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a voice for men MRA

Is A Voice for Men's conference kaput? Doubletree says "they are not booked with us." [UPDATE: Elam says they have another venue.]

carwheels

Woah! Just wanted to pass along this news from the Motor City Muckraker:

A controversial conference for a men’s rights group in Detroit appears to be in jeopardy after a fallout with downtown’s Hilton DoubleTree, which planned to host the event from June 26-28.

The inaugural conference at the DoubleTree has been canceled for unknown reasons, and organizers of the first International Conference on Men’s Issues haven’t said yet whether it will be moved to another hotel and conference center.

“At this time, they are not booked with us,” Larry Brown, manager of the DoubleTree, said this morning. He declined to elaborate on the cancelation.

There’s nothing on A Voice for Men about this latest development, though Esmay hinted during his Fox News appearance that they were possibly going to reconsider the Doubletree. But as of right now, AVFM is still selling tickets, as if the Doubletree convention is still a going concern.

Are they going to try to book the convention elsewhere? Or are they going to take the $29,000 they raised for “security” and, I dunno, send Esmay to a better stylist?

One other, ah, interesting detail in the Motor City Muckraker story:

When asked Tuesday whether the event would be moved, an organizer responded: “The DoubleTree GM (general manager) actually said that he has ‘feminist phobia’ and sort of laughed but in a nervous way. So its being discussed.”

It’s questionable whether this conversation ever occurred because the general manager is a woman.

Yeah. Seems like a lot of things about this convention have been pretty questionable from the start.

UPDATE: Well, one thing’s a bit clearer now, though. I called the Detroit Police and they confirmed that the Doubletree did indeed report to them that it had received threats. Who sent them, we still don’t know, but I think we can all agree that whether the threats came from some misguided feminist or “progressive” or from an MRA trying to stir shit and make feminists look bad, whoever made the threatening calls is a shithead who deserves to face the legal consequences for what they did.

UPDATE 2: According to the Detroit News, Elam says they’ve got another venue:

“We have scheduled another venue and will make an announcement on the site this evening,” group founder Paul Elam said in an email Wednesday.

So far no announcement on AVFM; I’ll post about it when there is one.

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Cliff Pervocracy
Cliff Pervocracy
7 years ago

I’d predict a major meltdown of AVfM as all the members realize they’ve been ripped off, the conference was never really meant to happen, and Elam is laughing all the way to the bank, but that hasn’t happened any of the 20 or so other times this has happened.

I just want to know why this fairly small number of guys even had 29K to spare. Wish I was that kind of oppressed.

jared
jared
7 years ago

The good thing is that some sort of protests do work. The Doubletree does not want any bad publicity about their company so they backed out of holding the conference. DoubleTree is owned by Hilton I believe so as a public corporation they do not want to have their reputation damaged by holding a conference for a group of misogynists. So all the negative feedback that DoubleTree heard about MRA’s was not for naught. They backed out and now .Yaay.

Esmay and his cohorts will try to choose another hotel. In my opinion I cannot see any hotels/convention/retreat centers allowing this conference on their grounds. They will know based on the DoubleTree incident that it is not worth it given all the chaos and bad publicity that will ensue. Thankfully it could happen that avfm may not be able to find a suitable location for their conference. I would not put it past them to cancel the conference and keep all the deposit money they received from their fellow gullible mra’s.

sarah
sarah
7 years ago

There is a troll on the event page and on news website comments libeling the hotel manager already.

I called the hotel and left him a message.

Auntie Alias
Auntie Alias
7 years ago

I posted this exchange on an older article but it’s relevant to this.

Fku • 4 days ago
LYING SONS OF BITCHES. I was SCREWED by my wife and try to find help and YOU SCREW ME? My cousin at the police dept says there was absolutely never ANY DEATH THREATS CALLED IN. He confirmed it with the local FBI office, said there is NO WAY there was a death threat called NEXT DOOR from the FBI at the Doubletree without them being contacted. So who’s lying? The hotel, or you? Because you sure used it to screw me and a bunch of other actual MRAs out of tens of thousands of dollars. Well played assholes. Or was it that Judgy Bitch? Lol bet it was, never trust a women with your finances. I can’t believe I trusted you guys I feel personally betrayed. There are actual MENS PROBLEMS AND YOU COMMIT FRAUD INSTEAD Damn I’m pisseeeeddd I’m not stopping until all men know you’re frauds

Paul Elam Mod Fku • 3 days ago
Really? Your posts are being deleted? Interesting. I seem to be reading them just fine.

Now as to your complaint, the case numbers to the Detroit Police Department are 1406060175 and 1405300248.

Also, if you donated it was through paypal. If you regret donating, file a complaint with them, or simply request a refund.

I don’t think either will happen because I am certain you never donated anything.

Personally, I think you are just full of shit. I think you want to undermine our credibility with the people that trust us and you’re stupid enough to think that you can accomplish that like this,

I know who I believe. 😀

grumpycatisagirl
7 years ago

I called the hotel and left him a message

The manager? I thought she’s a woman?

weirwoodtreehugger
7 years ago

Who could have ever predicted this turn of events? No one ever went broke underestimating the stupidity of MRAs. Well played Elam.

emilygoddess
emilygoddess
7 years ago

Anyone surprised by this turn of events?

*crickets chirping*

Yeah, me neither.

titianblue
titianblue
7 years ago

When asked Tuesday whether the event would be moved, an organizer responded: “The DoubleTree GM (general manager) actually said that he has ‘feminist phobia’ and sort of laughed but in a nervous way. So its being discussed.”

It’s questionable whether this conversation ever occurred because the general manager is a woman.

Sweet, sweet schadenfreude!

If you’re going to lie in your press release, MRAs, at least get the facts correct that can be checked.

And trolls in the comments are torn between accusing feminists of terrorism whilst claiming the AVfM cancelled because the Doubletree wasn’t big enough to hold all the attendees.

Ally S
7 years ago


Oh, AVFM.

Athywren
Athywren
7 years ago

Whaaaat? Well I never. After all this time of being upstanding pillars of society, AVfM are revealed to be less than perfect? I shall never believe it! NEVAR!

@Auntie Alias
I like ScaaarBeeek’s comment above that one… apparently we are engaging in a proxy war against AVfM with government backing. Soon the Rebellion will be crushed, and young Skywalker will be one of us… or something like that.

sarah
sarah
7 years ago
Reply to  Ally S

The general manager is a woman. This is another manager.

hellkell
hellkell
7 years ago

HAHAHAHAHAHA. I am soooooo shocked at this turn of events.

Maybe they can use the money to fix Dean’s grill and get him a new suit for public appearances.

serrana
serrana
7 years ago

I just made a Schadenfreude Pie. Would anyone like a slice? It’s huge.There’s enough for everyone.

Ally S
7 years ago

Sounds delicious! I’ve been meaning to make misandry cake myself…

Mike Buchanan
7 years ago

Opinions were divided among MHRAs, between those who thought that radfems – and their male poodles – would be so STOOOOOOOOOOOOOPID as to seek to force the venue to not host the world’s first-ever conference on men’s issues, in a bid to censor free speech and thereby hand a huge PR gift to AVfM (and the MHRM more widely), and those who thought the radfems wouldn’t. Our experience has been that it’s generally worth putting money on the viciousness and stupidity of radfems, so this comes as no surprise to us.

I look forward to speaking at the event, whenever and wherever it’s held. No MHRA of my acquaintance has the SLIGHTEST concern about the integrity of Paul Elam, Dean Esmay, or any other key figures in AVfM, which is why the $25,000 fundraiser met its target in 22 hours. It’s a safe bet to say the event will attract MORE delegates and media attention, after what’s happened. Happy days.

hellkell
hellkell
7 years ago

No MHRA of my acquaintance has the SLIGHTEST concern about the integrity of Paul Elam, Dean Esmay, or any other key figures in AVfM,

That’s because you’re fucking stupid and gullible. Go away, you sad little man.

Ally S
7 years ago

Hey Mike, how do you define “radfem”?

Lea
Lea
7 years ago

I would like some of that delicious pie.

I may actually make popcorn too.

My favorite bit was that JB must be at fault because she’s a woman.
She’ll never be able to hate other women enough to make her MRA buddies stop hating her for being one too.

Mike Buchanan
7 years ago

A key difference between radfems and MHRAs is that while feminists seek to stifle free speech, MHRAs would be happy to see live streaming of radfem conference speeches onto the internet, and I’m sure would go to some trouble to advertise the speeches to the maximum possible audience. After all, anyone with an IQ above that a goldfish would surely laugh at the nonsense radfems believe in.

Ally S
7 years ago

You didn’t define radfem. You just described a difference between MRAs and radfems.

hellkell
hellkell
7 years ago

A key difference between radfems and MHRAs is that while feminists seek to stifle free speech

You’re here and your frozen peaches are being exercised, so just stop lying, asshole.

magnesium
magnesium
7 years ago

I look forward to speaking at the event, whenever and wherever it’s held. No MHRA of my acquaintance has the SLIGHTEST concern about the integrity of Paul Elam, Dean Esmay, or any other key figures in AVfM, which is why the $25,000 fundraiser met its target in 22 hours.

So what’s your cut of that $25,000, there Mike? Whatever you all do, don’t collect any donations that might go to helping a man that isn’t yourselves. You wouldn’t want to risk it helping a man who doesn’t meet your specific standards of appropriate man-ness. Just keep coming up with new insults that attack their masculinity. That’s how I know you care so much about men’s rights.

Man, I’m in the wrong profession. I have to go to a job every day and do work. These guys are raking in 80’s televangelist cash,and all they have to do is be angry on the internet for a couple hours a month.

Mike Buchanan
7 years ago

Ally S

Radfem – an American feminist, Christina Hoff Sommers, wrote in ‘Who Stole Feminism’ (1994) of equity feminists – like herself – and gender feminists. The latter seek female supremacy and relentless advantaging over men on the grounds of gender alone – so why shouldn’t they get £20,000+ pa grants to study engineering at postgrad level? Something nobody last night on another comment stream objected to, from memory. After all it’s men who pay 72% of the income tax which finances that lifestyle option, and they can quit when they have their first kid.

To all intends and purposes gender / radical / militant feminism are the same – all female supremacist ideologies driven by misandry, and enabled in the main by male poodles.

hellkell
hellkell
7 years ago

anyone with an IQ above that a goldfish

Guess you won’t be watching.

weirwoodtreehugger
7 years ago

in a bid to censor free speech

I think you’re confused about what free speech means Mikey.

MRAs have the right to speak and hold their repulsive opinions. The rest of us have a right to disagree with you and speak out. Free speech works both ways. The Doubletree is a private business and has the right to make business decisions. They seem to have concluded that hosting a hate group is bad for business.

As an aspiring politician you should really learn what free speech actually is. You’re starting to sound like Britain’s version of Sarah Palin.

jayemgriffin
7 years ago

Dude, radfems are to feminists as squares are to rectangles. All radfems are feminists, but not all feminists are radfems. The two terms are not interchangeable. Words: they mean things.

hellkell
hellkell
7 years ago

Mikey doesn’t know what a radfem is, there’s a another shocker.

leftwingfox
7 years ago

MHRAs would be happy to see live streaming of radfem conference speeches onto the internet,

…along with the names, phone numbers, and home addresses of al the attendees.

Mike Buchanan
7 years ago

David, I do hope you are able to put up a blog post on the topic I suggested to you earlier today, concerning the strong evidence that when female representation on corporate boards is increased, financial performance declines. Anyone doubting that assertion should check out http://c4mb.org.uk.

hellkell
hellkell
7 years ago

Mikey, write your own fucking blog piece. What’s wrong, no one reads your sad blog?

jayemgriffin
7 years ago

(Also, I should note that a. I am a feminist, not a radfem; b. I do not agree with or particularly like most of the radfems I have encountered; c. that has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not they are feminists. They are feminists if they identify as such.)

leftwingfox
7 years ago

Radfem – an American feminist, Christina Hoff Sommers, wrote in ‘Who Stole Feminism’ (1994) of equity feminists – like herself – and gender feminists.

Equity feminists are like libertarian civil rights activists: as long as it’s not _government_ doing the oppression, they’re fine with it.

In my experience, they spend all their time fighting Affirmative Action and the Civil Rights act than they do fighting discrimination by private entities, which is odd, considering how important fighting private discrimination is if you believe the government is not allowed to legislate against it.

titianblue
titianblue
7 years ago

And Mikey B is publishing assfax that bear no relationship to the truth:

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/2d320562-f52d-11e2-94e9-00144feabdc0.html#axzz34LzTlXpn

Companies with more/any women on boards actually perform better.

weirwoodtreehugger
7 years ago

Not only does Mikey not know the definition of free speech, he also doesn’t know that correlation doesn’t causation. I thought men were supposed to be the ones who are good at STEMlogic. But Mikey doesn’t even know basic 101 level science.

weirwoodtreehugger
7 years ago

Correlation doesn’t equal causation I mean.

Auntie Alias
Auntie Alias
7 years ago

Soon the Rebellion will be crushed, and young Skywalker will be one of us

HA! Love it.

Ally S
7 years ago

Radfem – an American feminist, Christina Hoff Sommers, wrote in ‘Who Stole Feminism’ (1994) of equity feminists – like herself – and gender feminists. The latter seek female supremacy and relentless advantaging over men on the grounds of gender alone…

Christina Hoff Sommers’ work is hardly a reliable source for understanding the breadth of feminist ideologies, but whatever.

Her dichotomy of “equity feminism” and “gender feminism” is completely unstable and has no bearing on the reality of feminist ideologies. “Equity feminism” as she conceives it would be nothing without “gender feminism” because the whole fucking basis of feminism is the goal to eliminate gender oppression against women. Gender is a key part of all feminist discourse and to ignore it is to shoot oneself in the foot. In any case, it’s too broad of a label to be useful, especially since there is a huge amount of diversity among “gender feminists”.

sparky
sparky
7 years ago

Oh, hahaha. This schadenfreude pie is delicious!

So, what do those MRAs think is going to happen to that $29,000 they donated for extra security for the Doubletree?

And Mikey B. doesn’t know what a radical feminist is and takes his definitions from Hoff Summers. Color me surprised!

This article and thread is hilarious.

Mike Buchanan
7 years ago
Reply to  Lea

Lea, you couldn’t be more wrong, Many anti-feminist and non-feminist women (‘Honey Badgers’) active on AVfM and elsewhere are MHRAs, and male MHRAs hold them in the HIGHEST esteem. Obvious examples:

Erin Pizzey (speaker at the coming conference)
Karen Straughan (Girl WritesWhat) – ditto
Janet Bloomfield (JudgyBitch)
Alison Tieman (TyphonBlue)
Diana Davison

They’re all fiercely intelligent and independent women who don’t want the power that comes with claiming victimhood status. They want to be treated as what they are, well-adjusted women – not whiny, narcissistic, dysfunctional ones. You should check out their articles, videos etc.

Cliff Pervocracy
Cliff Pervocracy
7 years ago

Ah yes, the First Amendment to the US Constitution:

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. Also, all people have an unalienable right to a Doubletree conference room and to total freedom from criticism.

Ally S
7 years ago

Now, let’s see what makes Christina Hoff Sommers a feminist:

-Calling herself a feminist
-Claiming to adhere to a “true” version of feminism

And what makes her anti-feminist:

-Telling women who were raped by their boyfriends and then later had consensual sex with them are lying about being raped
-Engaging in the exact same intellectual dishonesty that all other anti-feminists employ in their critiques of feminist research
-Uncritically accepting both the gender binary and the sex binary, and therefore falling into nothing but essentialism when she actually does try to theorize about gender oppression
-Citing the perspectives of women who are so self-absorbed as to completely ignore the reality of female rape victims’ suffering under patriarchy in order to shame those survivors for saying they are afraid of male violence

Yep, quite a feminist we have here!

weirwoodtreehugger
7 years ago

Cliff,
Don’t forget, right wing radio hosts also have an unalienable right to corporate sponsors.

Mikey,
We already know all about your feMRAs. We also know that you only like them as long as they stay in line. The second a feMRA steps out of line she is subjected to the same vitriol and misogyny you have for other women.

hellkell
hellkell
7 years ago

Many anti-feminist and non-feminist women (‘Honey Badgers’) active on AVfM and elsewhere are MHRAs, and male MHRAs hold them in the HIGHEST esteem.

Until they say the wrong thing and get booted from the clubhouse with extreme prejudice. See: WoolyBumbleBee.

sparky
sparky
7 years ago

Mikey B. does not appear to know what the definition of words are. He seems to think JB, TyphonBlue, Erin Pizzey, and GWW are “intelligent” and not “narcissistic.”

Ally S
7 years ago

@Mike

Erin Pizzey (speaker at the coming conference)
Karen Straughan (Girl WritesWhat) – ditto
Janet Bloomfield (JudgyBitch)
Alison Tieman (TyphonBlue)
Diana Davison

They’re all fiercely intelligent and independent women who don’t want the power that comes with claiming victimhood status. They want to be treated as what they are, well-adjusted women – not whiny, narcissistic, dysfunctional ones. You should check out their articles, videos etc.

Erin Pizzey claims that women in abusive relationships like to be abused.

Karen Straughan uses shoddy evo psych research to engage in a woefully misinformed armchair diagnosis of feminists.

Janet Bloomfield is a hypocritical rape apologist.

Alison Tieman made a horrible analysis of rape statistics, which includes a citation from a study that the authors acknowledged was methodologically flawed due to small sample sizes and an understanding of statistics at which anyone with a rudimentary understanding of statistics would laugh.

Diana Davison calls women “c*nts” and has no problem doing so.

Trust me – I know enough about them.

Ally S
7 years ago

Oh, and I did watch a video by GWW, and I would have rather drank orange juice after brushing my teeth than sit though that hour-long mess of misogyny and bad science.

Lea
Lea
7 years ago

It’s almost precious how oblivious to his own stupidity Mike is.

It’s so nice to know that the US hasn’t cornered the market of ignorant bigots running for public office.

Sorry, Canada. That isn’t very nice of me, I know.

Emmy Rae
Emmy Rae
7 years ago

Very sad to find out Mikey and his pals do not hold us gender feminist women in the HIGHEST esteem. I am very impressed that there are 5 women who do receive this honor! Congrats to them.

However I will cling to my victimhood status which allows me to rule over all of the poodles of my acquaintance. I am working to extend this control to other breeds of dogs as well. Who is with me?!

Cliff Pervocracy
Cliff Pervocracy
7 years ago

I’m a non-gender feminist. I believe in the equality of all people in a totally general sense that does not acknowledge any actual current inequalities. Basically I go around saying “hey! we’re all people here!” and that’s about the end of it. Pretty good gig.

Not sure why I’m called a “feminist” though, since of course women and femininity have no special relevance to my “everyone on earth is equally equal! yay!” beliefs. I should probably fix that up.

I’m a non-gender, um, ist.

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