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The “Tell Her Her Soul Is Dog Sh*t” dude declares that I’m a “misogyny pimp.”

If Jason Gregory were this adorable, it would be hard to stay mad at him
If Jason Gregory were this adorable kitty, it would be hard to stay mad at him

Hey, everybody!

So you remember that post a couple of days ago, that one in which I quoted Jason Gregory’s most peculiar dating advice for angry men? You know, the one in which he suggested that men rebuff women who are interested in them with a long and rather nasty assortment of misogynistic insults? You know, like these:

Tell her that she isn’t interesting, that her soul is dog-shit and that she has nothing to offer other than boobs and booty, that she is a piece of shit and a total failure as a human being, that you don’t find her attractive and that she isn’t even good enough to be a cum-bucket.

And he went on like that for several more sentences. You can read the whole quote in my original piece, or in his original post on A Voice for Men.

Well, it turns out I totally misinterpreted Jason Gregory’s post, according to an unbiased and neutral outside observer named Jason Gregory, no relation to the original Jason Gregory, who’s written a post about it on his blog.

Hold on, I’m being told that this second Jason Gregory is in fact also the first Jason Gregory.

Anyway, according to Jason Gregory, even though Jason Gregory did explicitly tell men to “tell her … that her soul is dog-shit” he didn’t really mean to tell men to “tell her … that her soul is dog-shit.”

No, he only hypothetically meant this. He was just trying to suggest was how mean the ladies are when they turn down men.

What he was really trying to express, he now says, was that

men need to learn self-respect and to value their selves in totality—including the importance of valuing their sexuality.

Pretty weird how that came out in the original post as

Tell her that she isn’t interesting, that her soul is dog-shit and that she has nothing to offer other than boobs and booty, that she is a piece of shit and a total failure as a human being, that you don’t find her attractive and that she isn’t even good enough to be a cum-bucket.

But, he insists, his aim was really quite noble. As he explains now, he wasn’t just trying to stand up for the dignity of men — he was trying to protect women from having their inboxes filled with dick-pics.

I wrote that men should stop giving away cock like it’s worthless. Perhaps if men valued their sexuality, they’d be less inclined to inundate women with emails, messages, and pick-up lines. Perhaps if men actually valued their sexuality, the ladies at Jezebel wouldn’t be so inclined to complain about all the free-cock oppression. Perhaps if men actually valued their sexuality, men wouldn’t degrade themselves by harassing, begging, and inundating women with dick pics and pleas for their attention and affection.

Indeed, he went on to argue, it was not he who was the real misogynist, but me. J’Accuse!

This might seem a hard case to make, what with the whole “tell her … her soul is dog-shit” bit and numerous other remarks in his original post, like, for example, his description of women who actually enjoy sex:

You may be able to find a few coked-up girls who really get into it—the kind of girls who end up with sweaty hair, mascara, and cum dripping down their cheeks, but those girls usually have emotional disorders and are simply trying to bury their emotional problems in various sorts of drug induced escapes.

And who can forget his suggestion that men make their dates “pay for a juicy sirloin to replace all the jizzed-out protein” they cause to be jizzed out?

But apparently I am the true misogynist because I ran my post making fun of him during my pledge drive. Which makes me a “misogyny pimp.”

This is where the mocking of misogyny becomes misogyny. He doesn’t care about the women who bother to read his blog. Though he may have a few days in which he invites women and other commenters to share and cry about their troubles, any good pimp knows the importance of faking like he cares. Any good pimp knows how to manipulate the emotions of “his bitches.” …

[H]e doesn’t care about why men are sending dick pics and bombarding women with emails and messages through online dating services. He’s not looking for solutions to these problems. He’s not saying that men who do such things may lack self-respect because the value of male sexuality is often viewed as less-than-worthless in our culture.

Wait, what? I don’t care enough about men who harass women so I’m a misogynist?

Exploiting women is a form of misogyny … In this way, Boobz has more in common with an abusive pimp than he has with any heroic slayer of misogyny. Boobz is the misogyny that he mocks. Boobz is a misogyny-pimp.

QED, I guess. Apparently quoting misogynists, mocking misogynists, discussing misogyny, taking notice of misogyny in any way … makes one a misogynist. At least according to a guy who apparently thinks that the only women who really “get into” sex are “coked-up girls” with “emotional disorders” and “cum dripping down their cheeks.”

You’ll notice that last line in Jason’s quote links to a video; that link is from him. It’s a clip from the film Bad Santa. As Jason makes a point of mentioning several times, that’s where he got the “your soul is dog shit” line.

But if you watch the clip you’ll notice one thing about that line, in its original context in the film — it’s not surrounded by a paragraph full of vile misogynistic abuse. Nope, that stuff is all Jason Gregory.

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kittehserf
7 years ago

I wonder, are these oh-so-sads harassers treating other men this way? Or would they never dream of doing that? No, of course not, because other men are people, not fuckthings. Funny how selective this inability to behave like a decent human being is for these pooooor sad anxious fellows.

Kiwi girl
Kiwi girl
7 years ago

I *know*, it’s almost like they’re situationally aware and able to consciously choose when to exhibit the behaviour.

kittehserf
7 years ago

Oooh, you have a nasty cynical mind, Kiwi girl! 😉

kittehserf
7 years ago

OT I just remembered an ad outside a travel agency I saw Friday:

US: too damn cold

Here: too damn hot

New Zealand: perfect

Sounded good to me. 🙂

Kiwi girl
Kiwi girl
7 years ago

Being female, having a nasty cynical mind is my birthright. 🙂 I would worry about being selectively quote-mined on r/rmr or whateveritis, but given the inability of MRAs to understand plain English, anything any of us write has the possibility of being incorrectly quote-mined anyway.

Kiwi girl
Kiwi girl
7 years ago

It’s 25C where I am, but I have a cold so I’m in warm clothing and fleecey slippers.

saintnick86
saintnick86
7 years ago

@LBT:

Much to my shame, I admit that I really enjoy Rorschach. But that’s because anyone that driven and stubborn gets my attention, even if I never, ever want to have a beer with them or talk to them. (And yes, I get that the only reason Rorschach was that driven was because that dude had serious issues. But hey, so do I.)

No need to be ashamed – he’s one of my favorite characters, next to The Comedian. It’s because they’re just very interesting people and their personal flaws are part of that.

I’m just bothered when people think he’s a good role model or something (mostly due to the movie adaptation) – ’cause he is anything but. It was kind of the point to the story, that real-life superheroes would be way more psychologically damaged or unhinged than in most comics.

Marie
Marie
7 years ago

@Kiwi

Do the women on these dating sites sit around waiting for guys to contact them, or do they contact the guys too? In BB’s comments, the only people granted agency are the males – I find that weird.

Not the best person to speak on this, since I don’t do dating sites too often, but I’ve been contacted by women on dating sites. (ok, I’m a woman too, so I guess someone’s got to message somebody, but it’s still proof that women do it.)

@Auggz

Hope you and your friend are okay. Her ex sounds like a total douche 🙁

Kinda random question, but what’s up with Buttboy? I’ve only seen him much in this thread and he seems pretty troll-y :/

CassandraSays
7 years ago

Is the thisiswhyyou’resingle blog/Tumblr/whatever it is still around? Because if so all of buttboy’s theories about how hooking up works should be on there.

I’m particularly fond of the theory that the content of the initial message doesn’t matter. Yep, I’m definitely going to write back to a dude who opens with “Wassup? Wanna come over later? PS Great tits!” as long as he has decent pics.

(I feel like a discussion about the idea of necessary but not sufficient conditions would be way over his head.)

pecunium
7 years ago

Maybe it’s just a quirk of mine, but I always want to look for a more complicated reason for bad behavior than “they’re a dirt bag.” Even if the ARE a dirty bag.

It’s not as if I am against nuance, or looking into motivation, but at the end of the day (to come back to the conversation on Kant) they are using women as an means to their end.

Lets say buttboy is right, and this is about rejection. These douchebros figure women will reject them. Rather than say, “what is it about my presentation which is alienating these women” they say, “I’ll teach her to refuse me. I won’t let her. She can’t reject me, I will force my sexual nature on her”, and then they send the dick pics.

They are denying the women they target their agency. Those women don’t get to say, “yes, I want to see your penis”, they don’t get to say, “no, I don’t want to see your penis,”, instead these assholes decide their desire to impose their penis on them is more important than anything else.

Which is a dick move.

Argenti Aertheri
7 years ago

“Which is a dick move.”

Literally!

Marie — he’s a troll. And an asshole.

Hey Falconer, my mother wants to see hose twin pics and I can’t find them, care to repost your wee ones? Thanks!

LBT
LBT
7 years ago

RE: kittehserf

US: too damn cold

SOMEBODY’s never been to Florida! *laughs* Seriously, I’m from Texas originally, and I’m pretty sure it’s comparable to chunks of Australia.

RE: saintnick86

he’s one of my favorite characters, next to The Comedian.

See, that’s funny, because I LOATHE the Comedian. Like, everything about the character just makes my brain screech like an ambulance siren and go fleeing into the night! Dude freakin’ SCARES me.

And yeah, nooooo, Rorschach is not a role model, ever. Noooo. I can only like him BECAUSE the story makes it clear he’s wrong, that he comes to a bad end and pretty much brings horrible things on himself.

kittehserf
7 years ago

LOL the sign was offering flight deals to NZ, I think; it was talking about the weather here and in the US right now, not as a general thing. Feck, no way would I want to be in most of the US during your summers. Worse’n here, being inland. Besides, I’d miss our winter, and I like winter.

saintnick86
saintnick86
7 years ago

See, that’s funny, because I LOATHE the Comedian. Like, everything about the character just makes my brain screech like an ambulance siren and go fleeing into the night! Dude freakin’ SCARES me.

I don’t like him – in that he’s an appealing person – either, but who he is and what he represents in the story is what makes him interesting. For me, a character doesn’t necessarily need to be likable as long as they are at least intriguing as a person.

And yeah, nooooo, Rorschach is not a role model, ever. Noooo. I can only like him BECAUSE the story makes it clear he’s wrong, that he comes to a bad end and pretty much brings horrible things on himself.

Right, you understand the story and appreciate his place in it as intended. With MRAs – in relation to this guy using the “your soul is dog-shit” line from Bad Santa – it seems like they couldn’t understand the story or the storyteller’s intent, thus the need to invent and attach a message that coincides with their viewpoint. It shows an inability to relate to others on one level and critical analysis on another.

buttboy69
buttboy69
7 years ago

Well, you’ve all clearly made up your hivemind, but I’d like to point out that Gregory was not, in fact, just talking about dick pics. Here’s what he wrote:

I doubt that it is unusual at all for a woman to get 300 messages in her inbox from men who are desperate for female affection, approval, and sex. There is no doubt in my mind that men send “dick-pics” and clamor, bother, and sometimes harass women for their affections and attentions.

His point was that men are so often rejected and ignored that they become desperate for attention from women and will spam them with noise. One especially unpleasant manifestation of this desperation is the dick-pic, or harassing behavior.

Minus all the huffing and puffing in the paragraphs before and after, I agree with him.

Kiwi girl
Kiwi girl
7 years ago

His point was that men are so often rejected and ignored that they become desperate for attention from women and will spam them with noise. One especially unpleasant manifestation of this desperation is the dick-pic, or harassing behavior.

You’re continuing to excuse this behaviour. Fuck off.

Marie
Marie
7 years ago

@buttboy

Well, you’ve all clearly made up your hivemind,

Gotta love trolls. Hint: if so many people find you repulsive, the problem is you, not the imaginary feminist hivemind.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
7 years ago

But Marie, it’s so much more comforting for dudebro to tell himself that everyone else has a problem. Taking that away from him is misandry.

Ally S
7 years ago

Here’s the thing: even if it is the case that they’re mainly harassing women out of some “defensive” measure (which is demonstrably false), that doesn’t change the fact that their actions effectively mean “I’m hateful towards women, so to make myself feel better I’ll harass any woman I’m interested in so that she never is able to hurt my feelings by rejecting me.”

Kiwi girl
Kiwi girl
7 years ago

@Ally: yes, this sort of logic is: I hit my thumb with a hammer, so now I will saw off my leg to forget about the pain in my hand.

cassandrakitty
cassandrakitty
7 years ago

Also, women react poorly when I talk to them in an abusive way, so that proves that I was right to want to talk to them in an abusive way. It’s a perfect intellectual loop.

Kiwi girl
Kiwi girl
7 years ago

The only emotion I know of that can trigger so much hate* for so little reason is fear. The more extreme the comments, the more they fear females. It’s obvious, and bizarre.

*hate and anger are caused by other emotions.

Argenti Aertheri
7 years ago

Auggz — I’d put a single message consisting of just “hello” or similar as a really lazy option A — your odds of a reply suck, but one contentless message is just boring, not harassment (certainly not the level of “hey I don’t know you at all but here’s my dick!”)

pecunium
7 years ago

buttboy: Minus all the huffing and puffing in the paragraphs before and after, I agree with him.

I’ve yet to see you disagree with him. You went on about how women don’t actually get spammed with abusive come ons when they use dating sites. You’ve said men send dick pics so they have an excuse for rejection (without addressing the madonna/whore standard they will apply if someone does respond to a dick pic, see the Omegle thread where some dude wants, “non-sluts” to bare their breasts for him; because he’s so depressed typing, “tits” into google images won’t do it for him”), and you pretend that self-defeating behavior is justification for being an asshole.

All while pretending you have answered any of the actual points raised.

You are fundamentally dishonest, to the point you have to resort to, “hivemind” because the preponderance of testimony and evidence makes actual refutation of the problems exposed in your work all but impossible.

I say all but because it’s just; but only just, possible your “experiment” did match the one you dismissed out of hand, and you might decide to give us the account name and password so we can examine it. That, of course, is predicate on a few things being true. 1: You actually did such an experiment. 2: You followed the description of the original closely enough to have a significant expectation of similarity in response, 3: If you performed such an experiment that you weren’t lying about the contents of the inbox.

The odds of all three of those being true is likely to be zero.

But it’s possible.

As for the rest all your arguments boil down to, “These dudes have sad boners, so it’s understandable they abuse women. If only those women didn’t choose to not want to fuck them, they wouldn’t have to be fuckheads and assholes”.

We don’t agree. 1: I have more respect for myself than that (so I’m not going to abuse a woman who isn’t interested in me). 2: No one is entitled to sex.

You, on the other hand, are arguing people are entitled to sex, and to bully the entire world because they aren’t getting it. Yes, I meant the entire world. The number of douchebro’s who think like you isn’t (I like to think) anywhere near the majority. I don’t even think it’s that large a plurality, but women are hounded by them.

Which affects me. Because (quite reasonably) those women are more nervous and apprehensive when they deal with me, because I might be a shitnozzle like you, and the assholes you are defending.

Bina
Bina
7 years ago

Minus all the huffing and puffing in the paragraphs before and after, I agree with him.

Well, since YOUR hivemind is already made up and you’re only here to troll, I have no qualms telling you to go fuck yourself. You and he don’t deserve anything better anyway.

Bina
Bina
7 years ago

Also, with advance apologies for a bad case of earworms, but I just came up with this:

“Hey, I just met you,
And this is shady —
But here’s my dickpic,
How ’bout it, lady?”

Ally S
7 years ago

OT, but this is probably the dumbest Tumblr image I’ve seen this morning:comment image

Funny how the women that picture all look middle class, judging by their appearance. Because lower class women are irrelevant. And certainly no woman ever advocates for workplace safety.

Also, I love how they’re focusing on jobs in the US only because, if we were to consider outsourced labor, there would be way more women in the statistics they cite. Among them being, you know, Bangladeshi female sweat shop workers suffering from illness just because of the abysmal working conditions and many of them dying because of the lack of access to health care.

emilygoddess
emilygoddess
7 years ago

Is the thisiswhyyou’resingle blog/Tumblr/whatever it is still around?

Ooh, is that a thing? I’ve been looking for a replacement for the late, great Why Women Hate Men.

Ally S
7 years ago

Also, FFS when are they ever going to understand how male privilege grants men freer access to more dangerous and demanding jobs because they are seen as stronger and more competent? It’s as if MRAs never bother listening to what we say.

Bina
Bina
7 years ago

All the small print on that Tumblr pic really defeats whatever message the MRAsshats are trying to put across under the false flag of “egalitarianism”. But hey! Don’t let me and my “unexamined privilege” stand in the way of your stupid exaggerations.

sparky
sparky
7 years ago

His point was that men are so often rejected and ignored that they become desperate for attention from women and will spam them with noise. One especially unpleasant manifestation of this desperation is the dick-pic, or harassing behavior.

No, that was not Gregory’s point. Now, granted, it’s not the most, eh, coherent article ever written, but no, that was not his point. Gregory’s point is that men are “giving away cock” and this makes women feel entitled. And that women, receiving a these unsolicited sexually explicit inappropriate messages, have no right to complain because:

Free cock is not your oppression. It is your privilege.

Gregory is arguing that receiving unwanted and creepy messages is a privilege. And oh yeah, think of teh poor menz who are sending those unwanted and creepy messages. They’re just doing it because they’re desperate for attention, any attention, from a woman. So no wonder teh menz get a little upset! It totally understandable that men lash out at women who reject them. Woman, on the other hand, have no right to object to any of this. How dare they? So the next time a woman wants to have sex with you, buddy, you just tell her her soul is dogshit! Then you’ll really how horribly spiteful and vindictive women are!

Gregory is pissed because women are complaining about online harassment. Gregory is complaining because women actually have agency and a choice in who they message and talk to and date and have sex with.

Gregory never stated that men send these messages because they are insecure about rejection. He says that the men doing it are clamoring for attention.

And that’s just fucking pathetic.

vaiyt
7 years ago

“I am simply acknowledging that maybe the people who engage in this behavior see it (and therefore try to justify it) differently than I do. ”

That does not make the justification valid.

Bina
Bina
7 years ago

Last time Buttboy was here, he argued harassment wasn’t even a thing for women…

Clearly, nothing has changed. >eyeroll<

Meanwhile, out here in reality, I have never EVER felt "privileged" at the sight of an unsolicited schlong in any way, shape or form. I've never felt "lucky" to see one. (In order for that to happen, sexytimes with a guy I actually like must be imminent. DUH.)

No, having the sight of an uninvited cock thrust upon me is no privilege. I know that for what it is…a gesture of intimidation. As in "You're gonna get this whether you want it or not, bitch!"

scott1139
scott1139
7 years ago

“Hey, I just met you,
And this is shady –
But here’s my dickpic,
How ’bout it, lady?”

LOL! that was perfect 😀 …did I find that too amusing?

“Gregory is complaining because women actually have agency and a choice in who they message and talk to and date and have sex with.”

…they (many MRA’s) seriously don’t think women should be treated as people like men are, do they? ._____.

LBT
LBT
7 years ago

RE: Kittehserf

Ahhh, that makes sense.

RE: buttboy69

Minus all the huffing and puffing in the paragraphs before and after, I agree with him.

Living lives of quiet desperation and dick pics. And harassment. *pulls out World’s Tiniest Violin again* Poor unfortunate souls. My manly soul bleeds for them.

People with shitty coping mechanisms are the ones responsible for replacing them. Even if they WERE doing this out of deep mental torment, if I managed to replace my starving techniques with something better, they damn well can learn to replace their harassment behavior.

Myoo
Myoo
7 years ago

@Ally S

OT, but this is probably the dumbest Tumblr image I’ve seen this morning:comment image

It’s amazing how it’s portraying those things as stuff that only women use. I guess men live in caves or something.

Bina
Bina
7 years ago

LOL! that was perfect 😀 …did I find that too amusing?

Nah…I figured some laughter was in order, after all the other stuff. Glad somebody got a chuckle!

LBT
LBT
7 years ago

If seeing unwanted cock is a privilege, it must be one of those peculiar privileges of things you don’t want, can’t use, in a place you never want to go.

You know. Like Segways.

Bina
Bina
7 years ago

Well, at least a Segway might be fun to roll around on a bit. But yeah.

LBT
LBT
7 years ago

Yeah, and at least Segways can help folks get around. (I’m hard-pressed to think of a mobility impairment that is more comfortable standing than sitting, but perhaps one exists.) Anonymous photos of genitals? Not so much.

Seriously, dude, I already got a dick. You seen one, you seen ’em all.

Marie
Marie
7 years ago

@Ally

Funny how the women that picture all look middle class, judging by their appearance. Because lower class women are irrelevant. And certainly no woman ever advocates for workplace safety.

Not terribly related, but I swear that image is from a movie. The Women, I think? Idk, I never actually saw it, just the ads.

Also, FFS when are they ever going to understand how male privilege grants men freer access to more dangerous and demanding jobs because they are seen as stronger and more competent? It’s as if MRAs never bother listening to what we say.

Probably never :/

@auggz

Last time Buttboy was here, he argued harassment wasn’t even a thing for women…

*not surprised* And I just met him…

Marie
Marie
7 years ago

re: segways/ standing up mobility aids

I asked fade, since she’s much more mobility device savvy than me, and she said it sounds familiar (not being able to sit comfortably and needing to stand) but she couldn’t find much on it with searching.

Falconer
7 years ago

Hey Falconer, my mother wants to see hose twin pics and I can’t find them, care to repost your wee ones? Thanks!

Happy to oblige!

As for the rest of this thread: what is this i can’t even

LBT
LBT
7 years ago

Thanks, Marie (and Fade)! I admit, my shit is such that in the rare times I do need a mobility aid, it’s specifically something that makes up for the weakness in my legs, so a Segway would be the absolute WORST.

deniseeliza
deniseeliza
7 years ago

It’s amazing how it’s portraying those things as stuff that only women use. I guess men live in caves or something.

It’s true. No man has ever:

1) Worn clothes
2) Lived in an apartment building
3) Crossed a bridge
4) Used electricity
5) Used wooden furniture
6) Thrown anything away
7) Eaten a vegetable
8) Eaten a fish
9) Flown on an airplane, or
10) Been in a building

kittehserf
7 years ago

Re Segways – there are times when my hips have been really sore and I need to stand up at work, so I can see someone using a mobility aid like that.

Unimaginative
Unimaginative
7 years ago

More segways: people with heart or lung conditions, where they can stand, but walking more than half a room requires a rest break?

moldybrehd
7 years ago

No love for the brown penises?

(Sorry for the delay in replying, I didn’t go online yesterday.)
Lol, most of the unsolicited dick pics I’ve been ‘privileged’ to view were of the pinker variety, hence my initial mental image. I live in a predominantly white area, which apparently limits the number of POC pene I find in my inbox.

LBT
LBT
7 years ago

*stuffy English nature documentary voice* Here, we see the Sea of Men, filled with gently waving tentacledicks and sperm whales…

kittehserf
7 years ago

Attenborough. Definitely Attenborough.