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Is A Voice for Men using phony death threats as an excuse to smear feminists and raise a quick $25k? Here’s what we DON’T know so far. [UPDATE: Hotel still not talking]

Adjusted for inflation, those 5 cent fears are now worth $25,000
Adjusted for inflation, those 5 cent fears are now worth $25,000

Is A Voice for Men using phony “death threats” allegedly directed at those planning to attend its upcoming “Men’s Issues” conference in Detroit, as well as upon employees and guests of the hotel where it’s scheduled to be held, as an excuse to smear feminists and raise a quick $25,000 in donations from readers and possibly even from a handful of gullible feminists?

As incredible as that sounds, that’s what some people I respect are saying. Despite AVFM’s history of lying about alleged feminist threats – you may recall John Hembling’s infamous confrontation with an imaginary mob of 20-30 feminists brandishing boxcutters – I’m not willing to go that far.

But there’s a lot about the story that makes no sense, and some big questions that need convincing answers.

1) The Doubletree Fort Shelby hotel has not confirmed that the letter Paul Elam posted on his site several days ago, and which he has now removed, actually came from them. The letter is, so far, the only evidence that there were any threats.

Hotel management needs to confirm whether or not they sent this letter to Elam.

2) Both the Detroit News and the Detroit Free Press spoke to Detroit Police spokesman Adam Madera, who told them that the police had not received any reports of death threats from the hotel. He told both papers that hotel staff had asked about hiring off-duty officers for security but hadn’t specified why.

Hotel management needs to confirm either that 1) they got death threats and didn’t report them or 2) that they got no such threats. They should also confirm whether their calls about off-duty police officers were related to the “Men’s Issues” conference.

There are a few other clues that support the “hoax” theory, though they’re far from definitive:

Several people who have allegedly contacted the hotel to ask about the threat say that the managers they spoke to knew nothing about the threats. Even if these reports are true, this may not be significant; managers may not have been told about threats related to a conference many weeks off.

The Detroit News also spoke to the owner of the hotel, and he said he was unaware of any threats. That may not be significant either; he may simply be out of the loop.

Essentially, we’re waiting for the Doubletree Fort Shelby management to answer these questions. If you look at the news coverage so far you’ll notice that the hotel staffers who can answer these questions don’t seem to be answering their phones or returning calls. I left a message for them today as well. No reply yet.

The other bits of evidence we’re waiting for? Well, the letter Elam claims he got from hotel management says that he and the other conference organizers need to send the hotel proof that they’ve hired the required number of Detroit police officers to handle security, as well as proof that they have also paid for at least $2 million in liability insurance. They have to have this done by the 6th.

In light of all the questions still swirling around, I think people are going to want to see this proof too.

It may be that the hotel comes forward and confirms that the letter was real, that the threats were real, and that indeed A Voice for Men does have to shell out $25,000 for extra security. It may even be the case that it was a feminist or a group of feminists making the threats. But we don’t know. And right now the people who do know are either not talking — or they have pretty much no credibility. Let’s hope the silence ends soon, because there’s no way the not-so-good folks at AVFM are suddenly going to turn credible overnight.

EDIT: I toned down some of the language, which I think was detracting from my main points, and added a new final paragraph.

EDIT 2:  Removed some speculation. We’ll know some of the answers soon enough; no need to speculate.

UPDATE: DOUBLETREE STATEMENT

So I’ve heard back from Atiya Frederick, the PR Manager for Embassy Suites Hotels & DoubleTree, and she’s made clear that the hotel won’t be answering specific questions about any of this just yet. Here’s what she sent me.

At this time we are confining our comments on this matter to the below statement …

Hilton Worldwide strives to operate meeting places for people from all walks of life, regardless of beliefs, race, color, national origin, religion or sexual orientation. The views of our guests do not reflect the sentiment of Hilton Worldwide. As places of public accommodation, our hotels do not discriminate against any individual or group. Our goal is to provide quality accommodations and a pleasant environment for our guests, employees and members of our community . We would like to emphasize that we strive to be an inclusive company and regret if this policy has unintentionally offended any individual or organization. 

This statement seems to be their standard response when they host a conference by a controversial group.

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weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

LBT,
I’ll start with some hot guys from GoT

Nikolaj Coster-Waldau

Pedro Pascal

Richard Madden

Enjoy!

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

Ninja’d by Lea on Pedro Pascal, but the more the merrier!

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

I like the “look for pictures of shexxy dudes” game. It is a good game. 🙂

Lea
Lea
6 years ago

http://thebicker.net/post/80924870644/woman-assaulted-after-protesting-mra-group
Anand, this is who you gave money to.
So much for not supporting violence.

pallygirl
pallygirl
6 years ago

Logic isn’t Anand’s strong point. Nor is putting up evidence to back assfacts, or even staying on topic and not shifting goalposts.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

On the plus side, I think the hot guys drove Anand away.

Athywren
Athywren
6 years ago

I take my previous comments about my limited taste in mans back. Rawr.

Robert
Robert
6 years ago

I used to play Civilization on the ‘no war ever’ setting. I suppose, by Anand’s standards, that wasn’t actually gaming. I tried to play Morrowind without combat, but that turned out to be impractical, due to game mechanics.

Myst probably doesn’t count as gaming, either.

Shorter: anyone accusing Sarkeesian of being a lying liar who lies has an unspoken (but painfully obvious) agenda.

pallygirl
pallygirl
6 years ago

Robert, I played PvP in WoW. Please give me your man card. 😛

LBT (with an open writeathon!)

RE: Robert

Myst probably doesn’t count as gaming, either.

Aw man, us and our hipster gamer friend fought through it, Riven, and Zork: Nemesis together. Gotta say, Zork: Nemesis was my favorite of the three puzzlers. In that, at least, I didn’t feel like some floating camera bubble in an untouchable world.

RE: Beautiful people! (because some of these people are too gorgeous NOT to post them)

A loyal member of the Furrinati!

Onnys Aho!

Cykeem White

Also, not a man, but my husband thinks she is really gorgeous, so here, have Elly Mayday!

Who that dapper lady?

katz
6 years ago

Female characters often wear clothing that features a boob window. Yet male characters never have a penis or butt cleavage window? Why would that be?

Did you see this beautiful Power Girl gender swap? (NSFW)

LBT (with an open writeathon!)

RE: katz

Did you see this beautiful Power Girl gender swap? (NSFW)

BWA-HAH-HA. Yup, pretty much! Only then add on a lot of whiny fans insisting that there’s a perfectly valid reason for that cock window to be there, because it symbolizes the gaping void in his soul and is a reference to Superman of the past and and and…

Seriously, I love comics, but godDAMN do the fanboys need to chill the fuck out.

katz
6 years ago

I think Anand may need to take a personal finance class if he actually looks at money and goes “I don’t know what to do with this. I guess I might as well give it to a scammer.” Does he not have a savings account?

kittehserf
6 years ago

Beautiful hot men?

Like this fellow (bonus Furrinati ftw)?

(I know, I know, but who else would you expect?)

kittehserf
6 years ago

Oh, and for LBT:

Making goo-goo eyes at you.

contrapangloss
6 years ago

Anand, I’ve given you the benefit of the doubt before. I’m disinclined to continue doing so, at this point. I have a bunch of reasons. I’ll list out just a couple, not in order of any significance.

1. You can’t keep your own bloody story straight. See, you just claimed to have a bunch of feminists and ONE guy friend who is an MRA. Earlier, you claimed to have a diverse selection of MRA friends. Which the flipping Frisbee is it?

2. You have no understanding, or are faking an understanding and pretending you are fully knowlegeable, about the US justice system in order to defend Paul Elam. The slimeball isn’t a judge, and wouldn’t have to be, in order to aquit rapists.

All it takes is one member of the jury being a sticker on “Not Guilty”. My dad was on a jury for the clearest cut assault case you could ask for. The defendent walked, because of one older lady who decided that the victim was guilty of ‘asking for it’ by having cohabitated with the defendant prior to the assault.

Paul Elam would love to be that older lady.

He advised other men to be that lady. Paul Elam is reprehensible for that, and he’s said other awful things.

YOU’VE BEEN GIVEN EVIDENCE OF THESE THINGS AND YOU STILL DEFEND HIM!

3. You don’t understand the nature of fundraising. Once they’ve reached their goal amount for security they can pocket the rest. They don’t have to use it on security. Once it’s their money, it’s their money.

4. You automatically give Paul Elam more faith than others. Even after 2. Seriously?

5. You’ve dodged every single point Sparky has tried to make and move goalposts like a pro goalpost mover.

6. You continually try to discount other people’s arguements, advice, and requests simply due to tone.

The worst vitriol can be said really, really politely.

The best advice can be given amid strings of profanity. Some of my best supervisors couldn’t go five minutes without dropping the F word.

If you haven’t, developing the ability to selectively filter out profanity in favor of understanding meaning is really, really a useful skill.

Of course, sometimes, people who use profanity really are just jerks.

Sometimes polite people are actually really, really nice.

TRY READING FOR CONTENT!

7. You’ve been advised before to just drop subjects, and you refuse. Some subjects are touchy, and hurtful, and need to be dropped.

If asked, please just quit it.

And, that’s just the beginning. Anand, I really think it’s past time for you to chill.

kittehserf
6 years ago

I think it’s time for him to be banned. He’s had his share of being exposed for the disgusting misogynist he is.

Back to hot men!

contrapangloss
6 years ago

Kittehs, the one with bonus Furrinati is my favorite. Partially because Furrinati, and partially because Mr. K just looks so happy and at peace with the kitties.

You two are lucky folks, to have each other!

Kitten picture totally beats Jean Baptiste de Lorraine’s attempt…

kittehserf
6 years ago

contrapangloss, thank ‘ee! Yes, we’re lucky people indeed.

Especially ‘cos you need a good co-worker to serve all those Furrinati properly. 😛

Okay, I lose the French Names quiz: who’s Jean Baptiste de Lorraine? I googled him and got nothin’.

kittehserf
6 years ago

Scratch that last comment, he was waaaaay down in the results. ::blush::

kittehserf
6 years ago

Ugh, yeah, JB de L made a right hash of trying to reproduce the de Champaigne portrait. What a mess.

emilygoddess
6 years ago

The problem with Anand’s pretense of neutrality is that, even if it weren’t a sophomoric attempt to look cool, he’d still be positioning himself as neutral on the question of whether or not women are human, and that’s morally indefensible.

I need some hot men:

Lee Min Ho

Chaz Bono

Ugh, it took me most of my 1/2 hr break to find those two, because the computers at work are from the stone age. So just google “Chris Hemsworth” and “Vin Diesel” and pretend I posted them.

kittehserf
6 years ago

Dammit, I wish I could remember the name if the actor a friend used to write about years ago – he was Thai, I think, but she mostly referred to him by his initials, TK or TJ. He’d be fortyish now, maybe older. Beautiful man.

kittehserf
6 years ago

Akk, not Thai at all, try Taiwanese-Japanese parents! He’s Takeshi Kaneshiro.

pallygirl
pallygirl
6 years ago

Danny Pudi, the cute guy from Community: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danny_Pudi

Misha Collins: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0172557/

Jason Momoa: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0597388/

Yun-Fat Chow: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000334/

My biggest gay man crush: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0057882/

My second biggest gay man crush: http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0272479/

pallygirl
pallygirl
6 years ago

Sorry, didn’t mean to erase the names of the gay men, they’re John Barrowman and Jesse Tyler Fergusson.

kittehserf
6 years ago

A list of hot men wouldn’t be complete without George Clooney, of course.

I read this on a forum here and LOL’d. It’s science, I tell ya!

A recent poll conducted by the Pew Research Center revealed that 18 percent of respondents described Clooney as looking “distinguished,” 11 percent found him looking “sharp,” and 3 percent found him looking “square-jawed and rugged, yet stately and reserved, as one would expect a baron or king to look.”

The poll had no statistical margin of error.

“When you think of George Clooney, the first thing you think is ‘sexy,'” said Julia Allison, editor-at-large for Star magazine. “The second thing you think is ‘hunky,’ and the third thing is ‘dishy.’ Then you think that, even if he were to get into a disfiguring accident, he would probably still come out with a face too dreamy for words. I love you, George Clooney.”

Whether viewing Clooney in a meticulously posed portrait by famed celebrity photographer Annie Leibowitz, in a candid photo toweling off his tousled hair near a pool, or in a paparazzi snapshot emerging from a grocery store, modern science remains unable to quantify just how phenomenally attractive the universally beloved Kentucky native actually is.

“The subject’s masculine yet disarmingly friendly features, from what we have been able to determine, do not appear to be constricted by the laws of physics,” said Princeton University geneticist Dr. Janet Hargrove, whose exhaustive, decade-long study of Clooney’s appearance concluded that the 46-year-old has only gotten better-looking with time. “From his modest beginnings as George Burnett, the long-haired repairman on the 1980s sitcom The Facts of Life, onward through his sexy ascent to Hollywood leading man, his facial features have defied the Second Law of Thermodynamics by being impervious to entropy.”

Hargrove continued, “Unlike most carbon-based organisms, which will, over time, succumb to the ravages of cellular decomposition and genetic degradation, Clooney, with his puppy-dog eyes and salt-and-pepper hair, has aged like a fine wine.”

Lots and lots of beautiful men on that page, btw.

Athywren
Athywren
6 years ago

Mathieu Kassovitz Today, I learned that he was in Fifth Element… which is both confusing and pretty cool. I’ve seen him try to rob Bruce Willis countless times, and never noticed it was him.
Jason Carter.
A cute kitty-cat!

pallygirl
pallygirl
6 years ago

WTF. Looks like it came straight from The Journal of Irreproducible Results or was from a Christmas issue of the BMJ which publishes articles like http://www.bmj.com/content/347/bmj.f7255

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

Out of all the unrealistic things in the Bond universe, alcohol consumption is not the one that stands out the most!

Is that for real or is it like The Onion of medical journals?

cloudiah
6 years ago

Oh golly, Viggo Mortensen — such a great Danish name. My mother grew up with dudes named Viggo and Vigge. He is a handsome fella.

pallygirl
pallygirl
6 years ago

That is a prestigious medical journal, but their Christmas issue is “special”.

Here’s another one: http://www.bmj.com/content/347/bmj.f7198

kittehserf
6 years ago

Rufus Sewell

Anthony Andrews, aka Sir Percy Blakeney, Baronet. (Remember the incredibly youthful Ian McKellen in that?)

Paul Gross and David Marciano in Due South (yes, I do think DM, or rather Ray Vecchio, is cute, big nose, receding chin, receding hair and all. Take that, MRAs.)

pallygirl
pallygirl
6 years ago
kittehserf
6 years ago

Oooh, know the ultimate science study? The survival rate of chocolates while watching George Clooney on the telly.

kittehserf
6 years ago

Hamish MacBeth! I’m in the middle of watching that for the umpteenth time. <3

He was pretty cute in The Full Monty, too – more hair.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

How did we go so long without mentioning Idris Elba? Serious lapse.
http://handson.provocateuse.com/images/photos/idris_elba_07.jpg

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

I wish I’d known sooner that Googling hot guys was such an effective way to repel trolls. It really hasn’t been a chore.

kittehserf
6 years ago

Funny, isn’t it, how just talking about stuff we like makes the trolls run away. Feeble, they are.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

I still have the men of True Blood in my arsenal for next time. *Rubs hands together greedily*

Robert
Robert
6 years ago

I can’t link (old phone, weak link-fu), but my all time man-crush has been Sananda Maitreya, a/k/a Terence Trent D’Arby. My husband has been indulgent, even when I flew* from Oakland to NYC by myself to see him in concert.

*On an airplane, I must admit.

kittehserf
6 years ago

😀

I wonder if it’d freak them out to include portraits of handsome men from the past?

It’d be an excuse for CLOTHES!!!!eleventy!!1 at any rate.

pecunium
6 years ago

Anand: Fromafar2013, She has definitely lied a lot in her videos. She introduced herself as a childhood gamer whereas in a leaked viral video she says that she hated violent games and never liked shooting games. First red flag.

So nu? Only violent/shooting games = games?

Color me shocked that you would have a narow-minded exclusionist sensibility.

i wonder who gave you the idea that all MRAs are white? I know many men of different races who identify as MRAs. Heck i even have a friend(indian) who identifies as an MRA. If you check the traffic of avfm, you can see that they have regulars from different continents. Also know two gay guys who are friends with my best friend who calls themselves MRAs.

For a non-affiliated dude you sure know a lot about the MRM and AVfM.

Could that be why you were willing to kick in and contribute to AVfM when they no longer needed the money for an unsupported allegation of death threats (which you accepted uncritically) even as you dismiss proven examples of death threats and targeted harassment of women by the MRM; and the violent rhetoric of a man who has said he would commit a crime so he could keep rapists out of prison?

Compare and contrast: Actually i have lots of friends, a few feminist female friends, normal female friends, normal guy friends, one mra guy friend

The women are female and the males are, “guys”.

Nope, he doesn’t have any tells, men and women are all the same to him, equality is his touchstone, nothing to see here move along.

Auggzilliary, i doubt our legal system would ever allow someone like pual elam to judge a rape case. I dont think we have to worry about him ever saving rapists in court.

Bullshit. He has said he would lie to get on the jury: that’s his agenda. Even if he never gets to do it… that’s what he promotes.

And that’s non-responsive. You have supported someone who advocates letting predators loose to prey on women. Yet you claim to be against violence; unless, apparently, it’s directed at women. That’s endorsing, and encouraging violence against women.

You paid him money.

Honestly, i dont support anyone.</i

Liar. You gave him money. You gave it too him even though he didn't need it. You admit you gave it to him out of solidarity for his hatred of feminism.

And you admit it: . Even if i threw that money in the dumpster, i wouldnt lose anything. If that money is used for extra security, then its cool or if it was a scam then whatever.

1: If you threw it in the dumpster it wouldn’t be supporting someone who hates women (see above, re rape). 2: It wasn’t needed for security, so it won’t go to that. 3: You admit you don’t give a shit if he took it in a scam; to use in whatever way he sees fit.

So you supported him. Full stop.

wordsp1nner
wordsp1nner
6 years ago