Well, you have to admit, he’s got chutzpah.
You may have heard that A Voice for Men is sponsoring what it calls the First International Conference on Men’s Issues later this month in Detroit, featuring such notable celebrity speakers as “internationally recognized writer, lecturer and videographer” Karen “Girl Writes What” Straughan, “former mental health professional” Paul “Boy Yells A Lot” Elam, Warren “Boys Aren’t Hurt By Incest a Lot” Farrell, and, well, a collection of other equally exciting names.
But there have been some doubts about it happening from the start. It took some time for the AVFMers to sell enough tickets to enable them to cover the costs of the event.
And now it the costs of the event are going up further: according to a letter that Elam has posted to his site, the hotel that will be hosting the conference has gotten “numerous calls and threats” of a violent nature because of the conference, and is demanding that AVFM cover the costs of additional security at the event.
So Elam has decided that feminists should pay some of these costs, in order to prove they’re “not like that.”
The death threats from feminists, in the attempt to silence these esteemed speakers, has resulted in the conference incurring tens of thousands of dollars in additional security costs.
We plan on launching a fundraiser tomorrow to address those needs, but I want to give the feminists who stand by free speech and assert decisively that these thugs do not represent what feminism is about, to have an early shot at helping us address the gender issues that impact men and boys in an open forum.
He’s even set up a special Paypal button “for feminists only.”
Excuse me?
Let’s be clear here: Death threats are bad. Other sorts of threats are bad. Harassment is bad. Shutting down talks given by people you don’t like is bad. Whoever made the threats against AVFM’s conference, feminist or not, deserves to be prosecuted.
But as someone who has never promoted violence or threats of violence or any form of harassment aimed at MRAs, and who has in fact spoken out against this on numerous occasions, I’m not actually responsible, even indirectly, for the threats against AVFM’s conference. (I haven’t even written about the conference before.) And neither is any other feminist who’s “not like that.”
Indeed, the idea that we should bankroll AVFM’s conference is a bit like asking anti-racist activists to fund a KKK rally because someone or other sent threats to the Klan.
AVFM, as I have documented rather throroughly, is a hateful organization motivated by a deeply misogynistic ideology. Its rhetoric is consistently threatening, designed to intimidate opponents into shutting up and going away. Elam himself — the master of the not-quite-legally actionable threat — once famously told one opponent that
I find you so pernicious and repugnant that the idea of fucking your shit up gives me an erection. …
Your only real hope is to keep your mouth shut and pretend AVfM and register-her.com does not exist for as long as you can. …
We are coming for you … .
It’s a group whose main form of “activism” has always been harassing individual women; indeed, the Register-Her.com sitte referenced in the above quote (currently offline and being rebuilt) was a phony “offenders registry” that posted the names and some of the personal information of AVFM’s female enemies alongside profiles of serial killers and sexual abusers. AVFM seemed to make a special point of picking vulnerable targets, often college students, evidently feeling that these women would be easier to intimidate.
AVFM has tried to destroy the lives and livelihoods of numerous other enemies, in at least one case through allegedly illegal means.
The site has also participated enthusiastically in misogynistic internet hate-orgies directed at outspoken women like Rebecca Watson and Anita Sarkeesian, women who received and who are still receiving numerous violent threats of rape and murder.
On one occasion, joining up with a hate campaign already heavily populated with white supremacists, Elam targeted a recent college grad for allegedly boasting on her blog that she’s been actively discriminating against white men in her job at the Georgetown Admissions Office. The blog was an obvious hoax and the woman in question had nothing to do with it. Even former KKK leader David Duke realized this before Elam did.
And we can’t forget that AVFM hosted a terrorist manifesto in its activism section for several years, written by Thomas Ball, a Men’s Rights Activist who hoped that his dramatic suicide – he burned himself to death on the steps of a courthouse – would inspire other MRAs to start firebombing courthouses and police stations.
So boys, we need to start burning down police stations and courthouses. … the dirty deeds are being carried out by our local police, prosecutors and judges. These are the people we pay good money to protect us and our families. And what do we get for our tax money? Collaborators who are no different than the Vichy of France or the Quislings of Norway during the Second World War. All because they go along to get along. They are an embarrassment, the whole lot of them. And they need to be held accountable. So burn them out. …
You need to flatten them, like Wile E. Coyote. They need to be taught never to replace the rule of law. BURN-THEM-OUT!
(Emphasis mine.)
AVFM finally removed the manifesto from its “activism” section shortly after the Boston Marathon bombing brought the issue of domestic terrorism back into the limelight. But the site still hosts numerous articles glorifying the author of this manifesto.
Oh, and those associated with AVFM are not above harassing their male critics as well. I get a lot of weird, creepy and threatening emails and comments. It’s rare that the senders are dumb enough to do it under their own name. But that was the case with a creepy and threatening voicemail message I received at 1:38 AM one winter night from a longtime AVFM fan and tireless poster-paster that Elam once described as a “One Man Army” and “an MRA’s MRA.”
And this is the organization that expects feminists like me to pay for its security costs?
I don’t think so.
Oh man, are they STILL trying to have the first ever AVFM conference? They’ve been working on that for how long? (And sucked up how much money?)
I just wanted to thank woodyred for their insightful contribution to the discussion.
Hmmm… Peter has told us, here and on another thread at least, to never trust anyone on the internet because you don’t know who they are or what their hidden motives might be.
Peter has also told us exactly how we’re supposed to feel about and react to PUA’s, AVfM, CoAlpha, the UCSB/IV shooter, and various threats to life and bodily integrity.
That we don’t know who Peter is or what his hidden motives might be is somehow not material when Peter is the anonymous online presence telling us what to do.
This is very sound reasoning indeed.
Also, are y’all still taking collections for the AVfM conference security fund? I just got done with some weeding in my veggie garden and the debris could surely be useful both as biomass and as soft packing materials for everyone else’s donations.
I had a sneezing fit yesterday. I think I’ve still got the tissue somewhere. Happy to donate it.
My guinea pig produces a prodigious amount of ahem, biomass. It’s low odor and excellent fertilizer! I’ll be happy to donate as much as fits in the box.
Boy, troll quality has been shabby. Posts are dumber than usual. I’m not sure why this partcular one keeps barging in to say absolutely nothing — except waiting for a chance to yell, “Rodgers was just crazy!” every once in a while.
“No, couldn’t find ableism in the dictionary so why don’t you just explain to me what it is.”
Naw, we’d never make fun of that comment. **snicker-snort** Is it coincidental that these trolls, as of late, have a lazy streak? Remember the one who kept insisting we help him get laid? This one doesn’t want to Google. Cripes, how do you trolls find porn?
And finally, in a last attempt to distance himself from Rodgers, he spouts off this ridiculous bullshit:
“You know, many of you are sounding just like Rodgers with your hypersensitivity to every trivial little thing. It’s like you’re waiting to pounce on someone if they put a period or paragraph in the wrong place.”
But my favorite part is how he attempted to call someone racist when they made fun of his fake French name.
“You’re also showing your racism by referring to me as Peter LeCrap.”
Indignant! Yes he is! Over his fake name.
But then he immediately shows his ass with the following remark, in which he reveals he’s probably one of those white guys who thinks the whole world makes too much of a big deal over civil rights.
“I guess it’s ok and fair game to defame someone with a French name but I bet you wouldn’t do it if my name was D’shawn LaCroix. You would walk on eggshells in that case.”
**shakes head, chuckles**
Weeds…a tissue…guinea pig donations…not to mention lint, purse debris, and all the other awesome stuff people have offered further up thread. We have the makings of a really nice compost pile starter. All they’ll need to do is add some more dry organic material and they’ll have lawn and garden goodness in no time. Seriously, why would we give money when we can give the gift of a greener planet?
We’re generous *and* ecologically minded! If this doesn’t prove our concern, nothing will.
The French are a race?
HAHAHAHA. Why don’t you just hold your breath for that apology?
Yes, you’ve insulted us several ways with your sexism, ableism, and racism. Thanks for asking.
I have some giant cat hair tumbleweeds and gum covered in purse lint that I can donate to the fund.
Does the Tour de France count?
It’s funny you’re accusing us of racism while you imply that only a white person could be named Peter LaCroix.
I always thought the French were the 100 meters
Oh, you!
Oooh, more donations! The bird guano will bring much-needed phosphate and potassium to the compost, and the cat hair will save the recipients from having to add too much dry matter (which is thoughtful, ’cause we know how some of those guys feel about doing constructive things).
You know what? As an extra step we should leave the box out in the sun for a few days before posting. The heat will jump-start the decomposition process and make it ready for use even sooner. Seriously, we are too good to these guys.
@leftwingfox and WhatIsThisGravitasOfWhichYouSpeak:
😀
“I…don’t even know what ableism is.”
Well, that’s not surprising.
*Threadrupt*
I don’t believe that there have been death threats. I don’t believe anything Elam says. He’s consistently demonstrated that he and reality only have a nodding acquaintance with one another. There has been a petition signed and sent to the hotel. Unless representatives of the hotel collaborate Elam’s claim of death threats, I’m going to assume that this is just one more lie on top of the pile of his lies. We already know that these folks are happy to make false rape accusations just to hinder victim’s ability to report rape. We know that when women remove their victim blaming posters, they’ll claim those women threatened them with box cutters. We know that they consider doxxing and harassment to be “activism”. This is just one more stupid, dishonest stunt from the head lying babyman of AVfM.
That’s Elam, classy as ever.
Hey halfwit, my husband’s French (like, actual real French) and all the regulars here know it – but he doesn’t get insults thrown at him for that or anything else.
That could be because he’s not a deliberately stupid, misogynist troll, of course.
Peter Lacrap (as someone with French ancestry I see nothing “racist” about this),
You pooped a post full of ignorance of the definition of legal insanity and your ignorance of mental illnesses and personality disorders in the other thread. If you haven’t read my reply to you, please do. I outline exactly why you are being stupid.
Now in this thread it appears you are ignorant of more things. Isn’t the word ableism pretty self explanatory? I knew what it was the first time I heard it.
You also don’t know what mansplain is. It is not having an opinion while being a man. It is condescendingly explaining something to a woman when she actually knows more about the topic than you.
Those of us here who are women (or have ever presented as one) have actually experienced misogyny. We know it when we see it. We know more than you.
Every regular commenter her regardless of gender is more knowledgeable about feminism, social justice issues and mental illness than you are.
Yet you speak as though you have authority or special insight. You don’t. You are just mansplaining.
^This
Peter LaCrap,
You’re boring, ignorant and rude.
We’re like a spree killer for not silently tolerating you’re bad behavior?
That has to be ban-worthy.
Go away.
I’m looking at the letter Elam posted and I’m really thinking–if the threats were that bad (“The threats have escalated to include death threats, physical violence against our staff and other guests as well as damage to the property.”)–why would the hotel agree to go through with this at all? It’s a business. It’s not honor-bound to put its staff and clientele on the line in the name of Free Speech. I’ve seen conferences lose venues for way less.
I feel a little bad saying this, because I know it comes a little close to “pix or it didn’t happen!!1!” internet detectivery, but it seems implausible to me.
Lady Mondegreen, that was my thought too, that anyone can get their hands on hotel stationary and make up a letter. It seemed pretty genuine, though. Usually people who do stuff like that betray themselves by not sounding anything like they should. Probably someone did send in a threat to the hotel. But who? In my opinion the possibilities (in order of likelihood) are they did it themselves to manufacture outrage and get out of the event, a competing men’s rights group did it, or perhaps, maybe a feminist did it.
There is no uncertainty in the minds and pens of a whole shitload of men’s rights bloggers that feminists have sent in death threats to Doubletree. If you didn’t know better you’d think they had some proof. I don’t recollect any feminist stating that the MRAs beat up that college student for sure, but these guys don’t have any compunction about stating categorically that evil feminists are sending death threats.
Some of them also seem to be mistaking a petition to Doubletree informing Doubletree about the nature of the conference and asking the hotel not to host it with TOTALITARIANISM.