Dalrock, a manosphere traditionalist with a great love of charts and statistics and other accoutrements of SCIENCE, has managed to figure out a way to stretch “don’t be so picky, ladies, or you’ll get old and ugly and no man will ever want you” out to 1500 words.
Here are a few of them:
Men foot the searching costs in the marriage and sexual marketplace (MMP & SMP). This means bearing most of the risk of rejection and expending the bulk of the resources to facilitate the process of meeting and getting to know one another.
Oh dear. We’re off to a very unpromising start here.
As the ones who bear the costs of courtship, men have a strong incentive to minimize the number of women they court and the overall duration of time spent in the process. However, as the consumers of courtship, women have an incentive to draw the process out as long as possible and to receive courtship from as many men as possible.
Here’s some surveillance footage of an average American woman being courted by several men.
But now — get this — the ladies are waiting longer to marry!
Just think about what this does to the dude navigating the marriage market hoping to “maximize his Pareto efficiency,” if you know what I mean and I think you do.
He needs to manage risk vs reward. When courting, there are two fundamental risks. These are the risk of wasting resources on the wrong women, and the risk of rejection harming the man’s reputation/MMV.
So watch out, ladies, because if you wait too long, guys are going to decide you’re not much of a bargain!
For a man who is managing the risks of courtship outlined above, the age of a woman is very important. The older a woman is, the more likely it is that she is very picky and/or not seriously looking for a husband.
Exactly! Because women never change their mind because they’re, you know, in a different stage of their life or anything.
Older women also are less attractive from a courtship perspective because they have used up more of their most attractive/fertile years, and while their attractiveness for marriage has declined their expectations for courtship have only increased.
This reminds me of that famous joke, you know, where that woman approaches Winston Churchill at a party and says, “Sir, you are drunk.”
And he replies: “And you, Bessie, have used up your most attractive/fertile years. But I shall be sober in the morning, and you will still have used up your most attractive/fertile years.”
That Churchill, what a card!
Consider the 25% of current early thirties White women who still haven’t married; unless they are terminally unattractive an awful lot of courtship has almost certainly been wasted on them.
Are there really a lot of guys who look back on the women they dated in their twenties and think, “boy, I wasted a lot of courtship on those gals! I mean, I wasted nearly 14 courtship on Jessa alone!” (Also, who knew that the women are always the ones to blame when heterosexual couples in their twenties break up?)
They aren’t just bad bets for courtship today, but (in retrospect) they clearly were bad bets for courtship for the last 15 years. …
Put simply, the extended delay of marriage by women has placed marriage minded men in a dilemma; older women are (generally speaking) known bad bets for courtship, but half of early twenties women are also poor bets for courtship.
Well, you could always marry a dude.
There are only two logical ways men can respond to women’s extension of courtship.
Wait, really? Please, please, please, let one of the ways be “marry a dude.”
The first logical choice is to recognize that these women are debasing marriage, and decide to “court” for sex and not marriage.
Damn. Anyway, sexual relationships are fine, but you are aware that there are other kinds of relationships — sorry, “courting” — besides sex and marriage, right?
Ok, we still have one more. Marry a dude. Marry a dude. Marry a dude.
But while “courting” for sex is a logical choice, it is not a moral choice, and we still do see men courting for marriage. For these men, having a fairly low age cutoff makes a great deal of sense.
That’s your, er, “solution?” Marry a teenager? Or a woman at most in her early twenties?
As Dalrock knows, but doesn’t want to believe, those who marry when they’re very young are much more likely to divorce than those who marry when they’re older. For evidence, see this chart, which I found elsewhere on Dalrock’s own blog:
But hope springs eternal for modern misogynistic manospherian marriage market minded men (MMMMMMM).
I love how he so pointedly points out Kaylene refused to date him even though they were friends. As if it casts aspersions on *her* character.
ninja’ed a bit by cassandrakitty.
mildlymagnificent, your daughters’ partners don’t ACT like this, I hope?
If Mikey ever did get a girlfriend, I wonder how many months weeks days it’d be before he pulled the “Nobody else would have you, you ungrateful -” line (thus showing he’s abusive and also thinks of himself as one of those Losers he rants about)?
If any of your daughters are dating someone like Mikey that calls for an intervention.
Because she’s a double-digit Ferris-wheeling Slutty McSlutSlut. And she wasn’t giving the Quality Man™ a pityfuck.
@ kittehserf
Someone actually tried that on me once! The “you’re so lucky to have me” thing. He seemed rather put out when I burst out laughing.
yeah, when I joined facebook I didn’t bother listing my maiden name. Figured the people from “back then” that I had any meaningful connection with already knew me by my married name. No need to be findable by that one weird creep you half-remember hanging around when you were 19.
Mike’s weird. I am not sure I even believe he’s 32; that’s my age and I can hardly believe anyone that old could be so…. naively B & W about life, I guess. Maybe some people have a difficult time navigating ambivalence and uncertainty– (reality?)
To go from seeing The Princess Bride as anything resembling reality to making the same error with The Gospel According To Dalrock! Both make some implicit “promises” about life fulfillment, though… Mike, if you are listening, I would suggest thinking about that before marrying *anyone.* Marriage is complex; the poorer your ability to tolerate significant emotional discomfort without lashing out at other people, (or stuffing those feelings altogether!) the harder it tends to be. Trust me. You need to develop good emotional health to have a thriving longterm marriage– marrying a 20something HB8 will not change that.
Sorta interesting, anyway
I was half-watching the game, working peyote stitch on some absurdly tiny seedbeads and that outburst made me lose my place! What was THAT about?!
Heheh I can just picture it!
OT thank you jefrir if you read this, the formatting toolbar is a gift from Ceiling Cat. 🙂
“YOu know, you’re like a natural 7, but I’ll bump you up to a 9 for being 20, uhhh…. you.” “My name is Cathy…” “Keep correcting men like that and you’re going to end up a SPINSTER you ugly slut!”
Brooked: Ah, that makes a little more sense.
When your opponent has to explain your argument for you, well, add debate to the long list of Mikey’s failings. And he claims to be a lawyer.
So lets see. 8-10 (really? Couldn’t be bothered to get an accurate count?) 18-24 year old white women attending college who Mikey seems attractive. Out of those, he looks up 5 on Facebook, after an unknown amount if time has passed since the first conversation (a year? a week? 6 hours?). One woman lists her status as married; the other 4 are either “single” or “in a relationship.” The others are lost to follow-up because Mikey can’t remember their names.
So, we have a ridiculously small and unrepresentative sample size, half of which we have no follow-up data on. Of the 4 out 5 who don’t list their Facebook status as “married,” we are unsure how many list themselves as “in a relationship” or “single.” So, we have no real numbers. And we have no idea of the relationship status of half the original sample.
And all of the above says absolutely nothing about the general happiness and satisfaction of those women.
Shows absolutely no understanding of the scientific method. I’d give it an “F.”
“Who Mikey deems attractive.” Not “seems attractive.”
To whom Mikey did not seem attractive, it seems.
So, to recap: Mikey can’t spell, analyze data, or think. He also can’t see past the end of his own sad, wilted dick.
And yet, we are meant to believe that he’s “educated”.
That’s so cute.
One of them’s now married to a bloke called Michael – but he’s a really nice person. See, Mikey, it’s really not that hard. Be a nice person, meet a nice person, fall in love, be happy – and you can be 25, 35 or 65, it still works whether you do or don’t get married.
As for intervention. Long, long ago they gave me carte blanche to speak up if I had any doubts about anyone they were involved with. They reckon someone who’s been through the disastrous marriage fuckup routine gets a free pass to prevent further fuckups in the making. (Well, someone who’s managed to have an idyllic marriage afterwards – they both like to talk about us as “soulmates”. I don’t have the heart to say I’m super not-keen on that expression.)
And now the other daughter’s bloke is talking to us about timing for the great engagement ring “moment”. I reckon he should just get on with it, though I didn’t say exactly that when he was being so prim and potential-son-in-law-ish about it. He’s really a sweetie.
Jeez, whatever he does, I hope he doesn’t do the spring-it-in-public routine. That’s horrible and manipulative even if the person doing it thinks they’re being romantic.
It is! Let’s hope it keeps Blockquote Monster at bay. Thanks, Jefrir!
Har. In Soviet Canuckistan, Mikey is unworthy of ME.
::grrrrrrr:
::is envious::
You Canuckistanis have all the fun!
On currently unknown planets where gas-based lifeforms mate by blowing bubbles at each other they could read this thread and realize that Mikey is unworthy of you.
No, nothing like that. He’s more concerned about how all their job / time / money / other stuff will fit together. He’d never do anything so crass as one of those public declaration things – his inclination is a bit different. It’s more that he’s afraid of putting a foot wrong (in ways that I don’t think any one of us would much fuss over, least of all my daughter).
Fun fact: Michael’s story (the one posted in the comments at Dalrock) is listed in the sidebar of the Red Pill subreddit, as the ultimate “women are terrible so you better become an alpha asshole” testimonial.
Strewth, they aren’t picky, are they?
I’m still not seeing what’s so alpha about shrieking at women on feminist blogs in a futile attempt to force them to care about your opinion.