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a voice for men are these guys 12 years old? johntheother lying liars misogyny MRA

The Daily Beast takes on the Men’s Rights movement — and takes down A Voice for Men’s John Hembling

John Hembling, possibly lying about something
John Hembling, possibly lying about something

The bad publicity bonanza for Men’s Rights activists continues — and it couldn’t happen to a worse group of  people.

Yesterday, the Daily Beast published a long-awaited piece on the Men’s Rights movement, and it’s a doozy. If you’re a regular reader of this site, trust me, you’ll want to read the whole thing, like now. The piece, by R. Tod Kelly, is long — some 6000 words — but worth it.

It’s mostly on the money, but with a few notable flaws.

Here’s what it gets right:

1) It captures the pervasive misogyny of the Men’s Rights movement in general, and of A Voice for Men in particular.

2) In an extended section, it profiles AVFM’s John Hembling, and tears apart some of his most blatant lies — including the now legendary box-cutter incident, in which Hembling claims to have stared down a mob of 20-30 feminists brandishing boxcutters.

As Kelly notes:

Vancouver police records show that there was indeed an altercation in September of 2012 between Hembling and others seeking to tear down men’s rights posters. However, according to the police, Hembling was arguing with two or three people, not being accosted by a “mob” of any size. When questioned by the authorities, neither Hembling nor witnesses mentioned seeing any weapons. …

Curiously enough, Hembling actually videotaped the events and had his AV4M Radio partner Karen Straughan post it online. The discussion with the police has been conveniently edited out, but the rest of the video clearly matches police records and not Hembling’s story. There are only a few young men taking down Hembling’s posters, and the video shows them choosing to ignore him except when he engages them in conversation. One of the men is seen using a box cutter to take down the flyers, but at no time does he use it as a weapon, raise his voice, or threaten Hembling in any way.

Kelly found some troubling, er, discrepancies in another story told by Hembling. Kelly writes:

According to Hembling, sometime around 1995 he was on his way home at 2:00 am after working a night shift when he came upon [a sexual] assault in progress. He says he used his steel-toed boots as weapons to chase off the perpetrator. When the victim was too distraught to speak with him, Hembling says he contacted the police, waited until they arrived, and then quietly left without speaking to them. He says they later tracked him down at his home, where he gave a statement.

It’s hard to know whether this event actually occurred or not. There is no record—at least, not in the Vancouver police files—of Hembling being a material witness to a rape, and police blotters from that time period do not show a crime that matches Hembling’s description. However, this does not necessarily mean the event did not occur. Vancouver police did not fully computerize their data until 2002, and it is possible the police never reported the incident. Hembling claims the incident took place at a specific hospital, where he says he worked as a contractor for 18 months. The address he gives, however, is for a different hospital in a completely different part of the city. This raises the curious question of whether Hembling forget the name of the hospital he contracted with for 18 months, or whether he forget what part of the city he worked in for that same period of time. The real truth of the matter is anyone’s guess, because Hembling wouldn’t comment to The Beast on that or any other matter.

In other words: Cool story, bro.

3) Another thing the story gets right: it makes clear just how little the Men’s Rights movement does to actually help men — and how in many ways it can actually be terribly damaging to men who need real help. As Kelly writes,

the movement’s radicals might … do … immediate damage to those who most desperately need the MRM to succeed.

“When we talk about recovery from trauma and abuse, there were two things that helped me,” says Chris Anderson, executive director of the male-victim advocacy group Male Survivor and a sexual abuse survivor himself. “The first was realizing that I’m not alone; the second was hearing that recovery was possible.” Anderson is quick to dissociate himself from the men’s rights movement: “In [the MRM] people get that first message, that they’re not alone. I don’t know that they ever get the second message. And when they don’t get that second message, it turns into an endless feedback loop and eventually they say, ‘Oh my God, all of society is f**ked.’”

Indeed, Kelly writes:

It is telling to note that of the professional male-victim advocacy organizations I spoke with, every single one specifically asked that I not allow readers to think they were in any way related to the MRM.

But there are also some things that I think the article gets wrong.

1) I think it gives Men’s Rights activists way too much credit for their supposed good intentions. While there are some MRAs who do seem to be motivated at least in part by a sincere desire to help men, most of the MRAs I’ve encountered in the 3 years of doing this blog have clearly been motivated primarily by anger and hatred of feminists — and women in general. They don’t really seem to give a shit about doing anything to actually improve the lives of men — and the paucity of their accomplishments reflects this. In its relatively brief lifespan, AVFM has raised many hundreds of thousands of dollars. Has it set up any shelters or hotlines or helplines for men? Not a one.

2) It wildly exaggerates the importance of Hembling to the MRM — especially ironic given that Hembling has been more or less AWOL in recent months, producing only a few short videos and one article for AVFM.

3) It paints a picture of The Spearhead’s WF Price as a Men’s Rights “moderate.” Really? While it’s true that Price is not an AVFM-style hothead given to rants about “fucking your shit up,” his views are anything but moderate. This is a guy who thinks higher education is wasted on women, who blames the epidemic of rape in the armed forces on women, who celebrated one Mothers Day with a vicious transphobic rant, who once used the tragic death of a woman who’d just graduated from college to argue that “after 25, women are just wasting time.” He published posts on why women’s suffrage is a bad idea. Plus, have you met his commenters?

I was, however, kind of amazed to learn that Price is married … and to a feminist. No, really.

4) The article, while solidly researched, contains some small errors and simplifications that will no doubt give MRAs and others the excuse they need to dismiss the whole thing. Kelly refers to Reddit subreddits as Reddit “threads!” He refers to Matt Forney as an MRA! Oh no!

Still, whatever its flaws, this is an important piece, and one that tells a lot of truth about the Men’s Rights movement. Again — go read it!

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Argenti Aertheri
11 years ago

…lager and cider sounds pretty good actually…

Pecunium, should I get down there again before, idk, April >.< Can we make this happen?

kittehserf
11 years ago

Ophelia – that’s him! 😀

thenat – both, really. Mint sauce isn’t much of A Thing here generally, though you might get it with roast lamb in some restaurants. Specifically, we don’t have it in our house. Took me long enough to get past “mint = toothpaste” and eat chocolate mint biscuits; I ain’t puttin’ it near meat or veg!

dustydeste
dustydeste
11 years ago

I don’t like beer (me & hops aren’t friends), but I do like boozy cider (not that the soft stuff’s bad, either), and I like sweet stuff, so I still think I’ll keep it on my to-try list, though not in a keep-taste-testing-it-til-I’m-so-drunk-I-puke kind of way. Also I’m only 23, so student drinks are fair game, I think 😛

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

The thing about snakebite and black for me is that it seems to produce that vomity feeling much faster than any other kind of booze.

opheliamonarch
11 years ago

Bloody hell, SNAKEBITE! Soooo sick!

@thenatfantastic, Mr M and I stayed here after Uni, Mr M was secretary of Rock Soc. Faaarrr too many pub crawls, not enough course work.

@argenti, thank you 🙂 Opheliac downloaded, thought it was appropriate.

Also, meant to link this video before, the corset in it was the one I was referring too.

http://youtu.be/GGF7bJdn6zI

thenatfantastic
11 years ago

@CassandraSays – My friends have made the designated birthday drink Buckfast.

I knew I was getting old this year when on my birthday I vommed all over a pub, stopped to clean it up with a mop and bucket and then gathered all my friends together to leave while the bouncers stood and looked nonplussed about how I’d pre-empted all their requests. I then left my own birthday celebration because we’d ended up at some godawful trendy bar and all I wanted to do was buy falafel and walk home.

thenatfantastic
11 years ago

@Ophelia – if you don’t mind me asking you, how old are you? There’s a good chance you might know BoyFantastic OR a couple who’s wedding I went to this summer and met there. I’ve met a couple of BFs exes and their friends through feminist activism. He certainly has a type!

opheliamonarch
11 years ago

Anyone remember Red witch and Green death? Christ they weren’t kidding about the death part!
Can’t remember what was in them, I know Red Witch had pernot and larger or cider, can’t remember which one.

thenatfantastic
11 years ago

When I was 16-18 I lived in a pub with my cousin and we used to make a Glow Stick (you had to split all this between two pint pots): Double vodka, pernod, blue wkd, orange juice and lager.

It still glowed when it came back up :/

thenatfantastic
11 years ago

*Sorry meant that the bottles were split between pint pots. Shots were per glass.

opheliamonarch
11 years ago

@thenatfantastic, You’re asking my age?…oh soooo old now…..soooo old.

If I tell you I’m gonna get depressed when you tell me you’re 25.

Okay…here it goes…

I’m 37.

Okay, bring it on…

Argenti Aertheri
11 years ago

That’d be FLAG!

The orderly at the very end also makes my “hot people” list.

opheliamonarch
11 years ago

Mmmmhhh, glowy puke, they didn’t have that when I were a lass.

kittehserf
11 years ago

37?

Young whippersnapper!

Seriously, I thought you were early-mid twenties from your pic. Y’know, the one you said was awful.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

Orange juice and lager sounds like the perfect recipe for later misery.

katz
11 years ago

It’s like a shandy except terrible.

kittehserf
11 years ago

Mmmmhhh, glowy puke, they didn’t have that when I were a lass.

Luxury.

When I were a lass, we had to get up in the morning at eleven o’clock at night to go t’ mines, and had to light our way with our own puke.

opheliamonarch
11 years ago

@kitteh, oh I lurve you (that might be the gin talking) you just bein’ nice. 🙂

Ally S
11 years ago

My older brother used to get drunk on tequila mixed with Sunny D on a regular basis. I’m glad he doesn’t do that anymore.

pecunium
11 years ago

hostilityboy:

And let’s be clear: I NEVER said that felling those masts was wrong. I used it as an example of a legitimate political movement legitimately causing material damage in an effort to accomplish legitimate goals.

Lie by implication. You made a direct comparison, in an attempt to show us as hypocritical of one type of destruction (which you lauded as legitimate political expression) with another; now the idea was that we, as internallu consistent, needed to decry that as horrid; or be hypocrites.

But, since you had already made a plea for the generic legitimacy of defacing artworks, you were implying the other was in some way unjustified.

So, either you agree that any political movement is justfied in any act of destruction (ends and means being cojoined, and a belief in the rightness of one’s cause being sufficient) or you don’t.

Since you have expressed a lack of support for feminism, and you used feminists to buttress your position, a “fair-minded” person would have to assume you actually think they were in the wrong.

kittehserf
11 years ago

No I ain’t! When have I ever claimed to be nice?

(I said that once to someone who said “that wasn’t very nice”. Stunned ’em into silence.)

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

Now spirits with orange juice, that’s OK. Though far better was the place that used the fancy organic tangerine juice for their mixed drinks.

opheliamonarch
11 years ago

Sorry ’bout all the vids, but appropriate:
@kitteh

http://youtu.be/Xe1a1wHxTyo

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

Also, if we’re recommending things, it’s now possible in California to get calamansi juice in bottles in the chill section at some Asian grocery stores. Mix that with tequila for easy awesomeness.

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