So here’s a new perspective on the whole “should we allow women to take over the tech industry or any other industry” question, courtesy of the Pro-Male/Anti-Feminist Technology blog. Yes, women, if you want to run a business or an industry you apparently have to check with the dudes at the Pro-Male/Anti-Feminist Technology blog first.
In a post titled “Why We Don’t Want Women Taking Over Tech Or Any Other Industry,” the ironically named “Reality forever” explains that women shouldn’t be allowed to run anything because, well, women are terrible and apparently love making everyone go to meetings:
[M]en are afraid of women in the workplace because all they bring is misery, low morale, lawsuits based on false accusations, insanity in general, never ending useless meetings and all around stupidity and dysfunction and low productivity.
Also, cats:
Even women hate working with other women. Put several cats in a small cage together and you’ll get the picture.
Huh. As sensible as Reality forever’s argument has been so far, I have a couple of slight objections to make here. Human women are not, to the best of my knowledge, cats.
Also, I’m pretty sure the issue here isn’t the cats so much as the whole small cage thing. Basically, if you put any animal – or person – in a small cage they’re going to be a bit grouchy, particularly if you stuff another couple of animals or people in there with them.
I mean, your uncle Ted might be the most affable fellow in the world, but if you throw him in a tiny cage with, say, your other uncle Brian, there’s going to be some friction. Toss in some cats, or perhaps a hyena or two, and you’re really asking for trouble.
Let’s let Reality forever continue, just in case his argument gets better.
But we can all give a sigh of relief because women will NEVER dominate any industry and there are specific reasons why. The reasons are contained in female nature. Any female above admin in any corporate office can barely even show up for work on any consistent basis.
I think he’s on to something. I sometimes see women walking around the streets in the middle of the day. They probably left to go to work in the morning but just got lost. Or distracted by a shoe sale. Women love shoes, amirite fellas high five.
I know this sounds insane, but we [have] thousands of clients and the vast majority of the companies wherein we have female contacts are rarely ever in. Many have taken off for a year at a tine.
You may not realize it, fellas, but women can just wander off on a break and not come back for a year.
It’s like this well hidden, but giant secret that no one talks about and I don’t think a lot of people are even aware of because women are so stealth at covering up their deviance and so many people will cover for them.
It’s true. If you look closely at many of the so-called women who work in your office you will discover that a lot of them are actually mannequins, carefully disguised to look like your female co-workers – who have probably been sitting on a tropical beach somewhere eating bon bons for the last 8 months with no one suspecting a thing.
In fact I’ve been trying to find other people who have seen this who deal with a large number of companies like I do.
They take off huge chunks of time- months even a year at a time then refuse to be at work before 11am and are gone by 2pm and never work on mon. or fri. then suddenly quits after a short time. Forever. Not just that job- all work completely.
It’s the dirty secret of the corporate world: most full-time women employees work only 12 hours a week, if that.
Women really only want to work part time if at all – they just like the idea of work and a status title and do not want to make any commitment to anything or anyone- especially women now.
It’s a little-known fact that Sheryl Sandberg’s official title at Facebook is “Pretty Princess of Operations” and that she only works three hours a week.
That is their flaky nature. And yes, they are ALL like that- 98% of them. And they’re lazy and don’t want to ever try harder or get out of their comfort zone or take risks. Women are their own worst enemies.
Oh, don’t be modest, Reality forever. People like you are their worst enemies.
In the comments, Reality forever expands upon his thesis.
I … work for a telecom and I’m in sales – so we have clients in virtually ALL industries and/or go to pitch potential clients in all industries. And I’ve been at it for 6 years total and with any females who have an actual title like IT Manager, VP or any kind of administrative anything, they are extremely clever at barely putting in any hours – I know because it’s my job (unfortunately) to have to deal with so many of them on a daily basis and communicate with them.
They’re extremely flaky, moody, never want any responsibilities at all to make any decisions, barely ever come into work, are as useless pedals on a wheelchair, spiteful, condescending, vindictive- the most horrible people I have ever had to deal with have all been women. And the vast majority of them are all the same in their patterns.
They’re overemotional about everything so they come off even creepy a lot of the time! With the men, it’s about 2-5% of them are jerks, flip that for women to about 2-5% of them are decent. That’s just been my experience dealing with all these women in virtually every industry there is.
And they are always just… OUT. Whether it’s ‘not in yet’ ‘already left for the day.’ Not in ‘today.’ ‘Out till next week.’ If I had 25 cents for every time I’ve heard ‘she’ is ‘out’ I would be wealthy, and no, they’re not just trying to avoid me and lying- they’ll actually be out, you can hear the sincerity in the voice of whoever’s telling me this that day. …
And I would expect it’s their being allergic to work that has kept them from really achieving anything across the board. And it’s ironically BECAUSE of Feminism that made them this way- everyone needs to make special ‘concessions’ for them and bend to them, not them needing to bend to fit in and join the work flow. …
Feminism, everything women are up to now, all of it, is mostly just a fraud and illusion and I’m telling you this thing of women being OUT all the time is real! Go to any company website in any industry, go to the staff directory, or go to Data.com connect and look up the staff directory for any company, then call and ask for any of the females above admin on that list and they will just happen to be out that day!
And it’ll be like Tuesday at 11am. It’s this phenomenon that I’ve been trying to tell people about for years, but they just don’t believe me or don’t understand what I’m talking about.
Huh. It must be true. Because I can’t think of any other reason women would want to avoid taking a call from you.
Soooo…this guy is a telemarketer, and women managers won’t take his calls, and this means that women are always “out” and aren’t working and are pulling some kind of “fraud” with the help of Feminism (with a capital F) to keep getting paid even though they don’t do any work, because everyone has to make concessions and bend over backwards to please women. Because Feminism.
Right, dude. Riiiight.
So let me get this straight. You’re suggesting that I should start calling up companies and asking whatever receptionist or admin answers the phone if I can talk to some female executive I don’t know and have no reason to contact just to see if said female executive is in the office and available to take my pointless call? I’m supposed to waste some poor receptionist’s or admin’s time (and what am I supposed to say when they’re likely smart enough to ask me what this call is in regards to?) as well as the executive’s time if I actually manage to get through to them? All just to see if said executive is “being lazy”?
Dude, just how big of a douchebag do you think I am? Apparently, an even bigger douchebag than you, because at least it’s your job to try to call them for the purpose of trying to sell them something.
Have you guys read about the most recent dust up with Dawkins? Basically, he threw everyone at FTB under the bus and cited Christina hoff Fucking Sommers as a good feminist.
Yeah, he’s basically been disowned by everybody who’s not an MRA lite Atheist BroBro.
WWTH
They do want to talk about misogyny and homophobia. But only as a way to criticise religions and theocracies.
And we should all bear in mind that skepticism and rationality are tools only for taking down people you don’t like. It Has Nothing To Do with examining your own thinking, presumptions or prejudices. Nothing at all.
Which is why I find them doubly (triply, exponentially?) irritating. If you’ve decided that there are no gods, then all those things that religions claim to be decreed or inspired by god/s are now null. You have to make up your own ethical and moral standards. So how come all these clowns come up with an ethical position which looks very much like religion – minus any slavery justification but plus the added bonus of feeling good about pointing and laughing at religious beliefs and religious people. And everything else stays the same.
I know, I know. It’s just that my fluffy pink ladybrainz don’t logick much but it troubles me.
Hi! At one point you use the word “mannikin”, when the correct spelling is “mannequin.” Thanks for doing what you do.
Which is yet another reason – despite still being strongly atheistic (I’ve yet to be convinced that even things like ghosts or other supernatural entities exist) – I cannot stand the movement. It’s absolutely disingenuous of them to act as if they care one moment, only to then do a 180 and pretty much shit on anyone who brings up those issues outside of atheism.
It was particularly aggravating how Dawkins acted as if he cared about women, by being seemingly aggrieved over policies in Middle Eastern countries that prohibited them from driving or getting an education. That’s all well and good…but you can’t also claim we should ignore instances of misogyny or sexism in the first world for supposedly not being “as bad.” It’s not a fucking competition – an injustice anywhere is an injustice anywhere.
Once you start making excuses as to how one form of sexism and misogyny is “not as bad”, then you’ve missed the entire point of working against sexism and misogyny.
And yet another reason I can’t stand the movement: I assumed the issue was to deal with and do away the cruelty that comes with many religious institutions – not all religion itself. I honestly have no issue with someone indulging in spiritual beliefs, even if I choose not to, as long as they are not harming others or justifying such.
I certainly can’t stand all this Islamophobic bullshit because, on average, the Muslims I’ve interacted with here in the States have generally been the most congenial and considerate people I’ve come across. Rarely have they pushed their faith on me (they want you to *GASP!* show interest first) nor treated me in a degrading, judgmental fashion. Y’know who does? Just about every single Western Christian. But that’s because I had the gull to admit I was raised Jewish and still considered myself such, at least culturally – since I assumed it wasn’t that big a deal.
Of course, I learned otherwise when every mildly religious kid in school seemed freaked out by the mention and kept trying to rope me into going to their church in the hopes of converting me…
As far as “biotruths” go: I never thought I’d of used this term but that comes from being…blinded by science. Being so wrapped up in the workings of biology has crippled their critical faculties when it comes to the way culture influences us. I’ve seen plenty of ardent atheists go on and on and on about how everything is dictated by “genes” but can’t comprehend why, say, certain kinds of entertainment can influence one’s attitudes. They’ll claim its influence is miniscule…as they go online or watch TV where entire advertisements are manufactured SPECIFICALLY to influence opinion. It’s certainly funny when they’ve obviously been influenced by various memes and go on to, erroneously, use them as talking points as if they came up with themselves. GEE, I WONDER WHY?!?!
It’s so much easier to excuse shitty behavior on genetics than to be introspective enough to realize how the world around effects your thinking.
Yes, this! I like some of the platonic ideas behind the whole movement, but they just fail introspection completely.
I haven’t seen any recent Dawkins thing, but given what comes every other week it can hardly be a surprise anymore.
Wouldn’t Free Cell be too easy for cats? I think they’d opt for Spider.
@HowlOwl – If it were a reference to A Doll’s House, it would be macaro(o)ns rather than bonbons. A good idea, though.
“Hi. I’m from BigTelco and I’d like to speak to X about…”
If X is FEMALE reply
“She’s out”
If X is MALE reply
“Piss off”
Conclusion: FEMALES are always out…
When I worked at the hospital, I was gatekeeper for the lab techs. From my office to their lab was one clear corridor. When unsolicited vendors would stop by, I asked them if they had an appointment; if not, they were to leave their literature and wait for a call*. Given that they were standing right there, and could HEAR the techs down the hall, they were frequently annoyed by this. Behold, the field wherein my fucks grow; see that it is barren. The techs greatly appreciated my gatekeeper skills.
*This happened less often than you’d think.
Wow, okay. I’m just piling on at this point, but this mess:
just made me LOLOLOL! I was a temp for about 6 years after I got out of the USAF. I did many* assignments as a receptionist and a big part of that job was ALWAYS to screen out cold calls from salespeople. For male as well as female execs. Even the admin assistants for these execs don’t typically have the time to listen to a bunch of sales spiels.
Reality forNever is lyin’ his ass off if he’s blaming just the women contacts on his cold-call list.
*as in waaaaaay too many. Bleh.
A friend of mine is the supervisor of a calling center for a commercial roofing company. They call all over the country. 60 to 70 calls a day for each person (about 20 people in the center). I think they count their successes as one or two a week. And “success” is defined as getting someone to refer them to the person who might make a decision about a new roof in less than 10 years time. So they can get on the bidder’s list.
That’s gotta wear on you after a while. My guess is this shining light of reason doesn’t realize “out” means “no thanks”. Move on, buddy. You got thousands of phone numbers to get through. Returning to the same played-out list over and over again doesn’t do your numbers any good.
I hereby nominate reality forever for the yearly award for the post which demonstrates the highest possible degree of cluelessness about the actual cause of the phenomenon he describes.
Here, Muslims are a strong contender for most peaceful religious community, right next to the Buddhists. Plus, we have a long history of Middle Eastern immigration, dating back to before World War I. It’s especially heartbreaking to see all the bullshit going on in Gaza and Syria because a lot of people here have family branches there.
@Chris Jacob
I love the English language, and am a good speller. Spelling is important. However, it is not so important that you need to point and laugh when someone makes a mistake in it.
Grammar, on the other hand, is vital, because it makes your meaning CLEAR. Poor grammar can make your sentence mean something completely different than what you meant.
Example:
“Let’s eat, Grandma!” vs. “Let’s eat Grandma!”
Proper punctuation is your friend. Learn how to diagram a sentence, to see which modifiers apply to which words, so that you’re not saying that inanimate objects are doing things, while the people holding the inanimate objects are simply standing around like ninnies.
See, that’s why I’ll point and laugh at the grammar, because it makes the person look like a fool, who cannot think clearly, at all. However, spelling? Not usually important, unless it’s so badly misspelled as to be either unrecognizable, or else a completely different work.
I once had an apology email that said, “Sorry for the incontinence.” Darn you, Spellchecker!
But just to point and laugh at someone’s spelling, when the meaning was perfectly clear, is silly.
My English professor in college once said that the only people who never make spelling mistakes are illiterate. He didn’t even knock off points for the odd spelling mistake in an assignment, provided it was no more than one or two times on a page. But get the grammar wrong, and be prepared to go down a grade!
So, back to that a original source material:
He’s taking two disparate ideas and squashing them together, without the proper punctuation, to form a long, rambling sentence with poor structure and a foggy meaning. When I first read it, I thought he meant that men are afraid they will out-produce women. Why that would frighten them, I do not know. Then I thought, OH! He means men are afraid that women will out produce them, while they are running on to cause misery and lower morale, etc. What? And what is that random “no” doing in the middle of that long sentence? To what does it refer?
It’s just very confusing, and the rest of the article is no better.
On the topic of cold calls – I can’t tell you how many times I got calls from people telling me that they were our vendor for printer cartridges, and asking me for my make and model number, so we could set up a refill order.
We got ALL our printer supplies from the IT department. Every last cartridge. And the IT department went through some sort of intense screening process to choose their vendor, and never told anyone in other departments who that vendor actually was.
Therefore, anyone who called about printer sales was a lying liar who lies, and was promptly dealt with. Except on that one reeeeeally slow day. Hehehehe.
I used to work as a telemarketer, too. I know how hard it is. I also know that I never lied to my potential clients. One telemarketing group I was in, I lasted for three days, before I realized how unethical the practices were. We were given lists of names and numbers, of people we were told had applied for credit cards within the last month – and then when I called them, I found out that they had died six months before, or operated strictly on cash. I noticed about one of these “mistakes” per page on my list. When I asked my supervisor about it, he told me to shut up and get back to calling.
Since I really needed the job, I kept at it, but after three days, I found something else, and left. I saw on the news later that same week that the company was shut down and charged with all sorts of felonies. I was so glad I quit!
Anyway, I’m usually polite to telemarketers, because I sympathize. But if they lie to me, or are rude, I feel no more sympathy.
Also, Policy of Madness – YAY, another admin-type!
Weren’t the Medicis a famous Florentine banking family many years before Calvin?
And if anyone ever called and asked to speak with my boss, and then refused to say who was calling, it was “One moment, please. I’ll connect you.” DISCONNECT.
If you want to get anywhere in business, never tick off the admin! You may even have something they really want, but you’ll never get through. I actually learned that in my first job. My boss was looking to hire someone, and he asked me, the receptionist, to be the first screen, with full authority to toss anyone’s application in the trash, if I deemed it right! I tossed out two applications, and my boss thanked me for making his work easier, by weeding out the worst.
See, it’s not just the admin being a jerk. It’s actually part of the admin’s job to stop jerks from getting past them. We are the guardians at the bridge, and Xerxes SHALL NOT PASS.
But the nice ones? The ones who are offering something worthwhile and valuable? We know the ins and outs and how to get you through as efficiently as possible, and we’ll grease the wheels, when we think it’s appropriate.
@saintnic86 – I’m so sorry. They have no business treating you that way, just because you’re Jewish.
Jesus was a Jew. Furthermore, all those sacrifices made in the temple were precursors to his sacrifice, and it WAS a sacrifice. The Romans did the actual grunt work of it, but it was the work of the Sanhedrin, who had the legal and religious authority to carry out sacrifices. They were doing what God had intended for them to do, and frankly, I’m grateful.
So, I really don’t get all the Jew-hatred from Christians. We should be grateful that they did what was necessary to fulfill God’s plan and bring about Christ’s atonement. Without the Jews doing what they had to do, the Atonement could not have happened, and that would be bad for all us Christians.
I like Jews. I feel a kind of kinship to them, because of my Christianity.
Likewise, Muslims are linked by Moses and Abraham.
I don’t really feel a kinship with Buddhists, though, although I do admire the philosophy. But I haven’t found a common link, you know?
On behalf of all the western Christians who have treated you badly, I apologize. That really stinks! And there’s absolutely no religious reason for it. It’s pure bigotry.
Christians who behave that way really don’t have a clear understanding of Christ’s gospel, and it irks me. Unfortunately, they also tend to be the same ones who tell me I’m not a Christian, at all, because I don’t believe in the Nicean Creed.
For clarification: I am a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, a.k.a. Mormons, and yes, we are Christians.
Personally, I prefer to just live my life, and if people ask me, then I’ll tell them about my beliefs. I don’t like to push it in people’s faces, because I don’t like other people pushing their beliefs in my face, either.
I had to put this out there, though, because it’s a big thing for me. I hate anti-Semitism, because I’m actually grateful to the Jews! And since I’m grateful for Christian reasons, having Christians claim Christianity as a reason to hate Jews just really sticks in my craw.
Anyway, back on topic…
My niece wants to be a vet – think this guy would be OK with that?
@Saintnick86
TRUTH!
I think, sometimes, the only reason MRAs and their ilk support women driving and getting an education is so that their female slaves can drive to the grocery store and read and do math well enough to figure out the best deals, to save the men’s hard-earned money.
@Saintnick86
I just hope that my comment didn’t offend you, or anyone else on this thread. I realize that it might be interpreted badly. Religion is often like that.
If I have offended anyone, please accept my apology.
There’s a reason why I don’t generally talk religion in forums, and it’s because it’s so easy to offend. Beliefs, deeply held, can be painful when they clash.
Mods, if you think my comment was problematic, please feel free to delete it.
Introspection, rationality, and skepticism are valuable tools. If your beliefs can’t stand up to them, then it’s time to find stronger beliefs, which can.
Nietsche said, “What doesn’t destroy me, makes me stronger.” It is true for religious beliefs, as well as the human soul.
That’s one reason I like debate. Defending my position helps me to analyze it in greater depth, and either I am further convinced of its truth, or else I see why it might not be so, and I can actually change my position, when convinced by rational argument.
But the debate needs to be polite and civilized, or it is worthless. Mind you, if someone has good reason to be angry, and every right to be angry, they can express that anger, and it can be quite important in the debate, because it adds power to the weight of the issue. We don’t bother to debate issues that don’t at least irritate us, after all. However, abuse is NOT valuable to the debate. Passion? Yes. Abuse? No.
Freecell has more moving things at which to bat. Spider is more mind-intensive, but it’s so static.
My kitty likes the moving things.
@Grumpyoldman
I hereby nominate reality forever for the yearly award for the post which demonstrates the highest possible degree of cluelessness about the actual cause of the phenomenon he describes.
Seconded.