So some Swedish movie theaters have decided to institute a new rating system to let viewers know whether or not the films they show pass the Bechdel Test — that is, if at any point in the film two female characters have a conversation about something other than a man.
Over in the Men’s Rights subreddit, a fella with the classy handle classypedobear takes strong exception to this terrible affront to human decency. His argument?
Wait. WHAT IS WRONG WITH TALKING ABOUT KITTENS?
Thanks, AgainstMensRights subreddit!
He’s just softening you up, wordsp1nner. Beware!
I’m with Karalora: I want to know the women are people in their own right, so I will accept as, “passing” a movie in which women talk to men, about things they have in common, which relate to things outside themselves (if that makes sense).
So I’d say Fargo counts, and so does, “Across the Universe”, because in the first our heroine talks about her work with lots of people (and at least once to another woman; the man in that conversation; as I recall it, was the subject of her work related inquiries), and in the second we have several women who are being independent (which means more to me than the one conversation between two women which is about a non-male; but even that conversation has an unstated male; but the relationship between the three is integral to that arc of the plot, and that arc is about the women, not the man.
naltia, thanks! I conclude from this that: I should probably extend my test to include cats. Also, I should probably rewatch Hellboy. And maybe watch Sunshine Cleaners.
And that I should absolutely under no circumstances watch The Ugly Truth. Also, what kind of cat owner is she anyway!? You don’t yell at a cat for breaking things. That’s what cats do.
I just remembered a TV cat moment from a drama series about Richelieu done in the 70s. There’s a scene in the Cardinal’s study, where a white cat’s sprawled on a cushion on his desk and playing with a quill. Richelieu walks in and ruffles kitteh’s fur while he’s talking. Trouble is the mic must have been a bit close, ‘cos you can hear the cat grrrRRRRrrrowling.
Best bit’s when kitty goes on playing with the quill and manages to knock it off the desk. Then of course zie has to peer over the edge, then wash zir face because zie totally meant to do that and didn’t want that stupid quill anyway.
“PoC Bechdel”
Does it count if they’re married?
And the Moko one is mentally ill people?
Gothika gets a B if those are both “yes”
So MRAs are against people discussing and rating a film based on a test they dont like because FEMINISMSMSM and want to stop it? And women should not talk to other women because this jerk thinks their conversations are dumb?
Gosh, what about our freedom of speech? I thought they were all about that!
Quackers – There’s one fatal flaw in your reasoning. You forgot that women =! people in the minds of misogynists. Hence, there is no repression of speech, because women =! people.
“Why do women need to talk to each other? I don’t get it.”
“I know, sweetie. I know.”
Alice:
Yep. Freedom of speech is only for men. Or more accurately, only for women and men who agree with MRAs.
Quackers – And not even then, since we have Spearheaders and other MRAs saying that women can’t take part in the MRA movement (and hating on the FeMRAs on AVFM).
“Why do women need to talk to each other? I don’t get it.”
Because…good writing? Compelling characters?
But no really, I’m having myself a big ol’ giggle imagining a movie where all the characters refuse to interact with each other. Especially if it’s an action movie. ‘Hero’ walks in, blows stuff up for reasons, no one notices. He makes a daring escape with lots of backflips and ‘ki-YAHHHH” noises–while no one tries to stop him–and then in the final scene he dashes toward the heroine. She stands there, gazing out at the sunset, hair blowing softly in the wind… Then they just sort of walk past each other.
Screen fades to black. Roll credits.
Mort, I would watch the hell out of that movie.
Ah, no. I see the confusion. It’s different freedoms. Men have freedom of speech, while women have freedom of Screech. It’s the way it’s always been.
Regarding horror movies, as was mentioned by David earlier in the thread… A while ago me and Husband watched through all the nightmare on Elm Street movies, and I’m pretty certain every movie in that series pass with flying colours. They all have a female hero, and she always has some female friends, usually a mum that appears in the story and so on. Of course a lot of the conversations are about Freddy, but not every single one.
And I think this goes to show by Bechdel is really a pretty good test, although not the perfect “feminist test” (which NO ONE has ever CLAIMED that it is, so I don’t get it why people have to point it out over and over and over again). The Elm Street movies pass because they are set in world which is unlike ours in some ways, but it seem to be like ours in that women make up 50 % of that world’s population rather than being this small minority.
Exactly. Bechdel isn’t really about finding movies that are perfectly feminist, it’s just about wanting movies to have women in them, and for those women to be actual characters. That’s pretty much it. It really shouldn’t be too much to ask for.
cloudiah – it’s not quite the movie Mort imagined (which I’d also watch) but this one has nothing I’d really call interaction between the main characters.
http://youtu.be/n-wUdetAAlY
Kitteh: Some people really should have lived in the days of the internet.
I don’t know if his work’s on the Net, but Marv Newland’s still making animated films.
Mum worked at the Education Dept film library in the 70s and schools were always borrowing Bambi Meets Godzilla. Some of ’em for film studies, yeah … and some had no idea and waxed indignant when they found out it ran all of ninety seconds.
@Kittehs
Misandry at it’s finest- teh innocent menz (bambi) being squashed by the ebil femizillas (Godzilla).
Love it!
FEMZILLAS I love that!
The Reddit thread is nightmare, it’s like a contest to see which poster can understand the fewest things and who ever wrote the header, “Sweden wants 2 females per movie. This is getting ridiculous”, is a strong contender Some don’t understand Bechdel test (“Could your life pass the Bechdel test? Could anyone’s?”), others think it would be government enforced film law leading to censorship and a few just do what MRAs do best, spin wild tales of misandry gone wild. My favorite of the last type is the one who thinks Sweden is close to a feminist apocalypse that will compel all young men to flee the country.
Add a gloomy pedantic gotcha from GirlWritesWhat, “that would be a world wherein every movie has a female villain. Problem solved”. And 12 people thought this was a excellent point,
The Bechdel law is simplistic, yet pointed because it’s not some grand feminist film theory, it was a joke in a comic strip. As a side note, that strip, Dykes to Watch Out For, would pass any turbo charged WoC version of the law; Bechdel’s female characters were a variety of races and body types. She also had a character who uses a wheelchair and another with multiple sclerosis, and never mucked them up with “a very special episode”-style patronizing schmaltz.
Finally, her devastating memoir, A Fun Home, is critically acclaimed, brilliant and highly recommended. FYI.
Could this person be any more self-centered? It would take some serious effort.
Presumably this jackass thinks no women ever talk to each other about anything but men.
Which is … weird.
As a straight male, I actually prefer it when a series’ cast is all female
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ImprobablyFemaleCast
Apparently, no women ever talk to him so the Bechdel test is really misandry.