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alpha males domestic violence excusing abuse men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny MRA

MMA fighter and accused woman-beater War Machine gets an endorsement from a prominent Men's Rights Activist

While over on Reddit the regulars are highly offended that anyone would point out the striking similarities between their ideas and the crackpot “men’s oppression is worse than slavery” rants of War Machine, the mixed martial arts fighter and accused woman-beater is getting support from one prominent Indian MRA, Rajesh Kumar, known on Twitter as @MensMrm:

Kumar’s Twitter account, with roughly 1600 followers including numerous well-known names in the MRM, looks to be the official account for the Men’s Rights Movement group on Facebook, a public group that boasts some 14,000 members, among them AVFM’s Paul Elam and British MRA/child prostitution apologist Tom Martin.

The link in his tweet is to a story that details the charges against War Machine, as well as his hyperbolic MRA-eqsue views, so there’s no question that Kumar knows just who he’s endorsing here.

 

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Bina
Bina
6 years ago

AVFM’s mission statement contains this line: “We oppose all state authority over or interference in the private lives of consenting adults engaged in any form of interpersonal relationship.”

That sounds like a free pass for domestic violence to me.

Not to mention incest, date rape, and oh hell…mailman rape.

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

And I seriously doubt they care about the “consenting” part, either.

blahlistic (@blahlistic)

Policy Of Madness:

Yes, they know that it is seen as wrong, but they’ve given little to no indication that they think it is wrong. It’s not about morals to them, but about optics.

Agreed

Auntie Alias:

AVFM’s mission statement contains this line: “We oppose all state authority over or interference in the private lives of consenting adults engaged in any form of interpersonal relationship.”

That sounds like a free pass for domestic violence to me.

Yeah, police used to view wifebeating or child abuse as “a private matter,” didn’t they?

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

It is an interesting argument for them to make. That they are all bloviators and only bloviators and have nothing in common with d00dz who walk the MRA talk.

Compassion for Men and Boys™ is strictly limited to dissing those ebul wimminz. Whom the law doesn’t allow them to batter and get away with it…YET.

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

AVfM Managing Editor Dean Esmay co-hosts AVfM Radio’s Revelations with Erin Pizzey and Tales from the Infrared. He also writes about numerous topics on Dean’s World and The Moderate Voice. He encourages people to look at issues through the lens of compassion for men who deserve it, and respect for women who deserve it. He is the author of the critically-acclaimed novel Methuselah’s Daughter.

So much snurk, all of this. Who does HE think he’s kidding?

Policy of Madness
Policy of Madness
6 years ago

He encourages people to look at issues through the lens of compassion for men who deserve it, and respect for women who deserve it.

???? That’s so weird! Why doesn’t he encourage compassion for ALL men, not just those that “deserve it”? Why not respect for ALL women? What criteria are used to make the decision that someone “deserves” respect or compassion? And is compassion for women and respect for men out of the picture? For what reason?

I’m asking too many questions, aren’t I?

blahlistic (@blahlistic)

Funny, I try to extend respect and compassion to most people. I don’t think they have to deserve it.

AK
AK
6 years ago

I just looked up Methuselah’s Daughter out of curiosity and Esmay is listed as a contributor, with John Eddy as the author (and the person who created the main character, according to the summary). Kinda funny that his bio implies he’s the sole author of it.

http://www.amazon.com/Methuselahs-Daughter-John-Eddy/dp/184728440X

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

Why doesn’t he encourage compassion for ALL men, not just those that “deserve it”? Why not respect for ALL women? What criteria are used to make the decision that someone “deserves” respect or compassion? And is compassion for women and respect for men out of the picture? For what reason?

Yeah, funny how those guys are all about “deserving”. If it’s a question of THAT, then I’d say they don’t deserve respect OR compassion, because their whole snotty “I’ll decide what’s right for YOU, girlie” attitude makes it impossible to feel either one towards them.

Also (and getting back to topic): A woman in MMA takes the sexist culture of that and other sports to task. If SHE doesn’t deserve respect, then who does?

(I know Esmay & Co. aren’t going to grant it to her, because she’s a feminist badass who stepped out of line and made their boners unhappy.)

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

Also…huh…that novel is self-published, and the “critical acclaim” is limited to just ten readers. Probably all of them known to the authors. FAIL!

sparky
sparky
6 years ago

coffee:

@sparky Everyone needs more coffee.

I see what you did there 🙂

He encourages people to look at issues through the lens of compassion for men who deserve it, and respect for women who deserve it.

Is this from AVFM’s bio? Because this is really unintentionally relevatory. A lot like Elam’s “You’re consent is not required” remark.

sparky
sparky
6 years ago

“Relevatory” = “revealing.”

I swear, I can spell when I’m not sleep deprived and typing on a phone.

blahlistic (@blahlistic)

Is this from AVFM’s bio? Because this is really unintentionally relevatory. A lot like Elam’s “You’re consent is not required” remark.

It is indeed.
I never got the whole “respect is earned” thing.
Though…
I wonder in what sense he is using the word “respect”…that’s important I’ve heard the saying “respect is earned.” and it baffled me, because I thought of respect as “respecting rights.”

So respect would not be a synonym for admiration *to me.*
But maybe to others it would be.

When I say I respect people I mean the following:

to refrain from intruding upon or interfering with,

Or sort of an antonym of “Insulting, bellittling, badgering, abusing, violating.”
I don’t mean:

the condition of being esteemed or honored:

I don’t generally give everyone

esteem for or a sense of the worth or excellence of a person, a personal quality or ability, or something considered as a manifestation of a personal quality or ability.

You really do have to prove yourself worthy of being held in esteem…though I note that telling a person you believe in their ability to do________ well is a great way to shore up their faith in themselves so that they CAN do _______ well.
(definitions from: http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/respect )

So are they saying they don’t respect my autonomy and humanity unless I *earn* it? Are they saying I deserve to be treated as subhuman until I earn full humanity?
What do y’all think?

GrumpyOldNurse
GrumpyOldNurse
6 years ago

@ blahlistic – I don’t think that they think too hard about what words actually mean, and so often use them haphazardly.

Yes, I do realise that that was not a great insight. Sorry that I couldn’t forward your interesting conversation starter, but that is seriously all I got on this topic.

AbsintheDexterous
AbsintheDexterous
6 years ago

So are they saying they don’t respect my autonomy and humanity unless I *earn* it? Are they saying I deserve to be treated as subhuman until I earn full humanity?
What do y’all think?

I honestly think that they mean it that way. If you look at all of their ramblings, it really points to “rights are only applied to those who have esteem which must be earned”. I’ve seen racists make similar arguments. By combining “respect as in basic human decency” and “respect as in admiration”, they have a great code word that normally flies under people’s bullshit radar with which to make horrible arguments and it gives the speaker/writer plausible deniability when it comes to being called out on their bullshit. I mean, how many times have we heard “I didn’t mean it like THAT”?

AbsintheDexterous
AbsintheDexterous
6 years ago

LOL, this is the first time the blockquote monster got me!

contrapangloss
6 years ago

Congratulations! It was hungry. 🙂

blahlistic (@blahlistic)

I mean, I do make fun of MRA’s…but I respect their right to speak.

I do bear some scorn for the way MRA’s usually ignore…well…data and documented facts that don’t line up with their biases.
You can’t really have a reasonable debate with someone like that, you know?
I also am angered that they aren’t interested in looking for points of agreement.

They want to battle evil and by golly we’re the evil, like it or not.

mildlymagnificent
6 years ago

I don’t think that they think too hard about what words actually mean, and so often use them haphazardly.</blockquote

Yup. I think they work on the premise that if you don't respect someone for your own reasons, then you’re perfectly entitled to be rude, dismissive, insulting and generally horrible to them.

Whereas most of us work on a different hierarchy of terms or concepts. Like this one I saw on a poster in the physio’s office.

Courtesy is required.
Respect is earned.
Love is given.

This construction cuts right across their particular mindset. Rather than treating everyone with ordinary civility regardless of whether they know them, they feel free to be rude and offensive to anyone and everyone unless and until they demonstrate their worthiness to be admitted to this rather small group. It’s actually a reversal or inversion of normal social interaction. Most adults are reasonably polite to others unless and until they demonstrate that they’re beyond the bounds of normal interaction. Even then, they’re more likely to avoid or minimise interaction with an undesirable individual or group rather than scale it up to verbal warfare.

mildlymagnificent
6 years ago

The damned monster got me. Oh well.

emilygoddess - MOD
emilygoddess - MOD
6 years ago

What are you talking about, David? War Machine has nothing in common with MRAs!

blahlistic (@blahlistic)

I honestly think that they mean it that way. If you look at all of their ramblings, it really points to “rights are only applied to those who have esteem which must be earned”.

Okeydoke…So in saying this:

look at issues through the lens of compassion for men who deserve it, and respect for women who deserve it.

One notes that only certain men are deemed worthy of compassion, and only certain women are deemed worthy of respect.

Compassion:a feeling of deep sympathy and sorrow for another who is stricken by misfortune, accompanied by a strong desire to alleviate the suffering.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/compassion

So apparently he only wants to alleviate the suffering of SOME men?…Which seems rather hypocritical. Maybe they should call it the Some Men’s Rights Movement…

And apparently, if Absinthe is right, they only respect women who’ve “earned” it.
Presumably earning it involves submission.
Fine if it’s consensual submission, but it ain’t my kink.

blahlistic (@blahlistic)

Rather than treating everyone with ordinary civility regardless of whether they know them, they feel free to be rude and offensive to anyone and everyone unless and until they demonstrate their worthiness to be admitted to this rather small group. It’s actually a reversal or inversion of normal social interaction. Most adults are reasonably polite to others unless and until they demonstrate that they’re beyond the bounds of normal interaction. Even then, they’re more likely to avoid or minimise interaction with an undesirable individual or group rather than scale it up to verbal warfare.

MM, awesome comment, and exactly! I’ve seen and met people like this, not just MRA’s, but people who just seem hostile to everybody but their own ingroup, and that’s a great way of explaining it. Thanks!

Mens Rights Movement (@MensMrm)

War Machine said that “Men’s Oppression is worse than slavery”…… I said on twitter that Many men are realizing this……. Allegations against War Machine may or may not be correct, he may or may not be an ideal human being- nothing stops his right to think like a Man, express his view like a Man, realize slavery of a Man…… and I endorse his views on slavery of Men.

Unimaginative
6 years ago

Ooh, a necrotroll-spambot hybrid. How cutting edge.

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

War Machine said that “Men’s Oppression is worse than slavery”…… I said on twitter that Many men are realizing this……. Allegations against War Machine may or may not be correct, he may or may not be an ideal human being- nothing stops his right to think like a Man, express his view like a Man, realize slavery of a Man…… and I endorse his views on slavery of Men.

Well, good. That makes two complete idiots right there.

grumpycatisagirl
grumpycatisagirl
6 years ago

Really? This was important enough to be pasted onto two old threads?

Bina
Bina
6 years ago

emilygoddess - MOD
emilygoddess - MOD
6 years ago

The comment so nice*, he posted it twice!

*Comment is not actually nice.

vaiyt
6 years ago

The Men’s Men’s rights Movement strikes again!

Flyboy
Flyboy
3 years ago
Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
Axecalibur: Middle Name Danger
3 years ago

@Flyboy
I’ll remain cautious. Ain’t over until sentencing