On Monday, Martin Luther King Day here in the United States, this was posted in the Men’s Rights subreddit, where, as you can see, it was quite popular with the assembled Men’s Rightsers:
How wrong is this? Let me count the ways.
1) It’s wrong because Men’s Rights “Activists” aren’t “warriors for peace,” or justice, or even for their own backwards notions of men’s rights. MRAs, like a lot of men insecure about their own worth, love to claim credit for the accomplishments of great men in the past (without accepting any responsibility for the terrible deeds of the terrible men who lived before them).
But even in terms of claiming credit where no credit is due this is especially ridiculous. Aside from a tiny handful of “fathers rights activists,” who’ve bizarrely chosen to try to advance their cause by vandalizing paintings and/or dressing up in superhero costumes and climbing up buildings, and one troubled man who killed himself in hopes that his death would spur other MRAs to acts of terrorism directed at courthouses and police stations, MRAs don’t risk anything with their “activism,” insofar as they engage in anything that can be called activism at all.
There’s nothing heroic, or risky, about posting anonymous rants online about how women are all a bunch of hypergamous bitches, or sending some vague threat to the feminist villain of the day.
Indeed, MRAs face so little risk that some are forced to invent stories of persecution — like John Hembling’s tall tale of being confronted by a mob of boxcutter-wielding feminists, thoroughly discredited by The Daily Beast — in order to cast themselves in the role of the persecuted victim-turned-hero.
2) It’s wrong because the person posting this message, and attempting to suggest some sort of link between the civil rights movement of Martin Luther King and the Men’s Rights movement today, is someone who also posts in the White Rights subreddit, a haven for the same sort of hateful white supremacists who hurled racial epithets — not to mention actual rocks and bottles — at King when he was alive.
When one Redditor pointed this out, and noted (correctly) that numerous white nationalists post in the Men’s Rights subreddit, they were quickly downvoted for their troubles.
The original poster explained that he only posted in White Rights about “real cases of white discrimination.”
Another poster offered an example of what he saw as one such case of “real” anti-white discrimination:
Yeah, that was totally a real thing.
3) It’s wrong because it’s wrong. As in, factually incorrect. Warren Farrell is talking out of his ass, again. Here’s a slightly longer version of his quote, which you can find on his web page. (It’s originally from The Myth of Male Power.)
Men are likely to be not only the warriors of war but also the warriors of peace. Almost all those who risk their lives, are put in jail, or are killed for peace are men. While some of the peace warriors—Nelson Mandela, Martin Luther King, Gandhi, Dag Hammarskjold—are remembered, most are forgotten. Remember Norm Morrison?
Well, no, Warren, I don’t remember Norm Morrison. But I think you’re forgetting a few people too. Like half of the human race.
Women have been involved in peace and social justice movements as long as women have been active in the public sphere. Ever hear of Women Strike for Peace? Code Pink? At every large demonstration I’ve been at that has involved civil disobedience, I’ve seen both men and women arrested, with some of the women old enough to be grandmothers or great-grandmothers. The idea that women don’t put themselves on the line for peace or social justice is patently false.
This is really kind of basic stuff. But with MRAs, alas, you always need to go back to the basics.
But the post in the Men’s Rights subreddit was all about co-opting the civil rights movement, so today I thought I would remind anyone who might have forgotten — or who never knew — that it wasn’t just men who put themselves at risk in the struggle for civil rights.
You can click on the pictures for more information.
When I look at my life now (married with kids, how radical), I realize that the social justice activism I did in my late teens and twenties was so worth it. Coming out in high school in 1978 was a bit risky, for example, but for many of my schoolmates I was the first out gay person they ever knew. The sea change in this country regarding how LGBT& people are viewed has had a lot to do with people being willing to risk coming out and speaking up. Now, at 52, I’m living the life I wanted to have.
David Futrelle
So once again Warren Farrell instead of doing anything to promote the rights of men, insults women. Wow, he has shown himself to be such a “civil rights” icon.
I don’t think I could do what I’m currently doing as a volunteer without having people like you folks to hang out and play wack-a-troll with.
I appreciate your intentions, Charlie, but one thing to bear in mind is that we’re a pretty diverse commentariat, and that naturally means that we have all our own life circumstances that may hinder our ability to engage in activism.
For instance, I’m very passionate about my anarchist views. One of my dreams is to start an anarchist collective devoted to empowering and supporting fellow trans people, especially trans youth. But at this point at my life I’m very young (19), in the process of escaping from abusive elders, and in the process of gaining the resources I need to finally transition. On top of that I’m trying to deal with my self-hatred and my mental illnesses in a constructive, positive fashion and completely solidify my own political views so that I have a clear vision of what I need to do.
Because of all of these barriers, it is difficult for me to even gather resources with my friends to start the collective I speak of. Until that’s possible, my dreams will remain dreams. And that’s unacceptable to me because I firmly believe that anarchy isn’t some absurd utopian ideal but rather a just and feasibly maintained mode of society.
Of course, not everyone is an anarchist like me – I’m sure even the majority of the people I’m most fond of here disagree with my anarchist views. I’m just providing an example to point out that helpful recommendations for activism can’t simply be reduced to certain time allocations. We all have our own life circumstances and they prevent us from achieving what we really want. Again, your perspective is valuable and important to bear in mind, but it certainly isn’t the only perspective.
Farrell did not make a false statement. The images you present are anecdotal and how much their lives were at risk is debatable (the vast majority of civil rights activists who were killed were men if not all).
Wut.
I went to Google for more info, because they sound badass, and now I’m confused. I found a group of five who are British and dismantled a plane, and a group of four Aussies more recently who disrupted communications with soldiers in Afghanistan. Is one of those the story you’re talking about? Both groups are made of awesome.
They’re definitely adherents of the “if I haven’t heard of it, it doesn’t exist” school of thought.
Thanks for assuming we don’t (lurk moar, etc). And now, since you know better than all of us, care to explain (1) how you arrived at that particular ratio, and (2) which actions do or don’t count as “real” activism? Your credentials for telling us what to do would also b e welcome.
1: Citation?
2. You don’t think women in the Civil Rights movement didn’t face the same abuse and danger that their male counterparts did? Are you sure?
3. Las Mariposas were killed.
Sam: Thirding the demand for citations, yes. And you’ll need to cite formal academic reports that detail:
1: Fatalities among protesters and activists, by gender
2: Other abuse to protesters (assaults, blacklisting, and oh, yes, douchenozzle supremor, rapes), again broken down by gender
3: The method used in gathering this information, and other standard methods for establishing the legitimacy of the study.
Please note: Your ass is not a viable source for these claims.
The images you present are anecdotal
This is the funniest thing I’ve read all day.
“Your honour, I have a photograph here of the actual moment at which the accused plunged the knife into the victim’s chest.”
“I’m sorry counsellor, that image is anecdotal.”
Right verses his evidence which a “fact” because he said so .
Peaceful kittehs are all well and good, but what about dancing parrots?
Women were also a significant force within Solidarity, the political movement that ended Communist rule in Poland (and via the domino effect brought down the Iron Curtain). See here for example.
For the misogynistic mindset women simply don’t exist outside the home so they can’t possibly be social activist and they can’t possibly drive any meaningful social change. Yet at the same time those same misogynists claim that feminism is so powerful that has “conqured” the entire western world and is also spreading in other parts of the world.
How do they deal with this obvious contradiction? As usual they invent one zillion conspiracy theories to rationalize it.
Women have taken and continue to take part in lots of social movements and social issues, women in general are highly socially active, but like it usually happens they many times don’t get the credit for it from misogynists.
Financially contributing is also important – it enables NGOs to continue their direct actions. Not all of us have the time, transport options, or personalities (e.g. being happy cold calling door-to-door, marching in crowds) that are conducive to taking direct action.
In some cases, e.g. bullying in the workplace, direct action is local action – it can be letting the bully know that their behaviour is not okay, or seeing how the recipient (I -hate- the word “victim”) is feeling, or giving feedback on work policies around bullying and similar practices.
Yes you made a huge assumption twice. And you don’t see what the commentators here do offline. What you see -other people do- is not relevant.
For one second I actually thought an HB10 was a pencil type. Silly me. I’ve got to put my tin-foil MRA hat back on.
Ah my favorite assumption, that one has to engage in offline activism to be an activist or any sort of -ist. Does that apply to those of us who turn into dysfunctionally anxious messes around people?
It bugs me, that line of conversation always comes off as saying you aren’t a Real Activist(tm) unless you are able to engage in offline activism.
Wow Charlie, it takes a whole heap of privilege to be that condescending and egotistical.
30 years? Wow, you must feel super. Well done you.
Is there a prize for the longest serving ‘real world’ SJW? I mean, I did 15 years before I got poorly, but perhaps it doesn’t count now I don’t do my 1/5?
Or is social justice work measured on some sort of scale? For instance, if you helped save dolphins and I cared for the terminally ill do I get more points than you?
And if I helped people with Autism lead a more fulfilling life, would that trump you if perhaps you were part of the occupy movement?
I mean if that is the case and as I did care for the terminally ill and people with many types of disability, perhaps my 15 years is worth more than your 30. And whilst we’re doing this ‘I’m better than you exercise’ perhaps I’d get extra points because of my disability.
If so, my SJW prize should totally be a golden armchair.
@Ophelia I’m thinking a Game of Thrones type golden armchair. Instead of swords it would have kitties leaping away from the chair, with their paws outstretched. This is where I wish I was an artist and could do you a conceptual picture. However, I can knit and crochet, so I could do you a warm, snuggly cover to wrap over yourself for when you sit in the chair. I would also stretch to buying you a cushion, because I imagine sitting on the damn thing would be quite uncomfortable without some padding.
I think that every damn time.
You’re not mistaken. Straight male anti-feminists tend to prefer women who wear pencil skirts.
Concern trolling is the most boring kind of trolling.
Charlie, have you ever thought that the everyday battles that most people here have to go through might count as actually being activist?
Most people here have had to fight sexism, homophobia, transphobia, ableism and a host of other bullshit that comes down the pike, social injustice is just not some abstraction to them…it is very real because they are on the other end of the stick.
And they have done this everyday of their lives. These people are the real life activist. They deal with real life situations in their workplace, within their families and social circles, they are not fighting windmills.
Reminds me of the Hamlet pencil – 2B or not 2B. (Don’t blame me, that was a Spike Milligan joke.)
Oh, and Charlie? I don’t have disabilities but I do live in a remote ‘burb and spend five hours a day just commuting. My time at Manboobz mostly happens at work. I have neither time nor energy out of my eleven, twelve hour days to do volunteer work for any cause, nor do I drive, so getting places takes even more hours. So, y’know, fuck you and your condescension and privilege.
::applauds Robert R::