"Is u ass bif?" The Question of Our Time?

Yeah, implying that someone looking for casual sex doesn’t deserve manners or respect is essentially slut shaming.

So entering a space where the bodies of people are explicitly sexualized means that one shouldn’t expect one’s body to be sexualized?

I’m honestly confused as to why people are conflating entering sexualized spaces with consenting to have one’s boundaries violated. If someone else does or says something that one does not like about themone is perfectly within one’s rights to tell them fuck offand take further actions such as reporting to management work to law enforcement undesirable behavior continues. In fact, I will say that it is an assertion of one’s respect and self worth to do so.

Simultaneously, however, if one does not want comments such as “Do you have a nice ass?”–some things that I have been asked several times while cruising, one should not enter into spaces where such comments or questions are considered acceptable discourse.

Regarding high school books – we read Ethan Frome. Gah. That is one grim book. None of us got it in any real way; we’d never even lived through a New England winter, much less the pain of a frustrated, dead-end life. I now sympathize with the teacher, but at the time it felt like emptying a crate full of excelsior with a pair of tweezers.

Oh hey, my first blockquote monster!

Andiexist, try replacing your [brackets with <pointy things! Going in the appropriate direction, of course.

So, when so many men seem to think it’s acceptable to catcall, should women never go out onto the street? Or onto the internet as well? Oh, or to school or work. Someone might see them gardening or something if they left the house…

Basically, being gay does not give someone the right to objectify potential partners.

Could you kindly show me where that is a sensible interpretation of what I posted?

Look people who use hook-up apps and go to bathhouses our sex clubs–all things which I do–are seeking out explicitly sexualized space and can therefore expect more sexualized behavior from others using that space.

I would not welcome anyone cat calling me or grabbing my ass as I walked down the street. I don’t really know what I would do if it happened, but I certainly wouldn’t consider it appropriate general-public behavior. However, I would accept that type of interaction as part of the solicitation for sex in a bathhouse. What transpires afterwards could perfectly acceptably to include my telling the cat caller our ass grabber to go fuck himself our my fucking around with him.

The issue here is that being cat called or grabbed is not so transgressive of the social norms in the sexualized spaces I enter that it in itself constitutes harassment our assault. Continued unwanted comments or contact would most certainly comprise harassment/assault, but the explicit sexualization of the space renders interactions such as touching others’ genitals–which would otherwise be considered utterly inappropriate behaviors outside the space, at least provisionally acceptable.

Within the larger discussion of the OP, I was never objecting to how Yellow (bif?) responded to Blue (bif’s interlocutor): I see nothing worthy of criticism in the exchange at all. I was however trying to explain–now obviously and hopelessly unclearly–how Blue’s initial conduct might not be, as kittehserf put it, “brain breaking” in its social density.

@Michael

I was attempting to illustrate how going off what people who do that sort of thing think is acceptable is not going to get good results.

So, here’s a more relevant comparison: By your logic, women who do not want to be harassed should not go to bars. People are capable of wanting respectful partners for casual sex. No matter what the particular subculture you are in is like, it is NEVER okay to harass someone or act like they are obligated to have sex with you. Period, end of story.

Any “that is what it is like” is just an illustration of “you know, we should really teach people how to behave with people they want to have sex with.”

Michael, go read the OP again. When the man being asked if his ass is “biff” attempts to draw a boundary, the other guy tells him to fuck off. If you really don’t see why that makes the interaction not OK I’m not sure what else to try in terms of explaining why people find his behavior inappropriate.

Being in a sexualized space doesn’t mean that you’ve forfeited your right to draw boundaries, or that it’s OK for other people to chastise you for attempting to enforce them. People always retain the right to tell other people to knock it off, no matter how sexualized the space.

So is the objection to the guy who drew a boundary being told to fuck off? Or is objection to the ass-size question in the first place?

Because Myoo skipped directly from being at an orgy to being raped orgy all the way over being propositioned at an orgy which was the analog to what the situation was in the OP.

My point has always been that certain behaviors that are never acceptable in non-sexualized spaces (e.g.asking questions about a person’s body, touching others’ bodies, etc) might be acceptable and expected to occur in sexualized. Of course, the person being asked or touched had the right to refuse the question or touch, but I am disputing whether, the sexualized nature of the space, the question or touch is as wholly inappropriate as most posters insist they are.

I was however trying to explain–now obviously and hopelessly unclearly–how Blue’s initial conduct might not be, as kittehserf put it, “brain breaking” in its social density.

Maybe some of us just have higher expectations of people’s behaviour even in a sexualised context. At the very least the creep was being crass and disgusting in his approach, as the respondent made pretty clear. Creep was also chockfull of outraged entitlement, not an attitude likely to win friends, let alone sexual partners.

What the hell makes you think any of his behaviour was acceptable? Do you really think “sexualised context” means treating people like fucktoys is okay?