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Amanda Marcotte takes down Sunshine Mary; Mary digs her hole deeper

sunshine

So Amanda Marcotte has some thoughts on Sunshine Mary’s post about feminism allegedly reducing women to nothing more than sex objects:

Why should women want the attention of men who see them as nothing more than unpaid servants and semen toilets? …

The alternative to having a hateful misogynist around who expects you to clean up after him, accept his ranting about how women are a repulsive subhuman class whose only purpose is service to men, and to masturbate him without any hope of sexual pleasure yourself is simple: Not being with such a man. As many feminists can tell you, there’s a really pleasant alternative: Men who like women and like to hang out with us and aren’t just tolerating us in exchange for sex and housework.

But what if, as manosphere men (and antifeminist women like Sunshine Mary) like to gloat, you can’t find a man?

Being alone is better than being with a man who thinks you’re part of a degraded class put here to serve him. No matter how much misogynists may rant, they can’t get around this inherent problem in their philosophy, which is that “alone” is always a superior alternative to their company.

Sunshine Mary has responded with a post that basically argues, well, but men don’t like you, you fat slutty feminists — take that!

One of the core pillars of feminism seems to be trying to control how men think about women.  We want to be seen as smart, so by fiat order we’ll command men to see us as equally intelligent.  We want to be seen as having the ability to be sexually promiscuous, so we’ll command men to hold a positive opinion of sluttery.  We want to be seen as beautiful at 200 pounds, so we’ll command men to find us hot despite our obesity.

But it doesn’t work.  Men don’t like slutty women for anything other than sex, as the last comment thread here rather conclusively proved.  Men don’t find fat women attractive.  Men don’t like bitchy, loud-mouthed mannish feminists.  Men don’t care about women’s supposed careers.  All the commands in the world will only cause men to keep their opinions quiet, but it does not change those opinions.  All the attempts in the world at resocializing men to like what feminism has turned women into will always fail because it works against the natural order of things.

Now this is just nonsensical and, you know, not true for all but a backwards and rather assholish subset of men. But it’s what follows that’s really chilling — not chilling because it reflects reality, but chilling because it suggests how punitive and self-hating Sunshine Mary’s philosophy really is.

She argues that feminists find the Manosphere “scary” because manosphere misogynists won’t do what feminists want them to do.

It is scary to imagine that men will stop doing what they are told by women to do.  It is scary to feminists in particular because, instead of being dependent on one man like I am, they are dependent on men as a group to fund them.

Men pay the majority of taxes in the United States.  Without men’s taxes, student financial aid for Women’s Studies degrees will dry up.  Without men’s taxes, baby mamas will starve.  Without men financing it, women who are being placed into corporate leadership simply as a response to affirmative action and who then quit these jobs after a year to write tear-filled articles in the Atlantic about work-life balance, demanding even more subsidies from men to ensure that women never need to suffer the consequences for their stupid choices, will cease.  I only have to manage my husband’s opinion of me in order to secure his provisioning; feminists have to control all men’s opinions of them in order to secure their provisioning.

Yep, that’s right. Sunshine Mary believes that women are incapable of taking care of themselves and so must depend, essentially, on appeasing men in order to survive. She thinks she’s lucky because she only has to appease one man, while women who actually, you know, earn a living have to appease all men. Because they’re not really earning a living. They’re just playing at earning a living because the men of the world are nice enough to humor them.

But don’t make the men mad, Sunshine Mary warns, because then you’re screwed!

And she seems rather pleased that she can make this threat from what she percieves as her position of relative security.

How fucked up is that?

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bodycrimes
11 years ago

For me, it’s the comments to SSM’s post that are comedy gold. I laughed so hard at a couple of them that it hurt my tummy.

bodycrimes
11 years ago

oops! Sorry for the double posting.

lowquacks
lowquacks
11 years ago

Temple of Whorus

I’m having flashbacks to Ludacris’ and Nate Dogg’s (decidedly non-feminist) “Area Codes” (abominable ho-man/whore-d’oeuvres/whoroscope/southern ho-spitality/northern ex-hosure. . .)

kittehserf
11 years ago

Elderslut

Jesus Cat

Fi – love your kitty gravatar! Is that your furry overlord?

Well, Bumshine looks younger and less conservative than I expected – completely unremarkable. Just like all the women she’s sniping at for being not-supermodels.

In order for men to enter the bar they must answer the Riddle of the Clitoris.

I hope that means they have to answer me* these questions three.

*not literally me. I am not volunteering for that job.

Fi
Fi
11 years ago

Sassy kitty is the dearly departed Maggie, who loved mockery so much she was often photographed with her tongue poking out — perfect for an anti-asshole site, I thought! I miss that little beast.

Fi
Fi
11 years ago

Mum named her after her favourite Rod Stewart song (hey, it’s about an Elderslut!) but I nicknamed her Magrat after my favourite wet hen.

LadySunami
LadySunami
11 years ago

Her husband has cheated on her multiple times? That’s terrible. She might be a misogynist, but that doesn’t mean she deserves being cheated on. At least she’s found some way to cope. I just wish she’d found a project that’s more productive and actually helpful to men and women, rather then writing articles on why women must be submissive or else things will be horrible for them (apparently).

kittehserf
11 years ago

Maggie looks like she could give Grumpy Cat a run for her money, pulling that face! I’m sorry she’s departed.

Lady Mondegreen
Lady Mondegreen
11 years ago

ceebarks, thanks.

They have four little girls? How fuckin’ sad.

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
11 years ago

Speaking of kids in bad situations, I’m still not sure how Sunshine got away with pointing out that the woman who was planning to marry Mark Minter (did that ever happen?) was making a really bad parenting decision in planning to give him access to her underage daughter.

99.9% of what Sunshine has to say is nonsense, but she was right about that, and I’m still amazed that she didn’t get excommunicated for it. I guess by then the backlash against Minty must already have started.

titianblue
titianblue
11 years ago

@cassandrasays

“The Ceiling Cat smote me. I was smitten.”

Same verb form as “write”. /smug

rodafowa
11 years ago

I find some fat women attractive. I like loud-mouthed feminists. And I care about my wife’s awesome, contributing-something-of-genuine-worth-to-the-world career considerably more than about my own. I’m therefore shocked to learn that I’m not a man. I can only assume that it was the incredible hairiness that fooled me until now.

Brooked
Brooked
11 years ago

@David
I checked the comment thread and cannot believe how much use term “semen toilet” is getting overall. The phrase is icky and off-putting at best, so it’s a bit shocking to see one poster use it FIVE times in one brief paragraph while praising traditional marriage.

SSM: “In other words: ALWALT. Sluts want to be semen toilets for lots of men; married women want to be semen toilets for one man, or at least light-heartedly treated that way in the bedroom.” Okey Dokey then.

titianblue
titianblue
11 years ago

It says a lot about a man who thinks like that.

Brooked
Brooked
11 years ago

Another poster

“Meanwhile, the manosphere/tradosphere holds that the Bible is all truth, that men and women are different, think differently and process information differently.”

Fundies and PUAS, anti-feminism has led to some very strange bedfellows. And it seems like this Red Pill/Blue Pill nonsense is never going way. Sigh.

hellkell
hellkell
11 years ago

Elderslut? I prefer Slut Emeritus, thank you very much.

Chie Satonaka
Chie Satonaka
11 years ago

I checked the comment thread and cannot believe how much use term “semen toilet” is getting overall. The phrase is icky and off-putting at best, so it’s a bit shocking to see one poster use it FIVE times in one brief paragraph while praising traditional marriage.

Amanda purposely uses a term that could potentially have been viewed as hyperbolic or unnecessarily extreme to illustrate just how hateful and bigoted this group of people is….and they embrace it, totally proving her point! That’s really something.

Gawker recently covered Roosh’s “bang chart” of the world, and it was fun reading the comments of people who were entirely shocked to know that these folks exist.

I saw this picture of Patrick Stewart on Tumblr this morning and it gave me a happy, so sharing it to spread good vibes. I really think he’s an awesome person. He went through so much trauma as a kid and instead of continuing the cycle of violence, he used that experience to become an activist. It’s really badass.

http://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_ma02n88wsK1qc91k6o1_500.jpg

hellkell
hellkell
11 years ago

I wish Mary would learn how to use the word “dominant” correctly. She keeps using “dominate” when she clearly means the other and it’s really stupid.

I saw that pic of her, and yeah, she shouldn’t be throwing any shade at the fat ugly feminists. Not with that hair.

Chie Satonaka
Chie Satonaka
11 years ago

hellkell!

hellkell
hellkell
11 years ago

Chie!

Chie Satonaka
Chie Satonaka
11 years ago

I saw that pic of her, and yeah, she shouldn’t be throwing any shade at the fat ugly feminists. Not with that hair.

Naughty. (Even if I did laugh). But naughty.

MordsithJ
MordsithJ
11 years ago

I may be warped but when I read “Eldersluts” it makes me think of a terrible hypothetical porn movie in which a coven of feminist witches go out of their way to corrupt as many fresh-faced Mormon missionary boys as possible.

http://images.lazygamer.net/2012/10/shut-up-and-take-my-money-480×300.jpg

ceebarks
ceebarks
11 years ago

I’m not really into super fat guys myself– I’m attracted to a wide range of builds but at some point “hefty” gets into “hm… no thanks” territory for me, attraction-wise.

If there is anything I agree with the “red pill” crowd about, it’s that attraction isn’t necessarily a conscious choice. Who has never been physically attracted to someone you know upfront is a disaster waiting to happen, or wished they could be more attracted to someone who’s otherwise a great match?! It’s not that easy to find people you mutually click with on a physical level, plus an intellectual, emotional, and practical level. Keeping it going longterm requires a lot of flexibility and honesty. Maybe also some sheer stubbornness.

Dan Savage covered all that stuff about 20 years ago, though.

It’d be beyond weird to start a blog trashing people’s morals and fundamental human worth just ’cause they don’t turn me on, though. Or ’cause I don’t turn them on!

Maybe I’ll start dodging my taxes.

Sorry ’bout the link, David.

Hi Sunshine!