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Vox Day: "The concept of marital rape is not merely an oxymoron, it is an attack on the institution of marriage, on the concept of objective law, and indeed, on the core foundation of human civilization itself."

Anti-rape protest in India
Anti-rape protest in India

Apparently worried that the world might forget what a thoroughly reprehensible human being he is, fantasy author and freelance bigot Vox Day (Theodore Beale) has decided to bring up the issue of marital rape again – in order to assert, as he has many times in the past, that marital rape doesn’t actually exist.

In a post yesterday on his blog Vox Populi, Beale notes with obvious pleasure that an Indian judge recently ruled that marital sex, “even if forcible, is not rape,” thus upholding a section of the Indian Penal Code that refuses to acknowledge marital rape as rape.

Beale crows:

Some of my dimmer critics have attempted to make a meal out of my factual statement: a man cannot rape his wife. But that is not only a fact, it is the explicit law in the greater part of the world, just as it is part of the English Common Law. …

The fact that some of the lawless governments in the decadent, demographically dying West presently call some forms of sex between a husband and wife “rape” does not transform marital sex into rape any more than a law that declared all vaginal intercourse to be rape would make it so.

Unfortunately for Beale, simply declaring that the world is on his side on this one does not make it so. It not simply a handful of “ lawless governments in the decadent, demographically dying West” that see marital rape for what it is. The United Nations has recognized marital rape as a human rights violation for more than two decades. And the world is coming around to this point of view.

While (as of 2011) only 52 countries had laws specifically criminalizing marital rape, many others don’t have a “marital rape” exemption to their rape laws, meaning that in more than 100 countries marital rape can be prosecuted. And that number will inevitably grow.

Here’s a map from Wikipedia showing the countries (in red) in which marital rape is illegal. The countries in black allow marital rape. In the other countries, it’s a bit more complicated. (See here for the details.)

From Wikipedia.
From Wikipedia.

But for now, at least, Beale is happy for another chance to explain the toxic “logic” behind his assertion that “marital rape” is impossible.

Anyone with a basic grasp of logic who thinks about the subject of “marital rape” for more than ten seconds will quickly realize that marriage grants consent on an ongoing basis. This has to be the case, otherwise every time one partner wakes the other up in an intimate manner or has sex with an inebriated spouse, rape has been committed.

Now, by Beale’s logic, a husband is entitled to force his wife to have sex over her screaming objections. Since “consent is ongoing,” in Beale’s version of marriage, a woman could say no or even fight back against her husband’s advances, but none of this would count as non-consent because once a woman is married there is no such thing.

But of course Beale doesn’t want to have to defend what is obviously – at least to anyone with any humanity – violent rape. So he tries instead to restrict the debate to the seemingly innocuous practice of “wake-up sex.” After all, what guy doesn’t want to be woken up with a blow job?

But even this example isn’t as persuasive as he thinks it is. Some people like to be woken up in an “intimate manner,” at least some of the time; some don’t, and you don’t get to override their desire not to be sexually manhandled in their sleep just because you’re married to them. And while drunk sex is not necessarily rape, marriage doesn’t give you the right to force sex on a partner who is intoxicated to the point of incapacity.

And for those who wish to argue that consent can be withdrawn, there is a word for withdrawing consent in a marriage. That word is “divorce”.

No, that word is “no.” There is no such thing as ongoing consent to sex. The fact that you are married to someone doesn’t give you the right to have sex with them whenever and wherever you want, whether they want to or not, any more than the fact that someone is a professional boxer gives you the right to punch them in the head any time you feel like it.

The concept of marital rape is not merely an oxymoron, it is an attack on the institution of marriage, on the concept of objective law, and indeed, on the core foundation of human civilization itself.

No, Mr. Beale, you having the right to do whatever you want to with your dick is not the basis of civilization itself. Civilization, in fact, is built in part on the repression of some of our darkest desires. Part of growing up is reconciling ourselves to the sad fact that we can’t just do whatever the hell we want to all the time; Freud described this as putting behind the “pleasure principle” of infancy and early childhood for the “reality principle” that governs the more mature mind.

Beale seems to be driven not only by a desire for instant sexual gratification, whenever and wherever he wants, but also by a certain degree of sexual insecurity. In a previous post on the subject, he wrote:

If a woman believes in the concept of marital rape, absolutely do not marry her! It would make no sense whatsoever to marry a woman who believes that being married to her grants her husband no more sexual privilege than the next unemployed musician who happens to catch her eye.

Beale seems to think that if married women are allowed to say no to their husbands, they’ll desert these poor beta schlubs en masse in favor of scruffy alphas with guitars. At the root of all his arguments against the idea of marital rape is an obvious terror of unrestricted female choice.

In a way Beale’s petulant, self-serving defenses of marital rape serve a positive function, in that they help to remind us how abhorrent the practice is and how nonsensical the “arguments” in favor of allowing it really are.

Every time he opens his mouth on the subject, he helps to strengthen the growing consensus against marital rape.

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Anand
Anand
10 years ago

Im not a troll but not that it matters to you. (you’d call me a troll anyway). I dont nessasarily approve of his actions but attacking him with offensive language when he has been nothing but calm and rational in his responses is not making you look good.

cloudiah
10 years ago

The tone troll denies he is tone trolling.

:: yawn ::

Fade
10 years ago

@anand

you are one of the many, many people who does not get that it does not matter how polite or calm he appears. we’re judging him based on the content of his words, and the actions he says he’s done.

Marie
Marie
10 years ago

@anand

‘offensive language’ lol

spoiler space, if your more concerned about him sharing information about his daughter under her real name when he well could be doing it anonamously than you are someone throwing out cuss words, you are 100% a piece of shit human being and should go hang out in a box of legos.

Marie
Marie
10 years ago

I messed that up. Trollboy is more concerned about our language than his actions, and that
s what makes him a piece of shit.

Anand
Anand
10 years ago

@marie,
Im actually concerned about both.

Marie
Marie
10 years ago

@anand

1) you sure aren’t showing it
2) your priorities are still fucked
3) why the fuck are you even here?

Anand
Anand
10 years ago

@fade,
Fair enough. But it dosent make you a much better person than he is. -_-

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

Supporting someone giving their daughter’s personal info to a hive of angry misogynists is definitely a sign that you care about her welfare. Yep, that sure is a smart thing to do.

emilygoddess
emilygoddess
10 years ago

I have only been polite and respectful.

Oh, goody! It’s time for another exciting round of “Liar or Idiot?”

And Gary, I’m sorry (ish), but it’s really hard to take your concern for your daughter seriously when you affiliate yourself with AVfM. You know the old saying, “when you lie down with dogs, you end up with fleas”?

Gary thinks that taking psychiatric meds that have no addictive qualities is addiction

Hi, Gary. I’m a recovering addict and a current user of psych meds. There’s a huge difference between addiction and simply needing a drug to be healthy. And I don’t mean that philosophically – I mean there’s a literal physiological difference. I know neurochemistry isn’t easy, and I don’t claim to understand it in the broad sense, but I learned enough to understand what my drugs and my meds were/are doing to my brain, and I bet if you tried you could learn, too.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

I’m actually in the camp that thinks that psych meds for kids are often a very bad idea, but you know what’s an even worse idea? Pointing the collective rage against women and girls of AVFM anywhere near the direction of a little girl that you claim to care about.

Anand
Anand
10 years ago

David, I get it. Consent is always mandatory for sex even within marraige and the guy mentioned in the article is obviously an idiot. But to me, the use of ‘unrestricted female choice’ borders on advocation of cheating.

emilygoddess
emilygoddess
10 years ago

Possibly illuminating experiment: copy Gary’s story except for a few details, and post it on AVfM, with the genders swapped (dad has the kid and is medicating her, mom wants help freeing her from dad’s evil clutches). See which parent AVfM rallies behind.

Unrestricted female choice, is that what it’s called by feminists?

What are you talking about, and what’s it got to do with rape?

Im actually concerned about both.

Which is why your comment to Gary was “IDK what you did but I know these bitches are wrong”.

Liar or Idiot?

But to me, the use of ‘unrestricted female choice’ borders on advocation of cheating.

Only if you;re the sort of idiot who believes women are naturally prone to cheating. Have you ever used “hypergamy” in a non-ironic manner?

Marie
Marie
10 years ago

@cassandra

I’m actually in the camp that thinks that psych meds for kids are often a very bad idea, but you know what’s an even worse idea?

Can I ask why? Or, like, upto what age? Because I got on anti depressants at 17 and they reaallllyy helped me. I might have been on meds before, if I knew about mental health stuffs more and if I didn’t have such a negative reaction rating towards them.*

*my parents had me medicated against my will when I was a kid, so any medication was like ‘nopenopenoepnopenope’

Marie
Marie
10 years ago

@emilygoddess

(dad has the kid and is medicating her, mom wants help freeing her from dad’s evil clutches).

Wait, the kid’s just with her other parent?

Now I’m, if possible, even more suspicious of Gary.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

I don’t mean people in their late teens so much as tweens and younger. I just feel like the US overmedicates in general, and that extra caution should be applied when medicating kids given how hard it is for them to give informed consent.

In other news, Anand’s poor reading comprehension isn’t actually David’s fault.

Marie
Marie
10 years ago

@cassandra

that makes sense. I don’t know enough about kids + mental health problems, so I can’t really say much.

Other than that it’s nice to talk to someone who’s not an ableist shithead about overmedicating, cuz the last person I talked to who mentioned overmedicating was like ‘everyone wants a mental illness diagnoses so they can be special snowflakes!!!eleven” and it was super unbearable.

So um, rambles. you’re just the first person I met who talked about overmedicating who wasn’t a shit.

idk am I making an sense?

Marie
Marie
10 years ago

okay, I realize that was a sample size of 2 whole people, so I obviously haven’t had this conversation that many times.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

Yeah, I get it. My main concern with medicating kids is that sometimes adults want to do it to make the kids “behave better” or because they can’t be bothered to do talk therapy. Nothing to do with the kids themselves, I’m just wary of the motives the adults around them might have for wanting them on meds.

Anand
Anand
10 years ago

@david, As someone who reads jezebel, avfm, your site and a few others both feminist and anti-feminist alike, I dont really think that avfm is inherently misogynistic but rather a mixed bag. Paul elam has always struck me as a hot headed person who says some really offensive sh*t. Of the few articles i have read there, there were some i stopped reading mid article because it was boring/offensive and then there were a few i agreed with, same with your site. This atleast is my view about the whole feminists-MRA war. (dont judge me. 🙂 )

I agree that i dont know everything about this guy and his daughter and im in no position to defend him. I just disagreed with tone of the responses.

emma
emma
10 years ago

Anand, protecting a woman’s choice to mate when she wants it and with whom she wants is a moral and humane thing to do. We are talking about the women’s right to be free from rape, within marriage as well, the right that VD and his followers glibly and inhumanely disregard

It has nothing to do with advocating cheating. Obviously other moral and humane considerations play a role in a voluntarily committed relationship, and those make cheating unacceptable.

emilygoddess
emilygoddess
10 years ago

How about posting some of these totally-not-misogynistic articles from AVfM? I’m expecting this to go the way of the “Moderate MRA Challenge”, but I might be surprised…

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

I love it when they’re all “OK, so I admit that I’m lacking vital information, but here is my opinion that you should all make sure to act on anyway”.

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