So there’s a giant, growing, and extremely creepy megathread up on Reddit at the moment, and for once, the creepiness isn’t coming from inside the Reddit. Well, less of the creepiness is coming from Reddit than you might expect.
Yesterday, you see, a Redditor known as BA_Baracus posted a couple of simple questions to AskReddit: Women of Reddit, when did you first notice that men were looking at you in a sexual way? How old were you and how did it make you feel?
This wasn’t the first time he’d posted a question to his fellow Redditors; he’s posted a bunch, including “People of reddit with eyes that point in different directions, which one of them is usually looking at me?” and, er, “Recent rape victims of Reddit, how did it happen, and what the hell were you doing in India?” None of these questions got much of a response.
But this time, well, thousands of “women of Reddit” stepped forward to tell the horrifying yet in most cases completely unsurprising stories of the first time men started perving on them, in many cases before they were even teenagers.
Here’s a sampling of some of their stories. TRIGGER WARNING for extreme fucking creepiness.
Age 8, followed to a department store changing room
Age 8, molested by a landlord
Age 12, at a bus stop
11 or 12, walking to and from school
Age 12, waiting for carryout
Age 11, creepy step-grandfather
Age 12, creepy step-uncle
Age 10, wearing a Lion King backpack and light-up shoes
Age 12, creepy cell phone salesman
Age 11, walking home from the beach
Age 12, in Blockbuster (with bonus Reddit creepiness)
14, eating a lollipop
Age 12, eating a banana
Naturally, some Redditors decided to add to the creepiness:
And all this makes pretty clear just why we need age of consent laws:
Of course, many of these creepy guys are well aware that the targets of their creepiness are a long way away from being “legal.”
Check out the thread for countless more stories like this.
H/T — u/Iwillpixiecutyou on Reddit
I didn’t read any of this but excuse me I need to pull a knife out of my heart 🙁
I sincerely hope that the OP asked this as a joke, and he’s going over every. Single. Response.
I’m also tempted to make a Reddit account just to post my story in there.
Gah…I saw on fb a whole bunch of people arguing how /clearly/ all those stories are made up for sensationalism. Because reasons. (Yeah time to hit the defriend button)
🙁
I can’t even.
I don’t think I want to check out that thread.
…I am morbidly curious about the MRA responses to that though.
@Amanda: This kind of stuff is great for a Facebook Friend Purge.
What is particularly disturbing is that in so many of these situations the victim was clearly a child.
Now I’m not saying it would be acceptable even if the victim was an adult; but it’s the fact that so many of these instances occurred in public areas with other people around and the perpetrator wasn’t worried about the reaction.
It seems analogous to the “I wouldn’t rape a woman” but then only defining rape as holding a knife to a stranger’s throat apologia.
Presumably these guys are rationalising things to themselves as “It’s not paedophilia if she’s….”
Actually, I had to stop there. I thought I might be able to come up with some rationalisation they might use, but I couldn’t think of one. I just don’t get it. I thought even the scuzziest of men drew the line at paedophilia.
These are awful, I’m really sorry to hear that this is how it happens for so many… let’s not mince words – young girls. When you grow up male, you never have this experience of having predators after you and never have to think about it – it’s only recently that I realized just how common it is.
The rationalization goes like this: “That girl pleases my boner. I should tell her about it, because the pleasure of my boner is the most important thing in the world, and it will please my boner even more if I can make her uncomfortable. Also, she is clearly too young to have developed the defense mechanisms that older women have, so there will be almost no risk to me.” Then they carry through on this plan of action. It’s a risk/benefit analysis conducted from an entirely self-centered perspective, without even the glimmer of a thought that the girl in question is actually a person and that it’s wrong to harm her by shoving an adult man’s sexuality into her face.
It was never that dramatic for me. When my friends and I were between 12 and 14, we began to notice that young men sometimes shouted at us as we were walking down main streets. At the time we kind of liked it because it made us feel grown-up, but by 16 or so we understood the real implications and were completely uncomfortable and disgusted with our previous naivete.
When I was 18, I attended a summer program in a post-industrial town that was the worst place I’ve EVER encountered for catcalling. After the first few days there, none of us girls would walk alone. One time a truckload of guys pulled into a parking lot my group was crossing and circled us yelling before they sped off again.
I quickly picked up my local friend’s habit of flipping people off, but a 17 year old I hung out with was from the country and had never encountered this at all. She was very upset and kept asking us why the men were acting like that. After some consideration, I told her I thought they just needed us to *know* they were looking at us. A “look what I can do” sort of gesture. She didn’t buy it because she couldn’t understand why that would matter to anyone, but I still think I’m right on a level.
One day I was walking with her and a car honked coming up behind us. I spun around and was raising my hand to “salute” when I recognized my teacher and his wife, evidently heading home for the weekend. I managed to turn my gesture into a normal wave in time, thank god, because I’d have had to wait til Monday to explain that to them. Everyone thought it was pretty funny when I told the story, and it was, but that town got on my nerves and I was never so happy to return to my own city where I only get yelled at maybe one time per mile.
“Also, she is clearly too young to have developed the defense mechanisms that older women have, so
there will be almost no risk to meI will have a better chance with her.”Are they hoping that this 13-year-old will be the nymphet of their dreams? Or do they get off on fear?
I’m one of the lucky ones, I guess, having “only” been flashed on elementary school grounds at 12 or 13. I’ve heard so much worse and it just hurts my heart.
When I had just turned 15 and was a late bloomer who looked younger, that was when I first started getting cat called. My friend who had just turned 13 and I walked about 2 or 3 miles to a pool we liked to frequent. We decided to count the number of whistles and shouts we got. It was over 30. Some of them were from teenage boys, but most were from adult men. We were naive and proud of the attention at the time, but the next year I got stalked for an entire day by a middle aged man. After that, I realized it wasn’t a complement, it was predatory behavior.
My friend was the girl I discussed in a different thread a few months ago who had a 24 year old boyfriend at age 14.
And, true to form, other redditors are calling them names. See Cheezit624’s remark that she’s already received a PM telling her that “12 year old slutty me wanted it”.
Anyone who wants to make a Reddit account to tell their own story should be ready for those PMs. You might be willing to do a bit of skirmishing with a few lunkheads, but one thing you shouldn’t be is surprised. Might be worth thinking about possible responses or reports before you get started – then you’ll be pleasantly surprised when you get supportive rather than insulting messages.
My opinion is that, in general (there are exceptions), it’s nothing less or more than an expression of power. “I can make you uncomfortable, maybe even afraid, and it’s so effortless!” I don’t think they’re hoping or expecting to get laid (as a rule – again, exceptions). They just want to make some little girl upset because they enjoy having that kind of power. No different from pulling the wings off of flies, and with just as much moral weight invested in the action.
“They just want to make some little girl upset”
You know, in a way that’s even more creepy (if such were possible) than acting out of some misguided expression of inappropriate sexual attraction.
Although I suppose that does tie in with my thesis (that I keep repeating, sorry!) that on the whole MRA types sole rationale is that they get a kick from annoying/terrifying women. (Nothing to do with promoting men’s rights, or even actively trying to act against feminism)
@kraverknow
Sadly, I’ve heard of many.
“It’s not pedophilia if she looks older.”
“It’s not pedophilia if she’s a bad girl.”
“It’s not pedophilia if she totally wants it.”
“It’s not pedophilia if she’s already sexually experienced.”
See:
http://www.slate.com/blogs/xx_factor/2012/11/29/cleveland_texas_rape_case_defense_attorney_calls_pre_teen_victim_a_spider.html and also a horrifying amount of literary criticism arguing the 12-year-old was totally the manipulative one in “Lolita.”
Hey, why aren’t I Alan any more?
I have my own story, like everyone else here. It’s strange because reading those accounts, it makes me realize that this is just how things *are*. It wasn’t just me.
My story (I may share it later, but I don’t feel like it right now) is not the worst, but was of course traumatic. (Older boys groping a well-developed 11-year-old me.) The thing that I remember was the fear that *I* was to blame. *I* had done something wrong. That I “had it coming” even though I was the most sheltered, innocent 11 year old out there.
I think part of this belief came from having bullying against me ignored, not being listened to when I complained (at school to the teacher or at home to parents) when I wasn’t treated right. Authority figures (teachers, parents) often wouldn’t believe me. Why would they suddenly believe me now?
So I never told anyone, because I’d already been conditioned to believe that no one believes you anyway.
I don’t advocate believing kids when they make claims of molestation or abuse, just immediately believing them, because sometimes kids lie, and it’s pretty horrendous to be falsely accused. But to be automatically *not* believed is equally horrendous. All it does is condition you to expect that you’ll *never* be believed. It opens the door for becoming a victim of abuse over and over again, since you already believe that no one is going to be in your corner, that you’re on your own, and in fact, if something bad happens to you, *you’ll* be blamed for it. So you decide that it’s better to just never say anything.
Because of this early, unwanted, creepy attention, I gained weight in a not-so-subconscious attempt to make some of it go away. It kind of worked, but made my boobs and butt even bigger, so that wasn’t so good. In addition, we already know how angry weight gain on women makes some guys, so I got the creepy attention for the boobs and butt, as well as the anger for the weight gain.
The thing that makes me angry is that the weight gain was at least partly a response to the creepy attention, and yet I was constantly “blamed” for that too. I couldn’t win for losing. Lose weight, get creepy attention, or gain weight, and get creepy attention plus blame and hatred.
Oh, now I am again; weird.
@ suffrajitsu
Yeah, I can see people using those; but in many of the cases outlined there isn’t even that excuse. The victims were obviously just children acting and dressing in clearly childlike ways.
Oh, there’s definitely a sexual attraction component. Don’t let me mislead you in that respect. I just don’t believe that they’re doing it out of some wrongheaded notion that there is an actual possibility of getting laid. They’re doing it because they like to exert power (sexual power, I should have said) over persons who present as female, but adult women are less likely to cry and more likely to call the police. Girls make easier prey.
That’s what I’ve concluded from my experiences.
See, this isn’t a reason all men should be expected to walk on egg shells around every woman. BUT it is an example of why they need to be conscious of how women are treated sexually in the world, and consider that when they approach a woman who might find them threatening. They really do start to act like it’s an exaggeration after a while, and sadly it’s just not.
I wish I could remember at what preteen age men started catcalling or making lewd suggestions, but I spent a few hours being molested when I was 8, and after that, the kind of behavior in question is all kind of blurry timeline wise. I think I was 11 or 12 the first time the kids in my apartment complex had to report a creepy car with blacked-out windows stalking our bus stop.
But as we sadly know, most of these stories are just words and gestures – the real dangers are rarely from the outside. My molester might have been a stranger to me, but he didn’t pick me up at a store or in a van with candy – my babysitter lived with her mom, and her mom came home drunk with her boyfriend one night, while my sister and I were asleep on couches in their family room. She passed out, he didn’t, and I spent the night being frenched, fondled and asked if I was a virgin – in an accent that would’ve been thick enough if he hadn’t been shitfaced on really cheap beer – just trying to keep him quiet enough not to wake my little sister, lest he start messing with her.
This is the world women have to navigate. And not only is it not just the “pretty” girls, it’s too often the ones who are awkward or underwhelming, because they seem the most vulnerable to predators.
Okay, question:
When I was 7, my family went on a trip to Canada. We booked a tour and part of it involved boarding a boat somewhere (don’t remember where). My mom and I were hanging out on the deck with the other tourists when a white-haired man in his 60s or so struck up a conversation with us.
He commented on how pretty I was, which I wasn’t particularly weirded out by since I was 7 and lots of random adults will tell parents how cute their kids are at their age. Then he asked if I’d be his girlfriend. I thought that was kind of weird, but my mom was right there and I guess I thought he was teasing/flattering. I don’t even remember how the rest of the conversation went, but when we were about to leave he kissed me on the cheek. I don’t remember my mom reacting to it then but she complained about it to my grandma afterward.
I’ve wondered about it for a long time, but was I perved on by a pedophile or was it just an overly friendly old man coming across as creepy? I’ve thought about it since then and I feel like it was a really weird thing to do, but I can’t help but feel like I’m reading too much into it.
EW! EW! EW! EW! EW! EW! EW! EW! EW! EEEEEEEEEEEEW!
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Excuse me while I puke…