For a certain subset of horrible men, there are few things more infuriating than the fact that women they find undesirable can turn down men for sex. For this upsets their primitive sense of justice: such women should be so grateful for any male attention, these men think, that turning down even the most boorish of men shouldn’t even be an option for them.
Consider the reactions of some of the regulars on date-rapey pickup guru Roosh V’s forum to the story of Josh and Mary on the dating site Plenty of Fish. One fine December evening, you see, Josh decided to try a little “direct game” on Mary.
That’s what the fellas on Roosh’s forum call it, anyway. The rest of us would call it sexual harassment.
Josh started off by asking Mary if she “wanted to be fuck buddies.” She said “nope,” and the conversation went downhill from there, with Josh sending a series of increasingly explicit comments to Mary, despite getting nothing but negative replies from her.
After eight messages from Josh, with the last one suggesting he would pay her $50 to “come over right now and swallow my load,” Mary turned the tables, noting that she’d been able to deduce his real identity from his PoF profile, and asking him if he wanted her to send screenshots of the chat to his mother and grandmother. He begged her not to.
As you may have already figured out, from the fact that we’re talking about this story in public, Mary did indeed pass along the screenshots, and posted them online.
Poetic justice? Not to the fellas on Roosh’s forum. Because, you see, Mary is … a fat chick.
While dismissing Josh as a “chode” with “atrocious game,” Scorpion saved most of his anger for the harassed woman:
Look how much she relishes not only shooting him down, but damaging his reputation with his own family. She’s positively intoxicated with her power. Simply spitting bad direct game is enough to unleash her vindictive fury.
“Bad direct game.” I’m pretty sure even Clarence Thomas would consider what Josh did sexual harassment.
At any point, she could have pressed a single button and blocked the man from communicating with her, but she didn’t. She didn’t because she enjoys the feeling of power she gets from receiving attention from guys like this and then brutally shooting them down. It makes her feel much hotter and more desirable than she actually is in real life. She’s not there to meet men; she’s there to virtually castrate them for her own amusement.
I’m guessing here, but I’m pretty sure that nowhere in Mary’s profile did she encourage the men of PoF to send her explicit sexual propositions out of the blue. And I’m pretty sure she didn’t hold a gun to Josh’s head and force him to send a half-dozen sexually explicit harassing messages to a woman he didn’t know.
Athlone McGinnis also relies heavily on euphemism when describing Josh’s appalling behavior:
I don’t think its primarily the revenge she’s after, its the validation. She is enjoying the power she has over this guy and wielding it brutally because it shows she can maintain standards despite her weight and the doubtless numerous confidence issues that stem from it. In blowing up this guy for being too direct in his evaluation of her sexuality, she affirms the value of her own sexuality.
Oh, so he was just being “direct in his evaluation of her sexuality.”
In short: “I am wanted, but I have standards and can choose. I have so much agency despite my weight that I can go as far as to punish those who approach me in a way I do not like rather than simply blocking them. I’m teaching them a lesson, because I’m valuable enough to provide such lessons.
So apparently in Mr. McGinnis’ world women who are fat aren’t supposed to have agency? They’re not supposed to be able to choose? They’re supposed to drop their panties to any guy who offers to be their fuck buddy or tells them to “suck my dick?”
Also, I’m a victim bravely standing up against online bullying/harassment-look at me!”
Yeah, actually, she is. Get used to it, guys, because you’re going to see a lot more of this in the future.
This isn’t just a laughing matter for her. She needs to be able to do this in order to feel worthwhile. She has to be able to show that even she is able to maintain standards and doesn’t have to settle for just any old guy asking for any old sexual favor simply because she resembles a beached manatee.
And it’s not a laughing matter for you either, is it? You’re actually angry that a woman said no to a sexual harasser — because you don’t find her attractive. And because Josh — from his picture, a conventionally attractive, non-fat fellow — did.
Mr. McGinnis, may a fat person sit on your dreams, and crush them.
And I need to get to bed, so I can get to work in the early morning sun.
Y’all have fun with him before the local Mallet of Loving Correction comes down upon his head (‘bang-bang’).
“Kitteh — well I do have this little alien // gnome thing that has hair (algae)…it’s rather cute really.”
Just as long as it’s not one of those horrible rubber trolls with the nylon hair – gods I hate those things!
LBT – now if only we could get virtual maggots to feed on the trolls and clean the gangrenous little creeps off the site.
@Cloudiah, I just watched RENT last night.
Hey, you forgot leeches, pretty sure they have therapeutic use too. Granted maggots are far nastier.
Nth’ing the creepy vibe in other words.
AnonGuy — keep up, actively resisting violence once you are being assaulted has fairly shitty odds of getting the desired result. And you were, three pages ago, talking about PREVENTION.
And I’m with LBT, except twice over, since the time I managed to take some steps to protect myself was the time I was piss ass drunk and if able to take said steps was I really too drunk to consent? (Everyone, pass pecunium the popcorn for his stellar answer when I unloaded that one on his inbox; pecunium, thank you)
Cloudiah – herd creatues? Us?
NEEEEIGGHHHHHH
Drat – I included leeches in my comment then deleted ’em, cos maggots seem nastier! ::gnashes teeth::
“In any case it’s almost my bedtime but I have a weird hope that there is about to be a crack of light and some kind of rapproachment with someone here, so I’ll stick around a few more minutes.”
HAHAHAAHHHAAAAA!!! *falls over*
Yes, any second now we’ll realize that we were wrong and there totally are universally applicable rape prevention tips that don’t result in “you didn’t do X?!?”
Pecunium — aw, g’night. Hopefully won’t be talking to you tomorrow, on the phone that is (well, unless you feel like making a social call or something)
(Not talking to him on the phone = bullshit with my psych not happening, ergo that hope)
Kitteh — I can try to take a picture I guess? But it’s your standard ceramic fish tank decoration, with hair algae on its head.
RE: AnonymousGuy
it may be as you say and sockpuppeting is 1) what I did
Dude, this isn’t up for debate. This isn’t a ‘maybe’ situation. You came with a different identity specifically to avoid shit from your past here. That’s sockpuppeting. Why WOULDN’T it be?
as I said I’ve tried my best to be friendly and civil
You’ve failed. When people ask you to leave, and you refuse to, that’s not friendly, no matter how you say it. It’s an infringement of boundaries.
RE: Argenti
Leeches also have therapeutic uses, yes. But I agree that maggots are creepier. At least the maggots are innocent and have no ulterior motives.
Herd animals?
BAAAAA. BAAAA
Yeah, what?
” I was just trying to avoid what to me was a stressful and upsetting situation…”
Seriously? Then why the claims that rape victims should have put up more of a fight? Or been able to read their abuser’s mind? You were trying to avoid stressful interaction? No fucking way.
Don’t you know? Raul’s want to avoid the stressful situation of being called out on his shit is more than important than our want to avoid the stressful situation of being told our sexual assaults were in any way our fault.
I miss Asher. At least he was briefly ENTERTAINING when I was sleep-deprived.
Hell, I miss ANTZ. He treated me nicer than AnonymousGuy did, and he believed men and women should be split down the Mississippi River!
I mean, I think I even said earlier that this could be a discussion, but it would take a lot of work. Anyone who tries to start the discussion in a troll-heavy environment, without establishing good faith, and then engages in condescending snark, insults (“herd animals” supposed to be a compliment?), passion aggression, etc., while admitting they change identity at will — not someone I will ever engage with constructively.
I hope misery thinks hard about what went on here. I hope AnonymousGuy goes away. Forever.
I hope they both step on Legos. And then on dry dog kibble, and then track the resulting mess into a white rug.
Poor Antz. All he wanted was virtual women and a continent divided down the middle. Was that really so much to ask?
hippodameia – let ’em walk in fresh dog vomit before they reach the rug.
And in cat litter.
Used cat litter.
RE: Kittehserf
Well, at least I was able to realize his dream in fiction. *nostalgic nodding*
You are a benefactor to humanity, LBT! 😀
“And you were, three pages ago, talking about PREVENTION.”
Was I? Perhaps I was. It’s thorny terminology. The website I linked uses the word “prevention” in a way that I think is maybe counterproductive but is nonetheless standard (the CDC uses it in white papers) to refer to really ANY kind of rape policy including criminal justice policy, educating men about healthy sexual relationships, etc.
This collection, for example, is called “The Psychology of Rape Resistance and Prevention:” http://www.raperesistance.org/research/index.html even though it contains mostly stuff I think you would all agree wholeheartedly with (the article I posted is 7 or 8 down the list)
“keep up, actively resisting violence once you are being assaulted has fairly shitty odds of getting the desired result.”
This is, maybe, the crack of light I was talking about. That’s an empirical claim you’re making. It needs some support. Do you have any?
In the Hollander paper she says clearly “Again, it is important to be careful
when presenting this material. Presenters must make clear
that self-defense involves a variety of strategies—emotional, verbal,
and physical—that women use to make themselves safer and
that presenting information about physical self-defense does not
imply that physical self-defense is the best or only choice for all
women.”
Which obviates about 90% of the responses to this line of argument that have appeared on this thread. Yes, of course it’s true that sometimes violent resistance is a really bad idea. Wouldn’t it be useful to know when those times are, and when violent resistance might improve your outcomes?
You can continue to take that as an insult if you choose to, but it’s not an insult. It’s an empirical question that can be investigated through research,
Seriously, Raul, just stop.
Fuck this.
New MRA/MGTOW rap, actually more interesting than AG:
“Wouldn’t it be useful to know when those times are, and when violent resistance might improve your outcomes? ”
And WHOOSH the point flies over his head. Again.
Rape victims are not mind readers. How is anyone supposed to know what any given rapist will do in any given situation? Has it ever occurred to you that a rapist might change his tactics? Or that he is likely to know you well enough to have the advantage, on top of the advantage of him being the aggressor? You didn’t even fucking READ what Pecunium said, did you, doucheweasel?
(Oh, and if you’re getting your “empowering” jollies thinking maybe I’m triggered by this, I’m not: I have the good fortune not to be a rape victim, and that’s not because I somehow managed to fight someone off. I’m expressing contempt for your more and more obviously trollish attempts to distress people here.)
Fresh dog vomit would work! I also remember a camping incident that involved raw sewage . . .
But there’s a SyFy Original movie calling my name, and I’m sure it’ll be better than listening to Raul wank endlessly on, so goodnight!