are a very small part of the population, and their broad reach is because each rapist generally has many victims. Something like a quarter only rape once–maybe they actually do have empathy and can’t bring themselves to do it again after seeing how much they actually hurt their victim the first time. It’s inexact, but let’s say we could reach a *quarter* through teaching rapists not to rape. A quarter. That’s not nothing. It has value. By all means, go for it. It just leaves three-quarters of the problem to go.
Another is law enforcement. There are numerous problems here, only *one* of which is that American police are corruption incarnate, and something like, what, forty percent of them are abusers themselves? Even after getting through that, there are further problems like how frequently police can’t stop a crime in progress, only take reports and collect evidence for prosecution afterwards, after which point the damage has done. Clearly it would be better if we could trust the police, but right now we can’t. I’m certain you agree the police need to be massively reformed, probably for many reasons, but that’s a huge bloody war unto itself. It’d also be far better if police were quicker to put rapists behind bars so that each one reached fewer victims and to make an example of them to frighten other would-be rapists into behaving, but I’d still hate to be one of the initial targets. And it’d also be better if we had a perfect, immediately responsive police force in which we could totally entrust our safety… but we can’t, and we can never have that. I’d argue that there’s inherent danger in totally entrusting our safety to police and completely dissolving any responsibility for civilians to defend themselves or their loved ones, and this is probably where we’re going to disagree.
And a last problem is… who *is* society, but the people in it? Yeah, I fantasise about a world where would-be rapists get killed by the people they would have victimised, because poetic justice speaks to me. But you’re right; safety isn’t just the responsibility of those who might be victimised: it’s everyone’s responsibility. And yet, RAINN (the Rape, Abuse, and Incest National Network) still carries information about how to protect yourself and the people you care about from rape and abuse. And I’d argue that one of the major drivers of the impunity of rapists and abusers of women is that women are viewed as passive victims. Rapists and abusers don’t fear women. They don’t fear what will happen to them if they rape or abuse. They need to be afraid. Sure: I’ll grant that fear of potential victims alone isn’t enough, especially in the case of children and the disabled. But where gendered imbalances of power are concerned, force is one of the most fundamental forms of power, and I have trouble envisioning a world where there isn’t a major gendered imbalance of power until gender parity improves regarding willingness to use force. Anyway.
I don’t think mere education-of-would-be-rapists or even legal approaches alone go far enough. And I even agree with a lot of the ideas put forth by less aggressive leftists when it comes to culture needing to take rape seriously. But a gentle pacifist I am not, and I am not willing to stop at those solutions alone. Even Allison the bloodthirsty animal that feels childlike glee when women use physical force to defeat or even kill a would-be abuser or rapist can agree with Allison the human being that the best solution is a latticework of educating the minority of would-be rapists that can be reached through empathy, law enforcement that takes rape seriously to threaten would-be rapists with incarceration and to cage perpetrators, and a society where able-bodied, able-minded adults are willing and able to use force to defend themselves and the people they care about–and where abusive men *fear* women rather than seeing them as passive prey.
But some time ago I gave myself a thought experiment where I considered whether I’d rather have a world that’s less violent but more patriarchal, or a world that’s less patriarchal but more violent, and even in my most gentle moments I’d pick the latter in a heartbeat. And I’m not even uncomfortable admitting it.
LG asked me, rewritten how?
In the case of Ms. Alexander, Florida’s Stand Your Ground law specifically excluded domestic violence, which is bullshit of the highest order. More generally, long-term abuse isn’t considered a valid cause to use force in self-defense, which is why “Battered Women’s Syndrome” is an argument that has to get made in court. Broad strokes: domestic abuse absolutely should be regarded as cause for the use of force in self-defense, so that women who use violence to defend themselves against domestic abuse don’t have to be pathologised as having “Battered Women’s Syndrome.” Then again, this argument is as old as Andrea Dworkin, so I’m not covering any new territory here.
Pandapool: Nice strawman. I was tempted to respond in kind, but I won’t. Counterargument: you don’t need to be a “fighting machine” to be willing or able to use force, and while there’s an argument that *some* rapists could be reached through education, many will flat-out have to be *intimidated* into not raping or *forced* to not rape. Fear of retribution is an essential component of morality; empathy alone isn’t enough. And when even fear doesn’t work, force is absolutely required.
Weirwood: thank you for taking me seriously, and I don’t consider your concerns insignificant. Disabled people are an example of people who need to be protected, as are children–I’d certainly *hope* a child could count on their parents to protect them. I’d also argue that self-confidence and aggression *can* protect to no small degree against coercion: women who played competitive sports in their youth, for instance, are significantly more likely to stand up to abusers. It’s easier to say “no” to someone if you think you have the right to put your safety ahead of what someone else wants from you. Drugs and legal corruption are the hard parts, though, but I can’t claim not to be sympathetic to Malcolm X’s idea that black people should own guns and be willing to use them to defend themselves from white violence. Allison the pragmatic human being sees the problem; Allison the bloodthirsty animal wants it to happen yesterday.
@Allison
“Disabled people need to be protected.”
Patronizing. Mental or physical, disabled people get seen as lesser, sometimes even as inhuman — so why do we (I’m autistic, so I cannot speak to the physical end) get to be in the same boat we’re in now? Last I saw, I think some 80% of autistic women are raped at some point in their lives, so it’s obviously not working for us to be “protected,” is it? In fact, it’s usually the “protectors” doing it!
And women of color would have a very hard time in court afterwards, if they shot a would-be rapist — rape culture is not the only problem our culture has. Same with trans women.
So your proposed solution is one for cis, white, able-bodied, able-minded women who are attacked by strangers that don’t have the sort of connections that would end up with the woman jailed, and therefore no solution at all. Fearing guns would only drive rapists towards more vulnerable targets — marginalized women. They need to fear retaliation from society more than their targets, because there will *always* be women who aren’t in a position to defend themselves.
Somehow this became a teal deer. >_>
@Allison
Also, hoping doesn’t keep parents from raping their children. I, thankfully, come from a loving, supportive family, but not everyone is that lucky. And abusive parents probably won’t be teaching their daughters to respect themselves, protect themselves, et cetera, you know?
andiexist: well, shit. Thanks for explaining how there are no solutions that don’t cause as many problems as they solve. In a different thread I’d probably be making the same arguments you’re making now. Could I at least ask you to argue with the people who proposed “disabled people” as a counterargument to a culture where self-defense is accepted, and not just me? I was responding to weirwood. Could you tell them they’re patronising disabled people?
This is probably why I fantasize about rapists dying more than I fantasize about a peaceful, just world. Easier to suspend my disbelief.