Never doubt the ingenuity of the internet’s misogynists in coming up with new reasons to hate a woman they’re already inclined to hate.
Actress and geek icon Emma Watson has been near the top of the new Misogyny hate list all this week, in the wake of the speech she gave at the UN gently praising feminism and suggesting that traditional gender roles aren’t always such a good thing for dudes either. She’s made this point before, declaring in a Tweet last month that
Gender equality not only liberates women but also men from prescribed gender stereotypes. #heforshe
— Emma Watson (@EmmaWatson) August 18, 2014
But wait, the Red Pillers of the internet declare: Watson is herself dating a hunky jock rather than a “bald scrawny impoverished poet.”
WHERE IS YOUR FEMINISM NOW?
According to the UK’s Daily Mirror, Watson is currently dating a fellow Oxford student who also happens to be 1) gigantic 2) a rugby player and 3) handsome. As The Mirror put it
Matt was dubbed Oxford’s most eligible bachelor and was previously named the best looking player in his on-field position by the university rugby team’s Twitter account.
I know, you’re probably not exactly shocked – shocked! – to discover that a famous actress is dating a handsome dude. But in the Red Pill precincts of the internet, the regulars think they’ve got their CHECKMATE FEMINISM.
Right wing “journalist” and blogger Robert Stacey McCain triumphantly cackled
All the hot babes like Emma Watson are crazy for guys who don’t fit “prescribed gender stereotypes,” right? So you will probably be surprised to learn that Emma Watson is dating a
bald scrawny impoverished poetthe biggest jock at an elite university. …In other words, an Alpha male, the epitome of “prescribed gender stereotypes” from which Emma Watson says we need to be liberated.
Smart young fellows figure out that listening to what women say is less important than watching what women do. Women are constantly saying they want sensitive Ashley Wilkes types, even while they’re actually going crazy for the Rhett Butler types. …
When all is said and done, the basic human sex instinct is still as simple as, “Me Tarzan, you Jane.”
On the Red Pill subreddit, the regulars celebrated what they saw as a great victory over feminism. Redpillbanana seconded McCain’s “analysis.”
As a man in our new feminist world, you are liberated from your gender stereotype and have permission to be vulnerable and human. And women have permission to dump you for the next nearby alpha male who decided that he doesn’t need to be liberated from his gender stereotype.
Other Red Pillers made sure that everyone knew that they didn’t think Emma Watson was all that hot anyway.
WOULD NOT BANG.
Meanwhile, proudly racist, woman-hating dating guru Heartiste offered these, er, thoughts on the matter, in his trademark, er, style:
Feminism long ago abandoned any pretense to logic or internal consistency. It’s nothing but feels all day, every day, with an extra helping of feels. Watson’s rationalization hamster, like most rodents residing in the brains of her callow ilk, is 700% thigh and 800% glutes. A swole spinner on the wheel of ego-masturbation.
Ok then.
So how do you respond to this sort of thing? Point out that Watson was previously dating a guy who most Red Pillers would probably consider a big ol beta? Post examples of conventionally hot actresses who’ve dated “nerds” and intellectuals and otherwise not stereotypically macho men – from Marilyn Monroe (playwright Arthur Miller) to Christina Hendricks (nerdy actor Geoffrey Arend, who’s not even as famous as her).
But what’s the point? All you have to do is step outside to see examples of happy couples who don’t fit the “me Tarzan, you Jane” stereotype the Red Pillers are so desperate to assure us is the One True Way.
The human heart and libido are complicated things. Yes, some feminist women date macho dudes. And some traditional women are drawn to nerds. Some women date men who make more money than them; others date guys who are broke. And a lot of women don’t have clear “types” at all. (Watson doesn’t seem to.)
It’s also worth pointing out that, well, you can’t always judge a book by its cover. A gigantic rugby player who is ferocious on the field may be a teddy bear in private. And scrawny nerdy dudes can be horrible people (e.g. Woody Allen).
Feminism doesn’t deny that some women – including some feminists — are drawn to macho men. What feminism says is that traditional gender roles are not the only way to do things.
Emma Watson can date whatever kind of person she wants to date. It’s her own damn business. That’s feminism.
And trotting it out here says a lot more about you than you might mean to reveal.
Also, I know someone else who has a Grandad the Known Child Molester in the family. You know what her family didn’t do? Send her on a road trip with him.
Really, never seeing their kid again is the least of what the Kid’s parents deserve.
Those two comments that aren’t explicitly addressed to LBT and The Kid are addressed to Shadow_Nirvana, in case that wasn’t clear.
I remember when the movie Good Will Hunting first came out and pretty much everyone around me loved it, and it seemed everyone far away from me loved it too.
But I left the theater feeling cranky as hell, pretty much exactly for the reason above.
(And this movie came out 17 years ago (!), but spoiler alert for what follows, just in case).
Matt Damon’s character had been a giant jerk to Minnie Driver’s character earlier in the movie, and the movie ends with him having gone through the above-referenced “personal growth” and driving off to “see about a girl” (Minnie Driver’s character). And I thought, well, that’s just great for her, the giant jerk is about to be not out of her life anymore.
The movie ended without definitively telling the audience Minnie Driver’s character was receptive or not, and I admit I haven’t watched the movie ever again in 17 years so my memory/relative youth at the time could be factors in missing any nuances, but I’ve also wondered if I’m the only person in the world that disliked that movie for that reason (or any other reason).
Okay, what? I am specifically talking about women who wrote loveletters to convicts. Why are you skipping that part? And my other example is the female guardians who slept with an inmate druglord, one of them got pregnant and they fought each other for the guy, that’s why the whole thing got realized. Clearly they are the ones at fault?
Incidentally, we’re all capable of going back one page and seeing that the context of your statement was, “I read that Nice Guy post and I don’t know why this dude wants to sleep with women who like to marry guys that beat them up, why would anyone want to date defective women?” Just in case you thought you’d slipped that by me with your “but Heartiste and Reasons” backpedal here.
Y’know, Shadow Nirvana, I’m starting to suspect that you aren’t having just a kneejerk subconscious assholic feeling. I think it’s actually quite a large variety of beliefs, and you don’t like being called out on them.
Fuck off, dude. You want to talk about what’s wrong with women who let this dude date them, why don’t you talk about what’s wrong with men who get excused for hitting and attacking others.
–Rogan
RE: cassandrakitty
You know what her family didn’t do? Send her on a road trip with him.
But lady, if they didn’t send us on the road trip, they would’ve been LIVING IN THE PAST. It was over! Years ago! He was all better now! He was a wonderful old man and it was totally okay to love him and he would never, ever do ANYTHING bad, promise. Why punish him for things of the past? And we wanted to go on that road trip just SO BADLY, it would’ve broken our little teenage heart if they didn’t let us go!
–Kid
You have pretty much told people here all they ever want to know about you, Shadow_Nirvana. I want you to top using that name.
I want you to go away and study decent human being 101. Study hard. Elsewhere.
Stop. STOP using that ID.
That’s kind of a latecomer point. You brought that up literally one post ago. You’re getting into gaslight territory now.
RE: Shadow Nirvana
I am specifically talking about women who wrote loveletters to convicts.
Dude, you’re comparing women who write love letters to convicts with women in abusive relationships. You don’t see ANYTHING wrong with that at all?
–Rogan
But Rogan, he’s just saying, all abusive dudes are totally like people in jail and all the women involved with them are totally the same! That’s a totally objective, not at all creepy statement and says absolutely nothing about his perceptions of humanity at all!
I’m catching on to this feminism stuff, right?
–Kid
Shadow of a Troll is getting tedious. Yes, dear, we see what you’re trying to do, and we think you’re an asshole. Happy now? Things got nice and lively! Now piss off.
Would anyone like some Halloween candy instead?
http://emilianadarling.tumblr.com/post/98345029151/if-you-think-for-one-second-that-slapping-a
Dammit, I want to go back to the UK for Halloween, the candy there is so much better.
Halloween is a terrible time to be me. I have a level of arachnophobia that is matched by few; a couple of big plush spiders make the candy aisle completely inaccessible to me. I can’t even look at them without my skin crawling.
Aw, that sucks. I hate the damn things, but in plushie form they don’t bother me.
Welp, you certainly did liven it up on this thread trolly mctrollerson. Now how bout you go back under the bridge and take a rest.
So, so much this.
And I’m with blahlistic – I’m hoping our shady friend is going to take some of the comments on board, think about why he got the reaction he did, and possibly realise there’s some unexamined beliefs underlying them that need to be brought out into the light and batted around a little.
Sometimes it’s hard to hear “You’re saying what an asshole would say, why are you saying that?” without misinterpreting it as “You’re an asshole and are completely irredeemable!”. 😉
Also, since the Halloween aisle is not for you, have a cat being a hat instead.
http://siz.io/s/cat/v/hat-cat?srctum
Or embedded, even!
Okay, that cat is fantastic.
They should put a little wheel on the top of the headphones so they can pretend the cat is driving.
Oy. Disregard that last post, I missed his latest goalpost-shifting.
Shadow, I really get the feeling you understand why people are responding badly to you and you’re railing against it. The problem is we’ve seen so many people who came here with “devil’s advocate” arguments (which is exactly what it sounded like when you tossed “let’s liven things up” out there) that seem to be discussing in good faith until they’re actually challenged. When they start flailing for anything tangentially related that might make them look less like an asshole, and the regulars continue pointing out the unexamined misogyny behind the entire thrust of their argument, they start looking more and more trollish.
You’re pretty much at that point now. Either stick to the First Rule Of Holes and read up about abuse dynamics, and think about how they apply to women who might be manipulated into finding a skilled liar charming, or wear the troll tag with pride. There’s not really any middle ground there.
You know, I find it pretty fucking hilarious how Shadow Nirvana is conflating women who write love letters to convicts and women dating abusers, seeing as how he doesn’t seem to have much experience on either matter. So let me tell you a story, buddy.
By the time I was seventeen, I believed ALL MEN would rape me, given the chance. Every single one of them, at least the ones who were into girls. After a grandfather and a rapist and the way our families excused and gave them license to operate, we believed this behavior was normal. There was no point in trying to avoid rape, because it was just a part of being alive. Men would rape you whether they were related to you, dating you, whatever, so why even bother resisting? Why even notice or care? It happened to everyone.
Yeah, I was a total thrillseeker and a total jackass as a teenager. That’s why I was so petrified when my now-husband first tried to get me to believe he wouldn’t rape me, because by that point, at the age of nineteen, I knew that just meant he was trying to get my guard down so he could rape me WORSE. I actually tried to force him down while I was crying, because I was afraid that if he didn’t do it now, he’d get mad and then I’d really get it.
So Shadow Nirvana, you don’t know shit. This “therapist” with his story about how mad he is at all those women fighting themselves over a abuser (or so he says) doesn’t know shit. None of you know jack fucking shit, because you are still treating people in abusive relationships like they’re just ACHING to have terrible things to happen to them, like they’re a reward for being a good guy.
Go learn a bit about yourself, and shut the fuck up. Stop making excuses, stop acting like we’re all being mean to you, and fucking grow up.
–Rogan
Heartiste says…
Irony.
@Elle
Regarding Bay Area Guy and Dota, they do realize that many of the “silent majority” people they claim to speak for fully support patriarchy and colonialism, right? And of course there is the whole red scare bullshit that has been deep in the American consciousness for the last half a century. Seriously, Cultural Marxism is a pejorative that is as silly as it is ignorant. It’s like how creationists attack “evolutionists” for believing “something came from nothing”, or like how MRAs think “manginas” and “white knights” unquestioningly serve women and nothing else.
The Internet is a wonderland with its own crooked rules.
My hamster is more interested in shoulders, just for the record. Also, you know that bit on the hip on men that’s really pronounced if they’re in great shape? That bit too, the hamster always notices that bit if it’s visible.