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a voice for men antifeminism antifeminist women attention seeking boner rage creepy elliot rodger empathy deficit entitled babies entitlement evil sexy ladies evil women grandiosity heartiste imaginary oppression incel irony alert men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny MRA narcissism PUA PUAhate racism

Heartiste takes on an "egotistic, attention starved, solipsistic, passive aggressive, perpetually aggrieved … manlet" who somehow isn't him.

elliothate

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Well, the great minds of the manosphere have been going into overdrive trying to explain away the fact that a man who had a lot in common with them, ideology-wise, murdered six innocent people on Friday as part of a “Day of Retribution” that he had hoped would involve a lot more dead bodies, particularly of the blonde, female variety.

We had noted cultural commenter JudgyBitch (Janet Bloomfield) looking at Elliot Rodger, a man who wrote a 140-page manifesto detailing his hatred of women and girls, a manifesto that contained the following paragraph:

Women are like a plague. They don’t deserve to have any rights. Their wickedness must be contained in order prevent future generations from falling to degeneracy. Women are vicious, evil, barbaric animals, and they need to be treated as such.

.. and which ended with a fantasy of putting all the women in the world in concentration camps and starving them to death, while Rodger took a position in a giant tower built just for him “where I can oversee the entire concentration camp and gleefully watch them all die,” and suggesting that Rodger wasn’t actually a misogynist, because he wasn’t able to get into the sorority and murder all the “blonde sluts” he had hoped to murder and so ended up killing more men than women.

We had pickup guru and sometime date rapist Roosh Val looking at that same fellow, a young man who decided that all the women in the world deserved to die because no hot blondes came up and threw themselves at him while he wandered around campus talking to no one, and deciding that “game” would have saved his life and the life of his victims.

And we had Dr. Helen trying her best to insinuate that feminists were to blame for Rodger’s murders in California because a small group of feminists blocked a lecture by a Men’s Rights celebrity in Toronto and therefore prevented Rodger from getting the proper psychiatric care he needed, even though he had been seeing psychiatrists for years as well as a string of counselors in his final days.

But we still haven’t’ heard from the master of PUA purple prose, the Heartiste formerly known as Roissy. What the heck does he think about poor dead murderer Elliot Rodger?

Well, he has answered that question at last. According to Heartiste, the fallen Rodger was a repressed gay “social retard” who was also possibly a hetero incel beta male member of an omega male brothel. Plus some other stuff. I guess I should let Heartiste explain, because there’s no way to summarize his particular brand of fragrant prose poop.

First, teh gay:

Rodger pings some operational gaydars. There’s his plush gay face. There’s the “try-hard” nature of his manifesto, which reads less like a compendium of genuine pain than a B-movie script of what he’d think a guy with girl troubles would write. … And his narcissism; if you haven’t seen by now, Rodger had a stream of attention whoring pouty-lipped Facebook selfies that would make a dancing bar slut blush.

Setting aside the unproved gay hypothesis, Heartiste considers Rodger’s life as an incel – or “involuntary celibate.”

From what I can glean, Elliot Rodger failed with women because he was a social retard. That’s pretty much all there is to it. … He thought that “putting himself out there” with girls was sitting on a park bench like Aqualung. That making a serious move on a girl was quickly muttering “hi” as he stumbled past her, later delirious with rage that she didn’t reciprocate with an equally prompt blowjob. That bumping into an Asian dude talking to a cute chick, and glaring at them with his twisted angry face, was acting “cocky and arrogant”. That his effeminate passivity and lack of proactive engagement with women was evidence that they were “ignoring” him.

Actually, Heartiste sort of has a point here: Rodger seems to have literally never approached a single woman. His idea of courtship was to put on designer clothes and wander around outside, hoping that some lovely blonde gal would take a fancy to him and invite herself to be his girlfriend.

Heartiste, like Roosh, thinks that “game” could have saved Rodger, but only if he had been gotten to earlier. Alas, Heartiste notes, Rodger turned not to PUA but to the website PUAhate.

Which brings us to PUAHate … It’s not a forum for failed pickup artists as some male feminists licking the taint of their femcunt overwhores will want you to believe. It’s a hangout for socially awkward losers who desperately want to blame their failings with women on their sub-Pitt looks instead of on their awful social calibration and their inability to say two words to a girl without filling their Pokemon underoos.

Again, Heartiste is partly right. No, not that bit about the femcunt overwhores and the fellows in their underwears. That other stuff. PUAhate is indeed a cesspit. While there are some people on the site legitimately interested in exposing PUA fraud, they’re outnumbered by angry incels and misogynistic trolls.

No sense ignoring the race angle.

Oh dear. Given that Heartiste is basically a genteel Nazi and Rodger was half-white, half-Asian, this isn’t going to be pretty.

Mixed race people are more likely to have psychological disorders. And Asian men are especially susceptible to dating market lockouts. Throw in the cauldron a stew of vibrant proximate diversity and it’s a surprise suppressed racial/sexual rage doesn’t boil over more often.

Ok, that wasn’t quite as awful as I expected, though I’m pretty sure Heartiste’s reference to “vibrant proximate diversity” is basically just his way of suggesting that segregation is preferable to a society in which different ethnic groups actually come into contact with one another on a regular basis.

Heartiste decides to end by suggesting that the “effeminate” Rodger may be a sign of things to come:

The title of this post is a broad indictment of this infantile Millennial generation, which daily provides evidence that their ranks are filled with effeminate males who, like women, expect the world to cater their needs, no questions asked, no demands made. Elliot Rodger couldn’t stand how unfaaaair girls were to date uglier men than himself, how unfair life was that his car and clothes weren’t a magnet for hot white sorority chicks, how unfair the cosmic laws were to require of him a little bit of effort if he wanted to put an end to his virginity.

Egotistic, attention starved, solipsistic, passive aggressive, perpetually aggrieved, and unwilling to change when posing as a martyr feels so damn good… there’s your new American manlet, same as your new American woman.

Wait, run that first part by me again?

Egotistic, attention starved, solipsistic, passive aggressive, perpetually aggrieved, and unwilling to change when posing as a martyr feels so damn good

Heartiste has just described the typical manospehrian, to a t.

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kittehserf
6 years ago

“Grace” is a perfect concept in this context; this also articulates why the whole “sexual marketplace” metaphor is bullshit.

This. The “sexual marketplace” crap removes any idea of liking or affection or (gasp) love from the picture. I somehow doubt this unfeeling, physical-arousal-only notion has anything to do with the way most people treat sex and/or relationships. Even saying it’s dehumanising doesn’t cut it, because plenty of animals show more emotional involvement in mating than that. If anything I’d say it’s like the people pushing the idea think humans are some sort of sexbots.

kittehserf
6 years ago

(Mating in the long-term sense, I mean.)

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Please tell me that Black Linen Sheets is a Poe. This week has made me despair for humanity enough already.

suzurinrin
6 years ago

This is sort of tangential but I’ve been racking my brain, trying to figure out who Eliot Rodgers reminded me of. It’s Harold from Stephen King’s The Stand.

weirwoodtreehugger: This was my exact thought.

Also, screw that racist garbage about Asian men and mixed-race children. I just can’t even with that. I have two wonderful, well-adjusted, cute, smart, funny mixed race kids and that kind of racist BS just makes my blood boil.

These MRAs just take the fucking cake with their horribleness, don’t they? They can’t just only defend a misogynistic murderer, they have to be racist shitbags about it as well. It’s not surprising but AAAAaaaargh. OK, I’m just gonna stop now.

katz
6 years ago

But I’m really tired of people talking about millenials being spoiled and handed everything. They have some skills issues, possibly, but given the unemployment rate, the ridiculous costs of housing, medical care and the rising costs of food, not to mention their Herculean student loan debt, anyone who calls them “spoiled” because they have iPhones and take selfies is a fucking idiot.

Seconded. (Which is why I’m fond of the “Old Economy Steven” advice animal.)

steampunked (@steampunked)

Few things can make this rant weirder for me, but something I am bizarrely stuck on is the face thing, probably because most of the gay dudes I know are from the punk scene and are a bit craggy/experienced looking (like, well, everyone who has taken an affectionate mosh to the face…).

khymchanur
khymchanur
6 years ago

I recently ran across a new response (paraphrased): “Yes, Elliot Rodger said that his motive was hatred of women, but why should we believe anything murdering scum like him has to say? He could very well have been lying about his motives”

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

(Blinks)

OK, that’s it, we’ve officially proved that there’s nothing a man can do, however obviously motivated my misogyny, that some people will recognize as misogyny.

Lee
Lee
6 years ago

He wrote an entire book-length dissertation about how women are evil and should be exterminated, and people still want to believe he was somehow not a misogynist? This is getting to Holocaust-denial levels of cognitive dissonance. 😛

Ellie
6 years ago

Hey David, can you do a post about this? Scat Corney wrote it: http://www.donotlink.com/framed?38569

Ellie
6 years ago

Is it just me or is Heartiste the most goddamn awful writer ever?

Lee
Lee
6 years ago

Ellie: Complaining about feminists using the incident to “spread their agenda”, linking to other MRAs to try and support their argument, and blaming it all solely on mental illness. I think we’ve hit the trifecta. :O

Lee
Lee
6 years ago

That was in reference to your link, by the way, not Heartiste, though I wouldn’t be surprised if he’s done it several times over by now.

Lili Fugit
Lili Fugit
6 years ago

There’s no such thing as a biologically pure race. The ideas of “pure” and “race” doesn’t even make sense. It’s like stacking imaginary ideas on top of each other and hoping they somehow become science.

Also, “plush gay face” is kinda adorable. Also, I’ve seen plush gay face, and this kid didn’t have it.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants

He thought that “putting himself out there” with girls was sitting on a park bench like Aqualung.

Because nothing connects with a college-aged audience like a song reference from almost half a century ago. (Wasn’t he the one that penned that wretched racist parody of “The Wreck Of The Edmund Fitzgerald”?)

Re: plush, I’m holding out for Tickle Me Gay Face.

velveteenrabid
6 years ago

I posted my own little #yesallwomen tale earlier today. It was a story about my friend’s nephews getting into a nearly physical fight, and whipping out their junk like light sabers and setting them on the table we were playing cards at, (in front of their mother and aunt) All because they assumed I’d want either of them.

This after I’d vehemently stated I’d never, ever, EVER, because friend’s adult kids and respect and stuff.

I was seriously asked in the comments what it was that I “had” that MADE them do this.

Because, obviously, it was me that had the problem.

We really need to start teaching boys and girls that girls are not prizes and they are not the pot of gold at the end of the “I have a good job, nice car, and ain’t a douchebag” rainbow.

My faith in humanity has been sorely tested these last couple of days.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

and whipping out their junk like light sabers and setting them on the table we were playing cards at

Yep, that’s how you turn the ladies on. And also make your mom, who’s watching, so proud.

I dunno whether to scream in frustration or go all “get off my lawn, creepy kids”.

hookergal
hookergal
6 years ago

@bodycrimes – I know you where just trying to make a point, but sex workers aren’t “brainless whores” we are, at the end of the day, people. I know it is an aside, but it’s frustrating seeing so many in this thread (and previous ones) refer to sex workers as inhuman things that people just stick their dicks in. We ARE people. Let’s not continue to dehumanise sex workers. Please.

And yes, as other commentators have said, a sex worker wouldn’t of helped his sense of entitlement. Because how *dare* we commodify sex acts? Given what he has put out into the public, he wouldn’t have passed stage one of my screening process (aka: being a decent human being). Because sex workers don’t just fuck anyone. We also have standards. We are not “brainless whores”.

scott1139
scott1139
6 years ago

@velveteennrabid

Wait, your nephews just pulled out their penises and displayed them on the table where their MOTHER and you were playing cards? o_O O_o Just…what!? >_<

velveteenrabid
6 years ago

@scott1139

No. My friends, who are sisters, their sons/nephews did the whip it out thing. In front of my friends, who happened to be their mother and aunt.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

I don’t care if you’re 40, if you whip it out at the dinner table in front of your mom she should still be able to send you to your room.

frostyto
frostyto
6 years ago

Not the first time I’ve seen the “Rodger was probably gay” argument raised, actually. The CTs have eagerly jumped on that bandwagon as well. They’ve pissed me off just as much as the MRA’s really.

…You know, the Alex Jones types and their knee-jerk “It was a staged hoax/false flag” responses. I know they pretty much come standard with every mass shooting, but knowing that doesn’t make it any less aggravating.

Zolnier
Zolnier
6 years ago

If only we lived in some Dickinson world where the chronically terrible get visited by three ghosts in the night.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

In this case it would be the Ghost of Embarrassment You Should Feel.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

I want something like the penalty box in hockey, but for social infractions rather than stick fouls. Then we can make people who whip their cocks out in front of their moms go sit in there for 5 minutes and feel shame.

seranvali
6 years ago

Hookergal:

I have no idea how the sex workers on some of the threads about this incident have managed to stay remotely civil. Why the hell should you be left dealing with this this? The guy was not safe and nobody should have been having to deal with him.

scott1139
scott1139
6 years ago

No. My friends, who are sisters, their sons/nephews did the whip it out thing. In front of my friends, who happened to be their mother and aunt.

Oh, okay. I would probably just stare in shock if anyone I knew did that. >_<

weirwoodtreehugger
6 years ago

Salon did a post about the incel community and featured that guy who propositioned his own mother. He’s pooping in the comment section and it’s pretty entertaining.
http://www.salon.com/2014/05/27/inside_the_terrifying_twisted_online_world_of_involuntary_celibates/

brooked
brooked
6 years ago

That’s what we’ve been missing, creepy incest! It’s the unpleasant cherry to top our sundae of disappointing humanity.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Is anyone who’s ever read that guy’s comments or blog post going to be surprised if he goes out and does the same thing Rodgers did? I won’t be. Being part of his family must be terrifying.

kittehserf
6 years ago

I woudln’t be at all surprised, cassandrakitty. He was giving off that vibe pretty early in his short and inglorious trolling career here.

On a slightly lighter note, I liked the snarky comment on the thread I mentioned yesterday – Croatia can’t be as paternalistic as it’s painted if he’s so miserable there.

Not that any level of paternalism would suit him, given his Rodgersonian views on women. Be fucked then be murdered, or just be murdered, seems to be what he really wants for us, even if he does claim an Antz-like desire for men and women* to live separately, under separate governments.

*non-binary people don’t exist, obvs.

Kateli
Kateli
6 years ago

1. Ronan Farrow *swoons*.

2. I could understand, and might even go “aaw” att small boys fencing with their penises as light sabers. Grown ass men plonking them on the table? What. The. Fuck.

3. Parts of Elliot Rodger scare me senseless, because he sounds like a ramped up version of my ex at times. The hatred of his own perceived lack of masculinity, the grandiose self image coupled with hating oneself, the entitlement and the anger. My ex once told me that everytime he saw his ex his immediate thought was “whore, I wish you harm” (clunky translation of the Swedish phrase he used). I stayed with him for 18 months after that. Not my best or brightest idea.

Alan Boyle (@SkepticalNumber)

Re:incel guy

He’s already been in trouble for assaulting his parents, so we know he’s capable of violence against those he blames for his situation. He’s also been in trouble for wasting police time, by trying to have them charged for the damage they did by not getting him a prostitute at 14 when he was frustrated and horny. He doesn’t understand why people see him as being in the wrong for being violent, but don’t feel the same about his parents. He’s angry, hateful, and has a skewed view of the world.

In fact, I’ve seen other people elsewhere say they thought of him when they first heard about the Rodger shootings, wondering if it’s the same guy. He’s been giving off a mass murderer vibe all over the internet.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

The only reason I didn’t immediately assume that it was him was because it happened in the US, tbh. If it had been in Europe he’d have been my first thought.

Jennie
Jennie
6 years ago

Now, now, don’t anyone dare to claim this asshole was gay! He was clearly a heterosexual man who LOATHED women. I’m surprised that you mra’s aren’t touting this sick bastard a hero. He was just another small dicked, insecure, hateful kid that believed he is owed a pretty girlfriend in this patriarchal society. Poor wittle boy didn’t get what he wanted, so his response was to murder the gorgeous girls who wouldn’t let him fuck them. Plain and simple. Mra’s misogynistic websites should be under scrutiny after it was found that the little prick was lurking around on them. Whether that will happen is shaky. There are more mra’s then people think, I believe. Men in powerful positions to the scumbag bum who can’t get laid, and has no idea why. Anyways, you mra’s do not scare us feminists/ radical feminists..We will continue our work and will NOT be silenced.

kittehserf
6 years ago

I shudder to think how incelincest is looking at Rodgers. Approvingly, I imagine.

kittehserf
6 years ago

I’m surprised that you mra’s aren’t touting this sick bastard a hero.

The ones who aren’t No True Scotsmaning are touting him as a hero, with a side order of “this is what happens when women don’t put out, so be warned.”

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Presumably there will be an approving post at some point, but I’m not going to read it. Actually given the various options for IP tracking, required email addresses and so on I think it might be a better idea for women to avoid commenting on his blog in general. If there’s anyone in the greater manosphere who you really don’t want knowing where to find you, that’s the guy.

titianblue
titianblue
6 years ago

another small dicked, insecure, hateful kid

Not “small dicked”, please. Dicks come in varying sizes, and none of those sizes are wrong or indicate that their owners are murderers.

franticcaps
franticcaps
6 years ago

The dude couldn’t help his face, ffs. But “gay face” is one of Heartiste’s things — he says there’s a specific sort of “face” gay men have. Don’t ask me, I don’t get it either.

I guess when you already believe in ‘scientific’ racism and evo-psych, phrenology isn’t that much more of a stretch.

Z
Z
6 years ago

Am I wrong in thinking that Jennie above sounds suspiciously as a troll/parody? In addition to the “small dick” crap, there’s also this part:

Now, now, don’t anyone dare to claim this asshole was gay! He was clearly a heterosexual man who LOATHED women. I’m surprised that you mra’s aren’t touting this sick bastard a hero. He was just another small dicked, insecure, hateful kid that believed he is owed a pretty girlfriend in this patriarchal society. Poor wittle boy didn’t get what he wanted, so his response was to murder the gorgeous girls who wouldn’t let him fuck them. Plain and simple. Mra’s misogynistic websites should be under scrutiny after it was found that the little prick was lurking around on them. Whether that will happen is shaky. There are more mra’s then people think, I believe. Men in powerful positions to the scumbag bum who can’t get laid, and has no idea why. Anyways, you mra’s do not scare us feminists/ radical feminists..We will continue our work and will NOT be silenced.

Can David check if they have commented here before?

Z
Z
6 years ago

I guess when you already believe in ‘scientific’ racism and evo-psych, phrenology isn’t that much more of a stretch.

Technically, that would be physiognomy, not phrenology.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
6 years ago

Well, there’s an idiot for every occasion, so it’s quite possible that the universe somehow managed to spawn a “feminist” as ridiculous as Jennie, but the “I’m really a woman no really you have to agree with me because I’m a woman” combined with the MRA two-dot period does smell a bit sock-ish.

Zolnier
Zolnier
6 years ago

Ah physiognomy, a great boon to the British Empire’s PR department. Like when they “proved” that the Irish were basically black* and so therefore deserved nothing less than complete repression.

*Not to be confused with a 1960’s Australian Aboriginal theatre act turned sketch show.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants

I want something like the penalty box in hockey, but for social infractions rather than stick fouls. Then we can make people who whip their cocks out in front of their moms go sit in there for 5 minutes and feel shame.

Seconded. The stocks should also be an option, for cases like this. Special cock stocks.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants

. There are more mra’s then people think, I believe. Men in powerful positions to the scumbag bum who can’t get laid, and has no idea why.

Bullying of kid because he couldn’t get laid (not because of his toxic misogyny): check. Unsubtle praise for MRAs (not only are they legion, they’re powerful!): check. Sounds trollish to me.

“I are a Feminist…no, a Radical Feminist!”: the equivalent of wearing a Groucho Marx mustache and glasses in hopes of passing undetected.

scott1139
scott1139
6 years ago

The only reason I didn’t immediately assume that it was him was because it happened in the US, tbh. If it had been in Europe he’d have been my first thought.

Can this guy be reported to the government of whatever country he’s in? That he’s been violent before and that many people feel he’d be capable of mass murder is VERY concerning. :/

Wetherby
Wetherby
6 years ago

The only reason I didn’t immediately assume that it was him was because it happened in the US, tbh. If it had been in Europe he’d have been my first thought.

For the same reason that when I heard about the Norwegian shootings, my immediate reaction was to assume it was Eivind Berge. Whose rantings the police later took seriously enough to not only arrest him but lock him up for several days while they carried out a full investigation.

Hyena Girl
6 years ago

I apologize for posting this slightly off topic but it is relevant to the Elliot Rodger’s issue as well as MRAs making websites toxic for others. I’m a big fan of tabletop rpgs and one of my current favorites is Eclipse Phase by Transhuman Studios (TS). They’ve been having a running problem with some very toxic MRAs on their forums and so they put up this very well done statement (my apologies for TL:DR)

Regarding MRAs
There have been some heated discussions on our forums over the past few months involving several self-defined “men’s rights activists” (MRAs). We here at Posthuman have steered toward a low-key moderation policy in the past, but these discussions (among others) have prompted us to take on a more direct role. After some further deliberation, we’ve decided to just come out and make something clear.

Every single one of us at Posthuman Studios stands in support of feminism’s basic principle: treating women as people. As can be gleaned from our books, we’re a fairly left-wing group, and we don’t hide our politics or claim to be unbiased. We believe we live in a world where patriarchy and male privilege are real, ongoing problems, and equality for all people, regardless of sex, is a worthy goal.

As a group, we at Posthuman find the politics of MRAs to be toxic, offensive, and completely removed from reality. We have also found the conduct of MRAs on our forums to be far from ideal. We do not appreciate that MRAs are driving other fans away from our forums.

We want the Eclipse Phase community to be one that is inclusive of all viewpoints, but we must draw a line when there is a viewpoint that insists on attacking and offending others as an essential aspect of its existence. We are looking forward with Eclipse Phase, not back — towards the future, not the retrograde gender divisions of the past. No matter how MRAs may like to cloak their beliefs in the language of inclusiveness and equality, they support neither, and instead fulminate against the loss of privilege long afforded one half of society at the cost of another. Those who must attack the idea of another’s equality to better preserve their own benefits are not the sort we wish to encourage. They’re likely to do more harm than good in their toxic concern trolling and false equivalencies. So, we, the principles at Posthuman, are making clear our stance on the issue and the type of community to which we would like to belong.

Here’s our stance: If you self-define as an MRA, please fire yourself as an Eclipse Phase fan. We don’t want you. We want our forums to be open and inclusive, and we don’t see the point of debating with you anymore. You have other places on the internet where you can wallow in the awfulness of your male privilege.

While we will not be actively rooting you out, be forewarned that spouting offensive MRA bullshit will get you banned from our forums.

Rob, Brian, Jack & Adam
Posthuman Studios

(Note: We actually wrote this several weeks back, and were just waiting until we had finished recruiting some new moderators to post it. The recent attacks by Elliott Rodger just reinforce our stance on this matter and MRA politics.)

Retrieved from http://www.eclipsephase.com/regarding-mras

kittehserf
6 years ago

::applauds::

That’s a great message, hyenagirl, thanks for posting it!

Speaking OT things, have you seen the thread where “Erin” was having his meltdown yesterday? He tried insulting us by calling us hyenas, which a) wasn’t insulting and b) led to some info on female spotted hyenas – stuff you’d know about long since but which I’d never heard of.

I HAD NO IDEA FEMALE SPOTTED HYENAS WERE SO AWESOME