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$MONEY$ a voice for men lying liars MRA paul elam

Paul Elam: All Your Donations Are Belong to Me

Paul Elam, in his hovel.

Heh. I’m on my annual semi-vacation this week, and was planning on keeping my postings here fairly light. But the news waits for no one. And by “news” I mean the daily parade of ridiculousness coming from the Men’s “Human Rights” camp. So here’s a quick report on the latest bit of high irony involving A Voice for Men.

Well, I was wrong. I’ve often noted that the Men’s Rights movement in general, and A Voice for Men in particular, doesn’t actually provide any real help for any real men. Sure, as far as I can tell, precisely zero of the hundreds of thousands of dollars A Voice for Men has raised from donors over the years has gone into providing actual services for men — say, funding a hotline for troubled men or some other practical program that doesn’t primarily involve yelling at women online. But never let it be said that none of this money gods to help men.

Because, it turns out, that money has been going to help men. Or at least that subset of men that consists of one Paul Elam of Houston Texas.

After being pressed for details about A Voice for Men’s finances by anonymous commenters on Reddit, a certain Twitterer named @DavidFutrelle and a journalist from MSNBC, Elam has finally fessed up and admitted that all the money donated to his website goes directly to him. But don’t take my word for it. Here’s what Elam had to say in a post from yesterday:

Every dollar donated goes right into my pocket. I spend that money on this website and on activist efforts at my own discretion, considering the opinions of the AVFM management team that volunteers to help run this place. … I depend on the site for my living, and to do as much FTSU as possible while I am at it.

In the past, of course, Elam was a bit more, well, elusive about where the money was going, talking about the costs of paying for web hosting and stock images rather than, say, the costs of paying the mortgage of one Paul Elam. Maybe “elusive” isn’t the correct word. “Deceptive” might be more like it.

You may also recall this pitch he once made for donations (I’ve put the best parts in bold):

I am tired of seeing a comparative handful of men and women cough up the lion’s share of financial assistance when most, even some who come here every day to read and cheer on FTSU, won’t cough up five fucking dollars to help us out; who are just fine as long as none of the burden, even a trivial part of it, is on them. …

[T]he longer I am at this, the less patience I have with dead weight, those who think AVFM is a fucking source of entertainment, or a life preserver for when the tables finally, inevitably turn against them.

In a way, I feel even worse now for most of the men who will make contact with AVfM looking for that lifeline. Unless their story is one that has the potential for me to exploit and gain media attention to THE CAUSE, then all I will have for them is a link to this article.

Well, and perhaps this piece of advice.

If the system has ruined your life, join the club. You are now in the ranks of men you have ignored your whole life. My advice to you is simple. Take your fucking quietly and with grace. Expect the same compassion you have always extended to those men who wore the shoes you are now wearing.

If you want things to change, then stock up on Ramen, get cozy in your studio apartment and join us in the fight to fix this shit. Don’t ask us to help you, but rather give your life the only meaning it may have left, as someone ready and willing to turn your meager existence into helping others who have been similarly screwed over.

In other words, Elam told troubled men turning to his site for help that they should stock up on Ramen noodles — and pay his bills. Oh, and on several occasions he’s boasted about taking donations from people taking the money from their unemployment checks.

As for the other people who put in so much time and energy at his site? As far as I can figure it from Elam’s evasive post yesterday, they earn nothing but a “thanks.”

At the end of each day, even with the incredible levels of help I get from people like Dean Esmay, David King, Al Martin and every one of the incredible people who work at AVFM, I am still target number one. I am a target for feminists posing as concerned MHRAs, yellow hacks like David Futrelle, and a target for many in the media who would love nothing better than to publish my personal financial information after putting their disgusting spin on it.

As you might have gathered from that quote, Elam remains indignant that anyone would even ask where the money goes.

And that goes for the money he recently raised that was supposedly earmarked to pay the security costs of AVFM’s conference. About that, he says only:

we hired four police officials (three officers and one supervisor) for coverage of the entire event and also hired a local attorney, paying his retainer in advance.  We also had to engage our regular attorney, and have not yet been billed for their services.

In effect, we spent the money raised on precisely what we said we would spend it on, and have set aside what little remained for the next conference.

Really? According to costhelper.com, off-duty police officers generally cost $40-60 an hour; this Sheriff’s department puts the costs at $27-$31 an hour for each of its officers, including administrative fees. Even assuming that AVFM paid at the top of this range — $60 an hour — it would have cost them only $7200 to pay for four officers working ten hours each of the three days of the conference.

The amount that AVFM might have paid for legal fees depends on how much their lawyers charge per hour, and how many hours they worked. Assuming each lawyer charged $200 per hour and worked thirty hours over the three days of the conference — which I highly doubt — the cost for their legal assistance would have added up to $12,000. If AVFM actually paid even half that for legal fees I will eat my cats.

Even with these extremely generous assumptions, AVFM would have paid out only a little over $19,000 for security and legal fees. AVFM raised more than $30,000 for “security.”

In the interest of full disclosure, I should note that I also ask readers for donations. But I’ve always made clear that aside from donations specifically earmarked for other things the money goes to me. (And the cats.) And I don’t demand that donors pay me $20,000 per quarter — $80,000 a year — on top of whatever donations come in between the quarterly fundraisers, not to mention special “security” fundraisers.

I’m very grateful to those who donate to me — and indeed to everyone who’s contributed time and effort and knowledge and artistic skills to help the site — but I take in only a fraction of what Elam evidently takes in. And I don’t ask for money from those who are themselves broke.

In the comments on AVFM, the regulars are of course rallying around Elam. Then again, I can’t imagine anyone critical of what he does with the money would remain unbanned there for long.

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marinerachel
marinerachel
10 years ago

I don’t support PeTA so, no, I’m not going there. Nope. Won’t do dat. Can’t. It causes dangerous levels of disgust in me. Doc won’t allow it.

I hope no one takes me seriously when I say Paul or any MRA warrants the money. They don’t. Besides, look how much donation money Elam pockets. He’s doing just fine.

Could We Hunted the Mammoth be a worthy recipient? As I understand it, cats need food and clean litter.

Auntie Alias
Auntie Alias
10 years ago

@House Mouse Queen

I’m game to transcribe. I’d like to have reference source available.

brooked
brooked
10 years ago

I’d like to say that there are better charities than Red Cross, which I witnessed doing a sub-par job during Sandy. I worked with people who did relief work in the hardest hit area in NYC, Rockaway, and everyone had depressing stories of Red Cross’s incompetence. They raised a ton of money but sent ill-equipped and clueless volunteers who were incapable of making on the ground adjustments at a time when creative crisis management was the only reason ad hoc relief efforts did great work. I later discussed the charity with someone who did relief work after the 2010 earthquake in Haiti and he told me how the Red Cross was infamous for being late, inefficient and incapable of coordinating with other groups.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/brushing-off-criticism-red-cross-shifts-phase-sandy-172912715.html

ToolBox
ToolBox
10 years ago

I’d really like examples of this violent feminist rhetoric. I keep hearing about it, though never get many examples. The closest I’ve been shown are a few (fake) Dworkins quotes and that lame Jezebel article.

Actually, I wonder how they’d react if they came across Heartless Bitches International?

Hmm….

Kootiepatra
10 years ago

@House Mouse – I am game for transcribing (I have actually done a lot of it in the past — albeit for far less squicky lectures). Assign me a video and I will get to work.

From the previous page of comments, I saw someone mention that Anita Sarkeesian is apparently being held up by MRAs as a counter-argument to this whole scandal. But… her situation was 110% different. She said, “I would like (this much) money to make videos about (this topic).” She started a Kickstarter, saying exactly that. Gamer dudebros on the internet went nuclear on her. The rest of the internet, on their own volition went, “Hey, that’s not cool, and those sound like interesting videos,” and soared right past her original fundraising goal. She did not beg anyone to keep giving after she hit her target. In a bizarre sense, the dudebros inadvertently raised more money for her than anybody.

She then turned around with the money and did what she initially said she was going to do with it, which was make videos. Nobody was duped. Nobody was pressured. No particular community was pressed to give more money. People gave her money, they got videos. Everybody’s happy.

The fact that surplus money was involved in both cases in no way makes them the same. Super easy stuff.

kittehserf MOD
kittehserf MOD
10 years ago

OT: how’s Ohai Uruk-hai doing, Kootiepatra? Do you intend to do more comics? (I read the entire set in one go when you introduced him.)

🙂

Argenti Aertheri
10 years ago

If you want to put the transcriptions in one place, I’ll happily volunteer Borg space for that.

bittersteel
bittersteel
10 years ago

I don’t know what Paul is doing with all of the money, but I really don’t have a problem with him keeping some of it for personal use. I am more than satisfied with the website and the work that AVFM’s board and MRAs are doing in general. If people like Jezebel’s staff are allowed to write feminist articles and make salaries why isn’t Paul allowed to write articles and make money? Running a website with over 100k users is probably time consuming and costly, especially considering all of the research that most of the articles have (unlike feminist articles, AVFM seems to document everything with sources every time they make a claim). I also believe in free enterprise, so I don’t have a problem with Paul making a profit out of his work so that he can stay afloat and you know, do all of those things Jezebel writers have to do like pay rent and eat.

Really what this comes down to is you guys are attacking him for doing exactly the same thing that your side does. Jezebel writers have to eat. Feminist academics make salaries. Female DV shelter employees have to eat and therefore make money from the shelter. Feminist activists make films and books and make money off the sales. If you guys don’t have a problem with these guys doing this, why isn’t Paul allowed to make some money for food too? Feminists seem to love condemning people for doing what they do themselves because they want to be a superior, elite class (not females in general, but feminists).

And another thing: you guys claim that MRAs never do anything and that we just whine about all of our problems. Actually, that could not be farther from the truth. First of all, right now that “whining” is drawing light on the issues. The mainstream media has started to admit that men have issues (which they didn’t do before) and instead of ridiculing that idea and telling us to “man up” have started attacking AVFM’s “tone” (so basically they’re saying “your argument is correct but you aren’t being very nice!”). That’s important for getting the word out. Second, this type of outreach is important for educating young men about the issues that they potentially face because nobody else tells us about them. I had no idea that paternity fraud was so rampant (16%-30%? Like seriously, that’s totally disgusting. And I just love how women operate with this-first you have to meet impossible standards to met a nice one and successfully convince her to like you and then she just sleeps with an alpha and makes you pay for the child for the rest of your life. How wonderful that all of your hard work and efforts go to the benefit of everyone except yourself. I signed a chastity-for-life pledge after reading about this garbage behavior), for example, and that only certain states protect you from it. So guess what? After I finish my education, I will go live in one of those states that protects me from having some random girl that I have never met naming me as the father and then giving the judge a wrong address so that I can be hitched forever even though I’m not the father and the DNA tests say so. Thanks to AVFM I know that men can be victims of DV and rape, that many women are vindictive, and that the pay gap is about choice and not about discrimination (something that convinced me to make a better choice about my own career path and to pursue a higher paying career instead of a lower paying one).

Second, many MRAs have done wonderful things. Erin Pizzey started the domestic violence shelters. Carnell Smith was instrumental in passing legislation to help protect men in Georgia from paternity fraud. Sen. Anne Cools is fighting for shared parenting in Canada. Karen Straughan’s work on evolutionary psychology (absolutely fascinating) is being used in university lectures now even though she doesn’t even have a university degree! Dr. Paul Nathanson and Warren Farell are combating feminist bias in the academic sphere. Dr. Tara Palmatier does therapy for men who are ravaged by gynocentrism and feminism. Stefan Molyneux is a stay at home dad, proving every day that it is not a man’s responsibility to be a slave/provider for his family. Mike Buchanan started a men’s issues party in Britain that is gaining some traction. Anil Kumar and MRAs in India (MRA is much bigger in India than it is in the Western World because feminism hasn’t had time to brainwash everyone yet) recently brought down key provisions in the Anti-Dowry Act that were being used to jail entire families, including 2 month old girls (that evil patriarchal infant!), in false dowry cases.

So next time you want to ask what MRAs are doing to help men and then proudly proclaim that we aren’t doing anything, just realize that you’re wrong. It’s not easy for us to do all of the things that feminists do because we’re still getting the word out and because we don’t have government violence backing our agenda and stealing your money for our work like they steal our money for your work. For example no government is funding men’s shelters and feminists have stopped our funding and have eradicated paternity tests in UK, Australia, and France in order to champion cuckoldry and genetic destruction of beta men). But MRAs are doing what they can and we will continue to do what we can. Do I think we’ll win? No. The world has been gynocentric for too long. But at least we won’t go out prostrating ourselves before you and your alpha gods and we won’t expend our entire lives having our hard work taken by you for your benefit and our detriment.

damselindetech
10 years ago

In terms of cash, there are some programs that offer micro loans. How about something like that? That way the cash could potentially keep getting reinvested to helping other folks?

Pithy Pseudonym
10 years ago

Doug, if you’re still reading, I’ll rephrase my question to make it more direct: I have a finite amount of money that I can donate to charity/”charity”. I’m personally interested in using part of my charity budget for organizations which support male rape & DV victims and/or perform community education on the subject. I’ve poked around and some of the local groups around me serve men and a few have targeted programs for men. Can you provide me with any evidence that donating to AVfM would be a more efficient or effective way to support male-focused projects than an unrestricted donation to these local groups?

Flying Mouse
Flying Mouse
10 years ago

@Nitram and Lea – Have you ever been to reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists ? It’s one of the few places on reddit where asshole flags are forbidden to fly; it’s heavily moderated and with no slurs or victim blaming allowed. A lot of the posts are by people trying to deal with their parents, but narcissists of all stripes are discussed. I’ve found lurking there helpful when I’m faced with a “holy sloth, I can’t believe that she actually did that, am I imagining things?” moment. Though it is depressing that there are that many self-absorbed, zero-empathy control freaks wandering the earth. ::sigh::

Argenti Aertheri
10 years ago

“In terms of cash, there are some programs that offer micro loans. How about something like that? That way the cash could potentially keep getting reinvested to helping other folks?”

Oooh, I like that idea!

Viscaria
Viscaria
10 years ago

Micro loans are such a great idea. If that’s what you go with, marinerachel, I’d love to contribute too!

Viscaria
Viscaria
10 years ago

Or, sorry, was that a rude and presumptuous suggestion? I can be such an awkward duck sometimes.definitely didn’t mean to take over your great charity idea.

Woody
Woody
10 years ago

I’m not Doug, but he’s been killing it in this thread.

rjjspesh
rjjspesh
10 years ago

Trying block quotes for the first time; here goes

WTF is wrong with MRAs and fucking basic statistics? Fuck.

It almost seems like they have an agenda to push

Pithy Pseudonym
10 years ago

If by “it,” you mean “any semblance of decency,” you’re right.

Pithy Pseudonym
10 years ago

Oops; my reply was to Woody.

rjjspesh
rjjspesh
10 years ago

Aw yissss.

Viscaria
Viscaria
10 years ago

Perhaps “it” is our collective patience?

bunnybunny
10 years ago

I think “it” is “being a perfect parody of himself.” My favorite kind of MRA.

Shiraz
Shiraz
10 years ago

Uh, I don’t think “killing it” means what you think it means, little woodster.

Auntie Alias
Auntie Alias
10 years ago

@Toolbox

Here’s an example of what passes for violence in the MRA Land. Last night an MRA claimed feminists were violent at a University of Toronto protest – the one with lots of shouting and someone pulling a fire alarm. I said there wasn’t any violence and this was the response:

There was no physical violence, but there was both verbal and psychological violence deployed. Hey, if brushing up against a woman’s thigh is now sexual assault, fuck it, yelling at me is now violence.

Hahaha.

@Kootiepatra

You mentioned transcribing videos before. Is there an easier way to do it than switching from window to window and stop-starting the playback?

@bittersteel

Comments shorter than War and Peace would be nice.

Flying Mouse
Flying Mouse
10 years ago

Oh, Woody. Has there ever been an MRA that you haven’t loved?

emilygoddess - MOD
emilygoddess - MOD
10 years ago

Wait, donkey shows are an urban legend? I guess when you’ve read enough of the stomach-churning shit white men will coerce desperate third-world women into doing for money, it doesn’t seem that far-fetched. But I also see the point about how racism helped perpetuate the myth, and further research suggests that most of the “evidence” consists of white men merely claiming they got to see desperate third-world women doing humiliating things for money.

Anyway, I had a thought last night at work: even if the MRM was a legit cause, AVfM would be its PETA: more concerned with “raising awareness” by screaming “look at me!” as loud and offensively as possible than with actually helping their supposed beneficiaries. Then patting themselves on the back for being such good, awareness-raising activists. Then donating some of their money to the legal defense funds of questionable people.

I’m about to be pedantic about a stupid thing here. German chocolate cake is apparently not actually German. It was invented by an American man whose last name was German.

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