Let me take a moment to ignore my regular readers and speak directly to the Men’s Rights Activists who might be reading this blog. I suspect there are a few.
What I would like to talk to you about it ironic humor. Because, here’s the thing, sometimes people say things they don’t actually believe in order to make a little fun at the way other people see them.
When a feminist writer posts a picture of herself wearing a shirt that says “I bathe in male tears,” noting that the picture is directed at the haters who leave nasty comments on everything she writes, she is not actually announcing that she, literally or metaphorically, bathes in male tears. Nor is she saying anything about the vast, overwhelming majority of men. She is saying “fuck you, I’m on vacation” to a small subset of men. That is, those who leave nasty comments on everything she writes. You know, like she explicitly stated she was doing.
I point out what seems to me patently obvious because so many men in the so-called Men’s Rights movement continue to pretend that somehow Jessica Valenti has launched a war against all the good and honest men of the world by wearing a t-shirt that she knew might annoy a teensy tiny fraction of the douchiest of men. And when people point out that she was making an ironic joke, these dudes react as though they’ve never heard of ironic humor.
This isn’t the first time MRAs seem to have had trouble getting ironic humor. In 2012, A Voice for Men launched a campaign of defamation against a college student inspired in large part by a joke she made on Twitter declaring that her political position was “kill all men hail satan.” AVFM’s Paul Elam presented this as proof that the young woman “hate[s] men [and] want[s] them dead or silenced or marginalized or ignored.” Not as the joke it obviously was.
But the thing is, MRAs do know what ironic humor is. Because they indulge in it themselves, all the time.
Over on AVFM, for example, the regulars jokingly refer to themselves as “kitten eaters,” presumably in an attempt to mock what they think people like me think of them.
Now, as you all presumably have figured out, I happen to be a giant fan of cats young and old, regardless of their beliefs. But I don’t for a second think that the assholes at A Voice for Men, despite being some of the worst human beings I’ve ever encountered, actually eat kittens.
I recognize that they are making a joke, albeit a poor one. Because, here’s the thing: I live in the real world, and I can distinguish between things meant seriously and things meant as a joke.
And I think most of those who continue to rail against Valenti and her eeeeevil t-shirt can tell the difference, too. They just choose not to, because they’re not looking for a reason to attack Valenti. They’re looking for an excuse.
Now, is it possible that things meant as ironic jokes can sometimes contain a kernel of truth? Well, yes, but there is no evidence that this is the case with Valenti. There’s no evidence at all that she hates men. None. Zero. Sure, she admits to being less than fond of a few men who are assholes, but that’s because they’re assholes, not because they’re men.
Indeed, in one recent column, she wrote this:
I have the most amazing men in my life. My father, who bought me chemistry sets and robots for every tea set or doll. My husband, an incredible feminist who is an equal partner in parenting and the home. My male friends, who believe that gender justice is important and worth fighting for. I don’t have a hard time finding these amazing men because – shockingly – most men are pretty cool guys.
In another recent column, she stood up for male victim of sexual blackmail online, reminding her readers that “it’s still revenge porn when the victim is a man and the picture is of his penis.”
I know, you can just SMELL THE HATRED there.
But there are some people, I will admit, who don’t do quite so well with their attempts at ironic humor. Ironically, the first people who come to mind are amongst those who profess to be the most shocked, shocked by Valenti’s t-shirt. I speak, of course, of the Misogyny Bunch over at A Voice for Men.
That picture at the top of this post? I didn’t photoshop it. Nor did I come up with that little nickname. They did. Indeed, on their online store, AVFM sells not only pillows but t-shirts, mugs, tote bags and even playing cards emblazoned with the catchphrase. No, really:
Yes, that’s right, the guys (and gals) who are railing against Valenti’s allegedly misandrous t-shirt sell not only t-shirts but also playing cards declaring themselves misogynists.
This shouldn’t be that much of a surprise, given that the head of this little bunch, Paul Elam, posted on YouTube for years as The Happy Misogynist; he posts under his own name now, but TheHappyMisogynist is still part of the URL.
Oh, but it’s an ironic joke! They’re not really misogynists!
Well, except that they kinda are. Well, more than kinda. Unlike in the case of Valenti, there is ample evidence of real, honest-to-goodness hatred coming from this bunch. Ironically, the shirts they intend as ironic jokes aren’t ironic at all.
Proof? Look at my archives. (Well, skip those posts at the top about commemorative plates and coins.) Look at this collection of quotes from Elam – or maybe just the story he published, or the posts he’s written, offering justifications for men to beat their partners. Go to A Voice for Men and type in your favorite anti-woman slur and see just how many articles have featured those slurs, almost always in highly unironic ways. Oh, ok, I’ll do it for you: Bitch, Slut, Slattern, Whore, C*nt. My favorite one in that last group starts off memorably:
Women are facing a very real and grave problem in our culture: They are obnoxious c*nts.
Needless to say, there is no asterisk in the original.
While Valenti describes “most men” as “pretty cool guys,” Elam once suggested that
feminism, consumer products, psychology, media, advertising, politics and social custom [have] all merged into one Great Big Bitch Machine … [T]he modern female psyche is nothing more than a product of that machine … .
Last Father’s Day, Valenti wrote proudly about her feminist father. One recent Mothers Day, Elam suggested that mothers should
Place a bunch of daffodils at a dumpster near you, perhaps one in which one of you, or one of your kind, has tossed an unwanted baby, leaving it there to slowly die alone in a pile of trash.
Perhaps you could lay a single rose at the base of a bridge that has been used by a mother to throw her baby into an icy river. Perhaps you can lay it there with hands that have beaten or shaken a baby to death.
You get the idea.
There’s nothing ironic, or even particularly happy, about this man’s “happy misogyny.”
Irony, you’re doing it wrong.
@Nova – OOohh! And bedpan covers!
Ahem:
From here.
This very, very strongly implies that you believe government aid to be “abuse and oppression.”
sparky, that’s just mean. If words have no meaning, how can they have implications? Stop picking on cupcake.
Oh, sparky! You and your logic! Haven’t I told you to lay off that stuff? (but, really, please don’t lay off the logic)
fibinachi,
It’s sad. That’s what it is. That’s alot of baggage to carry around. It’s no wonder she works so hard to believe she deserves to be treated like a belonging that can only have meaning and security through giving a man subservience, orgasms and offspring. I have sometimes found that people will defend their own mistreatment because it’s easier than admitting that they’re being mistreated. She’s another woman convinced she’s only special and has value because she’s being a woman the “right” way and part of that role is to police the actions of women who are not subservient to the patriarchy. She doesn’t seem to understand what she’s saying well enough to even comprehend disagreement with it. I think she may just be parroting back someone else’s words. (Like alot of Faux News viewers and assorted Libertarians) That’s why she can’t answer the questions asked of her. She doesn’t know the answers or even how to parse the questions in the first place. All she knows is that women are awful, unless they surrender their autonomy to a man. Maybe that has nothing to do with her real life, but I seriously doubt it.
Oh, look, insanitybytes is capable of reading my comments. That means she can answer the question from the last thread now, right?
If I were being generous, I’d say IB was trying to catch us in a gotcha, and she really thinks government assistance is benign and also the same as being “protected” against her will (again, scare quotes around the wrong thing), which is benign.
Somehow, though, I’m not feeling very generous to someone who both implied they are just pretending to be interested and questioning in order to score points and made a big stink about “asshole” somehow being a gendered insult.
Also, wow, she really sucks at gaslighting. I thought women were supposed to be good at that kind of thing?
Jury’s still out as to whether IB even understand the question. I’ve had more edifying conversations with my cat.
IB22,
You’re about as frightening as a dog rubbing it’s butt on the carpet.
Sure, maybe you worry that it’s anal glands are impacted and that it’s going to leave a stinky mess behind it for you to clean up, but that’s hardly scary.
I actually have been “protected” against my will.
Funny. Being physically restrained and dragged to the bathroom while I kicked and screamed with all my might, so I’d brush my teeth… it wasn’t actually very benevolent.
I have a lot of bones to pick with the social services I’ve had to use, but at least they have not dragged me down a hallway while I screamed to let me go.
It wasn’t a lot of fun having my physical weakness used against me in that way, either.
But what do I know? It was a woman dragging me and I’m a man. We were just engaging in mutual inter-dependence! That’s why one day I packed our shit and fled the dorm without telling her why or where I was going.
LBT,
Damn, that’s awful. I’m sorry that was done to you.
It’s okay, Lea. It was a long time ago, I got away, and I never have to deal with that creepy woman or her creepyass rape-joking headmate ever again.
Seriously, sometimes, homelessness really is the best option.
Jessica Valenti is hiding? Where? Oh…behind the tea stains on your keyboard, I see. Very cowardly of her. Come on out, Jessica! It’s okay, most of us here won’t bite…
BTW, you’re not doing a very good job of defining irony here. Care to try again?
So saith the most passive-aggressive person posting here, and she would know.
Well, actually, she doesn’t know. But we’re all much too nicey-nice and polite to tell her that. The women because we’re socialized to be nicey-nice and polite, and the men because they’re protecting her. Out of benevolent sexism, natch.
BTW, you still haven’t gotten the basic concept of irony. Perhaps you’d like to read O. Henry, he was a master of it. Clearly not a Real Man by your lights, though…
For someone who claims to be equally reviled by Mammotheers and MRAs, inanitybites really might want to look at how much her ideas mirror those of the Honey Badger Brigade…
Bina, when I re-read that I noticed something I had glanced over before.
Irony is an attack? It’s a passive-aggressive ATTACK? To the dictionary!
irony
noun, plural ironies.
1.
the use of words to convey a meaning that is the opposite of its literal meaning:
the irony of her reply, “How nice!” when I said I had to work all weekend.
2.
Literature.
a technique of indicating, as through character or plot development, an intention or attitude opposite to that which is actually or ostensibly stated.
(especially in contemporary writing) a manner of organizing a work so as to give full expression to contradictory or complementary impulses, attitudes, etc., especially as a means of indicating detachment from a subject, theme, or emotion.
3.
Socratic irony.
4.
dramatic irony.
5.
an outcome of events contrary to what was, or might have been, expected.
6.
the incongruity of this.
7.
an objectively sardonic style of speech or writing.
passive-agression
: being, marked by, or displaying behavior characterized by the expression of negative feelings, resentment, and aggression in an unassertive passive way (as through procrastination and stubbornness)
— passive–aggressive noun
attack
verb
1.
take aggressive action against (a place or enemy forces) with weapons or armed force, typically in a battle or war.
“in December, the Japanese attacked Pearl Harbor”
synonyms: strike, charge, pounce; More
antonyms: defend
(of a person or animal) act against (someone or something) aggressively in an attempt to injure or kill.
“a doctor was attacked by two youths”
synonyms: assault, assail, set upon, beat up; More
(of a disease, chemical substance, or insect) act harmfully on.
“HIV is thought to attack certain cells in the brain”
criticize or oppose fiercely and publicly.
“he attacked the government’s defense policy”
synonyms: criticize, censure, condemn, pillory, savage, revile, vilify; More
begin to deal with (a problem or task) in a determined and vigorous way.
“a plan of action to attack unemployment”
synonyms: address, attend to, deal with, confront, apply oneself to, get to work on, undertake, embark on; informalget cracking on
“they have to attack the problem soon”
make an aggressive or forceful attempt to score a goal or point, or gain or exploit an advantage in a game against an opposing team or player.
“the home team showed some good attacking play”
CHESS
move into or be in a position to capture (an opponent’s piece).
noun
noun: attack; plural noun: attacks
1.
an aggressive and violent action against a person or place.
“he was killed in an attack on a checkpoint”
synonyms: assault, onslaught, offensive, strike, blitz, raid, charge, rush, invasion, incursion
“the attack began at dawn”
I’m not sure how to do block quotes so I’ll use punctuation. Sorry. I’m better at Tumblr!
“why is it perceived as bad for men and women to exist in any kind of economic inter- dependence, but reliance on the government is a good thing that should be promoted?”
Is it perceived as bad for men and women to exist in economic inter-dependence? Because yeah, a SOCIAL STRUCTURE of women HAVING to rely on men would be awful (and I guess IS in some cases), but how different people choose to share their lives with others is well, a choice. Everyone depends on other people in some way, shape or form! This is true for all genders. Personally, I like how my life and security is intrinsically linked with other people. Life would be lonely without everyone else!
And actually, seeing as it’s the people’s votes that put a government in power; surely we should be able to rely on them for basic needs. Otherwise, why even have a government?
Also, criticism of a woman is not always misogynistic when that criticism is based in actions and words unrelated to her gender. Obvs. Example: Margaret Thatcher wasn’t awful because she was a woman, she was awful for the the messed up legislation she brought in and the awful way she treated the poor.
And LBT
I’m really sorry you went through that. Hugs if they are wanted!
I would like to interrupt the troll festivities for a moment to express my opinion that if one of your organizational principles is that Feminists hate men and have no sense of humour you are going to operate on that basis no matter how many times reality comes a knocking. Their income depends on it.
Also too and besides I intend to purchase and wear one of those t shirts. It will match my mug.
There are a lot of concepts you genuinely don’t get, my dear. This is only ONE of them. Here’s another:
You also don’t understand the concept of misogyny. Nobody was calling you an asshole here for the mere fact of your being female, as you seem to think they did. Assholes have no gender, as persons of all genders (and none) possess them. And assholes are all, regardless of gender, full of shit. Anyone, at any time, might have their head up the back end of their own alimentary canal. And therefore, any person of any gender (or none) may not only have an asshole, but be one at any time. One becomes one by going around with one’s head up one’s ass, as you have been doing since…um…when did you start opining on matters you know nothing about, again?
But oh, why am I explaining this to you? You’re obviously an ignoranus. Know what that is? I’ll give you a broad hint: It’s a portmanteau. Another concept I’m sure you also won’t get. Along with false equivalency, and logical fallacies, and oh yeah, my personal fave, SARCASM — that’s irony’s snarky little non-gendered sibling.
English 101 is now out. Class(less ignoranus) dismissed!
Does IB come here to gather “evidence” of how mean and idiotic the feminists are so she has fodder for her blog? Fuck that.
On the topic of merchandise, when I saw the picture of the pillow I did think it was an anti-misogyny group that had come up with it.
Here is something I would rather wear: http://blog.loveknitting.com/the-amazing-doctor-who-jumper-free-pattern/
Echoing others earlier in the thread: what happened to/with JtO?
Ahem.
You’re trying to equate patriarchal oppression (which we consider bad) to government benefits, which to anyone with a brain means you want the latter to be considered bad by association.
RE: NonServium
It’s cool. My point is… insanitybytes22 doesn’t seem to understand what “protection against your will” actually means and entails. In my “friend’s” mind, she wasn’t dragging a kicking screaming person across the hall. She was just playing an amusing joke and insuring I’d brush my teeth! It was good for me! (Never mind that I was twenty years old and knew full well how and when to brush my teeth, thanks.)
And if I just “happened” to get outed to a bunch of people she knew after we left… well, it just went to show we couldn’t take care of ourselves without her! She would protect us. Love us. Take care of us. We were just so UNGRATEFUL…
And she wasn’t even a romantic partner, just a roommate and “friend.” So she didn’t have near the power over me that, say, a spouse or a parent would. (Though she tried to date one of my system members, and take on parenting duties for another. She REALLY wanted that power, I guess.)
I’m not sure why insanitybytes22 would compare that kind of treatment to government benefits. It’s not like the government was just ACHING to get me into it’s power. I honestly feel like the damn machine would be happiest if I died and stopped badgering it.
And I notice she hasn’t answered my question about what exactly I’m supposed to do, according to her philosophy. I really do honestly want to know.
Oooooh, Pallygirl: that might be my next knitting project. Right now I’m working on a jumper with more batwing than jumper!