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Men's Rights Activists respond to the Elliot Rodger murders with a hearty "Nothing to see here! Move along!"

nothing-to-see-here
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If anyone was hoping – against their better judgement – that Men’s Rights activists would be inspired by the tragedy in Isla Vista to reconsider any of their beliefs, or even to reflect for a moment on the many striking similarities between passages in Elliot Rodger’s book-length manifesto and comments posted every day by MRAs and others in the manosphere, well, I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but you should not keep that hope alive.

It’s not that they’re not talking about the tragedy. A look through the top 100 posts in the Men’s Rights subreddit, the largest Men’s Rights forum online, reveals that roughly a third of them, including the top stickied post, relate in some way to Elliot Rodger’s rampage and the discussions that have come up online and in the media in its aftermath.

But the message of virtually all of these posts is: “Nothing to see here! Move along!” There are numerous posts expressing outrage that anyone would see any connection between Rodger’s toxic misogyny to the Men’s Rights movement; there are others mocking and attacking the #YesAllWomen hashtag; there’s even one suggesting that Rodger, who wrote about how he longed to watch all the women of the world starve to death in concentration camps, wasn’t actually a misogynist at all.

Take a look. One post, with more than 500 upvotes, complains:

Feminists highjack what should be a Mental Health issue.
Another post makes a strikingly similar complaint:

Feminists Hijack A Mass Murder To Boost Self-Esteem
One angry MRA asks:

Why am I being compared to a mentally ill, narcissistic, racist, misogynist, sociopathic serial killer?
Another wonders:

So at this point would it be worth it to look into a Defamation suit against those trying to link MRA's with the recent tragedy?

Sorry to break it to you, fella, but that’s not how defamation suits work. If it were, all of us who call ourselves feminists would be collecting millions of dollars from the Men’s Rights subreddit for all the patently untrue things you guys say about us every day of every week.

Still others make sure that everyone knows that Rodger hated men too – not that this has actually gone unnoticed in the media or in discussions of the tragedy.

Proof that Elliot Rodger Hates Men
Finally! The MSM acknowledges that Elliot Roger hated *MEN*

And then there’s this fellow, who seems to think that Rodger only hated men, and that his big problem with women was that he loved them too much:

Elliot Rodgers the Misandrist. (self.MensRights) submitted 13 hours ago by TheWhimsicalFox In listening to Elliot's videos, and reading some of his manifesto, I almost feel as if this guy really just hated men. It seems as if he put women on a pedestal and held such an adoration for them that he could not understand how the "beasts" (among other terms)/men got to date them. This is a totally new idea for me, I haven't really thought it through for longer than a minute or two. So that's why I'm taking it here. What do you guys think?
There are, it’s true, two posts that raise the issue of what might be done to prevent tragedies like this from happening in the future. One of them takes on the issue of “virgin shaming.” (Sure, I’m against that, and against slut shaming too. Odd that roughly 100% of the virgin shaming I’ve ever heard in my life has come from MRAs and other non-fans of this blog, even though — sorry to break it to you fellows — I’ve not been a virgin since the early Reagan administration.)

Meanwhile, the other “positive” suggestion  — the stickied top post, submitted by one of the forum’s moderators — is pretty transparently intended as a PR move – and an excuse to bash feminists.

Time to get positive. What would help alienated men? (self.MensRights) submitted 20 hours ago * by nicemod - stickied post The recent tragedy in California has focused attention on troubled young men. Attempts by feminists to associate our movement with violence have met with little success, but have drawn many curious people to see what we're about. We can take advantage of this by proposing positive, male-friendly solutions to such problems. Proposals by feminists, based on the false assumption that maleness is inherently bad, will not work. What will? How could society effectively address male problems such as Loneliness Mental illness Alienation from society Virgin shaming Creep shaming Depression Demonisation What other issues need to be looked at? Please discuss.
Yep, “creep shaming.” That’s the problem! Way to cut through all the bullshit and get to the heart of the matter! The problem isn’t that some men — well, a lot of men — think and act in predatory and entitled ways towards women. The problem is that sometimes when they do, women call them “creeps.”

The problem isn’t that the world’s creepiest and most entitled man just killed 6 innocent people, the problem is “creep shaming.”

After killing his roommates and a friend of theirs, Rodger attempted to get inside a sorority so he could massacre the women inside it. But he couldn’t get anyone to let him in. Probably because, well, whoever was nearest the door thought he looked a  bit, well, creepy.

“Creep-shaming” isn’t some insidious form of discrimination against awkward men. It’s a defense mechanism that women develop to protect them against predatory men. And in the case of the Isla Vista murders, I’m guessing that the willingness of women to go with their gut sense that Rodger was a creep literally saved lives.

But the mods of the Men’s Rights subreddit would rather moan about “creep shaming.” They would prefer that women lower their defenses against men like Elliot Rodger — because it hurts their feelings to sometimes get called a “creep.”

Guys, this is why people think Elliot Rodger was an MRA.

EDIT: I added more to the conclusion because I had more to say about creep shaming.

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sparky
sparky
6 years ago

Argenti: |_| 🙂

Davis, are you actually going to respond to anything anyone’s actually said?

hellkell
hellkell
6 years ago

The hell is with this petition?

Davis: no 1 curt you’re a virgin. We care that you’re a raging misogynist who’s defending other misogynists.

Davis
Davis
6 years ago

@ treehugger.

I can be around women, and ignore them. It’s a state of mind.

pinkfluffyunicrone
6 years ago

So much love for you all right now.

Shiraz
Shiraz
6 years ago

Who the hell called you gay? Also, we love gay men here, defensive posture not necessary.

Are you homophobic?

hellkell
hellkell
6 years ago

At least Davis is aware on some level that he’s spewing stupidity.

Ken L.
Ken L.
6 years ago

@Quackers

Your right,
There are so many factor that make misogyny so much harder to not see or hear.one factor I think that makes it so is that unlike say racism where a bigot can say “I don’t like (insert ethnic group) but another ethnic group is okay.” Misogyny can not be deflected if you hate woman, you hate woman. so misogynist tend to be quite in a situation where they can be identified. Also unlike say KKK members who seem to enjoy parading around, which causes the public at large to see them and say “yeah this guys are evil”. Misogynist (other then places like AVFM) really don’t get together in large enough numbers for people to have the same reaction to them as other hate groups.

Davis
Davis
6 years ago

MRA is full of stupidity, but classifying them as terrorist group is beyond stupid.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

I am 38 years old and I never had sex. Just because a guy no longer wants to deal with women doesn’t make him gay.

Wut?

I never said you were. My point was that everyone can’t go avoiding the gender they’re attracted to do just because they’ve been hurt by members of that gender. It’s physically not possible. What about bisexual people who have been rejected by both men and women? Do they have to go live in a cabin alone in the wilderness somewhere?

You have serious reading comprehension issues.

Shiraz
Shiraz
6 years ago

Can someone remind me why AVFM is endorsing the petition again?

J.J
J.J
6 years ago

Davis, if you haven’t taken the hint and fucked off, do so now.
You’re a misogynist and an ass and you’re not even good at it. You’re just annoying.
Everyone else is right. You can’t just search private property without a warrant or even probable cause, and you can’t commit someone who isn’t, for example, openly suicidal or homicidal. So, you don’t know what you’re talking about.

Also, you assume all women act as a hivemind or something, which is ridiculous. Women don’t hate socially awkward men. Most women do, however, hate assholes. Which you are. Maybe you could try to improve yourself or actually go your own way, because no one feels like dealing with you as you are. And no one has said you’re gay, Seriously, do you listen to yourself? I’m assuming no, because anyone with an ounce of self awareness would be too ashamed to keep this up.
Go away.

Argenti Aertheri
Argenti Aertheri
6 years ago

Shiraz — call me a cynic but my guess is that when it fails they’ll use that as “proof” that the MRM isn’t a hate group.

Sparky — thanks!

“What about bisexual people who have been rejected by both men and women? Do they have to go live in a cabin alone in the wilderness somewhere?”

Does it have internet?

Ken L.
Ken L.
6 years ago

@Shiraz

It’s the old any publicity is good publicity gambit.

Davis
Davis
6 years ago

JJ is mad.

You cannot control me on this site.

Your problem is that you want to bash men and women who do not submit to feminism. You’re too scared to take your complaints directly to these MRA shit stains. You’re just as pathetic as the MRA bums.

Davis
Davis
6 years ago

Everyone has the right to shut people out of their lives.

contrapangloss
6 years ago

Hi, Davis the construction worker gun salesman! Did you jump threads?

Hi, everyone else! I’m just here for a moment. The Tardis needed to refuel, and Cardiff’s rift is being… Persnickety.

Anyone want a jelly-baby?

hookergal
hookergal
6 years ago

I’m nominating Davis for “tool of the week” for his sheer ignorance & trying to tell us he hates women but comes onto a feminist forum anyway. THE IRONY. Hahaha

hellkell
hellkell
6 years ago

Davis: Fuck off and leave. You are not original or all that bright.

There’s one person here who can control you. He wields a mean ban hammer. I’m sure you’ll meet eventually.

sparky
sparky
6 years ago

Your problem is that you want to bash men and women who do not submit to feminism.

Prove it, Davis. Quote someone who bashed men and/or non-feminist women.

BTW, you ever gonna answer my question? Do you really think black women are worse than the KKK? Is that what you were trying to say? Do you really think that black women have done more damage than the KKK? Do you know how sexist and racist that is?

hookergal
hookergal
6 years ago

The self capitulation of @Davis is also something to be marvelled at. If only my arguments were so flimsy, that they’d blow over when someone with COPD tried breathing on them.

hookergal
hookergal
6 years ago

@Davis “you cannot control me”

BAHAHAHAHA

katz
6 years ago

Davis, you avoid women at the supermarket, where they’re just going to bag your goddamn groceries, and then actively seek them out and talk to them online. Methinks you may not be acting as logically as you think you are.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

You cannot control me on this site.

Gasp! We have an internet badass on our hands!

If David comes back online and confirms you are sock, you will be banned.

Even if you are not a sock, chances are you will eventually commit a bannable offense.

We aren’t terribly afraid of you.

emilygoddess
emilygoddess
6 years ago

The deputies could looked around his apartment.

Not without probable cause, no. 4th Amendment and all that.

FYI, Elliot killed more men than women.

OMG THIS IS TOTALLY NEW INFORMATION THAT TOTALLY CANCELS OUT HIS EXPRESSLY STATED MOTIVE AND PLANS!

What’s wrong with cutting off contact with people who do not like you?

Nothing is wrong with that. What’s wrong is your belief that 3 billion people don’t like you, and basing this assumption on the fact that they happen to share a gender.

You have serious reading comprehension issues.

Well, there’s not much light in his rectum!

pinkfluffyunicrone
6 years ago

I’m getting the giggles over the unanimously supportive comments section in Roosh’s new article.

dustedeste
dustedeste
6 years ago

What’s wrong with cutting off contact with people who do not like you?

Newsflash, asshole: We don’t like you. Please do us all a favor and cut off contact with us, and go snivel somewhere we don’t have to hear you.

emilygoddess
emilygoddess
6 years ago

@Davis “you cannot control me”

BAHAHAHAHA

“You’re not my mom!” Which we actually agree with, so that works out just fine.

Even if you are not a sock, chances are you will eventually commit a bannable offense.

I’m not up on all the rules, but didn’t already do so when he called another commenter a b*tch?

Shiraz
Shiraz
6 years ago

I agree, you can shut people out of your life if you want to.

So, why are you still here? It would make sense if you fled the web site, instead of staying here accussing us of making you do things in your life — like associate with women. You want to be here and crow about shit. That’s your choice, isn’t it?
And no, we’re not like the MRA. If we were, we’d be on the Southern Poverty Law Center’s radar — like the MRA.

Davis
Davis
6 years ago

@treehugger

All I have to do is clear my browser and return.

You can’t stop me from exposing your fake concern for those shooting victims.

sparky
sparky
6 years ago

Davis:

Hey, you keep ducking my questions:

Prove it, Davis. Quote someone who bashed men and/or non-feminist women.

BTW, you ever gonna answer my question? Do you really think black women are worse than the KKK? Is that what you were trying to say? Do you really think that black women have done more damage than the KKK? Do you know how sexist and racist that is?

While your at it, also prove that our concern for the victims is fake.

Go on. I dare you.

hookergal
hookergal
6 years ago

Ohhhh. Faux threats to @treehugger being made by @Davis!

He’s a REAL BADASS. It’s obvious his social awkwardness stopped the ladiez, and not you know, his toxic personality.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

David can see your IP address and location actually.

Shiraz
Shiraz
6 years ago

“I’m not up on all the rules, but didn’t already do so when he called another commenter a b*tch?”

**raises hand** Yes, that would be me. He also talked about guns, on thread discussing a young man who used guns (and a knife) to kill men and women.

hookergal
hookergal
6 years ago

@Davis is also clearly a COMPUTER GENIUS! He knows how to clear his browser history. WATCH OUT!

::typing through tears of laughter at this badass::

J.J
J.J
6 years ago

JJ is mad.

You cannot control me on this site.

Your problem is that you want to bash men and women who do not submit to feminism. You’re too scared to take your complaints directly to these MRA shit stains. You’re just as pathetic as the MRA bums.

Feminism isn’t some sort of regime, dude, it’s people saying that women are people and deserve equal rights as people. By saying that you avoid women simply by virtue of being women, you’re saying that women can’t act as individuals and people in their own right. Even non feminist women. So, really, you’re like an MRA. Or a MGTOW, especially in the way that you don’t actually go anywhere.

And if I wanted to seep myself in misogynistic stupidity, I would go and engage them on their sites, but I would do better talking to my friend’s three month old baby. He’s probably cuter, and he’s certainly more fun.

…yeah, I’m only mad because morons like you derail a lot of the conversation to listen to themselves talk. You can say whatever you want until you get banned, but I’ve had more entertaining and in depth conversations with my dog. Has anyone’s pet done something funny today? My dog got scared by his own fart.

pinkfluffyunicrone
6 years ago

Skimmed the AVFM re the petition. Turns out, if it did reach the White House, the movement wouldn’t meet the legal definition of the word “terrorist” and they would have a giant, public laugh- which would more positive awareness to their cause.

pinkfluffyunicrone
6 years ago

Pardon the pun, but I’m feeling trigger happy on the posts tonight. I’m going to burn scented fucking candles and masturbate to take the edge off. And my cat is watching.

Shiraz
Shiraz
6 years ago

You’re Erin, right? I dunno. You’re familar, that’s for sure.

Anyway, this is total bullshit:

“While your at it, also prove that our concern for the victims is fake.”

That would be you.

Davis
Davis
6 years ago

@JJ

LOL

You got ether’d kid.

Lili Fugit
Lili Fugit
6 years ago

I don’t think any of the MRA groups that exist online could organize their way out of a wet paper bag, so terrorist is a bit of a stretch.

Most misogynists are like the vast majority of racists. Most misogynists aren’t posting all over AVFM, and most racists aren’t in the Klan. I want to attack the fundamental misogyny that exists throughout our entire culture and that allows extreme cases like Rodgers to go virtually unremarked upon until the guns come out, and that allows mainstream media to ignore his misogyny and allows other idiots to deny it, claim it was all “mental illness” and “access to guns”, and Not All Men anyway, wah. I don’t want to get sidetracked by terms like “terrorist” on top of all that. Having a scheme to attack a sorority house, even in explicit detail, doesn’t qualify as a terrorist plot. Getting fed by hateful MRA bastards in websites all over the internet isn’t being recruited into a terrorist group. Most people who are called terrorists barely meet that qualification, or don’t meet it at all, and I’m tired of hearing it bandied about by anyone. It has become meaningless.

Should MRAs maybe be considered hate groups and maybe be watched by law enforcement? I don’t know. I’m too big a fan of privacy to want to advocate for that. I also don’t think new gun laws will fix this problem, and in this instance this guy was getting state of the art help for “mental” issues and it still didn’t help, so I don’t know that advocating for mental health access is relevant to this situation. (It’s totally relevant to, you know, mental health, but that should be advocated for without someone having to shoot a bunch of people.)

And no, I don’t want the police to be able to sweep in to anyone’s house and just, what, cart them off willy nilly to a lunatic asylum? Is that what you’re claiming should happen, Davis? Because if so, we did that in this country once upon a time, and it was a death dealing nightmare to hundreds of thousands of people. There’s a reason we don’t have good mental health policy in America– when the law allowed for people to be committed against their will for just about anything, from being too Native or too black or too gay or too female or too whatever, IT WAS ABUSED, so badly, so horrifyingly, that we have never been able to figure out how to fix it.

I don’t think there’s any solution to any of these specific incidents. I think in a non-misogynistic society, this specific crime might not have happened, maybe, or if it was brewing someone would have spotted it sooner. Unfortunately this guy was just the tip of a massive internet iceberg full of men who hate women and, frankly, aren’t bothered at all that we might end up dead. If we had a non-misogynist society, at least he would have stood out.

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

He’s a REAL BADASS. It’s obvious his social awkwardness stopped the ladiez, and not you know, his toxic personality.

Of course not! It’s just that the evil wimminz are shallow and only like bad boys.

I had to type this comment twice because of cat anger consequences. Darrow wants a snack and I’m failing in my duties and decided to type instead. He thumped his large tail down on the keyboard and hit F5 so the page refreshed and I lost my comment.

IMO this makes Darrow a much bigger badass than Davis.

katz
6 years ago

For those following along at home, the reason why it’s not meaningful to say that women/UCSB/the authorities etc are at fault because they could have prevented the killings is that, even assuming that’s true, none of them were what made him want to go on the rampage in the first place (no, not even women, since lots of men get rejected by women and don’t go on murderous rampages).

Whereas the MRM or, more broadly, masculinity culture in general are both plausible sources that could have put the idea into his head in the first place, and therefore can more meaningfully be considered possible causes.

contrapangloss
6 years ago

Davis, keep refeshing the browser. You see, I deal with grief and anger by either finding more volunteer work, or being excessively silly.

Since my pager is blessedly silent, meaning no one needs my help, mocking you is quite useful, because trying to be as ridiculous as your rich construction worker gun dealer who sells only to men, is a PoC yet doesn’t mind the KKK, and avoids checkout lines with lady workers, lady dentists, and lady charities like the plague self is making me go to quite silly extremes.

I know people directly hurt. Right now, I’ve done what I can for them. Bawling my eyes out and hugging pillows only helps for so long.

You, I’m just starting with. Thanks for the silly.

Sorry, my Delorean’s alarm is going off again. I thought I told that kid no more time traveling! Where’d I put that flux capacitor?

Have to fly!

katz
6 years ago

@treehugger

All I have to do is clear my browser and return.

You can’t stop me from exposing your fake concern for those shooting victims.

Oh, honey.

That’s not how it works, and even if it was, we can easily recognize you by the way you talk. I’m afraid you can’t actually have the run of a site you don’t own.

Shiraz
Shiraz
6 years ago

Ken, Argenti, thanks for answering my question.

J.J.

“Has anyone’s pet done something funny today?”

Yeah. My cat does this thing where she pretends something is chasing her. She stops abruptly after running around, she lowers her head and her eyes dart, then she takes off like a bat outta hell. Then she does it all over again.

moldybrehd
6 years ago

Oh look, Dood troll couldn’t handle the Supernatural gossip on the other thread, lol. Probably because it *wasn’t all about him*.

Well, if we’re waiting for the Tardis to refuel (I’m assuming more wine), I’ll see if I can find enough Dark Matter (I’m not sure what’s in Vex, so Dark Matter’s a good guess, right?) for a quick trip, since some guy with a hammer broke my main ride.

cloudiah
6 years ago

Has anyone’s pet done something funny today?

Not just today, but my cats have fixated on a small ceramic bird at my mother’s house, and keep dragging it all over the place. I find it somewhere unusual every day.

It’s like a little game we’re playing.

moldybrehd
6 years ago

My cat loves chia – I mix it into my yogurt every day, and she likes to lick the bowl. Anyway, ever since I started adding it, she’s gotten incredibly cuddly. It freaks my family out, since she’s normally super paranoid and stares at everyone like they’re weird strangers who she’s never seen before.

moldybrehd
6 years ago

*whom? that? Argh, this one always confuses me.

J.J
J.J
6 years ago

There was Supernatural gossip and I missed it! Damn it!

*tries to find fanart where the three prettiest boys were cats because the idea of chasing invisible enemies cat! Dean is too cute* Thank you, Shiraz for inspiring that image in my head with your cat.

Also, what is Davis talking about? That made no sense.