Huh. So Thor — you know, that dude in the comic books based extremely loosely on Norse mythology — is going to be replaced by a woman. No, for reals. Marvel comics announced it on The View. No, that’s for real too.
I wonder what the alpha dogs over in the Red Pill subreddit might think of this?
Huh. I figured they probably would hate it, but not “yet another step down the slippery rabbit hole of feminization that leads inevitably to mandatory lesbianism and the outlawing of PIV sex” hate it.
Let’s see if we can find some more nuanced takes on it. Hey, here’s a comment that starts off, well, calm at least:
Wait, “women and females?”
How about this one? This dude starts off by not blaming feminism.
Ah, I should have seen that coming. Everything that’s not the fault of feminism is always the fault of omega dudes trying to get laid.
Woah, I can’t believe my eyes! A commenter is actually suggesting that some of the other Red Pillers might be giving off the impression that they hate women. Oh, he got downvoted.
![PenguinWorld -8 points 10 hours ago (?|?) We don't hate women, it just really seems like we do permalink save give gold [–]HalfwySandwch 8 points 10 hours ago (?|?) How is this woman hating? It would be just as ridiculous if Wonder Woman was a dude. permalink save parent give gold [–]lexsird 1 point 8 hours ago (?|?) How would that play out? Wonder Man? Wonder Dude? Wonder Man, prince from the Amazonian kingdom...wait...can't have that. Wonder Man from ...what? Prince from the male dominate kingdom of ...about any kingdom ever. Shit, that would piss of the feminazis, so beta-bois aren't going to do that. permalink save parent give gold [–]HalfwySandwch 1 point 8 hours ago (?|?) Still called Wonder Woman... either a Trans chick to dude, who keeps the moniker. Or a non-transitioning trans dude to chick, who calls hemself Wonder Woman.](https://i0.wp.com/www.wehuntedthemammoth.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/hatewom.png?ssl=1)
That got ugly in a hurry. I did not see the transphobia coming.
This guy, meanwhile, thinks the only haters here are the man-haters who think it’s ok to make the God of Thunder a girl.
Seriously. I mean, it’s one thing to make Thor a young doctor named Donald Blake. That’s fine. Or have him put on tights and a cape and join up with an assortment of superheroes to fight the forces of evil in this and I don’t know how many other comic book universes as well as in a couple of films. But make him a female? Clearly that strains credulity.
The Red Pillers demand utter realism in their comic books involving Norse gods in tights.
Note: Thanks to Reddit’s own ShitRaditzSays for pointing out this lovely Red Pill discussion.
Only mildly related, but my first thought when I heard this was, “Tony Stark is SO gonna try to hit that.”
Thor: Verily, son of Stark, this will get weird.
Tony: Yeah, but that’s *later.* C’mon, where are the straps on this thing?
@maistrechat, who posted:
“In Supergods, Grant Morrison mentions that Moulton originally based Wonder Woman on Olive Byrne, the woman he and his wife were in a long-term relationship with.”
You know, I saw a documentary about comic book hero history once, and this was mentioned. It was also pointed out that in every photo of the three, Byrne was wearing wide, cuffling-like bracelets — kind of like the ones Wonder Woman wears. Also, if I’m not mistaken, Moulton developed what is now the lie detector test, which is funny when you think of Wonder Woman’s golden lasso and how it could force criminals to tell her the truth.
Oh, regarding All Star Superman, that ties back in with what someone wrote earlier in the thread, how powerful Supes would be under a blue star, since they give off more energy than yellow ones. In All Star (which, granted, is not in continuity) too much solar power is lethal to Supes.
@pendraegon : I like the new Batgirl. Batgirl & Supergirl friendship was also nice to see.
But at the same time I feel torn when I read Batgirl now. Because I like this Barbara Gordon but I liked the “old” Oracle Barbara too.
@Dvärghundspossen: Forming of JLA 52 wasn’t horrible. I actually liked those issues. That’s why I made the mistake of seeing the Justice League: War animated movie. It covered that storyline but with added whitewashing, misogyny and mean “a men want to dress in WW outfit” jokes.
To be fair the movie had some very good parts too. But bad parts made me dislike the whole movie.
I like “grew up in Kryptonian culture” Kara Zor-El. It interesting to see her bored with talks about some supposedly cutting edge, hard to understand new technology. Not because it doesn’t interest her but because it’s something she sees as antique technology.
They something similar again in Superman/Wonder Woman comics. Zod and Faora escape from the Phantom Zone and kick Supes all over the place. Then WW comes and save him.
They acknowledged that in one of older comics. Supermen, Wonder Woman and Batman are discussing who is faster in a fight, Superman or Wonder Woman.
Batman says that Diana is faster. And explains that Sups may be Usain Bolt fast, but WW is Bruce Lee fast. In a fight later is faster.
Supermen as a “terrifying, nigh-unstoppable alien monster” was done nicely in Superman vs. The Elite story arc.
And I liked Justice League Unlimited too.
I once read an interesting essay that there was a white supremacist fantasy element to Breaking Bad. Because our culture is used to the idea that white men are automatically the best at everything but in the Americas at least they aren’t the best at the drug trade. The rich, successful drug cartels tend to be run by Latinos. BB has a white man and his white protégé making a super special meth that’s better than all the meth being distributed by the Latino cartels. Most of the villains Walter must vanquish are Latino. The show makes the white man the best and restores the natural order of things.
I doubt Vince Gilligan was intentionally going for anything racial but I could buy this as a part of some subconscious thing since everyone, no matter how well intentioned was socialized into a racist culture.
@pendraegon: Well now I’ve had a look at the list of JLU episodes on Netflix and I can’t locate that ep by their description.
I think it’s Ep 39 “Destroyer” based on Wikipedia’s description, which says
@Catherine von Überwald I might actually start picking up the New 52 Batgirl books which would be nice to be able to do since every other new 52 series I’ve looked at has bothered the crap out of me. Especially poor Starfire.
@Falconer That sounds right, it was one of the last ones if not the last one from the series.
Breaking Bad did an okay job of critiquing toxic masculinity, but I’m not sure if that was totally intentional on the part of the creators. And a lot of the audience did not pick up on it at all. Wired has an article about it for anyone who is interested: http://www.wired.com/2013/10/breaking-bad-toxic-masculinity/ (spoilers obviously)
Just now read that Marvel will be giving the Captain America mantle to Sam Wilson, an African American character. I love this!
Yeah Marvel has been making a real push to be more representative of late. Though I still think it’s a bit odd that Archie has become way more heroic than most superheroes in the last few years.
@pendraegon: DC Comics is bad at math.
In many ways, Animated!Starfire is who I think of when I think of Starfire.
And lately I’m finding myself doing the same thing with the version of Anakin Skywalker from The Clone Wars rather than the one from Episode III.
Well, in Spider-Man’s defense, he did have a brain full of Doc Ock for 18 issues.
Although I’m sad that Ultimate Peter Parker was killed, I am really happy and intrigued by Miles Morales, and have considered picking the book back up starting with him. Especially the crossover where Parker-616 meets him.
Not a big fan of Shortpacked but that strip was brilliant, I think a lot of people still think of her that way and reasonably so since she is a far superior character compared to the 52 version. I never really got into The Clone Wars myself but I’ve never been a big Star Wars fan most of EU knowledge has been picked up in bits and pieces from friends who were more into it.
Oh when didn’t Peter have a brain full of wacky. 🙂 I haven’t had much chance to follow Ultimate Spiderman since they did the whole Gwen as Carnage bit and I just kind of shut down. Morales is definitely interesting though I’ve actually debated adding it to my pull list. Is it worth it?
@bunnybunny That article was great, really put it’s finger on a lot of my issues with Breaking Bad in general and the character of Walt in particular. The whole “Die like a man.” bit in particular always managed to cross the line from eye rolling irritation to actual anger for me.
I found it kind of wierd that in crossover books Wonder Woman usually gets jobbed by Superman and/or Batman solving whatever conflict is at hand with an asspull.
The animated series you mean?
I’ve been watching that lately. It’s… weird. On the one hand, the writing feels simplistic, as if it’s aimed at kids. On the other hand, the violence is horrific. Like, execute a renegade Jedi with a shot to the back, murder lots of clone troopers in creative and-awful-but-bloodless ways.
It reminds me of watching the Transformers animated movie back in the 80’s. Omnicron devouring and pulping entire civilizations, dumping the last survivor into a robot-shark-tank etc. Sure, it’s all happening to robots, but to INTELLIGENT SENTIENT robot civilizations. And somehow the writers thought this would be less horrifying because it happened to non-human people?
Anyone with even a glancing understanding of anthropology will probably enjoy this MRA “debating” with an actual anthropologist.
(The poor anthropologist seems more mystified than upset or angry during the exchange.)
@Pendraegon:
Linkara discusses the problems with 52-Starfire here: http://thatguywiththeglasses.com/videolinks/linkara/at4w/42973-red-hood-and-the-outlaws-1
Adding: Starfire comes in at 13 minutes in the video.
@leftwingfox: Yup, The Clone Wars is weird, for exactly those reasons. For instance, I don’t think the series ever says explicitly that Anakin and Padme are married, although there is one story where Anakin is handicapped because he’s given Padme his lightsaber (salacious eyebrow waggle); and then Anakin sneaks up behind a guy and sabers him right through the chest on-screen. And then again, they never show Anakin’s prosthetic directly, although it gets him into trouble with a big magnet once and they acknowledge it on the sly (it gets dinged once and sparks a little).
It continues to fail to make Grievous scary, although it does a marvelous job of making me take Cad Bane seriously. That’s because the former tends to lose all the time and the latter tends to win before the Jedi start to prod buttock in Act 3.
It’s beautifully conceived, though. Have you noticed how it’s made to look painted? I really dig that. And I don’t think I’ve ever caught them re-using whole sequences, although the animators probably made a macro to make Obi-Wan cross his arms and stroke his beard at the push of a button.
Oh, and @pendraegon, I haven’t actually read any Miles!Spidey except a few excerpts on the web. I keep putting it off because babies.
That’s a solid critique of the Starfire, new 52 has treated most of it’s heroine’s just terribly and that’s not even touching on the other issues characters like SImon Baz. As a big GL fan he still makes me ear steaming angry.
Speaking of babies, it was pajama day at daycare today.
Meant to say issues that characters like Simon Baz raise.
And Falconer clearly you fail as a geek, putting children before comics, for shame. 🙂
I like how Linkara makes it really clear that Starfire having very little clothing and sleeping around with the male heroes isn’t really problematic in itself, but how the way it’s presented, as if she’s not a real person but some kind of live sex-doll there for anyone to use, is really really really terrible.