Over on men’s rights hate site A Voice for Men, Attila Vinczer has found the true villain in the case of Walter Scott, the black man shot in the back after he ran from a white cop: Don’t blame the cop for shooting and killing a man who was no danger to him whatsoever; blame the ex-wife who simply wanted Scott to pay the child support he owed:
Another AVFM commenter seconded Vinczer’s, er, interpretation of events.
As did someone called TLC:
Over on the Men’s Rights subreddit, the regulars, to their credit, were a bit more reluctant to see this as a Men’s Rights issue rather than a “white cop shooting black man despite being in no danger at all” issue. Well, some of them were, in any case. The others posted comments like this:
Dungone decided to spread the blame to evil feminists eager to cash in on sweet, sweet child support payments.
InBaggingArea offered the most succinct explanation:
It’s true that Scott owed child support. He had four children with two ex-wives and apparently owed thousands of dollars in child support for his two younger children; his family says this is the likely reason he ran, though we can’t be sure. Despite being behind on his payments, he was reportedly on good terms with his children, and saw them regularly.
Scott’s funeral was held today.
H/T — r/againstmensrights
Wasn’t a huge reason his being jailed for being in arrears that SC has child support paid directly to the state if the custodial parent is recieving aid?
I’m not saying that that’s right or justified (it isn’t), but it does place yet another layer between the EBIL WIMMEN and the case itself.
A bit of googling tells me that the victim in that case was a Latino man.
I mean, Wikipedia has a list page of police officers convicted of murder. Browsing around it, we find mob-related killings, premediated killings (mainly of women), and at least one serial killer who was also a cop. But no victims who were unarmed black men or boys among the cases that resulted in conviction.
People don’t go to jail for failing to pay their child support, they go to jail for being in contempt of court. You can owe child support, and as long as in the eyes of the court you’re making a good faith effort towards doing your part, then you’re golden.
In other words, judges are usually pretty hesitant to throw men in jail, because they know that men can’t pay from jail. For a judge to find a man in contempt of court he most likely either completely dropped the ball in failing to file a motion to modify when hiz financial circumstances changed, or he’s one of those assholes who “needs” a new car and phone and is all shocked when he doesn’t have enough money left over to pay support. Although I’m not too surprised that most men in jail are black. Because as we all know; black men are deadbeats who want to spend their money on jewelry instead of their kids, right, right?/s 9_9
Child support collection is becoming the industry, though. Those private collection agencies scare the shit out of me. I’m sure there’s no room for abuse there, right right? /s
@proxieme “Wasn’t a huge reason his being jailed for being in arrears that SC has child support paid directly to the state if the custodial parent is recieving aid?”
AFAIK usually Social services, (or whatever it’s called in whatever state), takes on any case for which it’s help is requested, regardless of the mother’s income. Supposedly, by law, whether the mother is on welfare/aid or not can not come into play at all .
Return of kings posted an a piece blaming the germanwimgs crash on the pilots girlfriend who was pregnant and recently broke up with him. Apparently (and I’m not making this up) he was distraught about the invetible separation from his not yet born child because you know all women eventually take their kids away from their father out of spite. They actually said this made his action justifiable because he suffered from … get this… “Beta male rage.”
I would post the link but I don’t know your policy about links.
Hey MRA assholes: I know that most of you are libertarians or free staters or Republicans or Tea Party members, so chew on this a bit: In a real welfare state, there would be no child support payments because children would get their stipends from the state. You’d be 100% equal to the women in the parental sense and in every other way. Only in a true socialist welfare state can men truly cast off their shackles. So you must evolve your political/economic views to get what you truly want, True Equality of the Sexes. You know, the goal of all MRA’s everywhere?
Wow! You guys are as on point here as the MRA’s are off point there.
Keep it up!
Meanwhile, the officer who shot Scott has a prior record of police brutality towards black men.
But no, let’s blame the ex-wives, and not the entrenched (and bloody fucking OBVIOUS) racist biases of the law enforcers.
It’s not that there can’t ever be a discussion about child support laws, but this is a ridiculous time to have one. Walter Scott’s child support record is completely besides the point here (especially since the shooting was at a traffic stop, and the cop presumably had no knowledge of the situation with his ex-wife–you might as well blame laws making it illegal to drive with a broken taillight and that would actually be less absurd).The point he was unarmed and running away when a cop shot him, and that he’s not an isolated incident but part of a trend.
Just like Wilson had no any knowledge of Brown “Stealing” (in quotes because I read somewhere that the store owner said he bought them legitimately, but I can’t find the article so correct me if I’m wrong) the cigars but it was still thrown about as if he did. (And even in some alternate universe where he did – stealing smokes is still not a death penalty offense.)
Yep. No trend at all. *rolls eyes*
The biggest problem I’m running into with this case, with respect to the people in my life who are not the most self-reflective and non-racist folks I know (spoiler alert: it’s my parents), is the same one I encountered after it came out that Trayvon Martin might have done some marijuana at some point. There’s this attitude that if black men (or black boys) are not the most perfectly angelic individuals who would put Jesus Christ to shame in their virtue, it’s perfectly okay to kill them.
We don’t actually, officially, put people to death in this county for smoking pot, and the notion that Trayvon Martin smoking pot at some point somehow justified a random vigilante killing him is so beyond absurd and racist that I honestly don’t know how to respond to it. But I ran into it so often. I can’t even describe to you how often this came up.
So now, we again have a black man who did something that is mildly illegal and he got gunned down, and now those kind of racist people in my life can’t shut the hell up about the child support thing. Getting behind on child support is not a capital offense but you’d never know it from listening to them.
You know, my dad admitted to me that he smoked marijuana when he was younger, but for some reason he doesn’t seem to think he forfeited his basic human rights when he did that. It’s only African Americans to whom this rule applies, apparently.
It’s also not a black thing (Paul Fucking Elam being a big, white case in point), but you’d never know that to listen to them, either.
The quotes are from the Huff Po article I linked to earlier.
I’m interested in discussing Scott’s child support issues because I view the system in South Carolina as horrifically broken to the point where it’s prime example of ongoing criminalization of the poor. In South Carolina contempt for non-payment a jailable offense but it’s one of the few states that don’t provide the poor with free legal representation to fight the charge. The only people (98%!) who end up in jail for contempt are the poor, the majority of whom are black, who couldn’t afford to pay for legal representation and therefore had none.
Since MRAs are adverse to research and uninterested in the problems of people not exactly like themselves they act as if the rise of new debtor prisons only involve men paying child support. In fact it’s the rise of government money making scheme involving ridiculous fines for misdemeanors and legal fees that the poor can’t afford to pay that have brought back debtor’s prisons.
Despite child support being one of AVfM’s pet topics, they’re completely incapable of saying anything useful, insightful or even factual about the subject. They’d rather blame the mother in all sorts of ridiculous ways and/or nonsensical demands that child support payments simply be eliminated.
Has there ever been a MRA who was well-versed in a topic and came up with a substantial public policy proposal that was not pulled from their ass? I’m guessing no. This is why their conferences are just a poorly attended fan get togethers.
This is a bit of an link vomit, sorry:
Here’s a devastating report on the criminalization of poverty.
http://www.ips-dc.org/the-poor-get-prison-the-alarming-spread-of-the-criminalization-of-poverty/
Here’s an article about the topic in relation to Ferguson.
https://news.vice.com/article/st-louis-suburbs-ferguson-and-jennings-sued-over-debtors-prisons-criminalizing-poverty
Here’s a report on how unfair bail amounts have lead to mass incarceration and is used force the poor into taking unfavorable plea deals.
Bail Fail: Why the U.S. Should end the practice of using money for bail
http://www.justicepolicy.org/uploads/justicepolicy/documents/bailfail_executive_summary.pdf
Hey MRA assholes: I know that most of you are libertarians or free staters or Republicans or Tea Party members, so chew on this a bit: In a real welfare state, there would be no child support payments because children would get their stipends from the state.
The Red Pill subreddits have some regulars in European countries where this is the case, and they STILL complain about it. They blame their taxes on women and rant about how feminists are stealing men’s hard-earned tax money. No, really.
A homicide could be committed in an isolated monastery, with both the victim and perpetrator being monks, and MRAs could still blame women somehow.
@ zolnier
Monks are the ur example of ‘men going their own way’ so that’s obviously women’s fault. If they weren’t so damn alluring and distracting with their womanly wiles then men wouldn’t be distracted and could do all their (whatever it is monks do) without having to isolate themselves.
Plus the Incels would probably whine that the nearby convent should’ve sent nuns to service them.
The moment I heard that his family was saying he’d run because of issues with child support, I knew this was gonna happen. They’re not just horrible human beings, they’re DULL horrible human beings. It’s the old truth about the banality of evil.
Oh, and posting a bit of brainbleach, industrial strength,to deal with this shit:
http://i.imgur.com/mjQiNrm.jpg
How much do you bet that all the guys blaming Scott’s death on the evil matriarchy are white as snow?
Also, there is definitely a nuanced, grown-up conversation to be had surrounding the penalties for non-payment of child support and how they disproportionately punish poor black men. But mras don’t want to have that conversation. They want to fuck women bareback with no consequences because condoms are hard, and ignore their own children except to use them as props to show how great they are.
Someone upthread mentioned the Last Week Tonight where John Oliver covered municipal violations and the return of debtors’ prison. Just thought I’d drop the video here (Youtube link here in case it doesn’t embed).
What always gets me about the criminalization of poverty, is that a lot of times it’s not even the law but the uneven enforcement of the law which is the problem. I know it seems odd, but poor people can’t really afford drugs. It’s middle class and higher kids/college students/families who aren’t searched but have the contraband.
Of course, there is also the whole “Everyone is equally banned from sleeping under bridges.” bullshit. Thanks a lot for the links here on some of that everyone. I think John Oliver is doing a great job making what are essentially lectures/primers to help unfamiliar people approach difficult topics. With the spread of those links on youtube, I feel almost like his show is a public service.
This whole topic makes me angry and I am probably bouncing around a bit here.
The situation and the responses remind me of the limitation Kansas put on spending of welfare money recently. This also ties in the drug tests prior to welfare/SNAP benefits. We, meaning American society, continue to act like poverty is a choice caused by moral failings. (I don’t want to pretend to have a huge insight into other societies on this.)
May I suggest “monkey business” as an answer to whatever it is monks do?
I fail to see the controversy in any of this. The man was afraid of being thrown back in debtors prison, ran and was shot. If the sexes were reversed then it’d of been “the patriarchy” which killed her.