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The Daily Beast takes on the Men’s Rights movement — and takes down A Voice for Men’s John Hembling

John Hembling, possibly lying about something
John Hembling, possibly lying about something

The bad publicity bonanza for Men’s Rights activists continues — and it couldn’t happen to a worse group of  people.

Yesterday, the Daily Beast published a long-awaited piece on the Men’s Rights movement, and it’s a doozy. If you’re a regular reader of this site, trust me, you’ll want to read the whole thing, like now. The piece, by R. Tod Kelly, is long — some 6000 words — but worth it.

It’s mostly on the money, but with a few notable flaws.

Here’s what it gets right:

1) It captures the pervasive misogyny of the Men’s Rights movement in general, and of A Voice for Men in particular.

2) In an extended section, it profiles AVFM’s John Hembling, and tears apart some of his most blatant lies — including the now legendary box-cutter incident, in which Hembling claims to have stared down a mob of 20-30 feminists brandishing boxcutters.

As Kelly notes:

Vancouver police records show that there was indeed an altercation in September of 2012 between Hembling and others seeking to tear down men’s rights posters. However, according to the police, Hembling was arguing with two or three people, not being accosted by a “mob” of any size. When questioned by the authorities, neither Hembling nor witnesses mentioned seeing any weapons. …

Curiously enough, Hembling actually videotaped the events and had his AV4M Radio partner Karen Straughan post it online. The discussion with the police has been conveniently edited out, but the rest of the video clearly matches police records and not Hembling’s story. There are only a few young men taking down Hembling’s posters, and the video shows them choosing to ignore him except when he engages them in conversation. One of the men is seen using a box cutter to take down the flyers, but at no time does he use it as a weapon, raise his voice, or threaten Hembling in any way.

Kelly found some troubling, er, discrepancies in another story told by Hembling. Kelly writes:

According to Hembling, sometime around 1995 he was on his way home at 2:00 am after working a night shift when he came upon [a sexual] assault in progress. He says he used his steel-toed boots as weapons to chase off the perpetrator. When the victim was too distraught to speak with him, Hembling says he contacted the police, waited until they arrived, and then quietly left without speaking to them. He says they later tracked him down at his home, where he gave a statement.

It’s hard to know whether this event actually occurred or not. There is no record—at least, not in the Vancouver police files—of Hembling being a material witness to a rape, and police blotters from that time period do not show a crime that matches Hembling’s description. However, this does not necessarily mean the event did not occur. Vancouver police did not fully computerize their data until 2002, and it is possible the police never reported the incident. Hembling claims the incident took place at a specific hospital, where he says he worked as a contractor for 18 months. The address he gives, however, is for a different hospital in a completely different part of the city. This raises the curious question of whether Hembling forget the name of the hospital he contracted with for 18 months, or whether he forget what part of the city he worked in for that same period of time. The real truth of the matter is anyone’s guess, because Hembling wouldn’t comment to The Beast on that or any other matter.

In other words: Cool story, bro.

3) Another thing the story gets right: it makes clear just how little the Men’s Rights movement does to actually help men — and how in many ways it can actually be terribly damaging to men who need real help. As Kelly writes,

the movement’s radicals might … do … immediate damage to those who most desperately need the MRM to succeed.

“When we talk about recovery from trauma and abuse, there were two things that helped me,” says Chris Anderson, executive director of the male-victim advocacy group Male Survivor and a sexual abuse survivor himself. “The first was realizing that I’m not alone; the second was hearing that recovery was possible.” Anderson is quick to dissociate himself from the men’s rights movement: “In [the MRM] people get that first message, that they’re not alone. I don’t know that they ever get the second message. And when they don’t get that second message, it turns into an endless feedback loop and eventually they say, ‘Oh my God, all of society is f**ked.’”

Indeed, Kelly writes:

It is telling to note that of the professional male-victim advocacy organizations I spoke with, every single one specifically asked that I not allow readers to think they were in any way related to the MRM.

But there are also some things that I think the article gets wrong.

1) I think it gives Men’s Rights activists way too much credit for their supposed good intentions. While there are some MRAs who do seem to be motivated at least in part by a sincere desire to help men, most of the MRAs I’ve encountered in the 3 years of doing this blog have clearly been motivated primarily by anger and hatred of feminists — and women in general. They don’t really seem to give a shit about doing anything to actually improve the lives of men — and the paucity of their accomplishments reflects this. In its relatively brief lifespan, AVFM has raised many hundreds of thousands of dollars. Has it set up any shelters or hotlines or helplines for men? Not a one.

2) It wildly exaggerates the importance of Hembling to the MRM — especially ironic given that Hembling has been more or less AWOL in recent months, producing only a few short videos and one article for AVFM.

3) It paints a picture of The Spearhead’s WF Price as a Men’s Rights “moderate.” Really? While it’s true that Price is not an AVFM-style hothead given to rants about “fucking your shit up,” his views are anything but moderate. This is a guy who thinks higher education is wasted on women, who blames the epidemic of rape in the armed forces on women, who celebrated one Mothers Day with a vicious transphobic rant, who once used the tragic death of a woman who’d just graduated from college to argue that “after 25, women are just wasting time.” He published posts on why women’s suffrage is a bad idea. Plus, have you met his commenters?

I was, however, kind of amazed to learn that Price is married … and to a feminist. No, really.

4) The article, while solidly researched, contains some small errors and simplifications that will no doubt give MRAs and others the excuse they need to dismiss the whole thing. Kelly refers to Reddit subreddits as Reddit “threads!” He refers to Matt Forney as an MRA! Oh no!

Still, whatever its flaws, this is an important piece, and one that tells a lot of truth about the Men’s Rights movement. Again — go read it!

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CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

My time-waster sensors are so finely tuned that they beeped the moment our tedious new friend showed up.

Athywren
Athywren
11 years ago

“Top ten percent in physical attractiveness” made me blink a bit; when have you ever heard a woman describe a man like that?!”

I didn’t even know we were ranked in any formal way to be honest with you. I mean, I get that Brad Pitt is at least six Hottimres ahead of me, but the idea that there is an objective standard of attractiveness? Bizarre.
I mean, I know women are a different species and all that, but I’ve never considered that there’s an objective spectrum of attractiveness for women, so why would there be one for men? I’ll grant you that there are women I find physically attractive, and that there are women who I don’t find physically attractive, and I could probably rank them to some extent if I wanted to be crude, but that would be a purely subjective measure even if it wasn’t squicky.

Many men are egalitarian, but at the end of the day, men don’t do as much child rearing – even the most egalitarian men don’t.

Can we please stop these sweeping generalisations of what men do or don’t do, or what we do or don’t want? I have no kids of my own, but I happen to know that my brother spends as much of his time taking care of my niece as her mother does. It may be true that most men aren’t as interested in their children as women are, but it isn’t true of men as a whole.
It’s funny, I very rarely hear feminists making sweeping and, frankly, derogatory statements about all men, but I hear it with remarkable frequency from the MRAs and their supporters.

Maybe you feminists should think a bit about the fact that, as long as we are human, there will never be a resolution to this issue that doesn’t involve “sleeping with the enemy.”

Men are not the enemy of women. Do not presume that a shared chromosome gives you the right to speak for the rest of us.
You do not speak for me.

“There are men who comment here as well as women, and people who don’t fit as easily into the traditional gender binary; we talk about issues that affect everyone.”

At the very best negligible. Didn’t your recent commenter survey reveal that not only is this blog’s commenter demographic less diverse than even the worst men’s rights websites, but also that it is basically little more than a large group of über-privileged middle-class whities?

In what way are those two matters related? Lets assume that every single commenter on here is an über-privileged middle-class whitie… how does that change the distribution of genders?
Btw, hint for you, if you’re going to move the goalposts… don’t do it in the same paragraph that you erect them. Makes it kinda obvious. Learn to be irrational a little more subtly.

hellkell
hellkell
11 years ago

Judging by the comments, they appear to be using *that* CDC study.

That was what I thought after I calmed down, plus what Pecunium said about 12 month stats.

Way too much face value on display.

thenatfantastic
thenatfantastic
11 years ago

So that means he’s not going to answer my questions about F4Js antics and instead wank on about ‘what is art’ and I’m the derailer?

ahostileworld
11 years ago

What passes for art is in the eye of the beholder. Fine engineering is a form of art.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

@ Athywren

Nonsense! Mr Price is clearly a 2.783, whereas Brad Pitt is a 9.175534534. How is this not immediately obvious to everyone?

hellkell
hellkell
11 years ago

What passes for art is in the eye of the beholder. Fine engineering is a form of art.

Aesthetics 101 wank ahoy!

Fucking thank you, Captain Obvious.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

@ auggz

But, you see, he IS the beholder of whom he speaks.

katz
11 years ago

The weird thing about the top ten percent comment is that it implies that she doesn’t care about his appearance in and of itself, but only about him being better looking than other men. Which in turn implies that she likes his appearance primarily because it’s a limited resource: It’s something she thinks other women want but can’t have.

titianblue
titianblue
11 years ago

And in the latest episode of “Dancing with the Goalposts”, @ahostileworld will be attempting the quickstep. here’s how zie got on in training …

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

It’s something she thinks other women want but can’t have.

Putting aside for a moment the sheer lulziness of that idea…do people actually think this way? As in, they’re not attracted to people because they’re attracted to them but because they think that by fucking this person they’re getting one over on other people?

Maybe I’m weird, but I don’t really give a shit whether or not anyone else finds the people who I want to fuck attractive. What’s important is that I do.

katz
11 years ago

In addition to his being a troglodyte who can’t imagine any purpose to art except to use to score cheap points in conversations, do observe that our troll just advocated burning your enemies’ houses down as long as no one is in them.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

Fine commenting is an artform. Does this mean that we can ban people for commenting ineptly?

katz
11 years ago

If you like, say, wavy hair and brown eyes, then if you wanted to talk about how your husband is good looking, you’d just say “he has wavy hair and brown eyes.” If you instead went off about how only two percent of men have that hair texture, that would imply a very strange relationship. Or if you like tall guys, it would be strange to say “he’s three standard deviations above the mean in height,” as though you’d stop liking him if everyone else got taller.

ahostileworld
11 years ago

@ katz, skipping past the pointless ad hominems, do you honestly think there is *never* any justification for burning down your enemies’ houses? It’s always wrong then, is it mate? May I just ask then how WW2 was won by the allies? Did Churchill and Stalin win it by being respectful connoisseurs of fine central European architecture?

And @ thenatfantastic, I *did* answer *all* of your questions. Thing is, you did not like my answers. I cannot help that.

hellkell
hellkell
11 years ago

That was not ad hom, you nitwit.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

Note that the people who run art galleries in the UK have now become the enemies of FFJ, somehow, via the latest goalpost shift.

katz
11 years ago

Seriously, what do you say to someone who thinks burning down houses is a morally right thing to do (and his example is…Stalin?). Aside from “I’ll let the police know to keep an eye on you,” I mean.

Athywren
Athywren
11 years ago

Is Families Need Fathers part of the MRM?

Fathers for Justice is, without a doubt, a men’s rights organisation.

Yes, we know. What about Families Need Fathers? Tangents are fine and all, but they don’t really make your point.

Think about them what you like I but they founded FNF.

A group founded in 2002 by Matt O’Connor went on to found a group which was founded in 1974 by Alick Elithorn & Keith Parkin?
The two are sister groups, even though the CEO of FNF made it relatively clear in an interview that they weren’t related:

In May 2004 the fathers rights campaign sprang to the world’s attention when two members of Fathers4Justice (F4J) threw two condoms filled with purple-dyed flour into the chamber of the House of Commons, one of which hit then-Prime Minister Tony Blair. However, any public sympathy for the campaign evaporated when stunts became increasingly disturbed and it was reported that members of the group had plotted to kidnap the son of Tony Blair. Has FNF had to work hard on distancing itself from these groups?

“F4J were brilliant campaigners who either didn’t want to or couldn’t make the step up to lobbying and evidence-based campaigning. I think history will judge them kindly for raising issues of which most people were ignorant.

“In terms of fundraising I think that ironically F4J helped us by making the case for ‘Fathers’ amongst organisations who wanted to support the issues but did not want to be associated with their methods.”

How interesting…

Funded, not founded. Sorry, typo.

Ah. Then so what? I fund the red cross. Doesn’t make them a part of the feminist movement.

Interesting. A human rights advocate defaces a portrait of a notorious reactionary parasite and kleptocrate, and all of a sudden, you turn all conservative and traditionalist and bloviate about how the guy defaced a piece of ‘British Cultural Heritage ™. Wow, you’re really fighting for the feminist cause here, aren’t you? The same monarchy that had suffragettes rounded up and beaten up under queen Victoria has now found itself a very interesting bedfellow.

Newsflash: no human rights movement has ever gained traction when it was not willing to make a noise and break some stuff. I do not lament the loss of a piece of tasteless, monarchist kitsch, especially if the defacement improved the work if anything.

So, defacing art = ok if we disagree with the content of the art? Ok… if anyone wants to see Warhol’s “Campbell Soup,” you’d better hurry. I just learned that it’s ok to deface it if I think it’s crap on some level.

I answer *some* questions but my troll sensors are super-high-tech. I can detect an attempted derailment from hundreds of light years off.

But you have no short range sensors, I guess?

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

I’d say “how about we leave the houses standing so that other people, who are not your enemies, can use them later”, because I’m practical that way.

Argenti Aertheri
Argenti Aertheri
11 years ago

“Puts on the popcorn while waiting for our resident stats genius to take you down.”

Assuming you mean me, which seems a safe assumption as the survey was my baby, I was asleep. But here I am!

And, in order:

Yes we’re very white, but that had no correlation to feeling accepted here, a question the r/mr study did not ask.

Uber-privileged? Uh, no. Nearly exactly half of us are middle class, and about a third are working or lower class. Leaving less than 20% as upper middle or upper class.

We are a large group though, I got over 1,600 replies! The curious can view the results here — http://infogr.am/Manboobz-Demographics

Alice Sanguinaria
11 years ago

katz – “I’m sorry that you believe that human rights movements involve waging everything short of actual war”?

katz
11 years ago

Also WWII is a particularly amusing example since the allies did, in fact, have a division tasked with preserving art and architecture.

You know who went on a campaign to destroy all his enemies’ cultural heritage? Hitler. (I think this is an acceptable context.)

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

I was going to go with the Taliban.

ahostileworld
11 years ago

Irrelevant point. Berlin. Dresden. Cologne. Stuttgart. Munich. Nuremberg. Brunswick. Hanover. Frankfurt. Dozens of German cities. The British bombers and the Red Army won the war for the allies.

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