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a voice for men feminism gender policing misogyny MRA PUA

The New Statesman's Margaret Corvid on the ways misogyny restricts male sexuality

Policing male sexuxality: a meme from A Voice for Men's Facebook page.
Policing male sexuxality: a meme from A Voice for Men’s Facebook page.

Check out Margaret Corvid’s fascinating piece in the New Statesman on male sexuality and the appeal of misogynistic movements to sexually frustrated men. As a professional dominatrix who’s also a feminist, she’s acutely aware of the ways conventional masculinity restricts and impoverishes male sexuality.

When I became a professional dominatrix after years in the kink scene, I expected my kinky work to involve lots of spanking, whipping and bondage. And, to my delight, it has. But in the majority of my sessions, I am creating a space for men to explore areas of their sexual lives that society feels are unmanly; they come to me to be penetrated, to be used, to serve, to submit, to worship, to be taken. A client might have any or all of a bewildering array of fetishes, but they mostly come to me to experience something well outside the very narrow confines of what society says that it means to be a man.

Unfortunately, as she notes, Men’s Rightsers and Pickup Artists offer nothing to men who feel confined by these narrow notions of manhood; indeed, their definitions of manhood are both retrograde and restrictive.

One of the greatest tragedies of the men’s rights movement is that, in the end, its lessons serve only to drive men further away from what they yearn for. Pick up artist techniques and aggrieved entitlement are unlikely to help men achieve the goal of intimacy, but feminist values can teach them the skills to communicate with respect.

You’ll notice a few quotes in there from me, from an email interview she did with me as well as from my post Is the Men’s Rights Movement driven by the rage of the rejected? (I also discussed the issue in this post on the weird sexual undercurrents in A Voice for Men’s Facebook “memes.”)

 

 

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kittehserf - MOD
9 years ago

HumourlessRadicalFeminazi, thanks!

friday jones – nice bit of projection you’ve got going there. Would it shock you to learn I’m reading sites written by trans women? That that’s where I got that information about the threats from?

As for the rest of it, get a grip.

friday jones
friday jones
9 years ago

I think I’ve said my piece, expressed my emotional response, and should probably stop using up the oxygen here while we entrench ourselves in a fruitless argument. I’m not flouncing or anything like that, just dropping the argument because it’s not helping anyone.

I’m probably not expressing myself well enough to get my point across, and I see no reason to make a big deal out of this when I’ve already expressed my emotional reaction to the stuff I read earlier today. I felt like I needed to say something, I did, and rather than continuing to argue over it I’ll let what I’ve already said stand, with one addendum: I have no grudge against Kittehserf for what she’s said in this argument, and I respect her for discussing this with me with minimal rancor.

HumourlessRadicalFeminazi
HumourlessRadicalFeminazi
9 years ago

@friday Jones

This isn’t some intellectual exercise for me, it’s my life, it’s my place in society, it’s my biological destiny.

I understand that this sense of urgency and personal risk about your future, your sudden cultural powerlessness and your role must make all dissent seem threatening. Sometimes, some of it is. But usually the actual threat is coming from the people in power. Whoever they are, they’re not calling Sheila Jeffreys for support.

Nequam
Nequam
9 years ago

Aaaand back to eccentric musical instruments I go.

katz
9 years ago

So.

This space is unfriendly to trans people.

This is not my subjective opinion; it is based on the fact that every openly trans person who has been a major contributor to this site has ended up leaving because they found it to hostile. Every single one. And friday jones doesn’t seem to be having a great time, either.

And you can argue until you’re blue in the face about how the things you guys say are completely reasonable and how the things that you’ve fought with trans people about are not transphobic and what not, but the fact remains that the way people here act makes trans people feel unwelcome. All of them. And frankly, I’m not sure I want to hang around a space that actively drives off trans people.

I’m not telling anyone to change their behavior, but if you don’t, you ought to accept that the result, however unintentional, is that this space feels hostile to trans people.

kittehserf - MOD
9 years ago

friday jones – thank you, and I apologise for my “get a grip” comment at the end; it was impatient and unhelpful. I don’t hold rancour against you, either. I know it’s a more immediate and emotional matter for you than for me – which isn’t to say there isn’t immediacy and emotion in it here; there is, but from a different perspective. But thank you for your restraint in these circumstances!

friday jones
friday jones
9 years ago

Eccentric musical instruments, eh? Well, I did make this here 8-string Kithara Lyre recently:
https://imageshack.com/i/nnlyre03j

kittehserf - MOD
9 years ago

You made that? That’s impressive! Does it sound as you want (total non-starter with musical instruments here).

HumourlessRadicalFeminazi
HumourlessRadicalFeminazi
9 years ago

@katz

This is the thing I don’t get. We constantly make jokes about the hive mind. The grand total of people who have questions about some aspects of trans activism is probably less than the number of closeted or out trans readers/ commenters, and certainly a drop in the bucket compared to the total commentariat. You know the mammotheers would not for a minute condone violence against teams people as individuals or as a group or language that denigrated them, so how do we create a hostile thread from that?

I mean, one or two people disagree with your self concept on a thread where your situation isn’t often discussed. It doesn’t mean the whole thread hates you.

friday jones
friday jones
9 years ago

Here is a Soundcloud clip of my lyre that I made right after I rebuilt it earlier this year:
https://soundcloud.com/butthedd-studios-presents/lyre2test

I rebuilt it with better materials (an updated pic is at the Soundcloud link) last Spring because I needed something to distract me while my mother was hospitalized (I am a worrywart).

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
9 years ago

Soundcloud link is showing as not found for me! Wrong link, maybe?

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
9 years ago

And now it shows. Weird.

friday jones
friday jones
9 years ago

I bet it was the “s” in the https. Let’s see if my hypothesis is correct:
http://soundcloud.com/butthedd-studios-presents/lyre2test

kittehserf - MOD
9 years ago

cassandra, I had to download it to get the sound coming through.

friday jones, that is a lovely sound! Reminds me of a wire-strung harp, but – warmer? More mellow? Can’t really describe the difference.

I hope your mother came through hospital all right. That’s a worrying time indeed – been there.

HumourlessRadicalFeminazi
HumourlessRadicalFeminazi
9 years ago

Sorry if this is a repost. “Teams” should be “trans ” in my last comment.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
9 years ago

It wasn’t there, and then I commented and the page refreshed and it was. WordPress is weird.

friday jones
friday jones
9 years ago

@Kittehserf: Unfortunately, she didn’t make it. She passed on a couple of days after my last birthday. 2014 is officially the worst year of my entire life. So glad it’s over!

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
9 years ago

There is no good time to lose your mother. Mine died 20 years ago, and it still hurts, but it does get a bit easier eventually. Give yourself time to grieve, and let yourself miss her, because you’re always going to on some level.

HumourlessRadicalFeminazi
HumourlessRadicalFeminazi
9 years ago

Very sorry to hear that Friday. Here’s hoping 2015 is the best and that you get all the support.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
9 years ago

My mum died exactly a week after my birthday too, btw. It makes birthdays kind of suck.

kittehserf - MOD
9 years ago

friday jones, I’m so sorry. Seconding the hope that this year is much, much better.

sunnysombrera
sunnysombrera
9 years ago

Been reading back through comments and would like to formally retract my comment that Friday is/was a troll. Thanks to kitteh for correcting me.

ParadoxicalIntention
ParadoxicalIntention
9 years ago

Fourthing the hopes that your year is much better. My grandpa died on my 20th birthday, and it was terrible for everyone in my family.

Hugs if you want them.

Tracy
Tracy
9 years ago

nthing the hopes that 2015 is a much better year, @friday jones.

Also @proxieme, hope you’re feeling better. Ugh.

(Just got caught up, hello all)

HumourlessRadicalFeminazi
HumourlessRadicalFeminazi
9 years ago

@katz

I’m sorry, on rereading my comment it sounds like I’m asking you to prove there was hostility. I’m not. I don’t dispute that those that left because of attitudes like mine felt keenly hurt, and I know intent isn’t magic.
This should be an “everyone except mra’s” safe space. Given that this community has some trans members and terfs and some who just wish we would stfu already, and, as another example of opposing views, bdsm practitioners, anti bdsmers etc, we need to be able to express our views when the issues come up. Otherwise we’re a bit shit at this social justice thing. If the cost of a trans friendly space is not being able to even talk about how trans activism affects women, then it’s not a safe space.

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