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atheism minus patronizing as heck pedophiles oh sorry ephebophiles playing the victim richard dawkins

Richard Dawkins opens mouth, inserts foot, mumbles something about "mild pedophilia" again

A young Richard Dawkins contemplates the beauty of the universe.
A young Richard Dawkins contemplates the beauty of the universe.

Apparently Richard Dawkins was worried that people might have forgotten what an asshat he is. So, helpful fellow that he is, he decided to give us all a demonstration of why he’s one of the atheist movement’s biggest liabilities, a “humanist” who has trouble remembering to act human.

Earlier today Dawkins decided, for some reason, that he needed to remind the people of the world of a fairly basic point of logic, and so he took to Twitter and thumbed out this little thought:

 Richard Dawkins @RichardDawkins  ·  5h  X is bad. Y is worse. If you think that's an endorsement of X, go away and don't come back until you've learned how to think logically.

However petulantly phrased this is, the basic logic is sound: If I say that Hitler was worse than Stalin, I’m not endorsing either Hitler or Stalin. Unless I add “and Stalin was totally awesome and I endorse him” at the end.

The trouble is that Dawkins didn’t stop with this one tweet. He decided to illustrate his point with some examples. Some really terrible examples.

    Richard Dawkins ‏@RichardDawkins 5h      Mild pedophilia is bad. Violent pedophilia is worse. If you think that's an endorsement of mild pedophilia, go away and learn how to think.     Details         Reply         189 Retweet         287 Favorite  Richard DawkinsVerified account ‏@RichardDawkins  Date rape is bad. Stranger rape at knifepoint is worse. If you think that's an endorsement of date rape, go away and learn how to think.Yep, that’s right. He decided to do what comedians call a “callback” to some terrible comments he made last year about what he perversely described as “mild pedophilia.” And then he added asshattery to asshattery by suggesting a similar distinction between “date rape” and “stranger rape.”

Anyone seeing these comments as insensitive twaddle designed to minimize both “mild” pedophilia and date rape has good reason to do so. As you may recall, in the earlier controversy about so-called “mild” pedophilia, Dawkins told an interviewer for the Times magazine that

I look back a few decades to my childhood and see things like caning, like mild pedophilia, and can’t find it in me to condemn it by the same standards as I or anyone would today.

He went on to tell the interviewer that when he was a child one of his school masters had “pulled me on his knee and put his hand inside my shorts.” But, he added, he didn’t think that this sort of “mild touching up” had done him, or any of the classmates also victimized by the teacher, any “lasting harm.”

Huh. If Dawkins says that a teacher groping him was no big deal, I guess this kind of “mild” abuse shouldn’t be a big deal for anyone else, either, huh?

I’m pretty sure there’s some sort of logical fallacy here.

Given his history of minimizing these “mild” sexual crimes, it’s not a surprise that his crass tweets today inspired a bit of a twitterstorm.

Dawkins has responded with his typical petulance, and has stubbornly defended his comments as an exercise in pure logic that his critics are too irrational to understand.

If you take a few moments to go through his timeline you’ll find many more tweets and retweets reiterating this “argument.” Dawkins is not the sort of person to admit to mistakes. Indeed, he so regularly puts his foot in his mouth it’s hard not to conclude that he must like the taste of shoe leather.

But these recurring controversies can’t be doing much for his reputation. Indeed, they seem to cause more and more people to wonder why anyone takes Dawkins seriously on any subject other than biology. Even his critics on Twitter are growing a bit weary.

https://twitter.com/somegreybloke/status/494045464308629505

https://twitter.com/markleggett/status/494044606342782977

https://twitter.com/endorathewitch/status/494071064008597504

Seems like it. I’m beginning to wonder why any atheists — at least those who are not also asshats — continue to think of Dawkins as an ally of any kind.

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hellkell
hellkell
10 years ago

Caramels, bras, recipes, anything.

Jasmine candy? Sounds good.

Ally S
10 years ago

I can’t share any thoughts on caramels, but I bought myself a package of mint Milano cookies again and I finally realized what was missing in my life.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

Yeah, just out of curiosity, in the current group that wants Octo to stop being splainey, do we have any theists? There’s an extra level of “dude, that ego” in attempting to splain atheism to a bunch of atheists.

Octo
Octo
10 years ago

Oh, fuck you, you disingenuous blowhard. You’re not debating, you’re having yourself a good old-fashioned ‘splain.

And where do you see the difference? I was making my point. Others could have challenged it. That is how debates usually go, no? Or they could have ignored it if they didn’t feel like a debate. That’s of course fine, too. But to make all these disparaging comments about New Atheism and then expect everybody to shut up about it and argue against them is unreasonable.

If you choose to ignore the “nope, this is not a welcome conversation” signals then you’re being a jerk.

You want me to shut up about New Atheism? Fine, if you do as well.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
10 years ago

Caramels!

Marshmallows!

Tell me more!

::sits attentively at cloudiah’s feet::

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

Milano cookies come in mint? Do they still have chocolate, or has that been replaced by the mint part?

cloudiah
10 years ago

Has anyone here sampled the Talenti brand salted caramel ice cream? It’s spendy but oh my dog it is good.

The jasmine tea candy was like a not-very-sweet-but-slightly-sweet lozenge. I enjoyed it. I encouraged him to market it. He needs to work on some texture issues, because everything is coming out a little bit oily. He thinks he can figure it out, and will branch out into other teas later.

Ally S
10 years ago

They still have plain chocolate ones as well. Speaking of Milano cookies… *grabs bag*

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

Shorter Octo – “Let me tell you how to Atheist correctly, atheist! You are atheisting wrong!”

Do piss off, dear.

pallygirl
pallygirl
10 years ago

Ally: still waiting on the bras or have they arrived?

I haven’t thought of making caramels before. I can’t do fudge, it turns into toffee. I’ve been too scared to try again even after forking out for a proper candy thermometer.

Octo
Octo
10 years ago

No. In fact, the pushback you’re getting right now is from a couple of atheists.

I… recognize that? How has that anything to do with what I’ve said?

“She started it” doesn’t really fly around here. Feel the temperature of the room, and adjust.

I don’t think so. You’re free to make comments attacking New Atheism, I’m free to make comments defending it.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

If we’re talking sweets in general, there’s a place near me that makes vanilla gelato with lavender, which I thought might be a bit too strong, but nope, it’s amazing. Highly recommended if you see it.

cloudiah
10 years ago

I’m realizing I don’t have that much more to say about caramels.

:: stares glassy-eyed into the distance ::

Caramels are tasty.

Ally S
10 years ago

@pallygirl

The bras have indeed arrived! It’s just that I’m caught up in a lot of family stuff right now, so I can’t go back to my place in Santa Cruz and pick ’em up. X_X I’ll get my hands on them on Monday, hopefully.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

BTW, a friend of mine made vodka infused with tea once. Highly recommended, would drink most of bottle in one night again.

Octo
Octo
10 years ago

Shorter Octo – “Let me tell you how to Atheist correctly, atheist! You are atheisting wrong!”

Funny that. Considering I was defending one direction of atheism from criticism by other atheists. I don’t think I told anyone their atheism is wrong or invalid; I simply said that New Atheism likewise isn’t wrong or invalid.

pallygirl
pallygirl
10 years ago

@Ally: *squees* I’m sure they’ll be comfortable with the ?lycra ?spandex in them. Exciting! 🙂

I stopped at this shop on the way home today and bought their rosewater and coconut ice cream. I have kindly thought of you all by choosing their recipes page as the one to link. Sadly, their ice cream flavours aren’t shown. http://www.zanyzeus.co.nz/Recipes.html

cloudiah
10 years ago

Octo, you’re free to do anything, just recognize that if you can’t read the room people will probably conclude you’re kind of a jerk.

Let it go.

Ally S
10 years ago

Who here loves Andes mints?

AL3H
AL3H
10 years ago

Yey! Lets talk about sweets! 🙂

@pallygirl

I haven’t thought of making caramels before. I can’t do fudge, it turns into toffee. I’ve been too scared to try again even after forking out for a proper candy thermometer.

But … fudge and toffee are both delicious! Omnomnomnomnomnom.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

Oh, is something buzzing in the background? Funny, I didn’t realize flies were capable of being smug.

Also, rosewater and coconut are two of my favorite ingredients, so yes, let’s add them to all of the things and see what happens.

Argenti Aertheri
10 years ago

I apparently did the weird skip-a-page thing and want to apologize for seemingly ignoring pecunium’s comment. And now I’m going to refrain from saying more about it, lest I cross the line on wishing harm on others (her, not him, of course).

Shadow
Shadow
10 years ago

I have just discovered Cadbury’s Chocolate, Peanut Butter and Pretzel’s bars. Shit just got real

@hellkell

Have you tried Godiva’s salted caramel truffles?

cloudiah
10 years ago

I have to admit that I am one of those people who views rosewater as kind of a no fly zone. It’s a taste that just rubs me the wrong way. Like beets.

So now I’m going to write a 400-word manifesto telling pallygirl that zie’s wrong.

:: adopts boxing stance ::

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

If you attempt to make fudge and end up with toffee then hey, now you have toffee. This does not strike me as a terrible outcome.

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