Pledge Drive: Fluffy Cat Rolling In Money Edition!

I’m so sorry, MEZ. :<

Delurking to give hugs (if wanted) to Cloudiah and MEZ.

And a donation to the fluffy cat whom I assume is David ;).

cloudiah and MEZ, here’s a cat in a Trader Joe’s bagand a kitty lying on their back. I put a can of tuna next to both of you as well so they’ll stick around. :3

Here’s a contribution to the happy thoughts for those who lost loved ones. Gift wrapped, sort of 🙂

On the standards for job entry in the military and other such male-dominated areas: I just want to know who it was exactly that decided to make the standards different? I mean, were women demanding that they be given a different set of rules or just the opportunity? Maybe in order to protect the fragile egos of men at that time, those in charge decided to “help” those poor less qualified women.

For example, the PT requirement for push-ups is 35 for men and 13 for women. The only way this makes sense is if very comfortable and relatively wealthy women were trying to get into the military. 13 push-ups is frankly insulting and like someone else said, most women through-out time have worked physical jobs. The job standards argument that some men make is so easy to debunk on multiple levels if one just takes off the “white, upper- middle-class, western, comfortable-lifestyle” blinkers they have on.

Again, I realize that at the extreme ends of the spectrum men have more capacity for muscle and bone length. But, and this is a big but, you have to ask yourself if there are ANY jobs that really require more than just an average physical fitness/strength. I think the answer would be no. Yes women who do some jobs will have to be on the more fit end of the spectrum for women, but the idea that women can’t do the same jobs that men do is flat out bullshit. I cannot believe that we still need to keep debunking this crap. Thanks for reading my rant.

Here’s an extra one because my first sentence in the other post makes me look like an ass…

http://imgur.com/lfWUk

13 push-ups? Really? Only person I know who was never able to work up to move than that probably could’ve but her sensi got pissy about her boobs hitting the floor (like her cup size was somehow under her control?)

No way can I do that now, but I’m sure I could work up to more than that, and that’ she point isn’t it? To, you know, work up to the standard?

On the standards for job entry in the military and other such male-dominated areas: I just want to know who it was exactly that decided to make the standards different?

In the Australian army, they have a fitness requirement, but it’s ongoing, not just to join. What you have to do varies based on age and sex. So I suspect it’s less about “you need to be able to do pushups to be a soldier” and more about “pushups are one easily standardised so are one useful measure of fitness”. If you think about it, you can’t expect a 50yr old man to meet the same fitness standards as an 18 year old man. But it is reasonable to expect everyone to have an above average fitness level, for their age and sex.

Are you kidding me? I used to do 25 push ups and 100 sit ups every night before bed -_- What lame requirements…

Pecunium,

As to that guy, if you saw him in previous years I think this was a different guy, but I’d like to talk to you about anything you might have heard because there are “benefit of the doubt” conversations going on about him (not at Arisia, but in other venues).

Of course there are. But assuming we’re talking about the same guy (the one who disrupted the Carl Brandon party and distributed his manifesto around the con?), yes, I have definitely seen him before. I’d be happy to take this backchannel if you prefer.

Emilygoddess — manifesto? I think it may be a different That Guy, I might be wrong though, I hope I’m wrong cuz creepy.

re push-ups: 1: An Army push-up (the other services have different standards; only the Army and the Marine Corps have push-ups as a requirement). is a harder standard than most people think (a significant number of men fail their initial PT test at basic, in part because they just can’t manage to maintain the form required).

2: The test is timed, and there is a moderate amount of stress. I was always worried I would fail pushups. The only time I didn’t “pass” was my initial test as basic (for my age the minimum was 28, I only had 27 acceptable push-ups, though I did have one rejected for a small failure of form (I didn’t come to a locked position after assuming the rest position).

3: The normig for women is problematic. From my experience (16 years, and a wide slice of the Army, with an aveerage of taking part in some capacity in 4 PT tests a year) men tended to be fairly well represented on the curve.

A number of men would fail the test, and a similar number would max it. The rest were fairly evenly distributed on the scale (I tended to score in the middle 70s (out of one hundred points; which is to say I was ablt to do between 50-60 pushups in two minutes.

Women, in my experience teneded to score at the low end of the scale (60 points is passing), about 55-65 points, or up in the 90. I tabulated a fair number of PT tests and the lack of a smooth curve for women, while one was present for men is problematic.

What it said to me is the test isn’t fair; but the unfairness is not where it seems to be. Women’s ability to passively keep muscle mass in the upper body makes it harder for routine PT to keep them in shape to meet much more than the minimum, while the diffrence in CG makes it easier for them to go gnagbusters once they have the muscles.

The basic ability is there, and the Army hasn’t figured out decent training regimens (those being based on men’s physique, in part because men make up the vast majority of the Army, have always made up the vast majority of the army, and are the default phsyiognomy in question), to give the women in the army what they need.

It also look is if (if/when the Army manages to adjust training), the straight line scoring (each push up beyond minimum passing = x points on the grading scale) isn’t as accurate for women as it is for men. I don’t know how to correct that, without it looking as if the army is trying to exclude women with that as the tool.

Kim: PT standards are ongoing for the US Army too. They are taken every 6 months. There is an age adjusted scale for push-ups, sit-ups, and a 2-mile run. The events are always in that order. The first two are each a timed event of 2-minutes, and the other is, of course a timed run of two-miles. One gets not less ten minutes, nor more than twenty, between each event.

As a rule I was able to do about 50 push-ups, 65 sit ups, and the 2 miles in about 13 minutes. My personal bests were 57, 72, and 10:54 (though I think that one was mistaken, which makes my personal best 11:31).

The forms required are exact. Push-ups are done with the arms at a comfortable disatance, feet no more than 12 inches apart, body in a, generally straight line. From that position, with elbows locked, the partipant lowers the body; as a unit, until the line from elbow-elbow; across the back, is parallel to the ground, then the body is lifted; as a unit, until the elbows are again locked.

That counts as one repitions. Any push-up in which the body is not lowered as a unit, the plane of the arms does not become parallel to the ground, or the elbows are not locked, does not count.

A modified position is allowed for resting, with the hips arched in the air; and forward of the knees, or the body sagging at the waist (without any portion resting on the ground). Prior to recommencing the excercise the participant must come to a fully locked start position.

If either foot, or both hands are removed from the ground, or the feet are spread more than 12 inches apart, or the hips are moved behind the knees, or any part of the body is rested on the ground, the event is terminated, and no more repetitions will be counted.

There are similar rules (though less extensive) for the sit-ups.

I will say one of the things I saw most was a failure to get to the “upright, locked, position”. A lot of the people who knocked out more 90, or so, were “bouncing”, they’d get near the top, and then relax again.

And people like me (long arms) just had a harder time of it, because it was a greater distance to get to the fully-locked position.

MEZ, I’m so sorry, a washtub Capybara for you:

http://youtu.be/QTk688cXTsA

@Pecunium, is there contact info on your blog? I’m not comfortable posting my e-mail address where the Harassment Brigade can see it.