Jaclyn Friedman, who faced off with A Voice for Men’s always charming Paul Elam for that 20/20 story that may eventually air sometime this century, has just published a great piece in the American Prospect on the Men’s Rights movement. Unlike some recent writers on the subject who’ve been taken in by some of the “movement’s” rhetoric and personalities — *cough*R. Tod Kelly at the Daily Beast*cough* — she fucking nails them. Check it out.
Good on you for doing that, cloudiah.
Incidentally, that pig-apple-high-heel Andrea Dworkin quote . . . does anyone know the context around that? The anti-feminists seem to love to post that one and every item I see it I think-scream to myself “WTF, context extremely needed.” I know I’ve seen it source to her book Fire and Ice, which is a work of fiction. Just wondering if anyone knows the context surrounding the quotation if it indeed appears in that novel?
every time, not every item. Apologies for my sloppy typing.
This is pretty OT, but if you want even more mounting proof that the MRM is just one big abuses lobby, return of kings has an article that endorses beating your children. Most of the commentors disagree but only because it may make them “beta as fuck”. Others suggest beating is only a last report, but they would do it.
Reading the list….wow.
“No other men have the meat and two veg any more. It’s just me.”
The article is so courageous. I’m moved that Ms. Friedman wrote it, knowing that she would be terribly vilified, threatened, and have her character assassinated. I see it’s already starting up in the comments. David, thank you so much for doing this work and your own courage.
B-but any publicity is good publicity! It’s an old saying in Hollywood so it must be true!
…
So now a shaven vulva is a requirement of True Femininity(tm)? The fuck?
…I’m going to guess that for 99% of parents who’ve ever used corporal punishment, forcing your kids to counterattack in self-defense was not the goal. Similarly, I’m going to guess that if this man does in fact have sons (God help them) and they did hit him back effectively, he would not actually be pleased.
Nah. Your views would always have been abusive.
And this is why I’ve never been impressed by “And I turned out okay!” Thing is, most people turn out okay – you may have turned out “okay” in spite of your upbringing, not because of it. And if you didn’t turn out okay, your perspective is probably so warped that you think you did.
I would be so creeped out if my father took any interest in the state of my pubic topiary. Let’s all just hope that this guy never actually has a daughter.
And anyone paying attention notes how often they confuse “feminine” with “feminist”.
“things”, this person said….
RE person advocating fucking child abuse: may that person step on all the Legos. 😡
Roosh turned out anything but “okay”.
Again, I must express my astonishment at Dean Esmay’s sartorial choices. He looks like he bathes in cheeto dust while playing World of Warcraft.
Anyway, I’m glad to see Jaclyn Friedman hit the nail square on the head. I appreciated the Daily Beast dude’s approach, but he was too easily befuddled by things like WF Price’s so-called moderation. My only complaint is that since Friedman brought up false rape accusations without taking the hammer to the MRAs on the topic, they’re going to use that as “proof” that even a die-hard bigot feminist admits it’s a big problem, despite all the times they’ve been shown to be wrong on that issue.
Or should I say she hit the nail on the button? I miss Owly.
Er, at least I miss Owly’s entertainment value.
I eagerly await A Voice For Men’s article denouncing Roosh for advocating violence against boys.
*crickets chirp, tumble weed drifts by*
“We don’t hate women! We just think they should: Get back in the kitchen; Stop voting; Stop being educated about anything other than needlepoint, the piano forte, and possibly french; Be constantly available as a self-heating fleshlight, whether they like it or not; Shut up when men are talking about men’s things; Never, ever leave us, no matter how poorly we treat them; Never complain when we sleep with the governess; Give us enough children that we need a governess; Pay for said children themselves – we won’t be used, damnit!”
The “Men’s Rights” Movement: Because subjugation and hatred are totally different things!
And, once again, I feel I have to say it: You. Do. Not. Speak. For. Me. Fuck you, all of you MRAs, and the 13th century horse you rode in on.
Ah, so it’s like the sith? You beat and abuse them until they’re so twisted inside that there’s no shred of humanity left, and then they beat you to death with their piggy bank and bury you under the patio. Then it’s their turn to “take an apprentice.” Seems like a totally reasonable way to do it, sure.
That last comment might need a trigger warning… maybe… it’s uncomfortable, reading it back.
At least the 13th century was pretty honest about their misogyny…
Quote is actually “Hate feminists […]”, that’s a pretty significant difference between hate the sin and love the sinner… It’s more like “Hate people who do the action, not all of the group.”
Shit… I didn’t even parse that. Hate and hate are exactly the same thing… so women and feminists are things. Well, I for one am proud to be a mere object in the eyes of such a person, even if I’m only singularly objectified rather than double. Honestly, the idea of being respected by an MRA turns my stomach.
2edgy4me
Seriously though, for fuck’s sake, how can anyone who encourages toxic “masculine” behaviour like excessive violence claim to give any sort of a shit about men’s rights? Why don’t so called moderate MRAs call people out on this garbage?
I know, I know, because MRAs are full of shit…
So, Roosh is even more despicable than we knew (and that’s saying something) but does anyone else think he’s also desperate for attention, posting this sort of linkbait?
Someone (on Pharyngula, I think) quoted a line about how misogynist atheists think the Bible is wrong about men being subject to God but right about women being subject to men – a pointed comment indeed.
Me, I think the misogyny goes back way before the Bible and is the source of a lot of it, not the other way around (after all it wouldn’t have been written as it was without misogyny being a thing).
Roosh’s comment on the child abuse article:
“This article was indeed meant to be satire.”
That’s seriously their go-to excuse for every disgusting thing they publish, isn’t it?