So A Voice for Men, having lost or abandoned the original venue for their “Men’s Issues” conference in Detroit, has announced its new location: A VFW post some 18 miles away from the original hotel where, presumably, most of the conference’s attendees will be staying.
According to Paul Elam, they made the move in large part to spare conference-goers the terrible inconvenience of having to watch the no-doubt riveting presentations from an “overflow room.”
No, really.
In a post last night, Elam declared that all the media attention given to the conference
has produced is a hell of a lot more interest in the conference, and more ticket sales. So much so, as a matter of fact, that we have opted to move to a venue that will seat more people and provide more security than was available previously.
While we apologize for any inconvenience that the move is going to cause, it is nonetheless a positive move for the conference. Because seating capacity was misrepresented to us at the previous venue, we were forced to plan for an overflow room where we would pipe in live events to a monitor at reduced ticket prices.
With the change of venue we will be able to accommodate all attendees in the same space at the same time.
Naturally, the first thing some critics of Elam did when they saw this announcement was to look up the seating capacity of the largest rooms at both venues. The largest room at the Doubletree Fort Shelby, where the conference was originally scheduled to take place, seats 300, with a maximum capacity of 310. The largest room at the VFW post … also seats 300. Or maybe 350. The VFW website isn’t clear.
In other words, Elam expects us to believe that in order to avoid the inconvenience of having to resort to “overflow rooms,” AVFM moved its convention to a venue 18 miles away from the original hotel that might not even offer rooms any bigger than the original venue.
Meanwhile, in the comments to Elam’s post, one would-be conference attendee reports that the Doubletree has canceled his reservation. If Doubletree has decided to wash its hands of the conference attendees now that they are no longer hosting the conference, and Elam is telling the truth about the number of people planning to attend, this could mean hundreds of people scrambling for hotel rooms.
Still, Elam and his troops are eager to present this as a great victory.
It’s weird. You might think that this sort of reality distortion would be impossible in a democratic country in the internet age. Sure, back in Stalin’s day, the Soviet Union’s propaganda machine could present massive failure as success and get away with it – at least to some degree, at least within their own country.
In the wake of a disastrous program of “forced collectivization” of rural agriculture in 1929-30, which left many peasants dead or imprisoned and paved the way for future famines, Stalin famously announced in an article in Pravda that the program had been so amazingly successful that he needed to call a temporary halt so that everyone could catch their breath. The title of his article: “Dizzy With Success.”
The only way you can get away with bullshit this brazen is if you’re a dictator or the leader of a cult – something that A Voice for Men has increasingly come to resemble. AVFMers are expected not only to accept Elam’s leadership; they’re expected to accept his distinctly non-consensus reality – a world turned upside down in which men are the real victims of domestic violence and rape and pretty much everything else, a world in which the Southern Poverty Law Center is a collection of evil bigots and his motley collection of misogynists is the true human rights movement of the twenty-first century.
Like a lot of cult leaders, Elam keeps his troops too busy to think straight in a continual frenzy of pseudo-activism. AVFMers are forever brigading comment sections of newspaper articles and YouTube videos in little squads (AVFMers almost always travel in packs), all reciting the same few talking points.
Weirdly, the dynamics of internet discussions can actually reinforce this kind of intellectual conformity, much as Stalin’s control of the media did in his day. No, AVFMers can’t avoid being exposed to facts that contradict the shared (un)reality of their ideological bubble.
But in internet discussions you don’t have to be right in order to convince yourself you’ve won an argument. You just have to be loud and persistent and unwilling to ever give in. You don’t have to convince anyone else of your arguments so long as you convince yourself. MRAs don’t win many arguments on their merits, but they manage to convince themselves they win every one.
The trouble is that when they step outside of their regular stomping grounds on the internet, this strategy – so effective in generating ideological conformity amongst cult members – falls completely apart.
We’ve seen several spectacular examples in the past couple of weeks. First, we watched a concert organized by Canadian Men’s Rights group CAFE implode after musicians and sponsors realized what they’d been roped into; the pathetically unconvincing attempts by the group to explain away this failure were amazing to behold.
Then we saw AVFM’s Dean Esmay reduce himself to a caricature on Fox (local) news as he rapidly regurgitated standard AVFM talking points like some sort of fanatical ideological auctioneer, apparently unaware that to everyone outside of the Men’s Rights bubble everything he was saying was obviously utter nonsense.
And now we have Paul Elam trying to convince the world that AVFM changed its venue for its conference because, hey, we needed more room!
The trouble with having your head up your ass most of the time is that when you take it out, people tend to notice the smell.
But, hey, as long as the AVFMers are happy with their new venue, I’m happy for them. Janet Bloomfield, the official “social media director” for the conference, posted this triumphant tweet lat night:
https://twitter.com/JudgyBitch1/status/476822883881459712
She has assured me that this is an actual quote. The “Wayne State cunts” remark is apparently a reference to the Wayne State sociology professor who, er, debated AVFM’s Dean Esmay on the local Fox affiliate the other day. Esmay has also posted a slightly shorter version of the same quote in the AVFM comments section.
So, yes, both the official PR representative for the conference and AVFM’s “managing editor” both apparently think it’s a great idea to refer to women who disagree with them as “cunts.”
Oh, and Bloomfield also thinks it’s hilarious to joke about Elam scamming his supporters of the $29,000 raised for additional security:
https://twitter.com/BhasChat/status/476907717194702848
You can’t buy this kind of publicity, largely because as far as I know there are no PR firms that offer organizations help in destroying the last tiny shreds of their credibility.
AVfM: loving unsubstantiated/false accusation, unless it’s directed at one of them.
@ Pallygirl
I never visit the website. I rely on those hardy enough to stand the stupid enough to report on it for me…
This is kinda wrong of me, I know.
LOL, I see now. I can stand stupid, it’s willfully ignorant that annoys me.
“Blessed be his name.”
Seriously, the fawning in that nearly made me sick.
@LBT
The other side of that furiously heightened skepticism that you’re exposed to (which boggles my mind) is, well, if they really believe that you’re in a delusional state because of trauma… that the best thing for you would be to take away your defense mechanism?
That sounds an awful lot like placing their own pet theories and the advancement of them over any consideration for you at all. Even if their premises made sense (I think they ought to be sat down and forced to read that bit about Occam’s Razor upthread about a gazillion times) they’re still acting like heartless asshats.
Valuing theories above actual human beings; ugh.
And to loop this back into the actual topic of the thread:
And then JB will call them Wayne State c*****, and that’s your new era right there. With COMPASSION!! FOR ALL!!
I love all these Elam boners, as if he’s ever accomplished anything to improve the lives of men and boys. He just harasses women. Praise be!
…can I be a gender ideologue? I promise to only create silly genders!
Please kneeel, Howard *wafts sword around*
Iah hearebuy creee-ate you Gender Ideologue in Chief. Gourd bless you and all who sail in you.
Now either drink this champagne or smash it over your head. Either option works.
Trickster and the fools
(To the tune of Beauty and the Beast)
Tale as old as time
Assholes lose their shit
Angry bunch of dinks
Then somebody thinks:
”How can I profit?”
Just a little change
Then a little more
Rally for support
When you’re feeling short
on some money, sure
::reprise::
Misogynist fools
Contributing pools
of money streaming in,
Meant to help their thing
Now your pockets line
::reprise::
Tale as old as time
Tune as old as song
Smallest violin
Played with one wide grin
When they learn they’re wrong
Certain as the sun
Never shining on
All the dimes you took
Playing by the book
Trickster and the fools
Tale as old as time
Receiving is no crime
Trickster and the fools
(To Ashman & Menken, not to mention every native English speaker everywhere in the world, and to everyone who read this, whether or not they hummed it to the tune of the well-known Disney song: I am truly, truly sorry. I couldn’t help myself.)
Woody,
Protests =/= harassment
We signed a petition. People held a protest. It worked and you got booted.
I’m still dubious about the “death threats”. That’s what happens when your group destroys their own credibility. People don’t trust you.
As AVfM took part in a false rape allegation campaign and called it “activism”. I don’t buy that they’ve been threatened by feminists because I doubt everything AVfM claims and that behavior would be very out of character for feminists. We are the ones calling your house night to leave threats. Again, that’s a page out of your playbook. We’re capable of organizing a peaceful protest. AVfM had encouraged terrorism. MRAs tell the “truth” about gender in the same way the KKK tells the “truth” about race. Your movement is built on out and out lies. Yes, your guru is shady. You can trust him and think he’s wise. Send him as much money as you like. If you think advocating for the rape and battery of women makes someone wise and that making up tall tails about ebil feminist conspiracies makes him honest, you deserve to get grifted.
*We are NOT the ones…*
Stupid fingers and their stupid typos….
so you are for equal rights right? then why are you so against men having equal rights. the most minimal of searching and you will find out that the mrm is mainly about custody and divorce battles. it has little to do with women bashing. maybe look into what you are so passionate about hating and you’d see that THIS page is extremely sexist. i am not mrm, i am not a feminist. i am for equality for all. you kids need to keep yourself in check, its all coming off just like you say people say feminists are, angry irrational and overly sensitive. thats my 2 cents. also some facts, stats and sources can never hurt your argument
As a VFW member I’ve emailed that post asking why they’re hosting the conference of a known hate group. While I know that this bruises their freeze peach, the VFW isn’t a government institution so the First Amendment doesn’t apply. What does apply is their responsibilities to their members.
***
To make a Freeze Peach:
1 1/2 shots rum
1 1/2 shot peach puree
1/2 shot peach schnapps
1/2 shot sweet & sour mix
Mix in blender. Run till ice is entirely crushed (like the hopes and dreams of an Ayn Rand fan)
I just finished reading this thread and the comments. What a way to start my morning coffee becoming nauseated at this whole shenanigans. Imo VFW is going to regret allowing avfm to host a mens conference. The good thing is if that this particular VFW hall will get so much negative publicity with this conference and being allied with a hateful misogynistic racist group such as avfm that maybe they will back out before the actual date or it will be such a disaster public relations wise that any VFW hall across the USA will refuse to hold a mens conference in the future.
I was doing some homework for a troll on the other thread (I’m very helpful, don’t ask) and came across some more examples of how AVFM and JB are going to have COMPASSION! FOR ALL!!!
A previous post by David.
Scroll down.
The “Please help them” bit at the end of Teflon’s message is just like what judgybitch was saying when the threats first got reported and she was trying to pin them on that random woman. Sounds like someone’s been writing scripts for people to use.
If the death threats happened and I’m going to assume they did, that really sucks and I’m sorry it’s something whoever they were directed at experienced. I totally unequivocally do not endorse such behaviour. Boooooooooo. Booooooooooo!
Why the fuck do I owe you money again? I know I didn’t do it. There’s absolutely no indication I did do it. I denounce it. So why do I owe you teh monies? Why are you falsely accusing me? My name’s already clear so why would I go to any lengths to clear it?
We don’t know who made the death threats. The idea FEMINISTS DID IT is an unsubstantiated accusation. There is no indication or evidential support they did. Feminism doesn’t have a rich cultural history of engaging in such tactics on the regular so pointing the finger at them is goofy.
AVfM’s on the other hand….. they kinda do this all the time.
I’m open to the possibility these death threats did come from a feminist. I’ve no idea why I owe you money. The overwhelming majority of feminists denounce such behaviour. We’re not responsible for the bad behaviour of fringe-dwellers who we distance ourselves from and discourage and denounce the behaviour of.
AVfM, on the other hand, fosters an attitude of hostility towards women and feminism and regularly spouts violent rhetoric directed at them. That makes then a pretty likely candidate for this behaviour when it comes up.
Trying to equate peaceful protest and mockery and petitioning with doxxing and acquitting rapists and committing to fuck up the shit of feminists? Really? Come on, now. Even you know that makes you look like a silly sausage.
Woody,
Yes, we’re aware o the claims. Just repeating them isn’t going to change anyone’s mind.
I tend to be skeptical of attempts to liken AVfM to a cult, but this is…wow.
StrivingAlly,
This is a really good comparison, actually.
I’ve been to the Detroit Doubletree. That “300 seat” conference room is really just 2 conference rooms with a collapsible wall between them. Even with the walls down you could only realistically seat 200 people.
Re: JB
You implied the hotel manager said that, but good try. I doubt you’ll be successful in using this thread in your defence.
Pardon me…I meant the VFW facility’s manager.
Fnoicby, what part of “our new venue manager” don’t you understand?
Auntie Alias, is the VFW facility not the new venue?
Yes.
So was my comment incorrect? Yes it’s not the new venue, or yes it is?