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On The Spearhead, the regulars reject women rejecting feminism

From Women Against Feminism
From Women Against Feminism

Are women turning against feminism? Over on The Spearhead, WF Price sets forth the proposition that “the younger generation of women [is] rejecting ‘feminism’ in stronger terms than I’ve ever witnessed in my life.”

His proof for this? A Tumblr blog called Women Against Feminism, featuring a couple dozen photos of women holding signs denouncing feminism. Or what they think feminism is, anyway.

Some of these women are fairly articulate about the source of their hostility against feminism: they’re traditionalists who don’t like being judged for their choices:

feminismtruewomen

Others seem to be reacting against stereotypical notions of feminism that bear little relation to the real thing:

feminismequality
feminismcook

Still others have somewhat more, well, idiosyncratic reasons:

feminismbodyhair

For whatever reason, quite a few of the women posting these pictures are from Poland.

At least here in the US, it’s not news that a lot of women reject feminism – or at least the feminist label. There are plenty of  traditionalist women who reject the central tenets of feminism. And there are many others who may share some feminist beliefs but don’t want to call themselves feminists, in part because of the bad rap feminists get in the media and, these days, online. Anyone who’s been a feminist for any length of time has heard women (and some men) announce that “I’m not a feminist, but …” and then follow that statement with a sentiment that is, by any reasonable definition, feminist.

Now some of these “I’m not a feminist, but” types are posting pictures like this, using what is essentially a feminist analysis to criticize what they see as a central shortcoming of feminism:

 

feministagents
Naturally, WF Price has a somewhat different explanation for this alleged trend.

What I think is going on here is that younger women need men more than their older, feminist counterparts did in their heyday.

And why is that? Because times are hard. And so even though men today are struggling, women are struggling even more, and so – in WF Price’s imagination, anyway — they’ve come to appreciate what men can do for them.

The less men have – and the less men there are in general – the more women need them. Without men or without men of means, there can be no surplus, no you-go-grrrrl feminism, no fancy restaurants and no nice houses. Everything just goes to crap.

Heck, Price argues, even men without jobs make better roommates for women than other women, because, you know, they can open jars and stuff:

[W]hat use could a man possibly be if he has no money to speak of? Only someone who has never lived with a woman could find that one hard to answer. A healthy young man with no money can drive, carry things, fix things, protect his mate, solve problems, save money, do chores — the list goes on. And when he gets a job, he will pay his way and do all these things, even if he makes less than his girlfriend. It’s a much, much better deal for a woman than a female roommate.

According to Price, feminism had whatever successes it did have in the past because the economy was booming.

What created this “independent woman” myth was the great prosperity of the baby boomer era, which lasted from roughly the mid 60s to the mid 2000s. Men abounded, and they were flush with cash. Businesses could afford to hire superfluous cute girls and give them nice salaries. Family courts could rob men blind and they’d still have enough left over for a reasonable lifestyle and a chance to start over. Men were harvesting the fat of the land, and there was more than enough to go around.

Huh. I lived through that baby boomer era, and I’m pretty sure that it wasn’t one giant materialistic orgy. There were, I vaguely recall, more than a couple of pretty severe recessions. And back in the heyday of second wave feminism in the seventies there was something called “stagflation.”

But let’s not get in the way of WF Price’s little fairy tale. In the baby boomer era, everyone prospered. Now, everyone is poor. Or at least the young people are:

When you’re poor, life is a lot easier if you can share with someone, and nobody shares more with girls than boys. So merely finding a man to share burdens is a considerable relief to young women. Is a feminist going to fix a car, carry a TV upstairs or take her to the hospital to give birth? Will the feminist voluntarily share any of what she earns with the young woman? Yeah, right…

Apparently in Price’s world “the feminist” is essentially a female version of Scrooge McDuck.

Male scarcity in either numbers or resources effectively prevents feminism. Surplus enables it. In a sense, one could say that feminism’s own downfall is built in to the ideology itself, because it contributes to male scarcity.

Wars between the sexes accomplish nothing in the long run, but they do highlight the complementary, interdependent nature of the sexes: when one sex “beats” the other, both lose. Today’s young women seem to understand that a lot better than their foolish mothers ever did.

In the comments, the Spearhead regulars are less forgiving of “foolish” women than Price is. Regular commenter Geographybeefinalisthimself suggests that antifeminist men should be something less than gracious in their (alleged) victory:

Even if women are in fact rejecting feminism (and I treat this with a lot of suspicion), I don’t see why men should not be vindictive since feminists were pretty damn vindictive to men (myself included, though I am well aware that I am not the only one) when male power was a myth.

Since young men got paid back for discrimination that wasn’t their fault, I don’t see why they shouldn’t turn around and do likewise to a subsequent generation of females. If feminism can come to an end now (and I am not convinced that it is dead yet), it also could have come to an end twenty years ago. I always take the attitude that if something can happen now, it could have happened many years ago as well.

Someone calling himself Lastango, meanwhile, indulges himself in some hypothetical Atlas Shrugging:

[T]he tide is going out and it’s increasingly obvious feminism has been swimming naked, keeping its head above water only because it could float on government money. Unfortunately for feminists, this is happening at the very moment men are increasingly aware of having been demonized and exploited during the past 40 years, and Atlas is starting to shrug… he’ll be staying dry, on the beach, instead of swimming out to rescue a drowning political tribe of privileged, entitled women who have been using him for their own gain.

The misogynists of the manosphere are never quite so happy as when they contemplate women being punished.

The women posting pictures to the Women Against Feminism blog might be surprised by how ungentlemanly these fellows really are.

NOTE: I cropped the pics from Women Against Feminism to save space and highlight the signs.

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Skye
Skye
6 years ago

That doesn’t mean that everyone else has to like what they like. What is allowed is not mandatory. Why can’t people grasp that? It’s simple enough. Deconstructing gender roles can be done without shitting on what we think of as femininity. Rather, it opens options up for everyone to explore their own interests and develop the skills and interests they prefer regardless of gender. That should not be threatening to anyone. It should be liberating.

^This

Skye
Skye
6 years ago

Lost the itals again 🙁

dustedeste
dustedeste
6 years ago

@Flying Mouse:

Hmm, I wouldn’t need a dude to drive me places, except the Skytrain’s been awful the last week, and I can’t drive our standard-transmission van yet because what is a clutch. Damn.

Anyways, does Price know that TVs aren’t really that heavy anymore? Like, some lady tried to steal a 56-incher or something from my place of employment the other day; she lifted that right up on her own and tried to walk out the back door with it, and she was like 5’2″. Her (male) partner-in-crime had no piece of the TV-carrying action. Maybe be was waiting for stairs to be involved.

I’ve yet to see proof that men are the ones who save the money; iirc, isn’t it an MRA argument that women control most of the money because they’re the ones who do the grocery shopping? I’ve yet to hear of men as the stereotypical couponers.

girlsmarts
girlsmarts
6 years ago

@dustedeste- I completely agree. My mom was a homemaker and adopted a lot of tenets of feminism (despite her continuing to this day to claim the man should be the head of the household since it says so in the bible- never mind the fact her ex-husband [my dad] pretty much acted like a demon spawn throughout their divorce), so I totally understand how a woman could make that choice and still be a feminist. At the same time, I read an excellent interview with the author of a book that went into how mothers have a moral responsibility to financially provide for their children. If she is one of the rare few who make it to old age still married, having put kids through college and whatnot, no premature deaths (since statistically men die earlier than women), then that was an awesome choice. But I also think that theres a rather low likelihood of that, putting romantic notions aside and looking at things practically. And so I think that’s important to take that into consideration and I think as feminists, as people who feel it is important to look out for other women, we have to voice that concern. Obviously there are extenuating circumstances and differences in financial and other situations, but I think expressing concern about the financial situation EITHER partner is making when they decide to give up their career and rely entirely on the other person’s earnings, knowing that if they choose to stay out of work for a decade or so and return they will have much poorer job options, is not a bad thing and shouldn’t be resented.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

Since when were the 60′s through the mid 00′s the boom times. What Robert Reich calls the “great prosperity” was between the mid 40′s and the mid 70′s. Ever since than things have been shaky.

Damn right. I’m a tail-end baby boomer and my entire working life has been shaped, and often enough fucked over, by recessions.

Greebo, hi! Are you … THE Greebo?

girlsmarts
girlsmarts
6 years ago

@cloudiah- TY! I have lurked a lot and made a few comments so I hope I still qualify for the lovely basket. AVFM’s website looks a lot more palatable when the misogyny is interspersed with lovely pics of cats.
Now I think I’m going to spend the next few hours perusing the best of articles selected for this. Ive gone through the tags before and pretty much every article is gold but I’m excited to know exactly how penguins got lumped into the whore category with the rest of us riding the fabled cock carousel…

dustedeste
dustedeste
6 years ago

@girlsmarts:

Definitely with you on the concern about job market readiness – but I just still don’t think that either choice is innately more feminist per se than the other. There are just choices that make more or less sense for particular people based on their situations and predilections, and that the choices people make based on those aren’t the business of anyone who’s not affected by them, nor should they be judged on their perceived feminism-iness, unless one partner is literally forcing the other into it.

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

New jars:
Bang them on the counter or floor to break the vacuum. They’ll open right up.

Kim
Kim
6 years ago

@Cloudiah

That spider guy was in England. How scary could an english spider possibly be??

In my household it’s my bf who has trouble with spiders, but only because I seem to have a magic ability to breeze past spider webs, which he then gets a face full of.

Just the other day though, my friend posted on Facebook about needing to have a Python removed from the dash of her car. Was really wedged up in there. In the photos it was a man removing it for her, but that may have more to do with her being a lawyer, not an animal wrangler, than their respective genders.

Greebo
Greebo
6 years ago

“She’s probably a Viserys fan.” I CAN’T QUOTE FOR SHIT I AM SO SORRY.
EW. I’ve interacted with enough of them to understand why she ended up on that blog. smh.

Thanks David! Poland, eh? Given footy culture there, I would not be surprised if she was anti other progressive movements as well. *has terrible memories of white-supremacist, anti-feminist, polish co-worker.*

Ooh, a manboobz/mammotheer welcome package! Thanks Cloudiah!

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

I’m a complete wimp about spiders and even I can cope with the ones in the UK.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

All of these signs read as “I don’t need feminism because omg I am such a chill girl, please like me!” to me, just FYI. Like, aw, honey, whatever you’re getting out of limbo-ing under that bar I sure hope it’s worth it.

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

Hubby has spilled the beans!

The spiders and teh menz are in this together! Apparently men only have hairy legs to show their solidarity with spiders. The spiders use their eight legs to close jars extra tight and cause minor car problems to make men seem more useful because they know that if women take over the world, we will destroy spider-kind. Men are not killing bathtub spiders! They are secretly freeing them when we are not looking! He says he can tell me no more. He’s risked too much already.

You guys, that’s why cats eat spiders!

It’s all so clear to me now.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

My cat doesn’t eat spiders, only mother. Oh shit, she’s a double agent, isn’t she?

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Moths, not mother. WTF, me? That’s what I get for watching Coraline after pulling an all-nighter.

Quackers
Quackers
6 years ago

A healthy young man with no money can drive, carry things, fix things, protect his mate, solve problems, save money, do chores — the list goes on.

Because no women are capable of doing any of this. All those women driving? Men disguised as women. All the stuff I carried when I helped my brother move? just a figment of my imagination. All the times I opened jars for my grandmother? I just dreamed it.

It is incredibly pathetic how these idiots both deny reality and basic things women do every single day in order to reassure themselves that they’re still the big strong men and women are all useless just crying out for their help. I also like how often misogynists contradict themselves by jumping from “women have contributed nothing” to “but traditional women’s work is SO important, I swear men have always respected it *snickergiggle*”

If I had all the power that manosphere dudes like to pretend feminists have, I would designate an island for them and these particular women who wish to live their lives kissing pasty, MRA butt. Let them live their happy little lives. And I’m all for legitimate critique of feminism, but these signs are just nothing but regurgitated stereotypes and MRA talking points. You know what makes me hesitant to cook for men? it’s not feminism. It’s gender roles. Gender roles that spawned stupid things like sandwich jokes being used to demean and dismiss women by taking a gender neutral act of kindness and turning into a boring chore that lowly women have to do to serve superior men.

Quackers
Quackers
6 years ago

damn you blockquote monster!!!!!

goodrumo
6 years ago

Reblogged this on iheariseeilearn and commented:
Another excellent blog…(We Hunted The Mammoth)

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

I cook very well. Not for you, though, creepy misogynist!

Zolnier
Zolnier
6 years ago

Has anyone come up with some kind of term for culture wide Stockholm Syndrome?

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

cassandrakitty,

They must have bought her off with tuna and chin scritches.

Robert
Robert
6 years ago

It makes me think of closeted gay men arguing that they don’t need to be out because all the out guys are a)screaming Nancy fairy queens, or b) dead serious activist dudes. Not realizing that they’re getting laid because of those guys. I enjoy being a SAHD, but a big part of that is that I worked in an office for twenty four years – staying at home and cooking the meals looks a lot different than if I’d been doing that since I was twenty.

Quackers
Quackers
6 years ago

“I love to be sexy for my man”

until MRAs and other bitter men decide for you that he’s actually the wrong man to be sexy for. He’s actually a badboy, a thug. Or he’s probably rich and that’s why you’re with him, etc. Then you can enjoy having them call you a a friendzoning, slutty, hypergamous bitch who’s destroying WESTERN SOCIETY!!!!11

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

Moths, not mother. WTF, me? That’s what I get for watching Coraline after pulling an all-nighter.

I thought you meant she got all motherly with spiders, which would be double-agenting and then some.

I am shattered, just shattered, to learn that men’s hairy legs mean they’re showing solidarity with spiders. I always thought it meant solidarity with the Furrinati. I see I shall have to have Words with Mr K tonight.

(Though this leaves the question of what my hairy-leggedness means. I’m damn sure it doesn’t refer to spider solidarity.)

I would designate an island for them and these particular women who wish to live their lives kissing pasty, MRA butt.

I read that as “pastry” before I got to “butt”. Kissing pastry would be much more fun. 😀

Totally seconding about the island. Make it so. (See? Useful android dude!)

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

“Internalized misogyny” is the term you’re looking for, Zolnier. It’s pointless getting angry with people like that, I just feel kind of embarrassed for them.

girlsmarts
girlsmarts
6 years ago

@Quackers Slowclap.gif to that. Sums it up completely.

cloudiah
6 years ago

Like, aw, honey, whatever you’re getting out of limbo-ing under that bar I sure hope it’s worth it.

Word. Or whatever it is the kids are saying today to indicate total agreement.

Spiders: I was driving up a winding mountain road with my first serious boyfriend, on one of the first nice Spring days, when he thought “Hey, let’s open the sunroof!” And he did, and all the baby spiders who’d been nesting in there during the winter descended. As a bonafide arachnophobe, I was very impressed that I did not drive us off a cliff.

I think I may have told this story before here. I should just show myself out.

Quackers
Quackers
6 years ago

I would be more than happy to…well…attempt to cook, for a GENUINELY nice, and pro-feminist (and if not that, then at the very least, anti-MRA) boyfriend, because I like to do nice things for people I care about, not sexist shits who wish to force me to do those things just because I am of a certain gender.

@kittehserfMOD

Lol! it sure would. Even pastry in the shape of a butt would be better.

dustedeste
dustedeste
6 years ago

My husband and I have a pact when it comes to crawlies: He protects me from anything with eight or more legs, and I defend him against the terrifying moths and grasshoppers that are out to ruin his life. Win-win!

I think we’re kinda fucked when it comes to roaches, though, especially if they’re the flying kind; luckily we haven’t had to deal with that yet. I suspect it would/will involve a lot of screaming and stockpiling of cans of Raid.

cloudiah
6 years ago

:: waves at Quackers ::

:: kisses pastry ::

Daniela
Daniela
6 years ago

You are a fat man.

Why you bother about this?

You probably don’t get laid.

Even if you are gay, you probably don’t get laid.

Why don’t spend your time and money, working out in a gym, or eating less, or earting healthier, than tracking misoginy.

Misoginy is bad, and sure they deserve being alone and all that.

But man, I can’t respect an ugly fat man doing this!

I hope you’ll find a friend (a girl) who can take care of this site, and you start yo work out and eat healthy.

Bye.

Quackers
Quackers
6 years ago

Hi cloudiah! 😀

now I want pastries.

@girlsmarts

thank you!

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

Quackers,
Or they decide that you being sexy = they have the right to treat you like a party favor or that you are provoking rape by existing.

Remember, if she’s sexy then she can’t be taken seriously and is probably out to take something from a man and if she’s not, she’s gross, not existing to please men and therefor evil and can’t be taken seriously.

cloudiah
6 years ago

So I was just up in the Olympic Peninsula (hellkell’s new/old stomping grounds) with friends, and we stayed in a nice cabin that had a resident mouse. My feeeeemale traveling companion, E., spotted the mouse first and let out a completely stereotypical “Eeeek” (more out of surprise than fear). We insisted that she carry out the stereotype by standing on a chair, and she complied. Then we got a manly man to kill it for us coexisted with the mouse for the rest of our stay. (After all, he’d lived there longer than we had!)

I feel like this has something to do with the spider stories, but maybe I’m just a little tipsy. I’m … testing wines for a little party I intend to throw in the next few weeks.

Quackers
Quackers
6 years ago

@Lea

Yep. And no pesky feminists to protest or at the very least, speak out against such disgusting “reason”

She needs to get her stereotypes up to date. These days I hear more complaints and angry screeds from manospherians and other misogynists about how feminists created a whole slew of slutty slut sluts. How they encourage women to sleep around like men. They complain women are too sexy, rather than not being sexy.

So she’s actually doing what feminists WANT. Dun dun duuuun!!!

Quackers
Quackers
6 years ago

that should be disgusting “reasoning”

since they actually think those things are reasonable.

I can kill spiders ok. I don’t like doing it, but if I have to I will.

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

Did you know that sometimes Daddy Long Legs gather in large bunches of hundreds of little spiders?

I didn’t know that.

…until I opened the back door to take out the trash and a jumble of them fell on me where they had been clustered above the door. At the time I had permed, giant, 80’s hair. All those tiny spiders fell at once onto and into my teased to Jesus, Aquanet coated, mane of curly hair.

Do Not Recommend

Greebo
Greebo
6 years ago

Go home Daniela ur drunk.
much “misoginy” very fitness much bodyshaming very wow.

dustedeste
dustedeste
6 years ago

Lol at the current drive-by troll. What a piece of human excrement. You may not be able to respect an ugly fat man, and that tells us a lot about whether we should respect your opinions.

Quackers
Quackers
6 years ago

@Lea

That is just terrifying. It also reminds me of a video I saw…..proceed with caution to anyone who really hates spiders
😛

dustedeste
dustedeste
6 years ago

Ugh, Lea, I feel you on the spiders thing. I thought I had it bad when a wolf spider dropped out of a doorframe and down my bikini top. But I mean at least it wasn’t full of baby wolf spiders.

Quackers
Quackers
6 years ago

@Daniela

if David were here I would give him one of my a pizza pops. I hope that makes you sad.

marinerachel
6 years ago

BYE.

That’s my favourite troll line.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

…until I opened the back door to take out the trash and a jumble of them fell on me where they had been clustered above the door. At the time I had permed, giant, 80′s hair. All those tiny spiders fell at once onto and into my teased to Jesus, Aquanet coated, mane of curly hair.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

In Girl Scouts we taught the girls that the critters live in the woods and they are just visiting. We even sang a song about a spider finding a girl in it’s bed. It was sweet.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
6 years ago

Well, Daniela, you can just fuck off, loser.

Zolnier
Zolnier
6 years ago

Well “internalised misogyny” certainly rolls of the tongue better than “trying to win at patriarchy.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Flying roaches are the spawn of an unholy mating between Satan and Cthulhu.

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

Kittehserf,
Yup. That’s exactly how it felt. They were harmless little spiders, but ew ew ew ew ew ew.