So the Red Pill subreddit, as you may recall, is a place for dudes to discuss the devious and possibly not altogether ethical or even consensual strategies they’ve come up with to … have sex with anyone they want. But their real goal is not just to have sex, but to control other people’s opinions and thoughts of them doing so. They want to silence all critics, and then even demand praise for their morally reprehensible or at least morally questionable actions.
Woah. It feels like my brain was just taken over for a second. Did I even write that? I don’t think I did. I swear I’ve read most of that paragraph before.
Oh wait.
Oh yeah. That’s where it came from. I must have been possessed.
The Red Pill subreddit, where lying to women to get them into bed is perfectly acceptable but a woman having consensual sex is a reprehensible, narcissistic slattern with a gymnastic hamster for a brain.
NOTE: I found this quote through the always helpful Blue Pill subreddit.
10knives – priceless! What a great way to delurk. Have an Official Welcome Package!
Dvarg: Baptists were persecuted in much of Europe, when groups of them got to the states, where it was possible to get away from persecution some of them became pretty intolerant themselves. As a result there came to be a fair number of exclusionary pockets (and some of the rampant anti-catholicism comes from a blend of that, and the English Puritans rabid hatred of “papists”.)
It makes US baptists a very complex subject.
@10Kknives, that was great! I will add to the hall of fame very soon.
@Dvarg,
Even the most intolerant fundies here in the Bible belt can also have their moments of kindness and compassion. The same ones who yell at woman going to abortion clinics also came here to Joplin to give food, clothing, and a sympathetic ear to tornado victims. And I have fundies in my extended family who are closed minded tea baggers, but they are generous, caring, and fun to be around as long as you never discuss politics or religion. So I totally understand what you’re saying.
And I do know that the Baptists around here do not represent all Baptists in the world, or even the US. Maybe it’d be better for me to criticize the behavior and beliefs that I dislike, rather than the people themselves, especially since people can change and give up intolerance and bigotry.
Here we go, 10Kknives, you are now in the Manboobz greatest hits.
And as far as fundies go, I don’t see any redeeming qualities in the ones at Dalrock. All they do is sit around and whine that Christian wives aren’t submissive enough. They want a Quiverfull wife but without the requirement of having 10 or more children and all the work that comes with that. They’re disgusting chauvinists.
@ Dvarg: If it makes you feel any better, fundies are a powerful political force here in the U.S. (as a group; as individuals there are many poor and desperate among them, which makes their resistance to programs that would help them extra sad), so those who mock them are kicking up.
And while it’s true that there are kind and generous people among them, that’s only to be expected. They’re not orcs. The problem is that those kind and generous people do great harm to people they’ll never even meet.
Yeah, Dvarg, I can understand the personal conflict.
My hubby’s a Southern Baptist–sorta. Even though he really disapproves of some of their shit (naturally–he’s bi), the short version is, the Southern Baptist church was how his teen single disowned mom was able to raise him. The congregation took care of each other, and in particular had a very strong daycare program. If it wasn’t for them, his mom probably wouldn’t have been able to support him, and he would’ve ended up with CPS. So he’s pretty much going to be a Southern Baptist till the day he dies. Again.
I mentioned before I grew up a good little fundie, right?
My church was close. I mean, super close. I mean, sometimes uncomfortably everybody-knows-all-the-details-of-my-life-whether-I-told-them-or-not close.
But in terms of actually living out the kind of stuff they preached? Holy hell. I’ve never felt so supported or loved, I swear. They were great about that. Every time I needed something, they were there.
@Howard Bannister,
I know what you’re talking about. The fundie churches have a way of drawing people in and showering you with support and a sense of belonging. If someone is sick or loses a loved one, you know that everyone will rally for them, bringing casseroles and encouragement around the clock. I had way more negative experiences that overshadowed those positives, though, and I was much happier after leaving the Assembly of God. But I can understand someone like LBT’s husband deciding to stay with the Southern Baptists out of loyalty after all they did for him and his mom.
I met some wonderful people in Saudi Arabia. Doesn’t mean that it isn’t valid to point out that there are some really significant problems with the Wahabi interpretation of Islam. I think we should direct our criticisms of any religious group at either the institutions or the leaders who’re directly responsible for bad doctrine and bad policies rather than at the rank and file, since there will be lots of perfectly lovely people among them. We can’t refrain from criticizing the institutions just because they have some members who’re wonderful people, though, and in the US the Baptist faith as a political force is a danger to our most basic democratic freedoms.
So, to summarize that ramble – saying that all Baptists are bad people, no and not fair, saying that the Southern Baptist faith as a political force in the US is a problem, truth,
You just hit the nail on the head right there.
Pretty much. I mean, my hubby still IDs with a lot of Southern Baptist things… but he hasn’t set foot in a Southern Baptist church (or any church) in years. So it’s not like he’s totally fine with them, or still feels loved or supported.
This whole discussion reminds me so much of a good friend’s stories about growing up in the USian Communist Party. Very similar tales of growing up with wonderful, supportive, loving people who would do anything to help a comrade, often at great personal risk. Followed by the realization that the CP itself was propping up a terrible regime, and that CP policies were not in line with her views as a democratic socialist. Followed by the wrenching decision to leave the CP, which was like cutting herself from her family (in actual fact, it did cut her off from her family, many of whom refused to speak to her for a decade or more).
I think that kind of “us against the world” dynamic can actually lead to groups being far more than averagely supportive towards members. The problems happen when a member starts to reevaluate the values held by the rest of the group.
(Southern Baptists in the US aren’t actually an oppressed group, but they think of themselves that way, so the dynamic still applies.)
Is it a coincidence that Fred at Slacktivist reminded us of the SB purge just today?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/on-faith/leader-of-southern-baptist-seminary-marks-20-years-helped-make-school-more-conservative/2013/09/02/259fb7b0-13e4-11e3-b220-2c950c7f3263_story.html
RE: CassandraSays
I think that kind of “us against the world” dynamic can actually lead to groups being far more than averagely supportive towards members. The problems happen when a member starts to reevaluate the values held by the rest of the group.
Yeeeaaaah. And honestly, what you describe is common enough that I now specifically avoid trans or multi groups. Invariably, it seems think start out swimmingly… right up until you find yourself disagreeing, at which point the backlash goes NUCLEAR.
It truly is amazing how even if you agree with them, Man Boobz can find an angle in which you are somehow saying something negative about them. The mental gymnastics are existing. And what is it with the cat hate, don’t they know cats are great, loyal little balls of sweet fluff.
KittKat: I can’t make head, nor tail, of what you are trying to say.
I think KitKat is using Man Boobz in the UR way David originally established in the FAQ:
I think the cat hate comment shows that KittKat is talking about MRAs. Either that, or xie is horrible at reading comprehension.