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A Voice for Men’s Paul Elam blames rape chants at Canadian schools on feminism

Paul Elam: If he hears any ore about rape culture, he might possibly lose it.
Paul Elam: If he hears any more about rape culture, he might possibly lose it.

You might not think that student orientation events would be an appropriate venue for chants celebrating the rape of underage girls. But such chants have apparently been something of a tradition at not one but two Canadian schools — and possibly more? Last week, a scandal erupted at the University of British Columbia after word got out that an orientation event at its Saunder School of Business had included a chant on this particular theme, led by orientation leaders from the Commerce Undergraduate Society.

According to one woman who disgustedly live-tweeted the event, it went something like this:

Y-O-U-N-G at UBC, we like ’em young, Y is for your sister, O is for oh so tight, U is for underage, N is for no consent, G is for go to jail.

Meanwhile, in Halifax, someone made a video — and posted it to YouTube — of student orientation leaders at Saint Mary’s University chanting a nearly identical chant.

Naturally, noted, er, human rights activist Paul Elam of A Voice for Men felt compelled to weigh in on the issue. He started off by expressing his deep disgust … with having to hear anything about the issue at all:

I swear if I read one more outraged “report” — aka feverish, paranoid rant — that twists something stupid into “evidence” of a “rape culture,” I am going to just lose it.

Yes, how outrageous that a chant joking about raping underage girls at an official school orientation event could possibly be construed as contributing in any way to rape culture! So sorry that your delicate sensitivities were offended, Paul.

After some more predictable histrionics on this “hyper-hipster-hysteria” from Mr. Elam, he got to his main point: blaming feminists for the rape chants.

No, really.

I am an older guy. I find it interesting, given that I came from a more “patriarchal” generation, that something like this when I was 18 would have been unthinkable. Why? Because other men, especially older ones, would have pulled those young people aside and said, “Hey, we don’t do that around here.” That would have been that, as they say, if it had even happened in the first place.

We can thank feminists for this. Through policy and governance they have eroded positive male role models, and male authority, right out of the culture. After feminist undermining of the family, removing fathers from the lives of children and demonizing male heroes, we have a population of young people, especially young men, growing more socially feral with each new generation.

And now what do we see? Feminists running around everywhere telling men they need to tell each other, “Don’t rape. Don’t abuse women. Don’t this. Don’t that.” …

You can’t assault the identity of half the human race, marginalize and disempower them, which is exactly what feminism has done, and expect anything in return but what you are getting.

In other words: You gals asked for it.

Paul Elam, you are rape culture.

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Hyena Girl
7 years ago

Because rape never happened ever before feminism, right?

marinerachel
marinerachel
7 years ago

Just wanted to apologise for this, being Canadian. And for Nickleback. We’re sorry about that.

Howard Bannister
7 years ago

Fucking HELL.

The chant is bad enough. And then Elam is all, ‘what rape culture, nothing to see here, folks,’ and I just can’t.

You can’t assault the identity of half the human race, marginalize and disempower them, which is exactly what feminism has done, and expect anything in return but what you are getting.

…I kinda want to take this to a bad place, flipping his statement around and suggesting that he ought to expect some awfully bad treatment, by his own logic. I am feeling angry.

I will perhaps step away from the keyboard instead.

Bluecat
Bluecat
7 years ago

He finds it tiresome that people are telling men not to rape and not to abuse?

Seriously?

Wow, I can see how that might be a bit of an irritation…

titianblue
titianblue
7 years ago

I’m guessing that “rape chants” have always been part of these charming ceremonies. The only difference now is that, thanks to feminism, women are gaining places to study at these schools and are therefore present to be appalled by them.

cloudiah
7 years ago

Everyone, I present to you the most important human rights movement of the 21st century…

Hyena Girl
7 years ago

Not to mention the fact that it’s a really poorly constructed chant. I mean, if you’re going to be an evil minded asshole at least do it with some style.

sparky
sparky
7 years ago

Bluecat: “He finds it tiresome people are telling men not rape and not to abuse?”

He also apparently finds it tiresome that there are no older men “who would have pulled these young people aside and said, ‘Hey, we don’t do that around here.’ ” Because of feminism. Because, yeah, that just totally makes sense.

There is no logic here. This is slimy.

Morrigan
7 years ago

This is akin to saying that higher average global temperatures are not evidence for global warming, except that with global warming, deniers are also negatively affected. It is so frustrating to see people privileged positions indignantly deny it.

Feminists running around everywhere telling men they need to tell each other, “Don’t rape. Don’t abuse women. Don’t this. Don’t that.” …

You can’t assault the identity of half the human race,

In other words, rape and other means of denigrating the half of humanity Elam forgot are just a part men’s identities. How dare we assault that?
Naturally, “men will be men” works well to perpetuate these problems.

freemage
freemage
7 years ago

titianblue: In addition, there’s enough women there that at least some of them are willing to speak out about it (I’m sure there were women attending these chants before then, but they just tried to laugh it off, because none of them wanted to be branded the ‘poor sport’).

titianblue
titianblue
7 years ago

In addition, there’s enough women there that at least some of them are willing to speak out about it (I’m sure there were women attending these chants before then, but they just tried to laugh it off, because none of them wanted to be branded the ‘poor sport’).

QFT

Chie Satonaka
Chie Satonaka
7 years ago

I am an older guy. I find it interesting, given that I came from a more “patriarchal” generation, that something like this when I was 18 would have been unthinkable.

Wrong. That shit has always happened, but people didn’t think twice about it, and people certainly didn’t discuss the social implications of it, and we also didn’t have the technology to immediately broadcast it across the world for everyone to see.

MaudeLL
7 years ago

@bluecat

I think AVfM has a post right now about how terribly unfair and oppressive it is to teach men not to rape, and how we should put more responsibility on ‘female behaviour’.

But hey, they’re so tired of hearing about rape culture. (so am I)

titianblue
titianblue
7 years ago

I feel like I’ve been letting the great feminist collective down. I didn’t realise there were all these things I was supposed to be doing:

1. Erode positive male role models, and male authority, right out of the culture.

My boss is a man. And his boss. And his boss, unto the 7th generation. Where did I go wrong?

2. Undermine the family

Does this involve digging? My back isn’t that great? Can I hire someone to do any heavy spadework?

3. Remove fathers from the lives of children

My father makes an excellent chilled cucumber soup. Can’t I keep him?

4. Demonize male heroes.

Not sure about this one. Demonics. Erm, black cat, check. Broomstick, check. Cauldron – well, preserving pan, check. Grimoire – need to go to the library.

5 Running around everywhere

Never did the running thing. Is cycling or swimming an ok alternative?

6. Tell men they need to tell each other, “Don’t rape. Don’t abuse women. Don’t this. Don’t that.” …

Yep, got this one covered.

7. Assault the identity of half the human race, marginalize and disempower them.

Really? Why would any decent human being want to do that? *watches straw feminist burst into flames*

tinyorc
7 years ago

OK, I made the terrible mistake of delving into the comments on the second linked article. It’s infested with the Free Speech brigade.

Sigh. Free Speech: Protecting your right to sing rape chants without dealing with a single shred of criticism, circa The Invention of the Internet.

AK
AK
7 years ago

Because rape never happened ever before feminism, right?

But you see, no one used to talk about it. Talking about it is the real problem.

Hyena Girl
7 years ago

@AK
Ahhh, I see, that’s the problem.

Falconer
7 years ago

That pic of Elam looks like he’s about to warn us that we will be visited by three spirits.

Assholishness, Douchebaggery, and Peach Ice Cream.

sarahlizhousespouse
7 years ago

“And now what do we see? Feminists running around everywhere telling men they need to tell each other, “Don’t rape. Don’t abuse women. Don’t this. Don’t that.” …”

I can’t even imagine how purple-faced Elam gets when he sees anti-piracy commercials. “Don’t steal a car. Don’t steal a handbag. Don’t steal a DVD. Stealing is wrong.”

The gall! Telling him not to steal because stealing is wrong.

Karalora
Karalora
7 years ago

So what exactly was the deal before? Men used to respect women, until women went and spoiled it by asking for respect? It’s like a twisted version of the Unseen University taxation arrangement.

titianblue
titianblue
7 years ago

Witchy kitty ready to raise those feminist demons …

http://instagram.com/p/eC3RFal-yz/

Ally S
7 years ago

I love how Elam jumps ahead to make his own assertions about how people are reacting to these chants…without even trying to gain an understanding of what people are saying.

For instance, this article was recently shared in a Facebook group I’m in, and I saw people criticize both the men and the women who were chanting. I saw no focus on men. Speaking of focusing on men, he still has no fucking idea what that “Don’t rape” campaign even means – I would think that an “expert” on feminism would at least understand that this is purely a reaction to people who shift the burden of preventing rape on victims. But nope.

Moreover, there is absolutely no guarantee that this would be halted right away with the help of some kind men not yet victimized by feminism. Even if, like Elam, I assume that society wasn’t even more patriarchal back then (which it was), I think it could also very well be that the chant was ignored for so long because of that bullshit “It’s free speech!” justification, which many of his commenters are repeating. Is Elam going to say that all of these people are only saying that it’s free speech because they are disgruntled by feminism? I don’t think so – not unless he wants to sound even more uninformed.

I’m astounded by Elam’s unfounded blanket assertions and unconditional bias towards men, although I guess I shouldn’t be because he’s part of AVfM.

mildlymagnificent
7 years ago

something like this when I was 18 would have been unthinkable. Why? Because other men, especially older ones, would have pulled those young people aside and said, “Hey, we don’t do that around here.”

I hate to tell the oh so dignified Mr Elam this but when I was 18 and went to university in the late 60s, there were ample opportunities to hear, and to join in if anyone wished, the rugby / rowing / other sports teams and any number of individual faculty groups reciting or singing or roaring bawdy, obscene and silly/ disgusting rhymes and songs all over the place. And Orientation Week was as good a time as any to introduce newbies to these delights.

My father’s generation was the WW2 soldier generation and there were plenty such songs in the troops repertoires. Admittedly, my dad would never swear in front of women. When he very, very, rarely got extremely drunk, my mum and lots of other people were reduced to hysterics watching him try to sing such songs but with humming and aahing substituted for all the “dirty” words – which meant there was little other than humming going on.

Robert
Robert
7 years ago

This sounds like the “outside agitator” meme propagated by white Southerners a few decades ago. As in, ‘things used to be fine and we all got along, and then YOU people came along and roont it all.’

grumpycatisagirl
grumpycatisagirl
7 years ago

One thing that makes me feel better about Paul Elam is knowing that I am not him. What a miserable person.

cloudiah
7 years ago

Witchy Kitty is adorable.

This sounds like the “outside agitator” meme propagated by white Southerners a few decades ago. As in, ‘things used to be fine and we all got along, and then YOU people came along and roont it all.’

Exactly! Everything was just fine until WOMEN!

Perry
Perry
7 years ago

Here I thought MRAs were supposed to be so logical but Elam is about to lose it. Gosh, he is soooooo emotional.

freemage
freemage
7 years ago

And I was 18 in the 80s, at a Lutheran-ish university, and we had all the same shit, too. So this Golden Age of Civility that Elam remembers is obviously a delusion brought on by overcontemplation of his rageboner.

kirbywarp
7 years ago

So let me get this straight… In the past, people would never chant such disgusting things, because male role models would tell students “we don’t do that,” (ie, we don’t joke about raping people).

Now that feminists have come along and eroded male role models by telling people not to joke about raping people, there’s nothing stopping this shit from happening?

WHAT?!?

Cthulhu's Intern
7 years ago

So… he’s getting annoyed that people would, in the past, tell them not to do it, but now, people are… telling them not to do it.

cloudiah
7 years ago

So… he’s getting annoyed that people would, in the past, tell them not to do it, but now, people are… telling them not to do it.

It’s okay when people tell them not to do it, just not okay when women tell them not to do it.

serrana
serrana
7 years ago

It’s okay when people tell them not to do it, just not okay when women tell them not to do it.

Exactly. Because when women tell people not to do things, they’re marginalizing men.

Crip Dyke
Crip Dyke
7 years ago

Paul Elam, you are rape culture.

QFSFT

cloudiah
7 years ago

Oooh, there’s a new Dan Cardamon video:

sakurabelle
sakurabelle
7 years ago

I can’t properly put into words how angry his response makes me.

Aren’t these people the ones who are always telling women to take responsibility for their actions? WHY DON’T THEY APPLY THIS SAME STANDARD TO MEN?

carnation
carnation
7 years ago

“We can thank feminists for this. Through policy and governance they have eroded positive male role models, and male authority, right out of the culture. After feminist undermining of the family, removing fathers from the lives of children and demonizing male heroes, we have a population of young people, especially young men, growing more socially feral with each new generation.”

Citation, please, Paul???

I actually lol’d at his stupid.

cloudiah
7 years ago

Hilarious comment from a r/mr thread on why the 50 Best Guitarists are all male*:

And I actually do know why. Because few women want to do the work of becoming a great guitarist. It is a lonely and obsessive task and it is heavily competitive. When it comes to pop/rock music, women tend to want one thing. Center stage. That’s it. Their interest is in the attention, not the craft. They want the image not the creation. It’s all very simple. If you asked all those 50 greatest guy guitar players why they took up the instrument, the answer would be a near unanimous “to get girls”. Women don’t have to accomplish amazing feats of virtuosity to achieve mates nor even to accomplish survival and that is why they rarely even bother to attempt it.

Emphasis added. For some reason this made me laugh almost as much as the MY SPERM IS GOLDEN guy.

*Yeah, right.

daboys1215
daboys1215
7 years ago

Mr Elam, well said. This is the result of feminism. Like you said, men used to do just what feminists seem to want yet their movement is what destroyed it to begin with. As usual, feminists cannot accept accountability for their pathetic nonsense. Feminists, You reap what you sow.

augochlorella
7 years ago

So female guitarists aren’t very good because they only play guitar for attention, unlike male guitarists who play guitar to get… attention from women?

Howard Bannister
7 years ago

Oh, yeah. Male musicians don’t want attention. They want to hide from the world and make music.

That’s why only female musicians have concerts, of course.

cloudiah
7 years ago

Isn’t he just precious? He’s completely unaware that he totally contradicted himself.

serrana
serrana
7 years ago

When it comes to pop/rock music, women tend to want one thing. Center stage.

I’ve always wondered why there were so many female bass players.

ivyshoots
7 years ago

There was a college craze called “panty raids” in the 50s and 60s. Where were all these alleged older men who were supposedly saying, “Hey, we don’t do that around here?” That would have been that, as they say.

markb
markb
7 years ago

I think he’s saying women can get the attention by simply being sexy on stage, while men need to be virtuoso guitarists to get girls. Except as far as I know the biggest fans of the “virtuoso” guitarists are other guitarists, and the groupies all go to the guys who strut around, either as lead guitarists or lead singers. I’m guessing that David Lee Roth got more action backstage than Eddie Van Halen, Robert Plant got more than Jimmy Page, Axl Rose got more than Slash, etc. It’s the attitude and passion that’s “sexy”, not how good your technique is.

Robert
Robert
7 years ago

When my son was taking up the guitar, I passed along some wisdom from my eldest brother. Learn bass, not lead guitar. Every jumped up chump wants to play lead guitar and get girls, but every band needs a bassist. You’ll always be able to find a band to play in.

My eldest brother has been happily married for over twenty years, for what it’s worth. Some women will give a bassist a chance.

markb
markb
7 years ago

Easier to pick up skills needed for bass by learning guitar than vice-versa. Bass = lower four strings of guitar. If your band needs a bassist, you can always pull a Paul McCartney and switch.

Good
Good
7 years ago

In the video. aren’t they saying “no regrets” as opposed to “no consent”?

LBT
LBT
7 years ago

Anyone who thinks ANY form of musical practice doesn’t involve lots of obsessive practicing in solitude hasn’t ACTUALLY played much music, in my opinion. (Unless maybe you’re in a choir or something, but surely even choir singers practice their songs on their own?)

Also, did that guy never HEAR of glam rock?

LBT
LBT
7 years ago

RE: Good

Seeing as they specifically talk about ‘underage,’ and ‘go to jail,’ I don’t think that really helps much.

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