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Attention ladies who have sex with men! The sex you are having now is a crime against the hypothetical man or men you will have sex with in the future. At least according to some Red Pill douchebags.
Yesterday, you may recall, we looked at a bizarre and nasty post by pickup guru Roosh Valizadeh that argued, among other things, that all women who aren’t virgins are essentially “soft cuckolding” their future husbands. Because, evidently, any man who marries a woman not only owns her in the present; he retroactively owns her past self as well.
Today, in Reddit’s Red Pill subreddit, we find a fellow called redpilltom making a very similar – if slightly less extreme – argument about women and their sexual pasts.
In a post titled “Never date a woman who won’t do sexual things with you that she did with her other partners,” redpilltom argues that if a woman ever agreed to any sexual act in the past she owes it to you as well.
[I]f you ever, and I mean ever, find out that she did something with an ex that she refuses to do with you, drop her. Drop her fast and drop her hard. This goes from giving it up on X number of dates, to certain sexual acts that you want to do, to threesomes, to the frequency of sex.
Yep. As redpilltom sees it, if a woman says yes to anal sex with one man, she’s obliged to say yes to every future partner who wants anal. To refuse would be a deep insult to whoever she’s dating – and evidence that she sees her current partner as the simpering “beta” in the Red Pill catchphrase “Alpha fucks, Beta bucks.”
It is not only the #1 sign of being on the losing end of the AF/BB relationship, but it screams “Oh, well I felt I needed to impress and be good to them, but you seem easy enough that I don’t need to put in effort.” Do yourself a favor and move on to a woman who sees you as equal or better to the men who used to fuck her. Don’t settle for being second best.
It’s not as if what she wants matters at all in this equation. As redpilltom and his fellow Red Piller see it, sex isn’t something that women desire or enjoy — except with hunky alphas. It’s something that women have in their possession – and which non-alpha men have to get from them, by hook or by crook.
And if for whatever reason, good or bad, a woman “gave” a man in her past a certain sex act, she can’t change her mind and refuse to “give” it to you.
For the women who may be getting furious reading this, just imagine what it was like if you knew your boyfriend was rich.
Oh dear. This can’t be going anywhere good. Red Pillers regularly denounce women as “whores” and “golddiggers” who trade (their) sex for (men’s) money – at least when it comes to betas with bucks. But Red Pill dudes themselves see sex as essentially an economic transaction.
Imagine that he always brought his ex’s out on really nice vacations, nice house, bought them really nice gifts, treated them like princesses, etc. But he refused to do any of that with you, he wanted to be frugal with you even though he has more than enough money to treat you. Wouldn’t you feel a little bit weird about it? Wouldn’t you question why you were different, why he didn’t care to treat you the same? Why the sudden change?
I don’t know, maybe he’s older and wiser and realized that he was spending too much money and driving himself into debt? Maybe he got tired of an ex who only “rewarded” him with sex when he spend a lot of money on her? Or maybe his ex got tired of him trying to buy sex with money.
Hell, maybe he realized that the whole “sex for money” equation is an unhealthy basis for a romantic relationship?
In a followup comment, redpilltom makes clear he has no interest in hearing what the woman has to say about any of this.
![ForbiddenFruit420 13 points 14 hours ago What if she doesn't want to do it with you because she didn't enjoy it with her ex? permalink save report give gold [–]redpilltom [S] 37 points 14 hours ago That's something that's a bit more delicate and requires a bit more context. "I tried anal with my ex but stopped him because I didn't like it" is different than "I used to do it all the time with my ex, but didn't really like it". The context in the first was "I didn't like how it felt so I stopped" and the second was "I didn't really care for it, but he loved it so I did it for him". Overall it doesn't carry the same weight as the "I'm not that kind of girl anymore" BS that the post is more about, but it is a huge red flag and you should keep your eye out for more signs you're getting strung along. And, of course, women lie up and down about their sexual history. If a woman tells you she only tried something once briefly but hated it, it's pretty likely that she did it multiple times and loved it in the context of an alpha guy who gave her more tingles than you.](https://i0.wp.com/www.wehuntedthemammoth.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/lying.png?ssl=1)
Red Pill dudes, if you’re so deathly afraid of becoming a beta shelling out bucks for sex that alphas get for free, maybe you should stop seeing sex as an essentially economic transaction in which the desires of women – or at least their desire for anything but money – counts for nothing.
But in the meantime if you do decide to break up with a woman because she won’t have anal sex with you like she did in her college days – or whatever – you’re actually doing her a giant favor. Because no one deserves to be stuck in a relationship with someone like you.
H/T — r/thebluepill
11 maids a-misanderin’…
on the 12th day of misandramas my true love gave to me…
12 kitty cats
11 maids misanderin
10 pairs of spanx
9 wooden chairs
8 scented candles
7 fake phone numbers
6 ex boyfriends
5 rejections
4 primary custody arrangements
3 more cats
2 blue balls
and a dildo in a little suit
Is the dildo wearing a necktie, or a bowtie? I need to know because of reasons.
Yes, I think so. I’ve only ever had one guy ask for my “number,” which has always has been pretty thoroughly average. But this guy was apparently kind of amazed by how low it was. Had I been living under a rock? Was I secretly Mormon? No, and no… I’ve just always had shit to do that I thought was more enjoyable and productive than dealing with a revolving cast of hookups. I’ve got no problem with people who are into that, but when I was single I spent a lot more time and money on my aquariums than on… clubbing or whatever.
But I think there’s a bunch of dudes out there convinced that EVERYONE (except them) has racked up like, dozens or hundreds of partners starting when they were 13 or 15 or whatever. Not sure where they pick this idea up. It can’t be from reading academic literature on the subject. lol Porn maybe? Peer boasting? Both great places for young people to acquire realistic expectations about sex. 😉
I’m sure not all of them become consumed with self loathing over it, but for the ones that do, of course this fuels their weird insecurities that they’re not living it up like “everyone else.”
Sometimes I read RP wailing sections and find guys gnashing their teeth that they never got laid in high school– the injustice! and I’m like, “uhhhh, me neither: when I was in HS you (general you) weren’t SUPPOSED to be having sex. Sure, some kids did it anyway, but it was largely seen as transgressive/risky, and my understanding is that teens now are having LESS sex than they did in my day (a positive development if you ask me.) So… how is that a thing we actually expect now?”
Dingbats
I personally think dildos should wear bowties, but maybe that’s old fashioned of me.
13 cuckolded betas!
There are 13 days in the misandramas advent calendar. I decided that just now.
re: dildos, I think cravats should be worn, unless a fez is also involved.
Heh
Ha ha.
HAhahahahahahahaa!!
You’ve all fallen for one of my least likely plans! Unsee this!
http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100809051609/tardis/images/2/28/11-Doctor-Fez.jpg
@ceebarks:
How is the “number” even determined? If it’s PiV sex my number is a big old painful unsatisfying one. If it’s getting naked with them and having other kinds of sex I’m up to two. If it’s touching a penis I’m all the way up to 3! None of which were when I was under the age of 18.
Then again, my mom raised me with “good girls don’t, boys only want one thing, sex is always painful, and if you’re gay you’re out of the family” so I had a hangup or a bazillion.
@Falconer:
“It’s a fez, I wear a fez now. Fezzes are cool.”
*ponders knitting a dildo fez because I’m strange*
I love the 12 days of Misadramas!
Tracy,
If you ever get a chance to read some of the anti-segregation propaganda that was circulated around Mississippi toward the end of segregation I recommend looking at it. It will make your blood run cold and your skin crawl. Those were good, Christian, civic minded, family oriented people murdering out of self defense, according to them. They were merely protecting themselves from disadvantaged people they were already actively oppressing. The fate of the world depended on keeping those lesser people in their place. There is not one shred of self awareness or shame to be found in that literature. People really thought the Klan were the good guys.
They do not teach that to kids in school and I do not think that is an accident. It is too much like the same defense of injustice and brutality we see today. They’d also have to explain why white children were taught racism in the classroom. A friend of mine is a teacher who collects old text books. She has one that explains that brown skinned people are lazy because they come from hot climates and their blood is different because of it. Another had the young readers reading “Slap the Jap” as an exercise.
Creepy stuff. Very scary. Scarier that people pretend it never existed.
Michelle,
There is a movie called The Woman that sort of fits that bill.
Dawn,
I think dildo cozies make great Misandramas gifts.
Falconer,
Necktie.
It didn’t have the panche to pull off a bow tie I guess.
Ellesar:
Or pegging, or having a dominatrix, or you could go all out and say ball torture. Watch their faces pale when they realize exactly what “same position, same benefits” and “Not negotiable” means.
Also, I am loving the idea of Misdramas. Reminds me of a tumblr post where someone was sarcastically asking about “Christmas Adam” (and then an MRA came in and whined we were making jokes at the expense of his plight of manhood).
Man tears, man tears,
Booey-hooey man tears!
Man tears, man tears,
Drink them up, YUM!
(that was revenge for the fez pic, BTW — unhear THAT!)
I think we should say that all of our exes were really into orgasm denial, and that it’s their job to beat the previous record of (insert ever increasing numbers here).
Eeeeeeeee Amigurumi dildo pattern!
http://seejainchain.blogspot.ca/2008/08/free-pattern-amigurumi-dildo.html
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2135/2181747463_01e985d77e_b.jpg
Sure not practical, but lookit the smiley face!
@ Michelle – Look to the Whedonverse for misogynist villains. Seasons 6 and 7 of Buffy – Warren is the insecure misogynist PUA who fantasises about submissive, weak women. Caleb is the misogynist preacher who murders women because they are all “dirty” to him.
It’s all kinda soft and cartoon-y with the horror, but still pretty chilling in that Warren especially starts out as a sympathetic character until he really shows how much he hates women. But it all ends with Buffy and her friends being all empowered and flippin’ savin’ the world and all that good stuff. Woo! 🙂
So if you felt trapped in a relationship where you felt you couldn’t say no to a particular activity, you now have to do that activity with every potential partner? Or if you liked an activity once, but have since gone off it, you have to keep doing it? I wonder if these guys think that applies to other things? Like, if they once liked seafood but now find it gross, do they now have to eat it anyway for every new person who wants them to?
The x number of dates thing is funny, by the way. Their argument is that it means we were willing to put more effort for a person we slept with on the first date than a man we waited to sleep with on the second, third, etc. right? And yet, most of the people I’ve slept with on the first date, we didn’t see each other after that. My last boyfriend I didn’t sleep with till the third date, and we ended up having sex almost every day for the duration of our relationship. It’s almost like individual situations have individual outcomes that aren’t dependent on how fast you feel like sleeping with a person, or if you even want to at all.
Warren so predicted the manosphere. Especially in the episode where he has that hypnotizing device he uses to turn his ex into his sex slave. Shudder.
Out of all the Big Bads, Warren was the only one who ever actually unnerved me, because he really is just a guy who could exist. He’s also the only villain to successfully pull a gun, which pulls all of Sunnydale into the real world just a bit too much for a moment.
Joss doesn’t leave much room for ambiguity when it comes to the messages behind his episodes. Warren is just a guy with an aggrieved entitlement issue. Beware guys like him.
::waves:: Howard, hi, how are you? Been too long since we’ve seen you on site!
duckbunny:
QFT.
Michelle – if it’s any consolation, I have to avoid chocolate these days, so I can be a bit envious backatcha! 😉
I totally sympathise about the first aid incident! I had a massage yesterday and told the dude to stop at the ankles, because my feet are way too ticklish to have someone else touching them. As it was, when he started doing my middle back, I squawked and jumped, because that tickled way too much too. (Mr K was totally unsympathetic; he sat there giggling! Wretch.)
On horror movies – when I was a teenager I loved the Hammer films. But I wouldn’t watch any horror films now, because I don’t take any pleasure in being scared, nervous or tense. I particularly dislike the sort of crime series where a serial killer is murdering women. I hate that stuff; it’s no fucking different from what happens all the time in real life, and women victimised by men isn’t entertainment as far as I’m concerned.
The 13 Days of Misandramas has ALL THE WIN. Also Falconer is an evil mastermind.
@Lea
Indeed. Shine a very, very big light on it, I say.
You know, that Misandramas carol scans pretty well! I keep humming it and grinning.
It appears to me that some of you must have played hooky during your Doodlogik (TM) classes.
If you choose to read this, you should first assemble a generous collection of pictures of cute, furry animals. You’ll need them.
I went to an all-boys prep school for a year, and every Sunday night the dudes would sit around the lounge and the ones who had gone off for the weekend would describe (i.e., lie about) what they’d managed to “get off” whatever girls they had been out with or imagined being out with over the weekend. They had even worked out a fairly elaborate scoring system to evaluate their “conquests”, which was supposed to add up to 69 if you “got” everything, but didn’t because they were bad at math. The only interesting detail was that you got the same number of points for cunnilingus as for fellatio, which was more points than you got for PIV sex. Ranking cunnilingus above PIV sex might seem a bit counterintuitive, but the Doodlogik (TM) was that it was harder to talk a girl into oral sex (this was in 1964, might well be different now). In other words, it was not about male pleasure per se, it was a competition in which the difficulty of obtaining a girl’s compliance was the standard.
The point system didn’t consider SMV, but it was certainly something the doods would have done if they had been smart enough to construct a two-variable system. To understand this kind of thinking, you have to be able to think of women as if they were poker chips in different colors and sizes, each with a point value, with the values being determined by (1) how attractive a woman was generally considered to be (NOT how attractive you personally found her) and (2) how much she put out for you. As guys get older (2) tends to morph into how high you rank on her lifetime list in terms of what she has put out for you relative to other men. You see, it’s not really about sex at all; it’s about an implied competition with other men, it’s how you rank in the male pecking order (peckering order?) In that context, something like getting her to put out anal sex isn’t because you necessarily adore anal sex or you want to hurt or humiliate her per se, it’s because it’s a bigger conquest if you can get her to do something she doesn’t want to. And of course if you can’t get her to do something she’s done for another man, you get docked just scads and scads of points. I mean, it hardly even counts at all. Just fucking a woman who’s done anal for another guy is hardly even worth the effort, you get so few points
So that’s your lesson in Doodlogik (TM) for the day. I realize that it’s difficult for many or even most women to comprehend Doodlogik (TM) — to think of human beings as brightly colored poker chips of different sizes — but every so often the need to interpret puzzling and/or infuriating dood behavior arises.
Most guys who think this way eventually grow up and grow out of it, though sometimes with a vestigial tail, so to speak. Those who don’t … well, it would be convenient if there were some way to get them to grow a set of horns so it would be easy for women to identify and avoid them — it would be more reliable than fedoras.
Living a life in which intimate relationships are primarily about the old male pecking order … it boggles my mind, but I have seen it and know it exists.