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You'll be horrified to learn where one popular pickup guru has found some, er, dating tips

The Duluth Power and Control Wheel
The Duluth Power and Control Wheel

Heartiste – real name James Wiedmann – is a proudly racist, woman-hating “pickup artist” guru known for advocating manipulative and often quite abusive “game” techniques to give men the upper hand in relationships and in the dating market. These run the gamut from emotional abuse – what he calls “dread game,” an elaborate portfolio of gaslighting ploys to keep women feeling insecure and off-balance – to straightforward physical abuse – slapping women “when necessary” to assert “alpha male” dominance.

Now he’s suggesting that wannabe lotharios borrow some tips on how to “game” women from the Duluth Power and Control Wheel, a widely used violence intervention tool designed to fight abuse, not provide a blueprint for it.

The Duluth Wheel highlights some of the most prevalent kinds of abusive behavior. Heartiste mines its descriptions of abuse for dating tips, claiming to find in it “a few curious nuggets of anti-feminist truth about relationships and how to keep them going.”

In his recent post, Heartiste goes through some of the descriptions of abusive behavior on the Duluth Wheel – and recasts them as handy tools for would-be “alpha males.”

“make her feel bad and guilty” — reframing.

“play mind games” — that’s one way to provoke a vaginal gusher.

“smash things” — occasional bursts of anger, when justified, are cues of sexy male dominance and they do turn on women. …

“threaten to leave her” — dread game. …

“take her money” — aka make a woman feel like she’s invested in you. she’ll try harder to make it work.

“be the one to define men’s and women’s roles” — chicks dig a leader. and they also dig benevolently sexist men! …

“treat her like a servant” — 50 Shades of Gray has sold millions of copies. To women.

His followers are, if anything, even more enthusiastic about adopting these abusive tactics to their dating life.

“[T]hanks for the road map,” writes dog king. “[A] handy chart for aspiring alphas,” notes Laguna Beach Fogey, also an occasional commenter on The Spearhead. “Much Thanks CH,” adds Ang Aamer. “It’s posts like these that turn the Femi-Matrix Vag monologues into decipherable ideas we can use.”

One commenter calling himself maldek offers a personal testimonial, claiming to have used the tactics on the Duluth Wheel to keep his wife of 20 years on her toes:

This is a female wishlist indeed.
Take it word by word.

Most of the listed items are things I do on a regular base. I mean it. And for more than 20 years it is working. Wife is looking top 5% in her age group, 3 kids, good life.

IT DOES WORK!

PS: That is 200% true for the darker parts of this list, you know the points those white knights would want to burn you on stake for. These are magic.

A commenter by the name of J Fisc seconds this endorsement.

This is an instruction manual for how to keep your woman happy. My marriage was doing pretty shitty until I said ‘Fuck it’ and started acting ‘abusive’. At least half the things on this list I do regularly and she eats its up.

One reader calling himself zaltyskaralius explains a favorite technique he (allegedly) uses to anger and excite the women – sorry, girls — in his life:

In the theme of brilliant game moves that bring the moist looks of indignation from girls, one of my old friends: The “Touchdown”:

When a girl says something (incredibly) stupid, interrupt and ask her if she knows what “touchdown” means.

Ignore her lack of football knowledge, shake your head and proceed to tell her that it has another meaning, as you put your hand on her shoulder with a grin on your face. Ask her if she has ever heard of Down’s syndrome. Tell her that it’s a tradition in your friend circle, that once someone says something not-so-very-smart, you proceed to do a “Touch-Down”. If she doesn’t get it, do another “touchdown”.

Congratulations, you just got a “pass this shit-test and collect tingles” card for the particular girl. From that moment on, anytime she says anything you dislike or throws a shit test at you, all you will have to do is simply place your hand on her shoulder and give her a knowing look, every so often muttering “touchdown” under your breath. No effort, no thinking, just a little touch.

Great move for AMOG [Alpha Male of the Group] friends as well. Great move for everyone in the know.

Luckily I think the chance that he’s actually used this “great move” on anyone outside of his own imagination is roughly zero.

Heartiste seems to think that the Duluth Wheel was conjured up by some Social Justice Warrior on Twitter. Only one of his commenters – at least only one that I noticed – admits to knowing where it really comes from.

“They made me memorize that graphic in a class i had to take because a broad said i hit her,” writes monster221.

Needless to say, he seems not to have learned anything from that class, noting that the experience convinced him

that i should act however i want and let them come and go. … Lifes great when its onyour terms, fuck anybody who tells you how to handle your shit.

Somehow I suspect that the “broad” who says he hit her was telling the truth.

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AliciaB
AliciaB
6 years ago

I guess the line between ‘pick up artist guru’ and ‘domestic violence cheerleader’ is pretty faint these days. Are all PUAs like this? Probably not. But the fact that one as ‘prominent’ as Heartiste can openly and explicitly advocate copying behaviors from a checklist on intimate partner violence is pretty appalling in and of itself. The fact that he receives no pushback at all from any other members of his community compounds that. I don’t expect any large group of people to be perfect, but these guys never call each out on their shit no matter how awful it gets. To me, that makes them all complicit in some way.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

I’m not the only one who finds this hilarious, right? Just straight up using domestic violence guides as a For Dummies guide to relationships – subtle! Truly, he’s doing a great job of hiding that whole misogyny problem of his!

Keep being this obvious, dudes. It makes explaining to non-feminists why they should never, ever listen to you so much easier.

Redcap
Redcap
6 years ago

I feel ill. Let the frantic search for brain bleach begin…

kinginascendent
6 years ago

I believe that these are deeply wounded boys who are stuck like flies in amber. Growing older is inevitable, growing up is not. These behaviours do not serve anyone well.

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

This is a female wishlist indeed.
Take it word by word.

Most of the listed items are things I do on a regular base. I mean it. And for more than 20 years it is working. Wife is looking top 5% in her age group, 3 kids, good life.

IT DOES WORK!

PS: That is 200% true for the darker parts of this list, you know the points those white knights would want to burn you on stake for. These are magic.

COOL STORY BRO.

Now wipe that Cheeto dust off your chin, put away the gunjy sock, and gradually re-enter reality. Where there is no wife, no kids, and no hope for you. Because every dude who ever operated by that list for realz actually gets left behind at some point, and quite unceremoniously. Ever read Sleeping with the Enemy?

When a girl says something (incredibly) stupid, interrupt and ask her if she knows what “touchdown” means.

Ignore her lack of football knowledge, shake your head and proceed to tell her that it has another meaning, as you put your hand on her shoulder with a grin on your face. Ask her if she has ever heard of Down’s syndrome. Tell her that it’s a tradition in your friend circle, that once someone says something not-so-very-smart, you proceed to do a “Touch-Down”. If she doesn’t get it, do another “touchdown”.

WTF is this, middle school? Is this dude 12 years old? Because that sort of thing turned me off anyone who tried it even then. Sexism, ableism, juvenility, and a sure sign that he’s none too bright himself. Yeah, real ‘nad-tingling combo, that. Perhaps someone should ask him if he knows what a “nutcracker” is. And if he shakes his head, thinking this is also some kind of joke, BANZAI!

Plus, I know what a football touchdown is. Everyone knows that. And I can’t fucking stand football.

(Also, if my nether regions start tingling at such a stupid moment, that’s usually a sign that I need to stop at the pharmacy for some Monistat.)

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

I no curr if they’re “wounded”, dude. We can worry about that in the unlikely event that they stop trying to wound other people.

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

that i should act however i want and let them come and go. … Lifes great when its onyour terms, fuck anybody who tells you how to handle your shit.

Yeah, you tell ’em, dude.

And go on ditching spelling, capitalization, grammar, and punctuation like a true badass rebel.

[/sarcasm, in case needed]

Abby March
Abby March
6 years ago

That’s not as surprising as it should be. Still, you’d think they’d try to disguise it a little.

Ellen
6 years ago

I have a feeling that all their girlfriends have always been imaginary. I cannot imagine these guys approaching / communicating with any woman in real life. I mean, the abusers usually try to hide their true nature in the beginning of the relationship, and these fellows are openly misogynistic and awful. And their tactics seem to be so hilariously over the top evil that such relationship seems just way too unrealistic to me.

Zolnier
Zolnier
6 years ago

Alpha Male of the Group implies that there can only be one alpha in any group, which I suppose fits with their childish understanding of pack dynamics. So what happens when these Alphas gather for like a PUA conference or something?

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Going by the video that the LaVey wannabe did it appears that they gather martial arts weapons that they don’t know how to use and have a dance-off.

drmrsthemonarch1
6 years ago

I remember being very small, and my mom trying to justify my dad’s abusive behavior by saying that he was “the king of the family.” I didn’t buy it, and I sensed that she didn’t really, either – but after reading this it’s slightly more horrifying to me that those are the words her brain grasped at to silence her own cognitive dissonance.

It’s straight out of Use Male Privilege. If ever I needed a single argument against traditional gender roles (and I don’t), it would be that they obscure and diminish abusive behavior.

icallmycatmrtb
icallmycatmrtb
6 years ago

Somebody please tell me this is satire. Please! Ugh, I’m off to find brain bleach.

ryeash
6 years ago

*crumples up ‘Faith in Humanity for the Day’ and pitches it*

I love how that troll yesterday was trying to justify the men’s rights subreddit ranter by saying he’d had bad experiences with every woman he came into contact with, and now today: this. Funny, many men I had the misfortune of coming into contact with would have fit right in with these Heartiste shitbags. Four of that number raped me, one repeatedly in a relationship, three after drugging me in my own apartment building. Yet here I am, friends with several men, dating a man, helping another man realize he was actually the victim in an abusive relationship rather than a fellow aggressor…actually caring about men’s rights, something the MRM only purports to doing…

This is nothing short of evil. Actually planning to abuse women. Oh this shit works to keep a woman in a relationship, as long as you also want to crush everything that woman ever was–what the fuck am I saying, of course they do. You know those “slavering male beasts” you like to tell us exist to justify victim blaming in domestic violence, men’s rightsers/pua fuckwads? Yeah, they’re YOU.

ryeash
6 years ago

I knew I shouldn’t have read this before work. Ugh. Maybe I should just reactivate my Facebook and start arguing with idiots again. At least then I could operate under the assumption that they’re just ignorant human beings instead of monsters who know exactly what the fuck they’re perpetuating.

Catfish
Catfish
6 years ago

Ok, that one guy openly admitted to practicing spousal abuse – and I would not be surprised if it was aimed at more than just the wife. Don’t these assbags realize that just because she stays, that does NOT mean they are happy ? Well, not that they care, because they are horrible, selfish douchenozzles.

Someone should report that asshat. What a sad excuses for human beings.

LBT
LBT
6 years ago

I can’t find it funny. This is shit people used on me; I wouldn’t be surprised if my rapist thought things like this. My consolation is knowing that more and more people are seeing through it and know they’re full of shit.

RE: kinginascendent

I believe that these are deeply wounded boys who are stuck like flies in amber.

No, that’s the myth they use to excuse their behavior. They WANT people to believe that only deep wounds could cause people to be so hateful. I AM a deeply wounded man; I was raised with rape and child-molesters. Note that I have chosen to respond to this by FIGHTING this bullshit, not espousing it.

Please, don’t help me.

LBT
LBT
6 years ago

Ugh, this post upset me enough that I might have to write fluffy happy consent relationships again to reassure myself that no, these are a vocal minority of abusive shitbags, not the majority.

vaiyt
6 years ago

I guess the line between ‘pick up artist guru’ and ‘domestic violence cheerleader’ is pretty faint these days.

There was never a line to begin with.

I believe that these are deeply wounded boys who are stuck like flies in amber.

No. Just no. They’re not wounded, they’re entitled.

opium4themasses
opium4themasses
6 years ago

comment image

cloudiah
6 years ago

I’m with that badger.

fruitloopsie
fruitloopsie
6 years ago

icallmycatmrtb
“Somebody please tell me this is satire. Please! Ugh, I’m off to find brain bleach.”

Wether it’s satire or serious it’s beyond disgusting and shouldn’t be taken lightly.

Have these guys ever thought the reason the ‘broads’ are staying because they are TERRIFIED!? No, they’re narcissistic and just plain evil. I hope the women/girls will stay away and get help.

fruitloopsie
fruitloopsie
6 years ago

Love that badger

justabrowngirl
6 years ago

This is revolting…I can’t even.

Just plain sad that anyone will have this way of thinking…and I’m out, too many triggers.

LBT
LBT
6 years ago

Funny how you can ALWAYS count on these posts for at least ONE person to come up and say we should feel sympathy and pat the asses of these people, because SURELY terrible things happened to them.

Sometimes I wonder if other abuse survivors besides me ever get pissed at the insinuation. “Of course they abuse others! They were probably abused themselves! They can’t help it; abuse survivors are just tainted and bound to hurt the people around them!”

*gaaag*

justabrowngirl
6 years ago

LBT… I have been,(let said in some very dark times in my childhood as well in adulthood) and still manage not to be a shitty person. I actually work very hard not to become what I survive.

icallmycatmrtb
icallmycatmrtb
6 years ago

Btw, love the badger!

My first husband pulled all the shit in that diagram and then some. He came from a very loving two parent home. He grew up with all the things that are supposed to make a person happy and well-adjusted. Sometimes a person is just an asshole.

LBT: The insinuation upsets me. As someone who has been raped, abused, and diagnosed with schizophrenia I have never hurt my kids, husband, others. I’ve been not nice to myself and that has hurt others. I try very hard to not do that anymore.

Shaun DarthBatman Day
6 years ago

Had a dude try to pick me up with a DV joke. I asked him why he thought it was funny, he was sorry that I got offended, and accused me of dehumanizing him. I asked why he thought I would find it charming and he said I am “crazy” and have “too much baggage”. Then he quit talking to me.

Does that count as my daily act of misandry? Because it really doesn’t feel good like they usually do…

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

This is bookmarked for the next time a troll tries to claim PUA is about self improvement, not abuse. We haven’t had one of those in awhile but we’re bound to get one sooner or later.

Sometimes I wonder if other abuse survivors besides me ever get pissed at the insinuation. “Of course they abuse others! They were probably abused themselves! They can’t help it; abuse survivors are just tainted and bound to hurt the people around them!”

I don’t know whether or not I should call myself an abuse survivor because when it happened to me it was two fellow children who abused me and the trauma has faded because it wasn’t an adult that I should have been able to trust or anything. But, yeah. It never once, even as a kid when the trauma was still there, occurred to me to hurt someone else. Because it’s wrong and I have empathy for others.

And now I think we need a nope llama.comment image

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

I wonder if any of these abusers in the comments section have copped to abusing women’s pets. I don’t think I care to visit the page and find out.

LBT
LBT
6 years ago

RE: justabrowngirl

I actually work very hard not to become what I survive.

Well said.

RE: icallmycatmrtb

Sometimes a person is just an asshole.

YUP. My rapist tried to portray himself as a poor abused nerd, but most of what he reported as his parents being terrible was, “I don’t like them, and I’m furious that I’m still completely emotionally and financially dependent on them but don’t want that to actually change.” He was a much bigger douche to his parents than they were to him, just in what I saw.

RE: WWTH

Spoiler: they totally have. David made a post about it a couple years back, involving the abuse of a woman’s cat to keep her in line. It might’ve been from before your time.

fruitloopsie
fruitloopsie
6 years ago

Shaun darthbatman day
Yes this pleases the Misandry Fempire.

WWTH
Dat llama XD

breakfastman1
6 years ago

Jesus. Fucking. Christ. This is some of the most horrible shit I have read on this site. These people are pure, unfiltered scum. I hope the women in relationships with these fuckers are able to get away from them safely, and that these men are left to rot in prison for the rest of their days.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

Spoiler: they totally have. David made a post about it a couple years back, involving the abuse of a woman’s cat to keep her in line. It might’ve been from before your time.

Ugh. Why am I not surprised? If anyone ever tried to hurt my cats they would be immediately ejected from the premises never to be spoken to again. Dracarys hides from people she doesn’t know (in fact I’m in trouble with her because I had the temerity to invite 4 friends over last night) but Darrow is so trusting. He greets every visitor at the door. It’s why I only let him go outside on a leash.

lacerta viridis
lacerta viridis
6 years ago

Oh my god, what the actual fuck even is that touchdown thing. Not only is it fucking revolting, it’s… not even remotely funny. Any ‘joke’ that requires that much explanation just doesn’t really work very well. (Also, any ‘joke’ that relies on making fun of disabled people? PROBABLY NOT THAT FUNNY.)

It always weirds me out so much when people claim that they have actually done stuff like this and had women swooning all over them for it, because I just can’t even remotely imagine it. Are they just flat-out lying? Or somehow interpreting women laughing nervously and edging away from them as a positive reaction?

I don’t even want to talk about the ‘try using abuse tactics to control women!’ thing because it’s making me feel slightly sick. Here, have a baby penguin instead: http://i.imgur.com/zQpPPMx.jpg

LBT
LBT
6 years ago

RE: lacerta viridis

Are they just flat-out lying? Or somehow interpreting women laughing nervously and edging away from them as a positive reaction?

Speaking as someone who grew up in a pretty fucked-up environment, these tricks might sound stupid, but they can be very effective on people who have already been abused. It’s intended to take advantage of someone whose defenses have already been compromised, or were never fully built to begin with.

Those are exactly the type of women they are seeking out. And then they keep spreading the beliefs so that they can be assured that they are right. It doesn’t actually MATTER how many women respond with laughter or, “WTF go away.” What matters to them is being able to SAY it, and have all their abuser friends agree with it so that their actions are vindicated.

It’s not really about reality. It’s about what they WANT reality to be, and believe it SHOULD be.

pendraegon
pendraegon
6 years ago

You know I was born in Duluth, I’ve actually been to the Domestic Abuse Intervention Project, people there helped my mother and I back in the eighties when it was just beginning and from the very bottom of my hearth fuck every single one of these pieces of human garbage. To take the work the people there have done and corrupt it this way. I can’t even begin to explain, I’m actually having trouble catching my breath I’m so angry right now. I need to go make some calls.

taitaisanchez
6 years ago

wow. this is horrifying.

It’s obvious that the MRA and PUA scenes are systematic codified psychopathy. It’s just… horrifying when it’s so raw like this.

Puddleglum
6 years ago

Whelp, the title for this one was correct; I’m horrified. Not shocked, just horrified. Though I am glad to know about the ‘touchdown’ thing; I am now prepared to bust the ass of any asshole who thinks it’d make a great joke to use on people.

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
6 years ago

I really don’t want to read about abuse of cats, so if someone wants to post that, could you put a flag up so I can skip it?

So much for saying there’s no misogyny. Oh wait, yesterday I learned that it’s only misogyny if a dude says out loud that he hates all women, no exceptions. Treating women like he hates them, or like he thinks of them as subhuman, isn’t actually misogyny. IDK what it is, but misogyny isn’t it!

Don’t MRAs and PUAs get their panties in a wad if you call them the abusers’ lobby? Not sure how they can deny it, given stuff like this.

Had a dude try to pick me up with a DV joke. I asked him why he thought it was funny, he was sorry that I got offended, and accused me of dehumanizing him. I asked why he thought I would find it charming and he said I am “crazy” and have “too much baggage”. Then he quit talking to me.

Sounds to me like the fact that he advertised up-front that he’s a douche saved you the time you might otherwise have spent interacting with him before learning this.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

from the very bottom of my hearth fuck every single one of these pieces of human garbage.

I love this typo. It’s making me imagine Heartiste being forced to clean out ashy fireplaces with nothing but a toothbrush. Sort of like Cinderella.

pendraegon
pendraegon
6 years ago

That would require allowing him into someone’s home though, I wouldn’t want to dirty the ash.

roguepixie
roguepixie
6 years ago

I feel like traveling with the badger and the nope-llama right now. That’s all I know.

Shaun DarthBatman Day
6 years ago

Does that mean that, in order to commit misandry, I must say, out loud (typing doesn’t count), that I hate all men? I could do that every day. No more educating assholes as to why they come off as abusive or, at least, abuse positive. No more teaching men that women don’t like to be harassed. No more anything but waking up each morning to say “I hate all men”! That’s gonna free up so much time.

Shaun DarthBatman Day
6 years ago

Also, yes, I am happy when men out themselves like that. Frees up time. I am all about free time.

cloudiah
6 years ago

Just dropping some more brain bleach here:

seraph4377
6 years ago

Reblogged this on Dreams of the Shining Horizon and commented:
Another public service announcement about PUA’s. It may seem like it’s a parody, like it’s too horribly absurd to be real, but no…these people can’t be parodied.

thebewilderness
thebewilderness
6 years ago

This is one of the reasons we counsel abused women to hide their copy of “Why Does He DO That”. Either the abuser will beat hell out of her for thinking he is abusive or he will learn new abuser techniques.

These are the d00dz who say with a straight face that they had no idea there was anything wrong, then she just up and left for no reason, and he is so shocked.

The abuser lobby. Abuse really really is a world view. We need to acknowledge that.

lacerta viridis
lacerta viridis
6 years ago

@LBT Oh, I’m more than aware that a lot of these ‘make people feel bad about themselves’ tactics can be very effective on people who have low self-esteem or whose defences are low/not-there (some not-so-great experiences over here, too).

It’s just the way it’s always reported as “this thing WORKS EVERY TIME and all women will SWOON AT YOUR FEET because deep down in their souls they just LOVE being the butt of creepy and badly constructed ableist jokes and also, something about ~gina tingles~.” Like… do they really believe they’re getting universal great reactions from this bullshit? Or are they all just flat-out making up their stories to impress each other?

(Also, I don’t know what the fuck the tingles thing is about. I don’t know about anyone else, but my vagina has never ‘tingled’ in my life. Sounds uncomfortable.)

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