GamerGaters like to loudly profess that they oppose harassment. They also like to claim that most if not all of the harassment that has occurred comes from people that aren’t “real” GamerGaters.
So what do GamerGaters do when they’re confronted with evidence that someone in their ranks — not an anonymous nobody but someone with some standing in their community — is harassing someone?
Well yesterday we had an opportunity to see just that. I wrote about a couple of instances of sexual harassment from a GamerGater known as Cameralady.
While not as famous as GamerGate celebs like Milo Yiannopoulos or InternetAristocrat or, you know, Adam Baldwin, Cameralady is, at least in Gamergate circles, a bit of a player. She was an early and especially eager opponent of Zoe Quinn, and devoted a great deal of time and energy to digging up dirt on Quinn and others. Many of her “findings” made it into GamerGate propaganda on the web and in assorted YouTube videos.
And her sexual harassment was about as blatant as it gets. In the midst of an argument on Twitter, she tweeted a crude sexual come-on to a woman who opposes GamerGate, and was immediately told to get lost. A week later, in the midst of another Twitter argument, she Tweeted another crude come-on to the same woman. The evidence was as plain as day, and I included it all in my post.
So what happened after I posted a link to my post in the #GamerGate hashtag on Twitter? Did other GamerGaters call her out on her behavior?
Well, no. Instead I was besieged by dozens — hundreds? — of tweets from GamerGaters who assured me that the harassment wasn’t harassment at all.
The tone of the discussion was set early on by Cameralady herself, who insisted that her harassment was simple “flirtation” and that anyone who thought otherwise was some sort of anti-sex puritan prude.
https://twitter.com/The_Camera_Girl/status/524967395715477504
https://twitter.com/The_Camera_Girl/status/524968506480410624
https://twitter.com/The_Camera_Girl/status/524969608043044864
I’m not exactly sure how that would absolve her for her bad behavior. If you shoot someone and you miss, you’ve still committed a crime. If you crudely proposition someone who earlier told you to get lost and they for some reason don’t hear you, well, same thing. Also, the woman she harassed did in fact see her tweet.
She also tried to explain that what she was doing really was flirting, and that I didn’t understand because I’m not a lesbian.
@The_Camera_Girl @DavidFutrelle So it's okay to sexually harass people because you've had sex with other women?
— BlackFish (@BlackFish775) October 22, 2014
Later, she tried another excuse.
https://twitter.com/The_Camera_Girl/status/525087005823483904
Apparently she sends crude sexual comments to so many women she can’t keep track!
Other GamerGaters did their best to minimize, deny and deflect.
@The_Camera_Girl @alexvdl0 @DavidFutrelle I think hes jealous
— SteamPunk_Devil (@SteamPunkDevil_) October 22, 2014
Even those who accepted that what had happened was harassment did their best to change the subject.
https://twitter.com/DanielGauss/status/524965533234393088
https://twitter.com/DanielGauss/status/524970974744039424
But if you really want a sense of the sheer horror of dealing with GamerGaters on Twitter, well, you’re just going to have to jump headlong into the middle of it.
Here you can see all of the responses to my Tweet linking to my post. Here you will encounter every type of deflection known to humankind, as you scroll downward through an argument that never seems to end.
Witness the terror of endless arguments with people who ask for proof that is already in the article they are ostensibly discussing! Hear the demands for screenshots that have already been given to them!
I never know if they’re really this obtuse, or if they’re just screwing with me.
It reminds me a lot of this classic Monty Python sketch. The only difference is that the Monty Python sketch is over in six minutes, while Twitter never ends.
Duh, it’s his 10th post, guys. We should treat him with kid gloves because he’s not gifted in writing or expressing himself. And geeze, everyone knows one would have to take a women’s study class to understand that rape threats and sexual harassment are both Very Bad Things. Cripes, give the kid a break, he’s a bull in a China shop, and we should understand that. OK, sarcasm off. You need to read a lot more, donovan. And an understanding about insensitivity would help you tremendously before you post here. Oh, sexual harassment isn’t flattery.
A more productive conversation
I agree, questioning her gender, het sexuality, or her mental health are unnecessary. A woman, and an autistic lesbian at that, is just as capable of misogynistic assholery as a man. I find it’s more common with men, especially straight white ones because they get away with more, but anyone can be an asshole regardless of their gender, mental health, and sexual preference. Cameralady is an misogynistic asshole. End of story. That is all that is relevant here.
Maybe I’ve giving Donovan too much credit, but they might have thought that “sexually harrassing” someone means sexually propositioning them, and doesn’t fall under the umbrella of actually threatening them. Which is still WRONG on so many levels.
Basically they’re buying into the myth that sexually harassing someone is indictive of desiring/complimenting them, and not being a power-tripping jerkoff who likes to make other people uncomfortable and/or afraid. Don’t do that, Donovan.
“The solution would be to treat this as a genuine request for information until proven otherwise, hmm?”
There’s a phrase I’ve seen…. called jaqing. In some forums, they frequently get posters that come along and “just ask questions”. Often these “questions” have already been answered or are easy enough for the person making the query to find with out on their own. It is possible the person is lazy or maybe genuinely ignorant, but more often than not it is used as a tactic to derail conversation, waste time, and frustrate those the person is asking. On top of that, more often than not, the jaqer becomes belligerent after others refuse to answer his/her questions and often they will continue posting repetitively.
Not that I am saying this is what you’re doing, but jaqing with a side of mansplaining isn’t exactly rare, so I can see why your questions might not be taken as being “in good faith”.
@Lids: True as such. Still, it’s awfully convenient that they suddenly have a lesbian to cling to, after campaigning directly against GLBT-friendly games and positions and directly stating that they are trying to use sockpuppets to get legitimacy.
“It’s not harassment, it’s flirting.” said every street harasser ever.
@Catalpa
That’s how I read it too.
This. There’s an implied violence to sexual harassment because the harasser is doing it, not to get laid, but to make the target feel unsafe. This is why it makes no sense to draw a distinction between rape threats and “flattering” sexual harassment.
I see an extraneous comma in my post. Oh well. I guess it’s better than a two dot ellipsis.
I never knew there was a name for this!
I just checked my notifications on Gawker and two replies in the last couple of hours were, a guy who had earlier asked me for evidence that gamergaters had admitted to doxxing in the IRC logs. I told him to Google it and he replied saying he couldn’t find anything.
Another guy wanted me to give him some links about how to be a male feminist ally that I had posted hours ago in a long, tiring, and ultimately fruitless conversation I had with a dude who seems to think of himself as an ally but kept mansplaining and tone trolling after not liking that a different female commenter called ggers manbabies. The second dude, who had also been tone trolling wanted me too repost the links because he didn’t feel like scrolling through the comments.
Gaahh!!!!
DO YOUR OWN HOMEWORK GUYS.
How much longer is this GamerGate fiasco going to go on for? How much longer is it going to take for these curmudgeons to get bored? A month? Two? I’m tired of hearing about it, like I’m tired of hearing about Ebola and ISIS, and like I was tired of hearing about Trayvon Martin.
For those not familiar with JAQing, remember that the topics being queried are almost entirely PRATTs*.
Not necessarily on the site / by the person concerned, but usually. Most such questions would be answered by searching the site or the person, looong before getting into general searches of the whole web.
*Points Refuted A Thousand Times for those who need to ask.
They’ve been fuming about Anita Sarkeesian for over two years. Gamergate is just the same old mob with a new paper thin cover story. The cover of jurnalism ethucs is likely to wear out eventually, but their weird obsessive hate boners aren’t going anywhere. The only thing that will stop this for good is a critical mass of people calling it out and a change in “geek” culture such that this kind of stuff is no longer acceptable.
Kevin K:
“Gamers are dead.”
“They’re not dead! They’re just pinin’ for the fjords!”
Now THAT would be a movement I could get behind.
“Please supply examples of strictly _sexual_ harassment by males in GG. Plenty of sexualized violence, but no overt comeons or catcalls. Sexual attraction is a sign of weakness for males in that crowd. MGTOW (while obsessing over women and their evil ways) doncha know.”
Dude…Where to begin. Oh, I know! Fuck off.
Men who make any and every thing about a woman’s attractiveness or lack thereof are sexually harassing (by objectifying and dehumanising) women. “Ugly”, “Fat”, and “Old” are used to imply that women have less value, and are therefore less worthy of being listened to. This is a form of sexual harassment. Conversely, when women are too attractive, they are viewed as too stupid to have their opinions taken seriously. This is a form of sexual harassment. That’s one. Rape threats and threats of gendered violence are based on weaponized hetero male sexuality and leveled at women as a form of sexual harassment. There is a difference between flirting, unwanted flirting which is stopped with one no, and harassment. Harassment and sexual (gendered harassment) have *nothing* to do with flirting. Nothing at all. And men who harass know the fucking difference, they just don’t like having to behave as though women are people. That’s two.
Words have meaning. Clear meanings are important, because if word meanings (to take an example completely at random…harassment) were not clear then purple monkey dishwater bought Rome.
” “Gamers are dead.”
“They’re not dead! They’re just pinin’ for the fjords!” ”
*reads
*dies
I’ve seen them talking about some Christmas plan, but we’ll see how that goes. I mean, it seems to me like they’re burning through names pretty fast- there’s no way Christina Hoff Summers stays a draw and I don’t know if y’all heard Milo Yiannopolis get interviewed on it but holy shit was it a train wreck.
I think this thing with Felicia Day might be the turning point. The amount of cognitive dissonance it must take to ignore it is incredible.
I’ve gotten hooked on reading GG threads just for the inevitable point where they get all grandiose and start monologuing like an old Republic serial villain. I also love how humorless they are; Mario Kart is as serious as ball cancer in these circles.
My three favorite moments:
1. A guy angrily declaring that “you can’t call yourself a gamer just because you play video games.” His analogy was that he can’t call himself a librarian because he read a library book. People pointed out that a librarian isn’t someone who reads lots of library books. “Exactly.”
2. “Nobody knows hardship like gamers.” Actual Tweet. Cannot even type this without laughing.
3. My husband foolishly got in an argument with one of these rubes, and at one point commented that it was cowardly of him to voice his opinions from behind an anonymous throwaway account. The guy replied, “Well, I don’t want to get fired from my job for having an opinion.” No trace of irony. None.
Cue tiniest violin ever.
I see a few patterns in them… which is a lot like what MRA’s do.
If you give evidence…
– They ignore it.
– Then they ask for more and more proof.
– They keep to ignore everything and ask other stuff.
Cyclic. As for them…
– They don’t reply with any evidence themselves, they establish their “truths” without giving any proof.
– If cornered, they may give a YouTube video as “proof” (or maybe even a meme).
They just ignore all evidence and keep claiming the same things over and over again, demanding that you proove what you say like they’re judges, however they don’t hold the same criteria for themselves.
Aside from that, there’s two particular excuses/attemps of justification I’ve been reading recently from GamerGaters…
– “A bad apple is spoiling the bunch!” Well, who is that “bad apple”? The whole “bad apple” argument is repeated over and over again everywhere.
– “Feminists have threatened GamerGaters too!” Then, assuming it’s true, why don’t you go to the police or the FBI or something?
And then, the inevitable fake feminist accounts flooding all social networks publishing nonsense, attempting to make feminists fight each other and make us all seem monsters to those that may not know much about it still.
I’m still waiting for the good apples to show up.
Talk at you for half an hour about the piece of code they’re trying to debug when you have no idea what they’re on about and all you asked was “how’s it going?”, sure, but randomly proposition you for sex while in transit? Not so much […]
Ah-yup.
I currently know enough about JavaScript and .NET to carry on (or at least decently follow) a conversation.
The only coding that I’ve ever done is messing around with CSS and HTML on Codecademy.
And thank you to this thread for introducing me to the term JAQing/JAQing Off.
http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Just_asking_questions
The next time someone does this, I’m just going to respond with this link.
For some reason, there’s an extraordinary amount of trolls in NPR FB comment threads – some obviously sock puppets (MUH PROFILE PICTURE’S AN EAGLE AND AH WENT TO FREEDOM UNIVERSITY!), some not.
1. A guy angrily declaring that “you can’t call yourself a gamer just because you play video games.” His analogy was that he can’t call himself a librarian because he read a library book. People pointed out that a librarian isn’t someone who reads lots of library books. “Exactly.”
So “real gamers”…um…curate collections of games?
*squints*