The We Hunted the Mammoth Pledge Drive will soon be coming to a close. If you haven’t already, please consider donating through the PayPal button below. (The PayPal page will say you are donating to Man Boobz.) Thanks!
Sluthate’s “shitty advice” forum, devoted to discussing such high-minded topics as “Do fat women have dirtier vaginas?” and “why is rape bad,” is a haven for embittered “incels” — self-described “involuntary celibates” — who’ve convinced themselves that they are too objectively unattractive and un-alpha to attract attention from the cruel and superficial “sluts” of the world — a category that seems to include all the women they find attractive.
Back when the forum was known as PUAhate, it was a regular hangout of one especially embittered incel, a young man known as Elliot Rodger, who last year killed six in Isla Vista California, and then himself, in what he called his “Day of Retribution” against women. Many of Sluthate’s regulars, unsurprisingly, have embraced “ER” as a kind of incel martyr.
Now they’ve found a new and improved hero: Andreas Lubitz, the troubled co-pilot who, French officials say, deliberately flew Germanwings Flight 9525 into a mountain in the French Alps.
In a topic entitled BREAKING: Co-pilot was incel and crashed the plane!!!, Sluthate regulars have embraced Lubitz as “one of them” — and are enthusiastically celebrating his alleged mass murder as the possible beginning of a “Beta uprising.”
“New high score, and in a much shorter time too,” a commenter calling himself gobman3000 wrote happily. “Damn, legitimate SLAYER.”
Alienfranco was even more enthusiastic:
What a fucking SLAYER.
Did you ever know that you’re my hero? You are the wind beneath my WINGS. …
Why go out with a whimper when you can go out with a BANG? An incel killing 150+ people will make a lot more of an impact than killing 1 asshole or a few assholes.
A large percentage of the 150+ people on that plane were sluts and Chads anyway.
Hopefully all these incel killings get to a point where society will fear autists/incels and give us $2000/month and subsidized prostitution to placate us from killing normalfags.
OmegaKV noted that many of the passengers on the plane “were teenagers who were vacationing,” concluding
This was DEFINITELY an incel motivated plane crash.
He couldn’t take it too see so many good looking and happy teenagers with gfs, experiencing the adolescence he always longed for but never got, so took advantage of the perfect opportunity to kill himself while taking the teenage normalfags with him.
PuaKiller agreed:
Yeah. He definitely knew what he was doing. I can only imagine what he was feeling in that moment. Wow. …
This one is going in the hall of fame!
Largely dismissing the news reports suggesting that Lubitz did, in fact, have a girlfriend, the regulars examined each new picture of the alleged mass murderer that appeared in the media for telltale signs of his incel status.
PJ1 was brutal in his assessment:
-looks like a manlet from his proportions. I’d honestly be surprised if he’s over 5 10
-small frame
-critical balding
-beta face
OldRooster1 agreed:
guy does look like an incel manlet that came to the realization that the status of being a pilot was not enough to overcome his 3.5/10 looks/body.
“Look at that frame, he’s about 60kg soaking wet,” Jigar added. “I’d be surprised if his wrists were a hair over 6 inches thick.”
Still another commenter labeled him a “betafaced framecel” — whatever that is — and “the kind of guy that’s INVISIBLE.”
These are harsh assessments, to be sure, and in some cases seem to have virtually no connection with the photographic evidence, but the Sluthate regulars tend to be equally harsh in their assessments of themselves. Thread-starter Zark_Muckerberg, for example, attaches a sig to each of his posts quantifying his romantic and sexual failures:
gfs: 0
kisses: 0
handjobs: 0
blowjobs: 0
intercourse: 0
Having convinced themselves that they will never be able to have a life equal to that of the world’s “good looking and happy … normalfags,” the Sluthaters feel Lubitz’ pain — or, at least, the pain they imagine he felt.
Flawed Mentat blamed the killings on an uncaring world that didn’t deliver Lubitz the “good woman” he deserved.
HE did not fire the first shot. Women and Society, blase, branded HIM as non human, invisible, an object of scorn and laughter. So, when it sunk in that all his effort was in vain, there were no good women awaiting him, life was gonna be just as empty, lonely and horrifying as before he even started training as a pilot, well, he probably logically decided to declare war back on the human race, since it was open in its war on him.
ThereIsNoGame agreed:
Just lol @ reddit comments saying how creepy it is that he didn’t think about the lives of all the people he killed.
Yeah, well what about all the people who never gave a fuck about him. He was probably treated like shit over and over again.
Society never looks itself in the mirror when it is to blame.
Don’t treat people like shit and shit wont happen. Why is that so hard to understand?
He ended his comment with this chilling warning-cum-threat.
looks like more people will need to die until the message is drilled in.
Zygominati directed his ire at a familiar target:
I blame feminism for this. In days gone by pilots would flirt with stewardesses and pinch their arses. They would leave their hotel room ajar for layover shenanigans. Now they are bus drivers in the sky that can’t even take a shit. This incel was probably sold a dream and after countless hours of flight time realised there is nothing there.
Meanwhile, the few Sluthaters who didn’t utterly dismiss the news reports of Lubitz having a girlfriend seized on the reports that the two had broken up — and blamed the girlfriend for “cucking” him. As Patriarch put it,
If its true that his girlfriend cucked or dumped him, just imagine how smug this entitled shitcunt must feel like right now. Looking at him, she was a 4 at best but now she gets her own little fairytale drama story and she gets to go on TV and talk about how awful she feels and how she never expected this to happen. In the aftermath, a bunch of whiteknights will whiteknight her into oblivion and probably donate a million € to her fundme so she can learn to deal with this tragedy…. Fucking feminist shitcunt society
It goes without saying that all of these embittered rants are based almost entirely on projection. We know very little about Lubitz, or what might have motivated him to (allegedly) crash the plane, killing 149 innocent human beings and himself.
While news reports suggest that he had suffered from depression and from some other mental illnesses as yet unnamed, these revelations raise more questions than they answer. Depression can certainly contribute to suicide, but mass murder? Mentally ill people are more likely to be victims of violence than victimizers.
While it seems clear that Lubitz was not literally an “incel” — he apparently did have a girlfriend — it’s certainly possible that he crashed the plane because he was upset over a breakup with that girlfriend, or angry at women in general.
That’s not a conclusion we can draw based on looking at Lubitz’s “waist-hip-ratio” or the size of his wrists. It’s a possibility we can raise based on our understanding of how murder/suicides unfold in the real world.
As I pointed out yesterday, murder/suicide is overwhelmingly a male crime, and the victims are often wives, girlfriends or exes. Breakups often trigger rage in men, and a few take this rage out on the women they feel have wronged them. Or, in extreme cases, on women in general. The intended targets of Elliot Rodger’s rampage were what the “spoiled, stuck-up, blonde slut[s]” in a local sorority. (Luckily, he was barred at the door and his plan collapsed.)
But even if Lubitz was driven by “incel rage” or something much like it, it’s worth pointing out that this rage is based on bullshit. Elliot Rodger was not objectively unattractive; his problems with women came from within, from a mixture of embittered entitlement, self-hatred and an assortment of other psychological demons.
Similarly, the rage of Sluthate’s incels is driven not by the actual behavior of women in the real world but by their fucked-up ideas about women — and themselves. Sluthaters hate themselves as much as they hate “sluts,” and project their own hyper-critical assessments of their own looks onto the women they think are perpetually judging them and finding them wanting. Ironically, they themselves view women with the same hyper-critical eyes, dismissing all but a handful of young, conventionally attractive women as “fugly hambeasts” and the like.
Sluthate reinforces a poisonous and supremely self-defeating way of looking at the world. Whether or not Lubitz was driven by “incel rage,” I think we have every reason to worry that Sluthate and other internet forums devoted to “incels” may be breeding more “heroes” like Elliot Rodger and, possibly, Andreas Lubitz.
My condolences to posters who lost family and friends in the crash, first of all.
And my sympathy with the people with autism in here today (‘autists’? Is that a word?! Do they mean painters or sculptors or what?) Ignoring for now the complete lack of any proof that the murderer was autistic, it actually would have been pretty wonderful to celebrate a person with autism rising through the corporate ranks to make co-pilot (and one day pilot) for a major airline – not exactly a beta/omega line of work! A guy who traveled the world and ran marathons and yep, even had a loving girlfriend. But that is not to be.
But go explain facts to these Sluthate people. It’s been past time to stop treating these people like an amusing nuisance. It’s been time for a pre-emptive roundup, as one poster put it. It’s been time to lock them all up.
@PussyPowerTantrum
I’d almost suggest pointing that guy in the direction of the various adaptations (movie, TV series, or two mangas) of “Train Man” (Densha Otoko) which is explictly about an introverted Otaku navigating his way out of a vicious cycle of isolation with the assistance of internet friends (sort of the diametric opposite of the sluthate). Sort of of an otaku version of “Marty”. (“Marty” is quite important to me in that when my father saw it, he had a moment of self realization, leading to a program of self improvement which led to him meeting my mother. Without “Marty” I quite literally wouldn’t exist.)
The protagonist is awkward, shy, and qute average in appearance. He makes a lot of mistakes, and nearly gives up at several points, but ends up in a stable healthy relationship. As a well adjusted shy introvert otaku myself, the movie brought me to tears at quite a few points.
I’m always suprised by the MRAs and other mysogonists latching onto a very specific and pernicious chunk of otaku culture, while ignoring all of the positive stories, and the generally well adjusted American fandom.
I always thought “autist” was a clever pun combining the words “autistic” and “artist,” since I’m both.
Uh, dude? THIS IS WHY YOU’RE NOT GETTIN’ ANY, YOU IDIOTIC BABOON TURD. YOU SCARE WOMEN OFF. YOU ARE NOT INVOLUNTARILY CELIBATE, YOU ARE WILLFULLY DISGUSTING. Nobody is gonna give you cookies for not running amuck.
(Sorry for the all-caps yelling, but it had to be said. I’ve had it with this idolatry of violence.)
Hmmm. Reading through later comments I realize I probably messed up in my earlier post. I probably should have said “autistic people”.
I am deeply sorry for my error!
And that’s why David’s post “When Men’s Rights Activists celebrate male rage, they make murder/suicides like the one that may have brought down Germanwings Flight 9525 more likely” is so important and right on target. That’s the context that some posters were missing.
No, they aren’t allowed to lump us autistics into their group. Trying to get people to fear us? WTF? Autism is already feared! People would rather risk their child dying of whooping cough or measles than have them be autistic. Many of us on the spectrum are actually working hard to stop people from fearing us.
Fuck.
And I have to read this bullshit right when I’m in the middle of helping support an autism acceptance campaign. Yes, autistic people can be violent, but it usually is because we’re completely overwhelmed and are not in control of ourselves. It’s terrifying from the inside. And honestly? Autistic people are more in danger of being the victims of violence than the perpetrators.
Sorry for the ASD rant, but this is a particular issue of mine.
THIS! Do these people not realize that when one autistic or mentally ill person commits horrific crimes, many of us feel the backlash and some of us can even be attacked or even killed by people who essentially say that they felt threatened by us. More likely, they don’t care. We don’t get paid, we get what rights we have restricted and taken away! Here’s the thing, even if it turns out that this (white) man was completely neurotypical, many people will refuse to believe that and argue that mental illness must be to blame.
Also, plenty of autistic people successfully handle romantic and/or sexual relationships. Some of us are even women, fancy that!
I’d like to leave some cheeky comment about the behaviour of MRAs on this thread, I really would. Normally that’s fairly easy: they’re usually whining with such incoherence and pettiness and breathtaking logical fallacies that the results can be entertaining, even hilarious.
This, though. There’s nothing funny or entertaining about this. This is sad and scary, and makes me think of how the “Trenchcoat Mafia” would have spoken to each other before Columbine, had 4Chan or social media been a thing back then.
Gives me the willies.
… I’m baffled by all the things these guys list as “he can’t possibly get laid because these reasons”.
I have like most of them, and I don’t think I’ve ever gone longer than three months without a girlfriend unless it was by choice. Maybe, gosh!, it’s actually your repellant personality!
Nah, that can’t be it. I must actually be 6’2″ and have a full head of hair and have never been severely depressed or chronically un- or underemployed.
Don’t mean to pick on some irrelevant detail with an irreverent joke, but trying to address the actual body of this leaves me with nothing to add but utter despair. And that they’d drag the autism spectrum into it is just beyond fucking reprehensible.
Because it’s never a problem with them or how they choose to act, it’s always something they have no control over! Like the width of their wrists or femicommunazi sluts! (All hail Katie)
The incel rhetoric is really appealing to guys who find themselves, for whatever reason, single for protracted periods of time, particularly if they don’t have many female friends. Because I both am perpetually single and have anxiety about my self-worth related to being single, I’d actually have been ripe fruit for the plucking by these people if I hadn’t been gay and mostly made female friends.
Since your friend can’t become gay, knowing women and becoming friends with them (friends in the absolutely-not-going-to-date sense, not the Nice Guy friends-in-hope-of-sex sense) is probably his best hope of being pulled out of that mindset, particularly friends who are versed in feminism. Which isn’t to say you’re obligated to be his friend, but realizing that feminists in particular and women in general are humans is more likely to bring him out than anything else.
And feminism, I might add, is something that has helped me gain a sense of self-worth. Feminism has helped me to realize that dating, or not dating, doesn’t define my worth as a person or even give a sense of my value; that my relationships with my friends and family are no less valid than romantic or sexual ones. It’s not been total, I still have major anxiety over being single, but feminism serves as a major reality check on that.
@Buttercup, that is such a flawless summary of everything about that forum. They’re just… so utterly bizarre and creepy. Like yes, I am so fucking sure it’s their wrist circumference that’s the problem, there is absolutely nothing else that could possibly be stopping them from forming meaningful relationships here.
@Linax5, I’m so sorry.
lacerta viridis:
I dunno… back in high school, this guy asked me out, and he had a really really low circumference wrist (I know, I always kept my trusty tape measure handy), and it totally turned me off men completely. I’ve been a lesbian ever since. True story.
Yeah, I bet the family and friends of the 150 people killed would absolutely LOVE to hear someone refer to them as ‘sluts and chads’ and I bet they would just love to have their murderer celebrated as hero-NOT. These MRAs are absolutely disgusting! No respect or regard to the 150 innocent people who have been killed at all! No, all they care about is their poor boners! >:-( They really believe that having their boners pleased is more important than the lives of others. It’s unbelievable, but sadly it’s true.
Paradoxical Intention-*Raises her arm in the Femicommunazi salute* Hail Katie! XD
I am not denying how delusional some of the ideas sluthate users hold are, like their hatred of modern liberalism or “$2000/month and subsidized prostitution to placate us from killing normalfags.”, but if there’s one thing they get (mostly) right, it’s looks. Media, advertisement, videogames – they all portray a certain ideal of appearance that has to be met for one to be considered fully human. If by some minor chance a short, ugly actor manages to play a visible role (Michael Cera, Jonah hill) he will only serve as an object of ridicule. In such a looks-obsessed society, where anything you do is perceived differently based on how attractive you are, it is only fair ugly people will feel rejected and wronged. Being a long time sluthate-lurker I can assure you that they do not hate the fact that people find beautiful people attractive, they only hate the facade that society conceals this simple fact with. Sluthaters hate dishonesty, they hate that instead of admitting it is their looks that are the problem, other people say they need to become more confident, or work on their body language, or do something as minor as getting a haircut or changing clothes. This also works the other way – most people can’t accept that someone is successful not because of the way he acts, but because of what he is by merit of genetics. This is a type of a coping strategy – by thinking that you don’t need to be attractive to get attractive people to date you, you give yourself hope that this 500$ real social dynamics disk will allow you to create a harem of models. As you can imagine, it is very depressing to be hurt and hated by the same people who assured you they would never do such a thing, out of fear to seem shallow.
I’d like to think that the Femicommunazi salute is a princess wave.
Elbow, elbow, wrist, wrist~
http://media.tumblr.com/525348b2c15591f1e9a50ee8203e32dd/tumblr_inline_n6kgy9Saom1rsu209.gif
My life for Katie! “princess wave”
5’10 is exactly average height for a man, and happens to be the perfect height for my Beloved to be – the key to great hugs is correct nipple alignment, you see.
If all these “incels” have 6″ thick wrists, maybe it’s because they masturbate too much.
… And I’m mostly trying to focus on the levity, because everything else in this post is just too chillingly awful for me to deal with right now.
Linax5, I am so sorry for the loss of your friend.
@ PussyPowerTantrum
I am going to base my response on my months of reading Captain Awkward’s excellent advice:
That is a shitty thing for him to do – threatening suicide in order to control people is emotional abuse and it is never ok. This guy is not being a friend to you. Not only are you not obligated to save him (nor are you likely to be able to), you’re not obligated to stay friends with someone who treats you like a toxic jerk.
If you think there’s anything salvageable, and want to continue your relationship with him, you can shut down any incel-related conversation with a simple “please don’t discuss this topic with me”. or “I’m not comfortable talking about this, please change the subject”. Use this twice and then disengage (say “ok, bye”, and then log out). But this guy is being abusive to you already and so I personally don’t think he’s worth your time and emotional energy.
I hope that helps, PPT
It is truly amazing how eager to demonize autistic people MRAssholes are. I mean, it’s almost like a movement that’s based in misogyny, transexterminationism, white ‘supremacy’, and entitlement is totally ableist, too.
Gosh, next you’ll tell me that they’re in favor of violence…oh, wait.
I wish we could put all incels into a plane and crash it into the Himalayas.
They just waste oxygen and food.
Hey Herbert, let’s not wish death and violence on people. Even if they are Sluthate-ers. We’re above their level (by a long, long shot).