I‘ve been traveling, so I’m a bit late getting to the whole “Don’t Be That Girl” poster controversy in Edmonton. For those of you who don’t already know all about it: A group called Men’s Rights Edmonton, closely associated with our favorite Men’s Rights hate site A Voice for Men, has been putting up some pretty obnoxious posters parodying an anti-rape poster campaign called “Don’t Be That Guy,” turning the anti-date rape message into one that targets alleged false accusers of rape.
Salon’s Mary Elizabeth Williams has a pretty good dissection of the whole thing here. As she notes, one of the biggest problems with the “Don’t Be That Girl” posters is
the idiotic defensive assumption that [the original “Don’t Be That Guy”] campaign expressly created to educate men and women about consent merits a hateful, finger-pointing response. And it makes the classic presumption that getting drunk, hooking up and then crying rape is a standard chick operating procedure — an idea that is based, by the way, on no solid statistical evidence.
That’s as good as far as it goes, but I would go a bit further:
I don’t think that MRAs are really concerned about false accusations. If they were, they would be working with groups like the Innocence Project that actually help men (and women) who have been wrongly convicted for crimes they didn’t commit.
No, it seems to me that what they’re really worried about is true accusations.
MRAs, with these posters, and with their endless whinging about the alleged complexities of sexual consent, are trying to push back against the date rape awareness campaigns of the last several decades. MRAs and PUAs like to pretend that consent is a complicated and weirdly arbitrary thing — something that women decide to bestow or not to bestow on a whim, and that women sometimes like to retract after the fact.
Feminists say that whenever there is a question about whether or not you have consent, you need to stop and ask. MRAs and PUAs pretend that this somehow means the death of spontaneous sex if not all sex altogether.
Ironically, for all their complaining about the allegedly blurry line between consent and non-consent, many MRAs and PUAs want to keep that line as blurry as possible. But unlike feminists, who want the blurriness to be resolved before anything happens, most MRAs and PUAs seem to want “blurry” to count as “yes.” That is, unless a woman is shouting no, guys are good to go, and if a woman later says she was raped, it’s because she’s “That Girl” and she’s arbitrarily decided to revoke her consent after the fact.
That’s what’s so insidious about the “That Girl” poster campaign.
And that’s why those responding to it should point out the history of the people sponsoring the campaign. Men’s Rights Edmonton and its spokesperson, Karen Straughan (Girl Writes What) are both closely connected with A Voice for Men, which is actively helping coordinate MRA activism around the issue.
So it’s worth pointing out what A Voice for Men has previously posted about rape — and perhaps putting some of these things on posters.
AVFM founder and publisher Paul Elam blames date rape on its victims, writing in one notorious post — which regular readers here will no doubt remember — that women who are raped after drinking and going home with a man are “begging” to be raped:
I have ideas about women who spend evenings in bars hustling men for drinks … paying their bar tab with the pussy pass. And the women who drink and make out, doing everything short of sex with men all evening, and then go to his apartment at 2:00 a.m.. Sometimes both of these women end up being the “victims” of rape.
But are these women asking to get raped?
In the most severe and emphatic terms possible the answer is NO, THEY ARE NOT ASKING TO GET RAPED.
They are freaking begging for it.
Damn near demanding it.
And all the outraged PC demands to get huffy and point out how nothing justifies or excuses rape won’t change the fact that there are a lot of women who get pummeled and pumped because they are stupid (and often arrogant) enough to walk though life with the equivalent of a I’M A STUPID, CONNIVING BITCH – PLEASE RAPE ME neon sign glowing above their empty little narcissistic heads.
Elam has also said that if he is ever on a jury in a rape case he will vote to acquit even if there is clear evidence that the accused is guilty, and he has urged other men to similarly “nullify.” Here is his exact quote:
Should I be called to sit on a jury for a rape trial, I vow publicly to vote not guilty, even in the face of overwhelming evidence that the charges are true.
The post of his in which this quote appeared is now missing from the AVFM site, but he has confirmed he’s said this elsewhere on the site. [EDIT: I’ve been informed that the original post is also available via the Wayback Machine here.]
Meanwhile, AVFM Editor in Chief John Hembling takes a certain pride in his callousness towards rape victims, and has gone so far as to make several videos in which he’s announced that he doesn’t care about rape, and that if he ever sees anyone being raped, he will simply walk on by. (You can find excerpts of both vidoes here.)
There are many other examples of the site’s utter contempt for rape victims, but perhaps the most telling is the site’s use of the term “rapetard” to describe people who take the issue of rape seriously.
The people behind the Don’t Be That Girl posters claim that they’re merely trying to protect innocent men from false accusers. Their real agenda is much more insidious than that.
Oh, Sunshine Mary. She really does appear to be as intellectually shallow and emotionally immature as she thinks all women are, but apparently it hasn’t occurred to her that those may be personal rather than societal problems.
You have to give her points for having the most ironic name on the internet, though. It’s like if Vox Day renamed himself Fluffy Happy Kittens.
JustJulia, Holy crap! She’s advocating that rapists marry their victims?!?! So folks taking poison to avoid that fate are just helping clear the court docket as well?
/head explodes
??? WTF is their deranged legislature up to now?
CriticalDragon:
Nope, see all the FeMRAs I mentioned earlier. How do you explain them?
Internalized misogyny goes deep.
Tampon seizure? WTF? I’m in TX and have been taking a news break today, it’s been too depressing.
@sarahlizhousespouse, the FBI stats are available as a PDF, you can find them at the Wiki for false accusations, which is quite good and is obviously watched like a hawk for vandalism. It has links to all the relevant studies. It also covers the study that MRAs use as their major metric, Kanin’s 41%. (Though I literally came across a comments-section MRA claiming it was 98 fuckin percent. Jesus christ.) I believe the most routinely cited FBI stat is 8 percent? The numbers do vary, but Esmay is, of course, being disingenuous about how hard this is to trace, as he is throwing out all the stats and commonly understood parameters in order to ignore what the typical numbers are. Numbers I see commonly in my layman social-science readings tend to be like 2-5.9 percent. You have to factor in things like the attitudes of the police themselves about rape, which, well, if you have any friends who’ve gone to the police to report a rape you know how that can turn out. I don’t have a single friend whose case was ever prosecuted. I must run with a real pathological liar crowd, pretending to have PTSD and lying to their therapists about it 15, 20 years later!
The FBI this year actually broadened its definition of rape.
CassandraSays “WTF is their deranged legislature up to now?”
Really bad agency denying garbage from a bunch of misogynists pandering to the worst in their base 🙁
But why, specifically? Have they decided that tampons cause abortion or rampant teenage fornication or something?
OK, finally figured out how to Google it…tampons are scary weapons now? What a bunch of babies.
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/07/12/texas-woman-cries-after-trooper-seizes-maxi-pads-ive-never-been-so-humiliated-in-my-life/
Now, I don’t know if I have their logic down perfectly, but I think it goes something like this. Women carrying tampons/maxi pads are either menstruating or have reason to believe that they will, at some point, menstruate, meaning that they are probably not pregnant, and, thusly, are sluts. Or something. That’s where my logic center fried.
This is what happens when misogynists are in charge, it never occurs to them that some people might be carrying tampons because they’re menstruating rather than as a wicked tool of feminist protest and possibly witchcraft.
Or maybe it did and they didn’t want those icky bleeding women in the legislature. Nothing would surprise me at this point. But given that it’s the Texas legislature I’m leaning towards “thinks tampons are witchcraft”.
TODAY IN MISANDRY NEWS! FEMINISTS IN TEXAS ASSAULT MEN WITH UNUSED TAMPONS AND PANTY LINERS!
Also Google gave me this link.
http://twitchy.com/2013/07/12/pro-aborts-whine-about-tampon-confiscation-at-texas-capitol-fail-to-say-the-reason/
Pro-aborts?
When they put up the “Don’t be that guy” posters, I don’t think feminists were concerned with reducing rape; I think they were more concerned with painting men as rapists. Rapes are committed by a very small minority of malicious, psychopathic men, and the feminists were trying to play the problem as something that all men are responsible for. THAT is why the Don’t Be That Girl posters were created.
Get your head out of your ass, Futrelle.
TODAY IN PRO-ABORT NEWS! FEMINISTS PRETEND TAMPONS AREN’T JUST AS DANGEROUS AS GUNS, REQUIRE ALL WOMEN TO ABORT AT LEAST ONE FULL-TERM FETUS BEFORE JOINING NOW
“Funny thing is, that figure is not solely from Brownmiller. It’s also a figure from an FBI study.”
It’s more like 6~8% from what I’ve seen, but because of methodology issues that’s unfounded reports — false, doesn’t meet the legal definition, etc. So it’s <8% which is, afaik, about the same for all crimes (which I cannot cite because even excluding rape from my search terms all I can find are stats in rape reporting…and they all either say <10% or scream MRM)
The fuck iPad? Apparently I was replying to the previous page, sorry!
A Texas state trooper seized maxi pads from an older woman and waved them around at her while chasing her to the elevator and yelling that if she didn’t like it she could go home.
Yeah, class act, Texas.
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/07/12/texas-woman-cries-after-trooper-seizes-maxi-pads-ive-never-been-so-humiliated-in-my-life/
Yep. I can’t get my head around Sunshine’s logic. In a recent post to celebrate the first anniversary of her blog she said that she would like to become a false-rape activist. Here’s how she’d get those lying women under control:
Well, outlawing fornication and getting rid of marital rape laws would exist within a whole constellation of changes that would get us back to sanity: eliminate no-fault divorce;
eliminate affirmative action (you sink or swim on your own merit); outlaw abortion, eliminate the alphabet soup of welfare programs; get women the hell out of the military where all they do is cause problems. Oh and repeal the 19th amendment.
Yeah, meritology absolutely works, no discrimination here, move along.
http://qz.com/103453/i-understood-gender-discrimination-after-i-added-mr-to-my-resume-and-landed-a-job/
I’m not dealing with Sunshine Mary because I can’t fucking (fornicating?) deal with Sunshine Mary’s bullshit right now. What an asshat. 0_o
Repeal all of the amendments except the one allowing people to carry guns! That will fix everything.
I stand by my earlier theory that the reason she thinks women as a group are fucking idiots is that she is in fact a fucking idiot.
http://twitchy.com/2013/07/12/pro-aborts-whine-about-tampon-confiscation-at-texas-capitol-fail-to-say-the-reason/
Excuse me if I have a hard time believing that people were planning on throwing tampons, poo, and bricks at senators while wearing “HAIL SATAN” shirts. If anyone actually said any of those things I’m PRETTY SURE they were joking…
Jesus, Texas.
“We’re pretty bad,” says Sunshine Mary. SMH.
To quote one video game character that misogynists hate so much: “What the fuck is wrong with these people?”*
This is awful. In my naive idealism, I’m unable to understand how these assholes can exist in the real world, where people are, generally speaking, complex individuals with motives, hopes and dreams beyond “hmm, how can I cause more misery to people who are already suffering? Mwahahahaa!”. They really sound like one-dimensional cartoon villains to me. All they need is a black cape and a twirly moustache to complete the look.
Ugh. Yes, I’m failing trying to be funny here. I’ve been hit hard by depression recently because of shit like this, and meeting the only RL friend I ever told about my rape didn’t help. Every time I see zir, I’m reminded of the fact that either people don’t give two shits about rape, or they’re actively trying to keep others quiet about it. If even my friends don’t believe me, what the fuck is the point?
Ranting. Over now.
*Yes, that quote is from Ellie in The Last of Us, in case anyone is wondering.