So a helpful Twitterer told me that I was a frequent topic of conversation on A Voice for Men’s Honey Badger “radio” show last night — that’s the one hosted by Karen Straughan (Girl Writes What) and Alison Tieman (Typhon Blue) and a newer addition to AVFM’s FeMRA stable named Della Burton. Bored, I went over to take a listen to the archived show. Well, bits and pieces of it, anyway. Life is short, and every minute of this show felt about an hour long.
Anyway, I missed most of whatever it was they said about me, but I did manage to force myself to sit through a good chunk of the segment featuring none other than Nick Reading, the guy who’s running a joke campaign for city council of Edmonton Alberta as the “Patriarchy Party” candidate. You know, the dude we talked about just yesterday.
The gals did their best to play along with his over-the-top patriarchal schtick, proclaiming themselves submissive inferior females unworthy of his manly phallus, and so on. It was as gratingly unfunny as you might imagine, and it went on and on. Even the Honey Badgers, perhaps wondering if this whole segment wasn’t a rather apt metaphor for their own role within A Voice for Men and the Men’s Rights movement at large, couldn’t quite bring themselves to laugh at any of Nick’s, er, humor.
At least not until, about 49 minutes into the show, he brought out the rape jokes.
Take a listen:
Paul “The Thought of Fucking Your Shit Up Gives Me an Erection” Elam, meet Nick “If They Didn’t Scream No, How Else Would I Get an Erection” Reading.
In case you weren’t able to make all that out, due to the clear-as-mud sound engineering job of AVFM’s James Huff — you may remember him as the guy responsible for this amazing rant — I have transcribed the exchange below as best I could, cutting out a few repeated phrases and ignoring some remarks that got buried under other remarks.
Nick Reading: No never means no. It only means yes. That’s an understanding that we have within the patriarchy.
Karen Straughan: It is.
Alison Tieman: That’s true. Actually “no” should be stricken from the English language because it simply makes no sense. How could any woman ever say no to the holy phallus unless she was criminally insane?
Nick: Criminally insane, yes.
Della Burton [?]: Criminally, yes.
Karen: But, but we shouldn’t strike “no” from all the dictionaries and the lexicons of language simply because there are numerous times in the course of a day when a man loves to say “no” to a woman.
Nick: I would almost insist on striking it from the non-male vernacular but if they didn’t scream it, how else would I get an erection?
[Awkward pause]
[Laughter]
Della [?]: Oh my goodness.
Karen: Right, you’re right.
Della: I hadn’t even thought of that.
Karen: So no is still in.
A Voice for Men: Promoting Human Rights, One Rape Joke at a Time
EDITED TO ADD: Below, a video on YouTube about this episode of Honey Badger radio, which not only looks at the show itself but at what was going on in the official chatroom for the show at the time, which turns out to be even creepier than the stuff said by Nick Reading on the show itself.
Along with the standard MRA misogyny from some of AVFM’s regulars, there were bizarre sexualized comments directed at the so-called Honey Badgers themselves: one commenter went on at length about how he wanted to use Karen Straughan’s breast milk in his coffee (and spike her coffee with his semen). Palani provides screenshots and everything. Some of her commentary is a bit problematic — she refers to them as “retards” at one point — but if you’ve got 15 minutes it’s worth a watch.
[VIDEO REMOVED BY REQUEST OF VIDEOMAKER]
Viscaria definitely hit the nail on the head there. As atrocious as these ladies are, I almost feel bad for them. It’s only a matter of time until this burns them really bad, in ways either private or public.
I can’t get over how he’s wearing that hat in the picture.
DUDE. IT IS 2013. IF YOU’RE OLD ENOUGH TO BE LOSING YOUR HAIR, YOU’RE TOO OLD TO BE WEARING BASEBALL CAPS AT ‘JAUNTY’ ANGLES.
Well… yeah I haven’t got words. All I can contribute at this point is a reaction. Maybe… maybe I’ll come back later; right now I just can’t with this.
Even if it was, they chose wrong, they still laughed.
@ therainparade
No shit. You know what a rape joke is, in practical terms? A warning that the person making it thinks rape is no big deal. When a man is making that joke to a woman, it’s a way of testing her boundaries to see if she’s likely to defend herself if attacked, and both of the FeMRAs in that recording just signaled “nope, no matter how uncomfortable you’re making me I won’t fight back” loud and clear.
@dustydeste
Aw, that link needed a warning! Appetite lost.
Welcome therainparade!
I ALMOST feel sorry for GWW, and then I remember when she had the chance to say, “you know, hitting people is not okay. Full stop,” she instead made all sorts of concessions for IPV.
Then I don’t feel sorry for her anymore.
It’s not satire if it’s basically what you believe, dudes. If satire worked like you think, Jonathan Swift would have written his Modest Proposal at the local Baby-Q pit.
I actually didn’t know about Calming Manatee. That’s a good resource.
This is something that “edgy” dudebro comics like Tosh don’t understand. When you’re a member of the dominant class making jokes at the expense of a minority class, YOU ARE NOT BEING SUBVERSIVE. You are upholding the status quo. Culturally, we’ve swung back around to this bullshit idea that being “non-PC” is subversive. It’s not.
Too many comedians think they’re doing it right as long as they’re making people angry, regardless of who or why.
Come on, guys, most of us figured out when we were two that we could hit people and provoke a reaction, and the novelty wore off shortly thereafter.
It’s like being “controversial” is often so much more important that actually making people laugh. And controversial can be good IF you’re working toward positive change. But this? This is just sick. What positive change could ever come from a rape joke? Even in their twisted minds?
Wanda Sykes talking about how convenient it would be to leave her vagina at home is a “rape joke” that works….maybe it’s a stretch to call that bit a rape joke, but obviously one of the issues that she’s hinting at is sexual assault.
This douche joking about how he can only get it up if the woman is screaming no is an example of a rape joke that doesn’t work.
Baby-Q.
<3!
D: Sorry, MaudeLL! I guess I kinda figured that the fact that it was a reaction to the above grossness was warning enough… I’ll put a content warning in next time I post a gif of puking.
The only ‘punching up’ rape joke I would call that is Ever Mainard’s “Here’s your Rape” routine.
Warning: it’s real dark.
I don’t understand how they can sit there, listen to him, agree with him, and honestly think that they’re on the right side. I mean, I can understand thinking the “other” gender needs attention and support… feminist with a penis, it makes sense to me… but how can you think a group devoted to destroying your rights is something you want to ally yourself with? I completely fail to understand feMRAs. Is it some bizarre form of Stockholm syndrome or something?
@freemage
I also think that “you can’t tell rape jokes” (or race/disability/etc jokes) is an ethical point – it’s basically saying that an ethical person wouldn’t say those sort of jokes. As ethics frameworks (e.g. university ethics committees and associated documentation) points out to us, the end does not automatically justify the means. Therefore, getting a laugh from a few people or promoting in-group bonding (possible desired outcomes from joke telling) do not justify making the sorts of jokes in that radio show, or similar others outlined here.
Hehe, no problem dustydeste, it was semi-tongue-in-cheek.
The argument has really never been “you can’t tell rape jokes” as in “I forbid you to”, it’s always been “if you tell rape jokes I will think you’re an insensitive asshole”.
The MRM: assholes, all the way down.
But, really, assholes actually have a function in the human body. These folks have absolutely no function. At all. They’re like, skin tags on the armpit of humanity.
Mind you, MRAs seem to think that people thinking poorly of them is the same thing as state-enforced official censorship, so…
A group of female comedians in India (All India Bakchod) have just released a video which satirises victim blaming and is a ‘punching up’ rape joke. (TW: rape, victim blaming, abuse, VAW):
http://www.youtube.com/user/allindiabakchod
Oops, should embed now: