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Red Pill dude: Women are "barely-sentient organic sex toys," insufficiently enthusiastic hobbyists.

Why can't women take up interesting hobbies, like men? (Note: this is a real book.)
Why can’t women take up interesting hobbies, like men? (Note: this is a real book.)

 

Now that he’s taken the Red Pill, the Reddittor who calls himself F9R recently announced, he’s “started seeing women as people rather than as magical beautiful goddess creatures.” That’s a good thing, right? Seeing women as actual human beings rather than some imaginary construct?

Well, not so much. Because it turns out that women are just terrible as human beings. No, it’s true! In a rambling comment in the Red Pill subreddit with more than 100 upvotes, F9R reports his scientific findings on the ladies of the world.

Now I’m disillusioned with them because women, for the most part, are boring people. 95% of them spend more time on their appearance than anything else, so as a result they never really have interesting hobbies or develop respectable skill in any particular area. This, in my opinion, could be one of the reasons that women have historically under-performed in almost every activity/industry.

Ah, that explains it! There haven’t been any women presidents, or Popes, or Chairmen of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, because the ladies are spending way too much time fussing with their lipstick and trying to find the exact right shade of eyeshadow.

There haven’t been more women inventors, not because women were denied education for thousands of years or because STEM fields are filled with angry manbabies who cry oppression whenever a woman comes near, but because women don’t have any fascinating, mentally stimulating hobbies like the Red Pillers of the world have. You know, like weight-lifting, or “Game,” or “saying terrible things about women online.”

So you swallow the pill, look around you, and see two groups of people. The first group, men, generally have no innate value and have had to work for everything in life. This is why the loser-winner spectrum is so broad for men; don’t work at all and you’ll end up homeless, work your ass off and you could make millions. The second group, women, have considerable innate value and don’t spend nearly as much time fighting to stay respectable, because they can always fall back on their female safety net; this is why there are almost no homeless women, but it’s rare to find a female CEO.

Ah, the old “female safety net.” You know, the free reserve of rent money and bon bons that all women have access to. Or does he mean “well, if worse comes to worst, you can always become a prostitute”

Not quite as easy to understand as the concept of an oppressive patriarchy, but demonstrably more accurate.

He’s got that right: it’s definitely not as easy to understand.

Tying this in with sex drive: an RP’er will have a hard time respecting plates or women they meet at the bar, because when looking at these women as people rather than as magical, mysterious women, the man will be underwhelmed by her bland personality and/or her obnoxious attempts to seem less bland by being a loud annoying cunt.

Still, if she’s got a nice pair of tits and a round ass, you can forgive her personality and lack of emotional development.

Gosh, I am shocked that a whiny manchild who refers to women as “plates” can’t find anything interesting about them besides their sexy bits.

But then let’s say you get her in bed, and you fuck her, and you’re having a good time. As soon as you finish and are in that refractory period, you look over at the person next to you and see them differently. The tits and ass lose a bit of their appeal since you just finished, and now you see the person next to you for the immature person they really are, and it’s like you’re lying in bed with a child.

Huh. Just a thought, but if you want to date mature women you might want to start by dating, you know, mature women, instead of creepily fixating on women and girls much younger than you are?

Or maybe what’s really happening is that when you look over at the woman you just had sex with, she’s looking at you with disgust, wondering how the hell she ended up in bed with such an asshole, and you rationalize away her disdain towards you as her being “immature.”

It’s weird as fuck and you start to question your life choices. Next time you go out to the bar, you remember that moment, and decide to raise your maturity standards a little. To your dismay, no women measure up.

I hate to tell you this, but I’m pretty sure there aren’t a lot of mature women who see your bitter, immature ass as much of a prize.

That’s the Catch-22 of the Red Pill. It gives you all the women you could ever want, but you see them for what they really are.

Yeah, I’m sure that’s the problem. You’re dizzy with success.

So you’ve got two choices: work on your game and improve yourself in order to keep fucking barely-sentient organic sex toys, or go your own way and focus on your life instead because the game just isn’t worth it to you.

The grapes barely-sentient organic sex toys are definitely sour.

Men who choose the former are Red Pill alphas, and men who choose the latter are MGTOW. Blue Pillers just ignore the game and continue to get screwed over because they have no idea what they’re doing.

Keep telling yourself that.

And seriously, go your own fucking way already. Just do it. The further away, the better. If you think of women as barely sentient organic sex toys, stick with the non-organic, non-sentient variety of sex toy and leave the actual human beings alone.

Oh, and speaking of needlepoint, here’s my favorite song about crocheting. I know I’ve posted it before, but I don’t care. It’s not every day I have such a good excuse to post Julie Ruin.

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GrumpyOldMan
6 years ago

Women don’t have real hobbies like collecting beer bottles.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

There’s something deeply un-feminist about setting aside a certain group of women and making them the human sacrifices that we throw into the volcano of male rage and sexual frustration. All women deserve better than that, and if you’re OK with sacrificing other women to save yourself in that way I have a hard time taking your commitment to feminism seriously.

wordsp1nner
wordsp1nner
6 years ago

Not to mention that makeup and fashion are hobbies–at least if you put in the time and effort into them to look really, really good. I don’t, but my sister and some of my friends do. And even they don’t spend all their free time on it.

Also, I just spent hours warping my loom. I now am going to weave a two-block twill Christmas runner in red and green. I have also finished one novel and am working on the sequel while letting it cool before editing. I HAVE TOO MANY FUCKING HOBBIES. None of which I would likely talk about on a date because (a) I don’t want to be pressured to share my (rough draft) novel and (b) most people who aren’t into fiber arts don’t want to hear me talk about them.

Also, I put in enough extra hours at work the last two weeks to take more than a full day off.

GrumpyOldMan
6 years ago

Yes, sex work is a tough issue. Obviously many women do it out of economic necessity, which is troubling, or outright slavery, which is beyond appalling. On the other hand, it exists, it does not seem possible to end it, so somehow you have to figure out how to give support to the women in the business. In any case, you might have to accept the reality, but you definitely don’t have to approve of it.

cloudiah
6 years ago

barely-sentient organic sex toys

I thought we were writing a parody of the TRP worldview when we said they view women as semi-sentient self-warming fleshlights.

Wow.

cloudiah
6 years ago

And those asshats should only be having contact with fleshlights, not women. Sex workers should not have to deal with them.

Shadow
Shadow
6 years ago

@GrumpyOldMan

Actually, none of the above posters are against sex work, they’re speaking specifically about when people look at hateful misogynists’ screeds and tell them to “go to a sex worker if they don’t want to deal with dating/interacting with women”.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

@ cloudiah

Poe’s law again. How do you parody people this awful? Stuff that any editor would reject as being too mustache-twirlingly over-the-top evil turns out not to have gone far enough.

saintnick86
saintnick86
6 years ago

I imagine sex work is like, the most literal ‘customer service’ job ever, and probably has the worst STORIES ever. It’s why I kinda recoil when people are like, “Lulz, just go to a sex worker, you misogynist!” Because. Uh. Do you really think they’re going to treat the sex worker any better?

Ah, gotcha.

I didn’t mean to come off as such, if I did – I simply can’t believe most self-proclaimed pick-up artists and “alphas” who claim to have a lot of sex aren’t being honest about it. Like I said, most evidence of “game” I’ve seen seems to always end in failure because most women – knowing better – can see through it quite easily. I can only imagine the women they have any sexual interaction with are, unfortunately, either drunk women they take advantage of or sex workers who they need to pay.

I would HOPE that said worker would have nothing to do with someone that creepy and unpleasant!

I’d rather they didn’t either.

Really, these dudes should not be performing any sort of sexual act with ANYONE except themselves until they stop being massive cockbites.

Of course. In a more ideal world, they’d keep all their self-induced bile to themselves and leave everyone else alone as they wallowed in it.

Exactly. If anything a sex worker is in more danger, because of the power imbalance in him having paid her and the expectation of control over her.

Yes, sex work is a tough issue. Obviously many women do it out of economic necessity, which is troubling, or outright slavery, which is beyond appalling. On the other hand, it exists, it does not seem possible to end it, so somehow you have to figure out how to give support to the women in the business. In any case, you might have to accept the reality, but you definitely don’t have to approve of it.

I’d wish that the practice was at least decriminalized, as that would do something about the abuse by police many of them deal with as it is illegal and often allows for such mistreatment, as well as being able to unionize – which would hopefully eliminate the use of pimps – and have healthcare benefits (preferably under a single-payer system). I know they do some of that in Amsterdam and they either lack those problems entirely or have minimized them quite a bit.

That doesn’t mean that you need to find the practice acceptable, there’s a lot of good reasons not to, but it at least means the women who do get involved are treated far better than they are now.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

Shadow, GrumpyOldMan described my feelings pretty accurately, really. If it did come down to a choice of for or against, I’d be against, simply because of the power dynamics and abuse in the vast majority of it.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Actually Holland is considering reversing a lot of the legal changes they made to create their current system and trying something else entirely, since they’ve discovered that the current system has led to a massive increase in trafficking and poorer working conditions.

cloudiah
6 years ago

I’m surprised at my capacity to still be surprised at the depths to which these chucklefucks will sink, with the complete approval of their peers. Why am I still surprised?

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

It’s partly decriminalised here, SaintNick, (there are legal brothels, but street work is still illegal) but while that seems to have helped some of the workers, and at least means the ones in legal brothels won’t get arrested, it doesn’t help that much with all the abuse issues. There’s massive trafficking and not much indication that the police give a damn about crimes against sex workers, except on the odd occasion when one hits the headlines.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

I don’t know. They long since exhausted my capacity for surprise, we’ve been in the “yeah, it figures” zone for a while now.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

Having more jobs that pay a living wage seems to be a better option to me than anyone having to go into sex work because they make so much more money there.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

It’s not even necessarily the case that people are making much money. Der Speigel just did a big feature about how all this has played out in Germany, and it’s not exactly a ringing endorsement of legalization.

http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/human-trafficking-persists-despite-legality-of-prostitution-in-germany-a-902533.html

GrumpyOldMan
6 years ago

@Cloudiah: I think what we’re dealing with here is an echo chamber, where these guys talk only to each other, and they get more approval the more outrageous they are. I see the same sort of thing on the political right (I suppose it’s there on the left, too, but I don’t see it), where all the Obama conspiracy theories get wilder and wilder with every self-reinforcement. Also, in particular, the responses to the child refugee issue. There is one tea-party congressmen who was claiming that the children were bring in diseases including smallpox, when the last reported case of smallpox in the world was in 1977 — and this guy used to be a doctor. Boggle.

mildlymagnificent
6 years ago

The other thing I notice about everybody’s new friend F9R is the entire, exclusive emphasis on criticising women who are in clubs and bars. It seems never to have occurred to any of them that they might meet different women in different places doing different things.

Or, horror of horrors, the very same women who were all dressed up for a night out dancing at a club would give off an entirely different vibe if they were dressed in boots and gear at the indoor climbing gym. Maybe they’d be super strict and in control when refereeing a netball match or teaching martial arts skills. Some of those not-out-for-a-night’s-fun-right-now women might be frowning as they concentrate on improving their rowing skills or their running technique. Same thing would go in a music or woodwork or car maintenance class.

But they’d be focused, possibly a bit sweaty and completely uninterested in lurking, leering men there as well. My passing thought was clearly no good.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Are these children supposed to be bringing in smallpox via a time machine?

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Today in People at Clubs Not In Super Serious Mood shocker!

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

There is one tea-party congressmen who was claiming that the children were bring in diseases including smallpox, when the last reported case of smallpox in the world was in 1977 — and this guy used to be a doctor. Boggle.

I don’t know if it’s the same congressmen because these assholes all bleed together but there was a tea party congressman who warned that those kids would bring Ebola into the country. Fucking Ebola! Never mind that there’s never been a single case of it in Honduras.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Oh dear, they’re reverting to the belief that everywhere outside their own country is a giant scary undifferentiated blob known as Foreign (or sometimes There Be Dragons) again.

contrapangloss
6 years ago

@Bonelady

Swimming with sharks?

I want to do that so bad. You have no idea. Elasmobranchs are what made me want to go into marine biology, in the first place.

Atlantic Weasel Sharks are super cute. Seriously, the cutest things ever. Although, kitties come in close second.

cloudiah
6 years ago

I think the only good reason to legalize sex work is that people will be more likely to report violations of the law if they don’t have to worry about being arrested themselves. That’s a good reason. Making it easier for asshats like the OP to abuse vulnerable women is not a good reason.

Similar to how it’s important to make sure that undocumented immigrants should be able to report crimes against them without worrying about being deported.

It’s not a moral equivalence to make it legal to hire sex workers, just like it isn’t equivalent to make it legal to hire undocumented immigrants (though there might be good reasons to do so). People who hire sex workers should be prosecuted if they abuse them, with no “Get out of jail free” card.

Again, this is really basic human decency 101, and it’s frustrating that we have to fight for this shit.

Shadow
Shadow
6 years ago

@kitteh’s

Fair enough, though it seems to me you’re against sex work as it stands today, rather than taking the stance that selling sexual services commodifies sex and is inherently antifeminist, most commonly found in radical feminist circles (though not exclusively). I’m fully in support of the former, and disagree with the latter. When I say “not against sex work” I meant to imply that the posters are not against sex work as a profession, not to imply that anyone is alright with the way things are right now. You’re obviously free to choose against, I just want to clarify that I’m definitely not advocating for the current abuses, power dynamics and other problems that exist in the sex work industry as it stands to remain that way.

GrumpyOldMan
6 years ago

Society seems to lose all scraps of reason whenever “sex rears its ugly head.”

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

There is one tea-party congressmen who was claiming that the children were bring in diseases including smallpox, when the last reported case of smallpox in the world was in 1977 — and this guy used to be a doctor. Boggle.

Strewth, where’d he buy his degree?

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
6 years ago

I was under the impression that “them foreigners are gonna bring in disease and poverty and steal our joobbbs” was a classic xenophobic line against immigration. What makes it particularly horrid in this case is that these are children. Refugee children.

But, because apparently nobody on the far right cares about credibility issues (or human decency), they can up the ante by claiming that Obama is bringing in these children on purpose (he isn’t, again, these are basically refugees), housing them in expensive luxury hotels (he isn’t, churches are providing basic shelter), all in an effort to cultivate a bigger democratic base (… they can’t even vote, they’re children) to steal all elections forever (because 500 people can influence elections in a country of 240 million voters).

This should really help the GOP secure the latino vote.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

I do think sex work commodifies sex, Shadow.

Ally S
6 years ago

I’m an anti-capitalist, so I’m against sex work in the same sense that I’m against all work. But that doesn’t mean that I think sex workers don’t deserve to be safe, have their needs met, and be respected for who they are.

Shadow
Shadow
6 years ago

@kirbywarp

This should really help the GOP secure the latino vote.

It SHOULD, but naturally, non-rich-white-straight-bigoted-male americans are notoriously illogical so they probably won’t. Leaving the GOP to once again wail “WHAT DO YOU WANT!!!”

GrumpyOldMan
6 years ago

I was originally responding to Cassandrakitty’s comments on sex work and feminism, and I think (if I’m interpreting her comments correctly) she and I and Kittehserf all have serious problems with sex work per se — although I think we all want to be supportive of sex workers.

“taking the stance that selling sexual services commodifies sex and is inherently antifeminist”
As a man, I’m getting into treacherous ground here, but I do agree with the radical feminists on that point.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

Speaking of Them Furriners And Their Diseases, did anyone see that Donald Chump went one better and complained about health workers going to help with the ebola breakout? All their own fault if they catch it too, their choice to take the risk, don’t let ’em back in, etc, etc.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
6 years ago

@kittehserf:

I do think sex work commodifies sex, Shadow.

Why is that a bad thing?

I’d think it’d be a stronger point to say it commodifies the sex worker, but even then there are a lot of commonly accepted professions where people are valued for their bodies (modeling, dancing, etc). Granted, these aren’t the healthiest professions in the world, but I’m not sure sex work should be more taboo.

kirbywarp
kirbywarp
6 years ago

@kittehserf:

Speaking of Them Furriners And Their Diseases, did anyone see that Donald Chump went one better and complained about health workers going to help with the ebola breakout? All their own fault if they catch it too, their choice to take the risk, don’t let ‘em back in, etc, etc.

I did. That man is the very model of a modern major capitalist, proving that in America, you can get away with frikken anything as long as you’re rich. And you don’t even need to pay anything to do so.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

GrumpyOldMan, yep as far as I’m concerned.

cloudiah
6 years ago

Commodification of work is bad, generally. Hey, that’s why I’m a socialist.

@kittehs, I did see that Trump thing. Way to leave some of the most courageous people in the world completely adrift! I’m already disgusted that only USians (or probably western Europeans, etc.) who get the disease are worthy of heroic measures, but to suggest that not even they are worthy of saving is something terrible.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

The argument that if someone thinks the sex industry overall is a harmful thing that women would be better off without that means that they hate/want to harm/don’t respect sex workers is a bunch of emotionally manipulative bullshit.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

I did. That man is the very model of a modern major capitalist, proving that in America, you can get away with frikken anything as long as you’re rich. And you don’t even need to pay anything to do so.

Plus you can get away with the Worst Rug Ever.

wordsp1nner
wordsp1nner
6 years ago

Ebola is not an airborne disease. It’s a fluid-borne disease, primarily (which is why healthcare workers are so badly affected.) Also, if Latin and South American children could bring it to the US, it would probably already be here, and we’d be fucked.

Also, the US already has plague in our prairie dogs, which sometimes gets back into humans (often via regular dogs).

Speaking of dogs and sex toys, I thought this quiz was funny. I got 8 out of 10 correct:

http://metro.co.uk/2014/08/01/quiz-dog-toy-or-sex-toy-4818384/

Shadow
Shadow
6 years ago

@kitteh’s & Ally

Fair enough. I’m definitely not trying to start an argument or anything. I disagree with that stance, or rather I believe that the commodification of sex that would happen with legalised sex work would be no more than restaurants commodify cooking, but I don’t have a problem with people who feel differently. I just wanted to make sure that I clarified that my support for sex work is fully informed by support for sex workers, and not by acting like sex work as it stands is just A-OK.

cloudiah
6 years ago

That should be commodification of workers.

And I think that undocumented immigrant workers and sex workers should get all the support and respect any human being deserves.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

So, to be clear, Trump’s stance is that healthcare workers should be punished for wanting to save people’s lives? I’m thinking he doesn’t quite understand why many people go into that profession.

GrumpyOldMan
6 years ago

What really fries me about the refugee children issue is that the present clusterfuck in Central America is largely the result of US policies — supporting brutal, corrupt, incompetent military dictatorships, pushing indigenous people off their land to make plantations to grow export crops for the US market, pushing the drug gangs out of Los Angeles and Colombia. Essentially none of the children are coming from Nicaragua, which has a government we hate; wonder why.
I have been thinking that if I could draw I’d do a cartoon of the Grinch in an Uncle Sam suit, kicking a couple of brown-skinned kids, labelled “Uncle Stinker.” The idea that several small non-rich countries in the Middle East can take in hundreds of thousands of refugees but big rich US can handle 50-100,000 kids — I can’t find words for it.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

Cassandra, and it also takes outliers as the norm, saying “But X loves her work!” has some sort of weight against the thousands – or is it millions? – of victims, the trafficked, the abused, the ones who have no meaningful choice in the matter at all. The happy hooker stereotype seems to come from a very small and privileged subsection.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

I believe that the commodification of sex that would happen with legalised sex work would be no more than restaurants commodify cooking,

Not a valid comparison. Having a skill and using it is not the same as your body being intimately used, and dangerously used, and put at risk of pregnancy, disease or murder. Legalisation doesn’t change that aspect of it at all.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

I’ve long since accepted that the right wing doesn’t give a shit about the wellbeing of, well, most people and never will, but you’d think even they would realize that their approach to the immigrant kids issue is terrible PR. Hey, maybe they’ve hired JB! That would explain a lot. Or maybe that’s where she learned her PR skills.

Shadow
Shadow
6 years ago

@cassandra

The argument that if someone thinks the sex industry overall is a harmful thing that women would be better off without that means that they hate/want to harm/don’t respect sex workers is a bunch of emotionally manipulative bullshit.

If this is in response to my post then that’s definitely not what I’m trying to say. I’m not going to take a stance one way or another about what is harmful to women, for obvious reasons, but I fully agree that the industry is rife with misogyny and abuse against women. I’m one of those people who believe that it is not impossible to have a sex industry that does not abuse or promote the abuse of women, but I am not an expert nor do I want to start arguments about it.

GrumpyOldMan
6 years ago

I don’t think people should criticize Donald Trump’s hairdo, even though it IS the worst I’ve ever seen in a man who could afford to pay for a good one. It has to be that way because it’s what he uses to communicate with the mother ship.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

The way the GOPians have carried on about immigrant children is mind-boggling, even more so than the foul behaviour of the government here.