So the uber-manly woman-hating woman-chasing alpha dogs over in the Red Pill subreddit are discussing the declining marriage rate. Which is a GOOD thing. Because marriage is for BETAs and FRUMPY WOMEN! It’s worse than RAPE!
![Marriage is RAPE - so if marriage goes down, then it's a good thing. permalink source give gold save hide child comments [–]Max___Power 49 points 1 day ago (64|15) No, it's worse. Marriage is institutionally promoted to men as a positive. If I ever took a contract to my lawyer where the other party could opt out at any time AND take 50% of MY shit with them, he'd chase me out of his office and yell at me to find a hobby. Yet men willingly purchase $30,000 flawed rocks for the privilege of asking a frumpy woman to sign such a contract. LO freaking L, I don't know whether to laugh or cry.](https://i0.wp.com/www.wehuntedthemammoth.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/wnosemarriagerape.png?resize=580%2C236&ssl=1)
Huh. If any of these Red Pill dudes were to get married I’m pretty sure it would be be a completely, you know, consensual act on their part. Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t rape a, you know, nonconsensual thing? (Reading the Red Pill subreddit, it’s sometimes hard to remember.)
At this point a fellow calling himself TheZimmerMan throws in his two cents on the subject. Like his fellow Red Pill alpha dudes, he’s no fan of marriage. But then he remembers that feminists are supposedly plotting to take down western civilization by destroying marriage. And feminists are bad, right? And so his brain sort of explodes, producing this wondrous bit of red pill word salad, sprinkled liberally with racism as well as misogyny:
Wow. Just wow.
I’ve never seen “Disney” used as a verb before.
Also, I’m not exactly sure what “they want everyone to be on welfare barley subsiding” means. Unless the government has started up some sort of barley redistribution system I can only assume he meant “barely subsisting.”
I also like the complaint about how the “actual working man” pays for all these evil welfare moms while “being denied traditional provider respect and benefits.”
In misogynist-speak, that’s code for “how come we have to pay money for welfare when we don’t even get to fuck the welfare moms and boss them around?”
Red Pill dudes: please continue your marriage strike. Also consider: A vow of silence? Moving to a desert island? Living the rest of your life in a hole in the ground?
(Thanks to Gemma_Lou in the Blue Pill subreddit for pointing me to this wondrous Red Pill discussion.)
LBT, yes, I know. But are you sure it’s a conscious choice?
Not that it’d really matter in the outcome.
RE: Michael
But are you sure it’s a conscious choice?
In some people, sure, but most, probably not. Though like you said, it doesn’t much change the outcome.
Yeah… That’s the saddest part.
It always seems worse than “just” empathy fail with MRAs – so many of them seem to be actively malicious. Not so much indifference to other people’s reality, to other people’s pain; it seems to be a combination of, on the one hand, actively denying that women are people, that we have the same complex thoughts and feelings as men, and on the other hand, wanting to inflict as much pain and distress on women as they can.
And how can any large scale group function with everyone lacking any sense of empathy? Narcissism I can grok, but societies endorsing it? How’s that work?
Michael — titanblue did beat me to empathy, but yes, it seems surprisingly difficult a concept for some people.
Pecunium — ca. 1980 *does some quick math* wouldn’t you have still been a bit young? Or that’s the point? I could never tell if “humans are horrible” was supposed to be the message there. “Funny” story, one you can add to my list of complaints about my mother’s church, when I was about that age they had a speaker come in and talk about how anti-Christian Bambi was because of the anti-gun message (I think that was it, I kinda may’ve run off to the bathroom in tears, I was probably, uh, about four years younger than you were in ’80)
Ermn… it might have been a bit later, but I was about 9 when I read it. The Message in the book wasn’t “people are horrible” but that you can’t trust them to be the same everywhere/everywhen.
Kitteh — yeah but not just women, they do have a far worse view of men than feminists. Manginas and all that, and how rape is because the victim asked for it and he just couldn’t control himself. Bull-fucking-shit, plenty of people with penī (it’s Latin plural day apparently) are entirely capable of not raping, not matter how bad they want to engage in sexytimes. And feminists know this, and expect men to have self-control because they are capable of it, and MRAs seem to say men have no self-control and can all turn into rapists in the “right” situation.
They can’t empathize with other men either, not even other straight cis white men where their experiences can be similar enough that it should come perfectly naturally (not that cis straight white men are a monolith, but that whole “like me” // “not like me” thing…of course, I just implied that pecunium is more like Elam than like me and I’m just going to noptopus away from that one)
Yeah I’m of the “assume capable of horrible things until given reason to believe otherwise school” and that makes my short list on inexcusable things.
Mind, I haven’t watch it since, gods, younger than you were in ’80?
Am I making you feel old too, or just myself?
Just yourself. We are talking about when I was young (that was, IIRC, the summer Alien came out. I was all, “I know how to kill that… hide out in one place, stand watch and burn it with the flamethrowers!”.
Same summer as Jaws, too, which I saw in in a downpour (even for S. Calif. it was raining hard).
Maybe it’s that I’m on a bit of a nostalgia movie thing. DL’ing Stand by Me now and you’d have been…fuck, the same River Pheonix actually was? Ok now I’m curious, I should know that one.
Ok, just a touch older than him, I was having a “wait, the early 90s don’t add then” moment.
If you didn’t notice already, I’m having a weird night.
Jeez you kids, it would have been the late 60s or early 70s, more likely, when I saw Bambi. Saw Jaws in the mid-seventies, at high school, so it was probably out of the cinemas by then. ::bangs walking stick on floor::
“how anti-Christian Bambi was because of the anti-gun message”
Well of course, because JC is always on about how only gun-owners will enter the kingdom of Heaven, isn’t he? There’s hardly anything else in the Gospels.
Argenti – no argument that those fuckers essentially hate men, too (or at least, all men who don’t hate women) but their specifically violent hatred is directed at women; it’s women they want to abuse, specifically sexually abuse. That’s the level of hatred I was talking about.
This used to be my favourite soup recipe – so simple, and so tasty! I guess I’ll have to stop making it, now that they’re onto my Fiendish Welfare Barley Subsiding Plan and all. Poo.
http://smittenkitchen.com/blog/2008/10/beef-leek-and-barley-soup/
I want to know what’s making all this barley subside, and can it be raised again?
It’s probably all the feminism eroding our culture and thus creating moral sinkholes. Or something.
Kitteh — no argument there! My point was just that they utterly fail empathy, they aren’t “just” raving misogynists. (Just being relative here of course)
And speaking of pecunium as “jeez you kids”, my mother referred to you as a kid earlier, to which I went “uh, mom?” and got “he’s younger than me, and therefore a kid” (to her credit, she borrowed the cousin that’s about your age to go see some snoopy movie since she felt weird going as an adult, so seeing that age gap as you being a kid relative to her does make sense, though I was a bit “huh, what?”)
One thing that always baffles me is how utterly heartless these cretins are… I try, time and time again, to put myself in their shoes and understand where the lack of human decency comes from. I try to imagine growing up in a world where half of the population is decried as weak and less than human, pile privilege on top of that, and then add the fact that I am not judged in any way on gender, colour, or interests. Even then, I myself still feel empathetic no matter how many times I run the thought experiment. I sincerely wonder if certain people are simply born without empathy, and there’s nothing they can do about it.
I suppose I am meandering to a nature vs nurture argument, but I think it is important to find out. Are some people just incapable of understanding or feeling for others who are different from them? I don’t think culture helps, but nearly every society in history has systematically oppressed women/minorities… It’s frightening that I can’t seem to figure it out or even begin to understand the mindset.
So the message summed up seems to be “marriage is declining and that’s good, but feminists would be happy about it so it’s bad, but is marriage is evil anyway so it’s good.”
Shouldn’t they be thanking us evil feminists for showing everyone how awful marriage is?
@Tracy
#1 – Your ex is a bad person and he should feel bad
#2 – I’m celiac too. Brown rice maybe?
@leocigale
I think for a lot of these guys have the same mentality as white nationalists. They had some bad experiences (or at the very least had what they perceived as bad experiences) and then found a whole community of people who told them that it was all a conspiracy by a certain group, that this group wants them to suffer, and is deserving of hate. Bitterness mixed with lies equals cruelty and stupidity.
Ignore that “for”
I just found a recent Oglaf (reasonably safe for work, though it uses some naughty words!) that could have been written for MRAs and MGTOW.
Part of my personal theory is that these guys see empathy as “girly” and they are very insecure about their masculinity.
I think also a lot of them honestly think women are monsters, presumably because of their upbringing. I’ve always been struck by their list of grievances – women don’t get long enough jail sentences, women get away with DV, women lie about rape, women do all kinds of horrible things and the media ignores it… I feel like the underlying theme is, “why doesn’t anyone else see how vicious women are?” The violent crime sentencing in particular seems very odd to me — most MRAs will start foaming at the mouth about Casey Anthony, but how are their lives going to get better by violent female criminals getting longer sentences? There’s something running deeper there.
Having been married to a nasty man a looong time ago, (mrmagnificent and I are celebrating our 35th wedding anniversary this weekend), there’s more to it than that. I used to call it salesman’s empathy. He could, fairly accurately most of the time, pick up other people’s feelings and preferences. At which point he could identify how he could best them or take advantage of them in some way.
It’s not about whether they can understand other people, it’s what they intend to do with the understanding they have. It may be pretty good understanding, it may be mistaken, it may be completely inside out and upside down. Regardless of their competence in understanding, it’s the morality or lack of it in deciding whether you want to treat others as means to your own ends or as people deserving of recognition and acknowledgement as whole people in their own right. Not as bit players in the blockbuster Story of Me.
Check out this Anita Sarkeesian approved fanfic.
http://femfreq.tumblr.com/post/58161053721/spider-man-recruits-the-help-of-anita-sarkeesian-to
In it, a real world, real life game developer is brutally gunned down.
Says Anita, “I kinda like it”
“She shot him once, twice, three times, the sound of the shots echoing in the grand hall of Gearbox Studios.
“Holy shit!” Anthony Burch said. He couldn’t stop typing.
“Anita…why, I said I wanted to change..” Randy said. He clutched at his open wounds. Blood was dripping in gouts from his gold gun throne.
“That’s for Aliens: Colonial Marines.” she said. Randy looked at her again, at first with anger, but then with a look of complete understanding, as though deep down he’d known that it was always going to end this way. He sighed one last time, and then died.”
I am not sure how to feel about this.
Can you girls help me understand why these expressions of hate against a man should be defended? I tend to see this story as hate speech and misandry, if such a thing were to exist.
What do you think David, are you just against misogyny, or do you blog against misandry too? Maybe you should do a post on this.