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James Taranto of the WSJ: Drunk women who are raped may be as guilty as their rapists

James Taranto, saying something annoying
James Taranto, saying something terrible

Wall Street Journal columnist James Taranto is probably the closest thing to an authentic Men’s Rights Activist there is operating in the mainstream media today, by which I mean he regularly puts forth “arguments” on gender issues that are breathtaking in their backwardness.

His latest, er, contribution to the gender debate? A column in which he suggested that drunk women who are raped on college campuses by drunk men are as guilty as their rapists. No, really. Here’s his argument, such as it is:

If two drunk drivers are in a collision, one doesn’t determine fault on the basis of demographic details such as each driver’s sex. But when two drunken college students “collide,” the male one is almost always presumed to be at fault. His diminished capacity owing to alcohol is not a mitigating factor, but her diminished capacity is an aggravating factor for him.

Huh. I’m pretty sure we determine the victim of a rape not on demographics but based on WHICH PERSON RAPED THE OTHER PERSON. Much in the way we would charge a drunken person who shot another drunken person with shooting that person, rather than simply throwing up our hands and saying, well, they were both drunk, so no harm no foul, right?

For a longer take on the issue, check out this piece over on Media Matters.

Media Matters has also assembled a nice, and mercifully rather brief, media montage of some of Taranto’s other pronouncements on gender issues. See if you can make it to the end without pulling out all of your hair.

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kittehserf
10 years ago

Nynaeve, thank you for telling us! I was wondering where lana was. That’s so horrible … will definitely be praying for her.

Skye
Skye
10 years ago

Nynaeve, I’ll definitely add her to my prayers. Nthing the please keep us informed & the best wishes for her recovery that others have said

Bina
Bina
10 years ago

OMG, I wondered where Lana was. Definitely keeping her in my thoughts!

Kiwi girl
Kiwi girl
10 years ago

I hope she gets better soon. Thanks for posting here with the information.

Buttercup Q. Skullpants

Nynaeve – sending best wishes for Lana’s recovery.

“…and that women aren’t equal to men because some of them have ovaries that must be “punctured” to procreate.”

So what? Some men have testicles that must be “punctured” in order to procreate. TESE (Testicular Sperm Extraction) involves needles. It’s a common fertility procedure for men who don’t have sperm in their ejaculate.

I don’t even understand what his argument is supposed to mean. Other than that he apparently had to puncture his own ass to extract it.

fromafar2013
fromafar2013
10 years ago

@ Nynaeve

“We’re looking in to some sort of donation program to help with medical expenses. I’ll let you all know the details of that once we figure it out.”

Definitely do. I’ll be sure to set something aside from my pay tomorrow just in case. I hope she gets better.

Sam
Sam
10 years ago

Way to join the chorus of untruths Dave. You know as well as I do what that man said. He said that when a man and woman have sex willingly while both are sloppy drunk, then based on the feminist definition of consent, BOTH participants raped each other. But we know that only one of the two is really succeptable to being accused of rape based on a blatant gender double standard. Drunk women are not held responsible for their sexual behavior. Drunk men are.

Marie
Marie
10 years ago

@Sam

That’s cute. Fuck off. The grownups are talking.

Myoo
Myoo
10 years ago

I hope Lana gets well.

fromafar2013
fromafar2013
10 years ago

@ sam

When two people have sex willingly, consent has been given. That’s what willingly means. I have drunk sex with my boyfriend all the time (okay, more like half the time, but often, regardless), but we have both consented ahead of time. Why is that so hard? (Hint: It isn’t).

Sam
Sam
10 years ago

So Fromafar, when a man and woman have sex while sloppy drunk, and neither consented ahead of time, did a rape occur and if so, which one was raped?

sparky
sparky
10 years ago

Sam, you fucking twit, if neither party wanted to have sex, then why would they?

Bostonian
Bostonian
10 years ago

Oh for fucks sake, like that scenario has never been proposed before!
People still have the right to refuse sex even when they are drinking!

LBT
LBT
10 years ago

RE: Buttercup Q. Skullpants

TESE (Testicular Sperm Extraction) involves needles.

…*makes small squeaking noise and crosses legs*

RE: Sam

He said that when a man and woman have sex willingly while both are sloppy drunk, then based on the feminist definition of consent, BOTH participants raped each other.

*sigh* Dude, I already talked about this bullshit. Leatapp already talked about this bullshit. Come ON, we’re still in the first page of comments, at least PRETEND you’re paying attention.

So Fromafar, when a man and woman have sex while sloppy drunk, and neither consented ahead of time, did a rape occur and if so, which one was raped?

DUDE. READ THE FUCKING COMMENTS. We already talked about this bullshit and the myths. Stop pretending you know everything and fucking READ.

LBT
LBT
10 years ago

Please note that Sam is doing THE EXACT FUCKING THING I fucking talked about earlier in the fucking comments. Kicking up dust and completely misinterpreting what we were talking about and completely ignoring leatapp’s story about a male friend being raped by a woman who got him drunk with the purpose of raping him.

In other words, Sam is being a stellar example of the usual bullshit today! God job, Sam, for kindly coming up and being an example! Now please shut up and go away.

kittehserf
10 years ago

So, Sam, why is it so important to you to confuse the simple matter of consent? Why are you doing the “But is this rape? Or is this?” thing?

Skeletons and closets, perchance?

Sam
Sam
10 years ago

Sparky, maybe they had sex because they were drunk? I mean, if a woman had sex with a man while drunk, and cried rape after sobering up, would you ask her why she would have sex if she didn’t want to? And Bostonian, we are not talking about someone refusing to have sex. We are talking about someone crying rape the next day.

LBT
LBT
10 years ago

Uuuugh, I hope Sam isn’t a rape survivor and trying to deflect shit by claiming it’s feminism’s fault. I get why people do it, I used to do it, but when you start splashing it on other people, so not okay.

LBT
LBT
10 years ago

RE: Sam

cried rape after sobering up,

Yes, because this happens ALL THE TIME.

Dude, I’m going to keep jabbing you until you fucking respond to my comments. I’m a man, I’m a rape survivor, I’m the one who actually has personal experience with the shit you’re talking about. Stop pretending I’m not here.

Bostonian
Bostonian
10 years ago

So you are falsely accusing women of “crying rape”. Good lord you suck as a human being.

Kiwi girl
Kiwi girl
10 years ago

The scenario that always enters my head with these stupid strawperson “awww it’s hard to get/prove consent” is:

It’s really hard to prove consent when you’ve fucking *waited* until the female is so wasted that she isn’t capable of giving consent. Because there’s an element of forward planning there on behalf of the rapist, which isn’t present when both parties are having fun together through the night and one thing leads to another.

This is fucking opportunistic predatory behaviour.

So this bit:

Matt Martel [was on] a taxi ride home with a friend and a very drunk woman they’d met at a UMass party. “The two of them were touching, cuddling, it was obvious she was down for whatever,” says Mr. Martel, a junior. “She’d lost her inhibitions to the point that it really seemed like a good idea for her to go home with this guy she hardly knew.”

Mr. Martel got between them to take her back to her dorm. “I said, ‘Dude, come on, she’s hammered,’ ” he recalls. His friend was angry.

The friend was sober enough to get “angry” when his attempt to rape this woman was prevented. Why didn’t the friend just give the woman his phone number so they could hook up at a later time when she was sober? Possible answers:
A. he preferred her so drunk he could have more control in the sexual situation and thought he could get her to do stuff she wouldn’t do when not drunk (aka only has sex with women who are drunk/otherwise incapacitated)
B. he believed she wouldn’t be interested in him when she wasn’t drunk.

If there’s mutual sexual attraction there, another night/day isn’t going to make that go away. The scenario suggests that mutual sexual attraction couldn’t be assumed.

LBT
LBT
10 years ago

RE: Bostonian

Of course, but it’s not like we FEMINISTS would care about a MAN who got raped this way! It’s not like leatapp discussed this already.

This guy is stupid. I mean really, REALLY, denser-than-iron-in-the-heart-of-a-star stupid. And he thinks he’s so clever, which is just sad.

kittehserf
10 years ago

would you ask her why she would have sex if she didn’t want to?

So you’re claiming you don’t actually know what rape is, are you? You’re both gross and grossly stupid.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
10 years ago

Sam, could you maybe aim for a bit more variety in your victim-blaming? Try to find a word to pair with rape that isn’t a variation on “cry”.

Or just stop being a shithead, that would work too.

LBT
LBT
10 years ago

Sam, please reassure me that you’re a child. If you’ve over thirty and believe this, I’m going to have to go into my Corner of Shame and weep for humanity.

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