Categories
a voice for men antifeminism doxing drama kings edmonton entitled babies evil women harassment imaginary backwards land men who should not ever be with women ever misogyny MRA not-quite-explicit threats not-quite-plausible deniability oppressed white men paul elam playing the victim rape rape culture taking pleasure in women's pain the poster revolution has begun things that aren't fascism

For A Voice for Men, and its Edmonton offshoot, terrifying women is a form of “human rights activism.”

Men's Rights Edmonton activist at work
Men’s Rights Edmonton activist at work

So the self-described “human rights activists” at A Voice for Men have found three more women to harass. Here’s the story, which for many of you will have a depressingly familiar ring:

Members of Men’s Rights Edmonton, a small group that is for all intents and purposes a local chapter of A Voice for Men, has been putting up pictures targeting Lise Gotell, the chair of women’s and gender studies at the University of Alberta. The pictures, which seem inspired by “Wanted” posters of yore, feature a large portrait of Gotell and the caption:

Theft isn’t black. Bank fraud isn’t Jewish. And rape isn’t male.

“Just because you’re paid to demonize men doesn’t mean rape is gendered. Don’t be that bigot.

Gotell’s crime? She was involved in what appears to have been a remarkably effective rape awareness campaign focusing on date rape and featuring the slogan “Don’t Be That Guy.”

A Voice for Men took exception to the campaign because, even thought it did deal with the male victims of rape, it didn’t devote equal time to the problem of evil, false-accusing “girls.” No, really. Men’s Rights Edmonton Activists put up “satirical” versions of the campaign’s posters with the slogan “Don’t Be that Girl.” Now, MR-E and AVFM, at least according to the “argument” advanced on their new poster, seem to be upset that the campaign didn’t devote equal time to the problem of female rapists.  [Note: this paragraph has been corrected; see note at end of piece.]

Gotell spoke out against the posters, and now Men’s Rights Edmonton and AVFM are doing their best to smear her as a “bigot.” Because she doesn’t believe that women are responsible for half of all rapes.

Since this is not actually true — more on this in a later post — it’s hard to see how this makes her a bigot.

As a rule, I don’t support tearing down the posters of one’s ideological enemies. Free speech and all that. But these posters are different: they’re slanderous personal attacks designed to harass an individual. Were they posted in my neighborhood I would tear them down.

And evidently that’s what some people in Edmonton have been doing.

Indeed, one recent night, several members of Men’s Rights Edmonton claim to have caught two women doing just that. While they don’t seem to have video footage of the women tearing down the posters, the MRAs filmed themselves following the women down the street and angrily confronting them for this alleged crime.

They posted the video to YouTube, and AVFM posted it as well, under the typically overheated title “Men’s Rights Edmonton confronts fascists.” They screencapped images of both women from the video and announced their intention to uncover their personal information:

MR-E would like to know the names of these two women so that charges of destruction of property can be laid against them. Also, the world should know the identities of those who seek to silence and censor messages advocating for human rights.

Of course, this is ridiculous. Tearing down a poster that was almost certainly posted illegally in the first place isn’t “destruction of property.” No one is going to be prosecuted for this. The police have better things to do.

But of course that’s not the real intent here. The real intent here is to scare the shit out of these women and other feminists by exposing them to harassment online — like the woman labeled “Big Red” and countless other women who have been targeted by AVFM and other MRAs (sometimes completely erroneously).

AVFM’s Paul Elam gave the game away with an “editor’s note” added to the post:

[A] woman who vandalizes man’s property and then flips him off when he confronts her about it on a dark street at night only acts in this manner because she is certain she has absolutely nothing to fear. Feminists terrified of MHRAs? My ass.

Elam could not have made it any clearer: the main point of this kind of “activism” — which has become AVFM’s bread and butter — is all about intimidating women, not helping men.

AVFM, where terrifying individual women is “human rights activism.”

Here’s the appropriate response to that:

edmontonfingerPN

CORRECTION/CLARIFICATION: I rewrote the paragraph starting with “A Voice for Men took exception,” which confused AVRM/MR-E’s current objection to Gotell’s views with its original “argument” against the “Don’t Be That Guy” campaign.

938 Comments
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
Marie
Marie
11 years ago

@blackbloc

He’s part of that grand tradition of men who think their problem in getting a girlfriend lies in the fact that somehow every lower/working class woman in existence is marrying into the 1% rather than their “winning” personality which makes every human being, including most men, run away as fast as possible in the opposite direction when they come.

But…where are all the other women? Or are they just voluntarily celibate XD

greendaywantsavatars
greendaywantsavatars
11 years ago

Dude *facepalm* I am pretty sure you have no record of dragon fighting.

Marie
Marie
11 years ago

@jason

If that’s the case, they should be the ones fighting dragons to rescue the prince more often.

…and that’s what women are trying to do? You’re like listing things people are trying to do and acting like noones doing anything about it.

Fibinachi
Fibinachi
11 years ago

Besides, christ, dude, read your own words:

“If women become coal miners, coal miners will start to feel less useful because they have been taught bad things about other people, and their inability to shake their own worldview will make them angry and upset”

… You don’t go: “Offer them the explanation that women don’t, in fact, marry up” or “You don’t need to be the sole provider, that’s not all that defines masculine” or “Being a slave to other people’s opinions is a suckers game” or “Talk a bit about expectations in a relationship and how to structure task sharing” or “Talk about archetypes and definitions of power”, you jump straight to “If women marry down, men won’t feel upset about them being coal miners, because they’ll think they still have a chance at getting laid and getting married”.

this is wrong. It’s not the job of other people to make you more secure in your disbelief. It’s your own mind and your job to fucking make it work for you.

How many sectors of industry do you want blocked off on account of irate, angry people with issues about their own security and low self confidence? How many sectors of the job market are women not allowed into because them working there would make the people feel they can’t offer something special?

Why not attack the root of the god damn problem, that they think they have to offer something special (And, interestingly, that if a woman does something, it’s no longer special enough to warrant attention huh huh implication huh uh interesting thing huh huh).

Please.
Life a happy life.

BlackBloc (@XBlackBlocX)

>>>But…where are all the other women?

They’re all fucking sports stars and movie stars and rock stars and captains of industry, somehow. It’s a wonder those people have time to do anything else but fuck women.

HYPERGAMY!

Alice Sanguinaria
11 years ago

Hey Marie, would a CDC pamphlet regarding suicide help your case?

Women are more likely to poison themselves. Because the poison is in the dose, you need to take a lot of poison to kill yourself, and it often doesn’t work.

Men are more likely to use handguns. Those will kill you much more often.

Women are also more likely to think about suicide.

Jason
Jason
11 years ago

“Feminism has no deities.”

You’re missing the point, if you think that feminists aren’t as dogmatic as any religious-believers.

BlackBloc (@XBlackBlocX)

>>>Dude *facepalm* I am pretty sure you have no record of dragon fighting.

Like every area replete with MRAs, though, I’m sure there’s a lot of damaged windmills along the way.

Marie
Marie
11 years ago

@blackbloc

Hypergammy. I should have know. *turns on nice guy tm voice* damn you hypergammy! DAMN YOU TO HEEEELLLLL

@Alice

Yes that helps, thanks 🙂 I’ll start reading it to quote to our boring troll.

katz
11 years ago

That feminist atheists = Christian atheists thing is a new one to me. But the only new one to me. Too bad I have no idea what the hell kind of sense it makes.

As far as I could figure, he’s saying that feminists have to worship Thor. I’m strangely OK with this.

Alice Sanguinaria
11 years ago

Jason – atheism isn’t skepticism either. You’re an atheist if you don’t believe in deities. Period. Learn to use a dictionary sometime, you’ll learn something.

Marie
Marie
11 years ago

@jason

You’re missing the point, if you think that feminists aren’t as dogmatic as any religious-believers.

…?

troll to english translation here plz?

chibigodzilla
chibigodzilla
11 years ago

if women want men to change, they should be willing to love men who don’t perform.

In my experience, women are willing to love men who don’t perform. I second Fibinachi, your world view is hella sad, dude.

Alice Sanguinaria
11 years ago

Marie – Jason doesn’t know how to use a dictionary. That’s all.

Jason
Jason
11 years ago

“Like every area replete with MRAs, though, I’m sure there’s a lot of damaged windmills along the way.”

That is honestly the best insult I’ve heard all day. Certainly better than all the “fuck off, you’re a horrible person” shit earlier. You get a brofist for that one.

Marie
Marie
11 years ago

I was going to quote more stats, but Alice summed it up pretty concisely, gender disparity wise. Different ways with different levels of effectiveness.

BlackBloc (@XBlackBlocX)

>>troll to english translation here plz?

Feminists have opinions, and ideology, which is just like religion, which means they can’t be atheists or skeptics. Unlike Jason whose ideas are all formed fully from pure first principles, that were handed down to him by Saint Rand and Saint Dawkins.

Alice Sanguinaria
11 years ago

Oh, and Marie, here’s the Wikipedia page regarding gender differences in suicide. I would have put both of them in the same comment, except then it’d go to moderation and you won’t see it.

Fibinachi
Fibinachi
11 years ago

Fibinachi, thanks for a semi-decent response, although I imagine you were being more sarcastic than I’m giving you credit for.

Men want women’s love. Men will do a lot for women’s love. If women made it clear that they loved men who could hop on one foot, there’d be hopping gyms springing up all over America. if women want men to change, they should be willing to love men who don’t perform. Women don’t like being the “damsels in distress” in video games, apparently. If that’s the case, they should be the ones fighting dragons to rescue the prince more often.

Oh, I get it. Sorry, I slightly misunderstood your previous point. Wasn’t being sarcastic, however. It… It sounds quite sad to me. So good luck with it.

But there’s a disconnection between “Men want women’s love” and “Men are taught that in order to get that love, they have to be useful, so women shouldn’t be coal miners, because then coal miners will feel they have nothing to offer”.

If you can’t percieve that disconnect, then I don’t… rightly know what to say, or how to say it, to make it clear that the problem isn’t wanting love and affection, the problem is the way “Men are taught”. And, ultimately, I don’t think it’s “Women’s” (Which is honestly not even a phrase I know what *means*) job to do anything.

And it occurs to me you’d get far more results by, again, hitting the root of the issue – the wrong assumptions about other people, than you’d be when trying to make those other people do something to make you feel better.

Marie
Marie
11 years ago

@alice

Marie – Jason doesn’t know how to use a dictionary. That’s all.

that would explain a lot 😛

Ally S
11 years ago

Jason thinks that the insults towards him are intended to be good, rather than just expressions of contempt. Interesting.

Jason
Jason
11 years ago

Women know how to kill themselves. They could do it properly if they really wanted. (I’m not a misogynist, so I don’t believe women are stupid.) In many cases, a suicide attempt is a plea for help. That’s very different from a completed suicide.

BlackBloc (@XBlackBlocX)

>>>You get a brofist for that one.

I’m bisexual and typically bottom. You should be careful about promising me brofists. I might misunderstand what you mean.

Jason
Jason
11 years ago

Saint Rand? I hate her. In face I was part of the Occupy movement. You shouldn’t be so quick to stereotype anyone who cares about men’s issues…

1 19 20 21 22 23 38