You know, maybe I’ve been unfair to these manosphere fellows. I’m always saying that they hate women. But what if they don’t really hate women? Like hate hate. What if they just don’t respect women, you know, for totally understandable non-hatey reasons that aren’t misogynistic at all?
I mean, there’s nothing misogynistic about refusing to show an entire gender any respect because of some reasons you came up with, right?
Anyway, what’s got me wondering all this is a recent stickied post on the Red Pill Subreddit, home to ALPHA DUDES who totally score with the hot women like all the time. The post, by a dude with the totally non-lady-hating name of bitchdantkillmyvibe is titled “I don’t hate women, I just don’t respect them, and unless many changes within their gender come about, I never will,” and really, I don’t think I’ve ever read a less lady-hating title than that.
So let’s hear this dude out, huh?
TRP gets regularly blasted for ‘hating’ women. TRP does not hate women, bar the vitriolic men usually new to TRP who are still overcoming their understandable bitterness and resentment.
Exactly! Red Pillers totally don’t hate women, except for the ones that do.
TRP just sees women for what they are, and the ways they behave, and treats them accordingly.
Exactly! We don’t hate women for being women, we just hate them for acting like women.
Oh, wait, we don’t hate them.
TRP does not hate women – TRP does not respect women, and they give us reason after reason not to.
There are a number of reasons I do not respect women. Again, as creatures of fun and entertainment, I love them.
Like, seriously, how can you hate something if you like to stick your penis in it, huh? PURE STEM LOGIC.
I never feel feelings of hatred towards them, more annoyance, dissappointment and, as mentioned, a severe lack of the respect they claim they so desperately want.
Yeah, bitches are always claiming to desperately want respect. What’s that about?
So anyway, bitchdantkillmyvibe goes through his list of reasons for not giving the ladies the respect they claim they so desperately want.
His list begins with all those terrible fatties who want to be treated as human beings despite being terrible fatties.
The fat acceptance movement is one of the clearest and best examples of how women completely lack any sense of agency and how they demand the most respect for the least amount of work or effort. ….
In reverse, you never see anything close to a fat acceptance movement among men, when men still face a lot of the issues about image and self esteem. Men get just as bombarded by the media about what is attractive and what isn’t, and instead of trying to rewrite the rules to our benefit, we either shape up, or don’t.
Yeah, I mean, it’s not like men are actually more likely to be overweight or obese than women or that women are actually likely to face more criticism and outright discrimination based on weight or anything. And it’s not like most diets actually fail and that dieting in the end often backfires and can cause people to gain more weight. Or that stigmatizing fat people is completely ineffective at causing them to lose weight and, yep, can also cause them to gain weight instead.
Oh wait, all of those things are true.
But bitchdantkillmyvibe is on to his next topic: child custody.
The way women embrace the broken system surrounding child custody laws is another example in women’s solipsism, and worse, their complete disregard and almost sociopathic lack of care for not only their husband/partner/lover, but the father of their child, their offspring, who without, would never have been able to grant her such a gift to begin with.
Yeah, I mean, it’s not like judges grant primary custody to the person who’s been doing the bulk of the child care and that this person is usually the mother.
In my opinion, the way women abuse child custody laws is reason enough to lack complete respect for women and is the biggest reason, personally, I will never respect their gender. Taking a father’s child away from him is one of the most horrible, disgusting, vile, vindictive, malicious and heartless things you can do to a man. I don’t care how much he may have hurt you, or how badly you want to get back at him, taking his seed away from him eclipses almost any wrongdoing he may have done to the woman.
Wait what? If the father has been, say, beating the crap out of the mother, wouldn’t it make sense to keep him away from the kids so that he won’t beat the crap out of them too?
This shows the true nature of modern women – that they only care for themselves and lack compassion almost entirely. I wouldn’t take a man’s child away from him even if he was the lowest of scum.
Uh, really? I’m pretty sure kids are a lot better off when they’re not being raised by “the lowest of scum,”particularly if this particular scum has a history of violence.
I wouldn’t wish that on my worst enemy, and for women to do that to someone they once loved and who once loved them back, and most likely supported them in a number of ways, not only dumbfounds me, but it scares me.
Hmm. I’m sort of beginning to wonder if this bitchdantkillmyvibe fellow might actually hate women. And possibly children too.
Oh, but he’s not done yet. He next takes on the specter of FEMINISM.
I’m a bit conflicted, because while the feminist movement did succeed in earning women some basic human rights that they shouldn’t have been denied, it is also largely responsible for the dismal state of the modern woman now.
After the world gave women almost everything they demanded, they still want more. …
For all this talk about ‘male privilege’, if you are born a white women with relative attractiveness, you are living life on easy mode.
Ah, yes, because all women are “white women with relative attractiveness.” And because that’s all it takes to become massively successful and powerful in the world today. That’s why 95.6% of CEOs of Fortune 500 companies are “white women with relative attractiveness.”
Oh, wait, I’m being told that 95.6% of the CEOs of Fortune 500 companies are actually men, not women. Sorry.
The feminist movement is now about the most trivial ‘rights’ being awarded to women and continuing to uphold the image that women are ‘oppressed’, when this could not be further from the truth. Women are more privileged than ever and get more pussy passes than in any point in history.
Here is a chart showing the increase in pussy passes over time.
Oops, sorry. That’s actually a chart showing the average annual output prices for potatoes in Scotland from 2003 to 2012. So in case you were wondering about that, you’re welcome!
I’m not sure where to look to find the historical data on pussy pass distribution.
The feminist movement is an example in how if you give an inch with a woman, she will take a mile. We were wrong to entertain their demands to begin with, thinking that if some of their demands were appeased, they would be content and more productive members of society. But … no matter how much more we continue to give them, they will never be sated and never feel content.
Yeah, I’m not detecting any misogyny here. Nope. None whatsoever.
And now we move onwards to rape. Well, “false rape culture.”
[F]or all the talk about ‘rape culture’, we are living in a society where women are taking more and more liberties with the law that already aggressively favors them by accusing men of rape for their own benefit.
Exactly. And there are so many benefits women get from accusing men of rape! Let’s see. They get to collect the $10,000 “rape accusation bounty” that’s placed by the government on every able-bodied adult man. And …
Wait. I’m being told there is no “rape accusation bounty” and that “you just made that up.”
Here we have another example of the vindictive, hurtful nature of women, where they only care about themselves and benefitting themselves, even at the behest of another man’s livelihood. Note, it’s not because they hate men – it’s because they hate everyone, or more appropriately, women are completely solipsistic and anyone’s wellbeing outside of their own is an afterthought.
Definitely no misogyny here at all.
This is the real reason ‘rape culture’ exists, to continue the victimisation of women and the benefits they reap by being society’s victim. They create a problem that isn’t there so they can exploit it to their own advantage. They willingly destroy men’s lives, careers and reputations, marking them permanently for the rest of their life, purely for their own gain. Men are completely disposable in a woman’s eyes, and this again is reason to not only disrespect them, but fear them.
But don’t get too sad, ladies, because, “as creatures of fun and entertainment,” he still LOVES you!
For all of men’s downfalls, nothing comes close to the manipulative, cold and psychopathic nature of women, not to mention that many of the slurs launched against men only apply to a small subset – rape is minimal and women are lucky to live in an age where the overwhelming majority of men view this as a most heinous act. …
However, the reasons I have listed here apply to an overwhelming majority of modern women …
Until these fundamental changes occur within the female gender – which I highly doubt they will – women will never be deserving of our respect and for them to demand otherwise is completely laughable.
But, ladies, remember – he still likes putting his penis in you!
Again, I do not hate women – I love women, I love fucking them, I love laughing with them, I love having fun with them, and even sometimes losing myself in the emotional rollercoaster that is their feminine nature which I am unable to experience.
Yep. “The emotional rollercoaster that is their feminine nature which I am unable to experience.” Which is located right next to “The Emotional Ragin Cajun that is their feminine nature which I am unable to experience” at “The Emotional Six Flags Great America that is their feminine nature which I am unable to experience.”
But respect them? Never. Not until these horrible rituals are called out as the disgusting, inhumane practices they are.
Ladies, he’s single! He’s horny! He loves to laugh!
Ninja-d by Howard. All hail Howard’s ninja powers.
@Ash
eh. you didn’t sound like someone who hates people with mental illnesses. But the attitude you expressed in the first comment was one I felt like I got from a lot of former psychs.
Thank you a lot for the apology. I probably jumped on you a little too hard, it’s just I’ve had terrible experiences with some psychs, including one my parents talked to who diagnosed me and recommended something (instantutionalization) without having ever met me, so it was a quite personal thing.
They aren’t aware, but I think for most of them it is a privilege denial/ willfull ignorance thing. Some of them may have mental illnesses, just cuz mentally ill people are people and are can be dicks, just like neurotypical people.
And uh…tell me if you don’t like me abreviating your name and I’ll use the full thing.
@dustedeste
Hi, sorry I got carried away with the psych thing: I was thinking about potentially doing a research paper on MRAs, but I guess I probably won’t be doing that now…
I didn’t realize I came off as so cold and analytical; my hands are shaking while I’m typing this now because I feel like I hurt a lot of feelings. I’ll try again later…. Sorry I ruined your day
If he’s anything like the majority of MRAs, he loves fucking women more when the women aren’t keen on it.
@Ash:
The important thing to remember is that behaviors and disorders are not the same thing. Someone can exhibit a behavior that is unacceptable while being neurotypical, and someone can have a disorder and not behave like an enormous asshat. Conflating the two is problematic, especially when talking about groups, rather than individuals.
If you don’t mind unsolicited recommendations, I greatly benefited from taking a course called Sociology of Mental Illness. I don’t know if they offer something similar at your school, but I found it very eyeopening, and would highly recommend it to any psych major, as it is important to understand the sociocultural implications of your course of study and intended career.
I do sometimes wonder if an enthusiastic response, in the unlikely event that an MRA were ever to encounter one, would kill their erection.
Hi, Ash. When you write a book, please don’t sound like some practitioners, who speak to us (and their clients) mentally interesting folk as from Olympus on high. I hate when practitioners do that.
My family tree is also rich with people with mood disorders. I used to be cyclothymic. Now I’m just depressed, though not so much as I was. Cheers.
@Ash
You don’t need to go away. You annoyed me, but then apologized for it and realized what you did wrong, which is something lots of people don’t do.
Dean is taunting David on Twitter for “getting emotional.” Like an elementary schoolyard bully. Yeah, if someone were publicly attacking me for defending child abuse and child porn when I’ve never ever done anything remotely of the sort I’d get angry and upset about it too.
Depositing hugs in the barrel for David.
Kind of ironic in that David is the only person involved in that conversation who I would trust to be around any kid that I was responsible for.
@Marie
I totally get that. I get a lot of pissed off reactions from friends when I tell them I want to be a psychologist because they have also had bad experiences from people who probably didn’t treat them like actual people. My aunt had a guy try to push pills on to her without listening to her concerns because he didn’t think they were as valid as his, or something, so she’s teaching me a lot as well.
Plus, reading a bunch of the MRA hate speech gets me fired up and I forget they aren’t hate spitting robots, but people with lives who probably only write this stuff when they’re in a really bad mood (I hope).
You can call me whatever you want, really. But I think it’s time for me to get back into bed….
Wow, this guy’s worldview is sickening. The lowest of scum should never have his children taken away, because of course the kids aren’t human beings deserving of safety and respect, no, they’re only objects that the man has created and thus he has the right to do anything at all to them. Eugh.
The vitriolic spew of hatred towards women is just as disgusting, though not exactly anything new. I just thought for a moment though that MRAs might not openly support the idea of child abuse. But no.
I swear that the only people that these assholes consider to be ‘human’ are adult cis white hetero men. Actually, probably not even that because if any of the adult cis white hetero men express feminist tendencies or act like decent human being, they’re branded as white knight mangina betas and have scorn heaped upon them as well.
And it’s women who have no consideration for anyone other than themselves?
Also depositing hugs for David in the barrel.
@Ash
Though I wouldn’t give the mra’s too much credit. I mean, sorry if it sounds like I’m jumping on you. I’m not trying to, I do hope you stick around.
But even if they’re in a bad mood, it doesn’t excuse their hatefullness (I know you didn’t say it does, I”m just rambling).
Is that in the same amusement park as the alpha cock carousel?
It is true that it must suck not to allow yourself to experience any emotion other than anger. Hmm, which political group wants to fix that problem for men and boys? Hint – the name starts with an F, not an M.
taking his seed away from him
I like how dude doesn’t even say ‘child.’ It’s just ‘seed,’ like by taking away a child, you’re taking away some guy’s semen. And that it’s all a damage done to the father–he doesn’t even mention the child’s feelings about it, or what’s best for them, or anything. It’s like a kid is just a favorite toy that’s being taken away.
RE: Areos
What’s funny is that most of those male CEOs are married to a woman who has the exact same lifestyle as a CEO but without the stress.
*pats you on the head* Oh sweetie. You just go and marry one of those CEOs then, and then YOU can live your sexist wet dream! Because TRUE power is being married to someone with power.
Except not. A CEO is making tons of money regardless of whether he’s married. A trophy wife only has money that he gives her. But if you actually cared about sense, you wouldn’t have spouted your horseshit in the first place.
Dumbass.
RE: Ash Serban
I’m an undergraduate psychology student and though I don’t have an official license to diagnose mental illness /yet/,
You know, when you start a sentence with THIS, you really might want to rethink armchair diagnosing anyone. That’s not an okay thing here.
@Ash:
You didn’t ruin my day at all! Like I said, it’s a thing I’ve seen a lot of, and done a bit of myself. It’s a very easy trap to fall into!
A research paper on MRAs would probably be more appropriate to a sociological, rather than psychological, analysis, though they are an interesting subject! An easy rule of thumb is that, if it involves the actions of a group, it probably belongs in the former, whereas if it’s the behaviors of individuals who would act that way on their own, it might belong in the latter. I’d argue that MRAs operate in a group-behavior kind of way, rather than there being some underlying mechanism that causes their doucheitude and subsequent grouping. Basically, I think it’s much more about socialization, in this case, than about biology.
I considered doing a study on Anonymous, but ended up doing a paper on anonymity in harshness of judging instead. Again, probably more sociological than psychological, but it’s hard to do any proper psychological studies as an undergrad, really.
(On a related note, I think that the Stanford Prison Experiment and the Milgram Experiment – both of which you should know about as being awful abuses and things that are so not ethically allowed – are more useful from a sociological than a psychological perspective. There’s definitely some overlap – there is in every field! – but soc and psych tend to be a bit… incestuous, if you will.)
As you can see, this is a topic I can easily blather on about forever, so feel free to take it where you want to go. Just keep in mind that people here can come down a bit hard when they feel that you’re being ableist or otherwise saying something problematic. If you ask me, that’s a good thing – it helps everyone learn where they might be wrong, and none of us are without problematic opinions and whatnot.
(@Everyone else: Sorry if I’m releasing the teal deer – it’s just like there’s a wee baby me in the thread!)
Mammotheers,
It’s official: We need a theme park!
…and a big Mammoth mascot!
There could be a petting zoo filled only with cats.
Aw…now I really wish this was a real thing.
Same here! I still have to stop myself from doing it. To get the temptation out of my system, I try to avoid doing it do random people and focus on fictional characters. When people at westeros.org ask if Arya or Joffrey from ASOIAF/GoT are psychopaths, I argue that the evidence actually shows PTSD and oppositional defiant disorder respectively. That way it doesn’t hurt anyone.
Marie,
I think those of us who get interested in psychology like to solve puzzles. We like to try and answer the question “why are people the way they are.” Of course, we have to remember to be sensitive and not hurt anyone by making assumptions.
It’s also tempting to explain away bad behavior and bigotry by attributing it to a sickness. If it’s a sickness, maybe it can be solved. Sadly, that’s not how humans work. Young people studying psychology can just be pretty idealistic and hopeful that the studying the brain and human behavior can fix the world’s problems. We learn that isn’t true soon enough.
Ok, big content warning here.
Sorry to hear about that David. Hope your rest is relaxing.
Unfortunately, this is not the first time I’ve heard an MRA swing a pedophile accusation at you. I wasn’t sure exactly how to broach the topic at the time though… but since it suddenly seems relevant… (Social awkwardness for the loss! woo!)
Anyway, back when Amanda Marcotte reported on the recent MRA poll at Pandagon, the MRAs swarmed the joint. One guy complained that people were demonizing MRAs, so I linked Manboobz. His instant response was “David is a pedophile”.
I demanded proof. He sent a link to one an anti-feminist site, and I took the risk to figure out what the fuck he was talking about.
What I got was… well… pretty awful, even by MRA standards. It was a massive angry screed. The “logic” was essentially Hugo Schweizer is a terrible person, women are child abusers, and therefore it would not surprise him is you did the same.
What made the site TRUELY special was the photograph of an emaciated child corpse in the middle of the page, apropos of absolutely nothing. Just pure “3 Minutes Hate” emotional appeals, with absolutely nothing like a fact or reference to back any of it up. It’s only natural that the next step is random commenter dropping it like it’s been “proven”.
By the time I got back and replied, he’d been rightfully banned and his posts devoured by discus.
I didn’t bring it up at the time, since the last thing I wanted to do was to put that in a Googlable string or give it link relevance. I figure since it’s been brought up here though, it’s not doing more harm.
I wish I could say which site it was from, but it’s long gone from my cache.
@weirdwoodtreehugger
Yeah. But I’m not a puzzle. -_-
Which, realistically, only hurts mentally ill people, and lets neortypical people off the hook.
@leftwingfox
(tw corpses)
um wow O_o That’s…disgusting.
Sorry for the downer. Have some GIF-related hilarity.
http://itswalky.tumblr.com/post/86450613352
I too am into the Mammotheer amusement park idea. We definitely need a log flume. After all, men chop wood for us while we sit around eating bonbons and going on flume rides amirite? The park also needs a gift shop that sells a wide variety of scented candles. In the carnival games section there should be a game where we throw things at targets in the shape of men in fedoras.
YES. I have obsessions and compulsions as part of my anxiety, but I don’t have OCD. So many people find this confusing.
With bonus misogyny, since accusing a man of being “emotional” (already a sexist dogwhistle) is probably just another way of calling him a mangina.
And now my irony meter is broken permanently:https://twitter.com/deanesmay/status/469514494066958337