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MRA icon Zed: Let little girls drown, because they’ll probably grow up to be terrible women

girlmonster
What kind of monster will she become?

“Zed,” also known as “The Zen Priest,” was one of the originators of the Men Going Their Own Way “philosophy” and is treated as a wise elder by many longtime MRAs.

WF Price of The Spearhead described a compilation of Zed’s writings as “really quite profound as well as a great read” and used to give it out as a bonus for everyone who signed up for his email newsletter. Paul Elam of A Voice for Men laid it on a bit thicker, saying of the man he described as both a mentor and a friend:

[H]is writings have taken him to iconic status in the minds of many men who have been at this for a while, this writer included. This has happened despite the fact that he has eschewed the path of self promotion and opted to speak from behind the persona of an archetype, maybe because of it.  Either way, he has wielded a sharp sword from his underworld den, and worn the uniform of a warrior in the battle for sanity between men and women … .

So what kind of fellow is this Zed?

Well, as I learned from a recent thread over on MGTOWforums.com, where he is officially an “elite member,” he’s the sort of person who thinks you should’t bother to save a four-year-old girl from drowning, because then she’ll grow up into a woman, and most of them are just terrible.

The regulars on the forums there were discussing the case of Michael Patterson, a Georgia man who was paralyzed after diving into a creek to rescue a four-year-old girl from drowning, and who has now died after several weeks in the hospital.

While a few suggested that Patterson was a hero, others made clear they wouldn’t have done the same thing themselves. 0kool put it like this:

i know i would never save an adult CUNT….and i know that as sure as i breathe air. however, i would be hard pressed to save a female child knowing what she might have the potential to do in the future. My hat’s off to the guy. Let’s hope his death isn’t in vain and the child doesn’t become a CUNT piece of shit!

Zed, that grand underground warrior for gender sanity, that icon of the Men’s Rights movement, argued the same thing in slightly more restrained prose. In one comment, he warned of the dire possibility that the seemingly innocent little girl you save could grow up to be

another Amanda Marcunt, or Jessica Valenti, or Betty Friedan? Do we think it is worth a man giving his own life to save the life of a woman who will spend it being totally destructive?

In another, he raised the specter of an even more hated figure, at least amongst MGTOWers and MRAs:

Given the evidence around me, it does appear far more likely that a girl will grow up to be another Sharon Osborne – who thinks it is “fantastic” when a woman cuts off the penis of her husband, or the audience of women who cheered that statement – than a woman who contributes much, even to her own family.

I really can’t think of any woman in the public light who the world would be much worse off without.

When a female is in trouble, if I don’t know her, I don’t see her.

This is the kind of timeless wisdom that makes you an icon in the Men’s Rights movement, I guess.

NOTE: Thanks to @taylerlp on Twitter for the tip.

EDITED TO ADD: When I wrote this post, there were 13 or so comments in the MGTOWforums thread; there are considerably more now, including a number from MGTOWers who say they WOULD try to save a little girl. But Zed only doubles down on his position.

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CassandraSays
CassandraSays
8 years ago

It’s the “well you don’t have to do X but if you don’t everyone will be disappointed and you’ll be ruining everyone else’s fun and people will think you’re a killjoy” aspect that I dislike. I hate it when people manipulate each other via social shaming.

Kittehserf
8 years ago

Yeah, that was part of what made me so angry. Fine if people go there knowing that’s what’s up and are happy with it, but not when it’s imposed on someone. Definitely a consent thing. If I’d gone alone just wanting a meal and had seen that setup, I’d have walked out, but one can’t spoil the fun! Well, yes, I can.

Kittehserf
8 years ago

That reply was to katz, btw, but yes, seconding what you just said, Cassandra.

Plus, fuckit – I was the guest, the overseas visitor, what the hell were they thinking? That’s not because it was *me* but because you especially don’t do that to guests.

cloudiah
8 years ago

Kittehs, that’s terrible! I can’t even believe there IS a restaurant like that.

Kittehserf
8 years ago

There is – my mistake, it was Milwaukee, not Chicago. Same visit, I was getting the towns mixed up. It’s called The Safe House.

I’ve been to a theme restaurant here in the 90s – Cafe Crypt. Difference was they didn’t impose shit on the customers, it was just the setting (OTT Goth for laughs, natch).

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
8 years ago

I’d be so tempted to pull a “who are these people? I’m not with them” on someone who set me up like that.

cloudiah
8 years ago

My sister and I did once take our elderly mother to a drag-themed restaurant on Mother’s Day. In our defense, she picked the place. She read a review of it in the paper that was FULL of snarky coded references to what kind of restaurant it was, but she didn’t understand them and unfortunately neither my sister nor I read the review before going.

Not that there’s anything wrong with drag shows that serve dinner! It’s just that maybe they aren’t the best place to take my mother. On Mother’s Day.

Anyway, they were very nice, even though they must have been wondering what the hell we were doing there. On Mother’s Day.

Kittehserf
8 years ago

cloudiah – whoops!

Cassandra – if it’d happened here in Melbourne, where I could get home, I’d have been sorely tempted. Couldn’t get away in Milwaukee, though.

Marie
Marie
8 years ago

@psychodan

I would say, though, that adults have a duty to protect children, at least to some extent. Which just makes what the MGTOWs are saying that much more galling.

That makes a lot more sense, though I was thinking the way spider from mars said it, which was men and women, so I was thinking the whole thing applied to adults.

@cassandrasays

When mad cow disease hit the news in the UK I felt kind of vindicated in my complete refusal to eat brains. I really don’t like internal organs, but I don’t think it’s a snob thing, I think it’s a texture issue. I’m sure there’s some subconscious stuff going on there too though.

I was only offered brains after the mad cow thing (became common? More heard of? whichever.) I was in a restaurant and our table was offered free samples of tongue, brain and guts, I think I chose guts but it’s been a while. /rambles. my main point is for my recent memory ‘no brains’ has been caused by that whole thing, and I’m rambling on it.

@bigmomma

And I love spiced and spicy food. We will never cross paths in a restaurant, I fear, Kitteh.

I love spicy food too! 😀

@kittehs

The texture I really dislike is fat or gristle. Bit on some on tonight’s steak – gah, that squishy resilient crunch, blerk.

Me too. Especially in sausage. Either that or there’s more in sausage?

@pecunium

Brains are ok. Done well they are textured like scrambled eggs (or so incorporated they lose texture).

And…now I kind of want to try brains. That’s not something I thought I’d be in danger of saying.

@cassandrasays

Speaking of which, Howard, if you like spicy things you might want to try classic Chinese spicy eggplant, since the cooking technique produces a different kind of texture (and also the sauce is great).

That sounds really yummy. I should try it.

Valerian
8 years ago

Kittehs-

The Safe House is a Milwaukee institution, to the point I was confused when you said Chicago (“oh hell not another of them”). It was crappy of your friends to spring it on you, but not altogether surprising, they probably thought of it as local color/fun. I was not a big fan either, which was especially unfortunate as my husband is from Milwaukee and loves the place to the point that we have Collectibles. It’s definitely the prime tourist trap (if you don’t like American football) around those parts, sort of like going to Branson or Cedar Point in the rest of the American Midwest.

I wouldn’t want Branson sprung on me by surprise either, though. I also don’t care for having rolls chucked in my face.

Kittehserf
8 years ago

Thanks for that background, Valerian. It’s even more surprising in a way, because I wouldn’t have picked those two friends as being into that sort of tourist trap except maybe with their kids/grandkids, let alone thinking I’d have any liking for it.

Weird. ::shakes head::

On the other hand, I loved the Pabst Mansion and the Milwaukee Art Museum. So did Louis and Katie!

CassandraSays
CassandraSays
8 years ago

In that case my response would be “why did you take me to a tourist trap”. Isn’t one of the main advantages of having friends in any given place that they can help you avoid the tourist traps?

Kittehserf
8 years ago

One would think so! Or at least who’d say “It’s really touristy, but would you like to go to X?”

If I’d known what the place was like beforehand I’d never have gone. Informed consent, what is that?

Howard Bannister
8 years ago

Speaking of which, Howard, if you like spicy things you might want to try classic Chinese spicy eggplant, since the cooking technique produces a different kind of texture (and also the sauce is great).

Google sez… yes, there’s a recipe that looks like I can easily adapt it. And low-carb.

I think I know what’s for dinner tonight…

emilygoddess
emilygoddess
8 years ago

I really need to believe that those comments are all Internet bravado and these guys aren’t really as awful as they want each other to think. I need to believe this because the alternative is much too terrifying for me to deal with right now.

(Sorry if the convo has moved on; I just got back from vacation and haven’t caught up with the comments yet)

justice741
justice741
8 years ago

I just have one question. (hypocrisy check)

What do you think of the girls mother, who was on the scene and saw her girl drowning, but did not go into the water to try to rescue her own daughter?

pecunium
8 years ago

Forcemeat liver (terrines, sausages, etc) are fine, but the straight stuff, nope.

pecunium
8 years ago

Argenti: But mango juice is amazing!

Lots of things are amazing, Good Gin, for example. 🙂

I am somehow more disturbed by the idea of you LARPing than eating brains…

Most LARPs are nothing like that. One dude tried to “impress” me (or perhaps the woman in his group, by trying to overpower me. Since I was an NPC with a huge amount of authority (even power), it didn’t go well for him. A bit embarrassing actually. Even more so later when there was some fencing to be done.

Falconer: Huh. Better not mention to this crowd the mango sherbet we enjoyed last summer, then.

I’m all for other people enjoying them. And it’s only the “raw” fruit (i.e. one in the skin, getting ripe) which really gets up my nose (because it gets up my nose, in the literal sense).

The PVC/foam is almost certainlt LARPing. SCA uses things that are much more substantial (rapier uses actual steel, schlägers with buttons).

Kittehserf: One of the things I hate about people who like foods others don’t is, the, “You’ve never had it done well”. Bullshit. I like lima beans. I don’t like mangoes (they taste just as the smell). Cooking spinach renders it inedible.

I am an adult. I know what I like, and telling me that I’ve been too stupid realise that for going on 50 years spinach which has been exposed to heat makes me retch, or that mangoes are (for me) one of the most revolting things on earth, is insulting.

As to the restaurant, katz hit on the head; coercive is out. So much the fuck out.

Argenti Aertheri
8 years ago

Gin *gags*

Ok, you got me. You keep that slime to yourself, and I’ll keep the sweet stuff to myself.

Howard Bannister
8 years ago

Kittehserf: One of the things I hate about people who like foods others don’t is, the, “You’ve never had it done well”. Bullshit. I like lima beans. I don’t like mangoes (they taste just as the smell). Cooking spinach renders it inedible.

Oh, yes.

I love a good mango on something.

I also can’t stand the taste of garlic.

After all the grief I’ve taken over the garlic, the odds of me telling somebody else ‘no, no, suppress your gag reflex–it’s awesome!!’ are somewhat low.

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

Random food we loathed as kids, and I haven’t dared try again?

Stuffing. We LOATHED stuffing as children. I don’t know what it was, texture, flavor, what, but I recall it making us retch. Thankfully, we only deal with it once a year, and now that we’re an adult, we don’t get shit about how we ought to eat it.

auggziliary
8 years ago

To be fair, some foods people haven’t tried well at all. Like tofu. I swear, about 10% of the people I know who say they hate tofu, respond with “I got a pack and put it in my pasta or stir fry, it was awful”.
Then most of the people I know who “hate tofu” haven’t ever even tried it, or think that all fake meats are tofu(they’re rarely tofu, they’re more heavily processed proteins from various plants or even dairy).
I live around a lot of vegetarian haters btw, so I am exposed to a lot of ignorance about vegetarian stuff.

SittieKitty
8 years ago

What do you think of the girls mother, who was on the scene and saw her girl drowning, but did not go into the water to try to rescue her own daughter?

I have no information on what the mother did or did not do, so I can’t comment on it. If she deliberately attempted to not save her child, that’s awful. If she freaked out because her child was dying, that’s an understandable reason to freeze/panic. If she was in the process of helping, that’s awesome.

Also, this is a derail and not at all a hypocrisy check. It’s irrelevant what the mom was doing because the topic of conversation isn’t the mom, it isn’t the girl, it isn’t the man who died, it’s not even about the situation that happened – it’s that some shitty people think it’s okay to let little girls drown.

Ally S
8 years ago

I just have one question. (hypocrisy check)

What do you think of the girls mother, who was on the scene and saw her girl drowning, but did not go into the water to try to rescue her own daughter?

Well obviously we have no problems with her because women are perfect and can’t do anything wrong ever.

There, satisfied? I told you want you wanted to hear. Now go cite this as evidence of misandry in a highly pretentious screed and shoo.

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

RE: auggzilliary

Through years of practice, I have forced my body to accept tofu, but as of yet, I have still only ever encountered one form of preparation that I actually enjoyed. (And believe me, I’ve eaten tofu in many dishes–soups, deep-fried, stir-fried…) That was a little Buddhist nun’s version where she stir-fried it with tumeric and… something leafy and green and mushrooms, I think? It was a long time ago.

I don’t know what it is. Texture, maybe.

RE: justice741

Oh, you totally got us there! It’s true, we believe women are under no onus to help people. We believe that women are useless, you see.

(Note: I’m being sarcastic.)

hellkell
hellkell
8 years ago

Dudes like justice741 never have “just one question.”

Ally S
8 years ago

“Dudes like justice741 never have ‘just one question.'”

They don’t even have a single question. They’re just here to have a “GOTCHA” moment so that they can run to their fellow misogynists and contribute to their long-winded essays on why men are oppressed.

katz
8 years ago

Protip: Never say you’re doing a hypocrisy check. It only works if you spring it on the person afterwards.

auggziliary
8 years ago

LBT, well at least you’ve tried it properly. I hate sitting at lunch trying to enjoy my delicious tofu, and hearing people start a conversation about how stuck up and pushy vegatarians are, or “what about teh complete proteinz?” or how I’m an idiot for not eating bacon and how nasty tofu is.
Yet when I ask them if they’ve bothered to try tofu, their answer is always BS like I mentioned.
(I have had a lot of experiences with pushy, stuck up, omnivore bullies who made fun of me for being vegan).

auggziliary
8 years ago

Also I don’t get what justices point is.
There’s a difference in not saving someone because you want them to die for being female, and not saving someone because you’re frozen in fear and don’t know what to do(probably how the lady was feeling).
Justice, can you point out where she said she didn’t save her daughter because she wanted her to die because of her gender/sex, or something equally terrible?

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

RE: auggziliary

trying to enjoy my delicious tofu,

Yeeech. Better you than me! Which is weird, because I LOVE edamame, and it’s made of the same shit, you wouldn’t think it’d make that big a difference to me.

I just try and tune out anyone who judges me for my eating choices. With an ED, it’s really the only way to go. (Though if I’m restricting, I do prefer people mention it; sometimes I do forget.)

inurashii
inurashii
8 years ago

aw sad, LBT…

I love tofu, and I’m an omnivore. Pretty much any protein source tastes really good to me 😛

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

RE: inurashii

I know! I’m actually rather disappointed that I can’t seem to train myself into liking tofu. I WANT to like it, because it seems one of the easiest meat replacements and I’d like to go vege safely, but so far, I can still only just tolerate it.

*has now eaten edamame because of this convo*

Valerian
8 years ago

Tofu is an essential component in a lot of nondairy baking applications and is as such my Best Friend.

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

RE: Valerian

I didn’t know tofu even COULD be used in baking. Though I have an AMAZZZZZING vegan chocolate cake recipe we used for my wedding. It is godsauce.

(Also, pssst, I replied to your LJ PM!)

cloudiah
8 years ago

I totally <3 tofu.

Could you please share this vegan chocolate cake recipe, pretty please?

auggziliary
8 years ago

LBT, tofu can be used in baking for puddings and cheesecakes. It’s generally silken tofu. Silken tofu is basically unpressed tofu, so it has the consistency of yogurt or custard.

I’m trying to think of recipes I could share here…
Most of my baking recipes are the same as the non vegan version, I just replace the ingredients. There’s these fake eggs I use called ener-G. They’re not like egg beaters, they’re only for baking.
To replace milk I use unflavored soy milk, and mix it with lemon juice. I usually see it mixed with vinegar but I hate the taste of vinegar, so lemon juice it is. The lemon juice makes it change a bit, I’m not sure what, but it makes it more flavorful and creamy in the baking.
To replace butter I use vegan butter. I’ve also heard people use applesauce or mashed banana.

Oh, here’s a super easy, cheap, fast, and healthy vegan recipe with lots of protein.
Roasted chickpeas.
Ingredients: can of chickpeas, an oil, spices/salt.
Tools: baking sheet, oven.

1: Heat oven at 350 degrees Fahrenheit.
2: Drain a can of chickpeas and dump the drained peas on a cookie sheet.
3: Add about 2 tbs of olive or vegetable oil on the chickpeas.
4: Take the sheet and swirl it around to spread the oil evenly on the chickpeas, and make sure the chickpeas are flat. Like not in piles.
5: Take your favorite spices and sprinkle it on the chickpeas. I usually use salt, chicken spices(not made of chicken, its for putting on grilled chicken), and cumin(I love cumin). Most spice combinations will do.
If you don’t feel like using spices then just put salt and hot sauce or something.
6: roast the chickpeas for 30 minutes.
7: use chickpeas on salads or eat plain in a bowl. Or whatever other ways you can use them. Seriously they’re delicious. They’re like my vegan bacon bits.

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

RE: cloudiah

Sure, gimme just a sec… *digs up wedding book* I got it from a Kiwi, actually!

Take:
3 cups flour
2 cups sugar
8 tablespoons cocoa
1/2 teaspoon salt
2.5 teaspoons baking powder

and mix them together. Poke three holes in the mixture, and into them put

2 tsp vanilla
10 tbsp canola oil
2 tbsp vinegar

Pour two cups of cold water on top and mix. Grease tin and put mix in, then cook at 160 degrees Celsius (320 Farenheit) for one hour. Hubby and I have also “iced” it afterward using honey.

OM NOM NOM!

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

RE: auggziliary

Ooh, that sounds delicious, and an easy way to beef up my salads! I shall have to give that a try.

auggziliary
8 years ago

Moarr vegan stuff…
there’s these vegan bullion cubes I love called “not-beef” and “not-chicken”. Seriously, that’s what they’re called. They make savory soups and sauces really easy.
I love making smoothies. My favorite so far is a cantelope, peach, and ginger.

Also I love this salad I learned. Its basically cubes of avocado and tomato, with some chopped onion(the sweeter kind of onion, not the strong ones). Then the dressing is vegetable oil, vinegar, black pepper, and salt.

Also tip for baking delicious cookies and cakes: mix the wet and dry stuff separately, except dissolve the sugar(or whatever sweetener you’re using) in the wet stuff.
(That tip is pretty well known I know, but it still made me super excited when I found it).

auggziliary
8 years ago

OH, I have an awesome recipe for a chocolate volcano cake. It’s literally 10 minutes to make.
Ingredients: chocolate cake mix, chocolate frosting(I get the plastic can that’s like 2 or more cups), 1 coke can(NOT DIET). If you want it to be vegan then obviously you need to check if the cake stuff is vegan. Surprisingly a lot of common baking mixes and frostings are vegan. So don’t spend like 10$ on some organic special stuff from Whole Foods, just check the Duncan Hines boxes.*
Tools: spoon(whatever kind), really large microwaveable bowl, microwave that will fit that bowl.

1: mix the coke with the cake mix in the bowl. Dont mix it too much. Just enough so that there’s not large lumps. Medium lumps are OK.(over mixing can make baked goods heavy and rubbery).
2: take the can of frosting and scoop out the frosting. Dump all the frosting the the center of the bowl. Don’t make a hole in the batter for it. Just dump it there.
It will seem like a lot of frosting. Don’t worry. It is.
3: put bowl in microwave and cook for 10 minutes. If your microwave doesn’t spin then IDK if you’ll need to rotate it halfway. I’m sure it will be fine either way.

During the cooking, the frosting sinks down to the bottom. It also melts and becomes not fudge basically. Also the cake won’t taste like coke, so don’t worry.

I’ve been told this is the best cake ever.

*some vegans won’t buy from brands that still use animal products in other things. I’m not one of those vegans, but if you are, then you need to find another cake mix/frosting brand. Or make your own.

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

RE: auggzilliary

Oh my GOD, that sounds AMAZING.

cloudiah
8 years ago

I now feel like I’ve heard that roasted chickpeas are awesome from enough sources that I will need to roast some chickpeas this evening. Also, all the chocolate cake things sound good, and now I am hungry.

(I am kind of pleased that a thread that started out being about a terrible misogynist is now just us sharing yummy recipes.)

auggziliary
8 years ago

Fuck, I put “not fudge” instead of “hot fudge”. (At “During the cooking….”)

LBT: thank you, it is!
It’s good with vanilla ice cream. Vegan of course. I usually get that SO delicious stuff, but the coconut based kind. It’s expensive though…

LBT
LBT
8 years ago

RE: auggziliary

Well, I’m not vegan, so I’m safe on that front. (Giving up meat is easy, except for the health issues I get, but give up my beloved dairy? NEVER!)

emilygoddess
emilygoddess
8 years ago

To be fair, some foods people haven’t tried well at all. Like tofu. I swear, about 10% of the people I know who say they hate tofu, respond with “I got a pack and put it in my pasta or stir fry, it was awful”.

I had only ever tried it raw. Blech! The day I had decently prepared tofu was a real eye-opener, and now I can’t get enough of the stuff. It helps that I have a weakness for crispy foods, and tofu fries up nice and crispy if you prep it right.

I think another dimension to people “hating tofu” is they tried to substitute it for meat in a recipe, and found that neither the taste nor texture was an adequate substitute. I find tofu is much tastier if you meet it on its own terms, rather than expecting it to function as a 1:1 replacement for meat.

And thanks for the roasted chickpea recipe. I’m in love with chickpeas. We have this recipe for chicken slathered in paprika that’s cooked with a handful of chickpeas, and I always end up making it with more chickpeas than chicken because they’re So. Damn. Good. Now I can just skip the chicken entirely 🙂

While we’re sharing recipes, here’s my friend’s vegan chocolate silk pie:

Melt chocolate chips in a double boiler. Stir in silken tofu. Pour into graham cracker crust. Chill until solid. Nom.

He stopped serving it at his potlucks when he got a roommate who’s allergic to soy, and even my formidable sweet tooth can’t handle a whole pie, so I haven’t gotten to have it in ages…

@Cloudiah

(I am kind of pleased that a thread that started out being about a terrible misogynist is now just us sharing yummy recipes.)

You would’ve loved Fandom_Wank. Back before we spun off a separate community for the unfunny wanks (racefail, sexism, etc), we would just fill up unfunny posts with recipe threads and requests. A lot of them ended up being staples in my house, too.

Argenti Aertheri
8 years ago

Yeah I can’t stomach tofu. I’ve tried it oh so many ways, and if the pieces are small enough to swallow whole I’m good, but other than that Mrs. Sree makes the only tofu I’ve ever actually liked (Sree’s, in Pittsburgh, $5 for enough delicious home cooked food to last lunch and dinner, go there if in Pittsburgh [the downtown branch is best, it’s the one Mrs. Sree herself works in])

Kittehserf
8 years ago

@Howard:

After all the grief I’ve taken over the garlic, the odds of me telling somebody else ‘no, no, suppress your gag reflex–it’s awesome!!’ are somewhat low.

Yup, I’m the same with pretty much any Asian food, except some Japanese. I really dislike the smell of it (not to mention the body odour it produces). I don’t like the smell of garlic but I do like the taste in some food, like garlic bread or herb and garlic sausages (the smell cooks out with those). But when the boss comes in and has evidently had garlic in dinner last night – ewwwwww it’s unpleasant breathing around him!

As for the latest halfwitted turd troll – Michael Patterson was alerted to the fact that Javaeh Jones had been swept away by the current by her mother’s cries. That kinda suggests she couldn’t swim or couldn’t get to her, doesn’t it? But noooo, trolly boy has to imply that she was going to let her daughter drown. Doesn’t exactly chime with her huge gratitude to Mr Patterson afterward, either.

Took me all of a minute to look that up.

I bet there’s a bit of racism in all this shit, too: Michael Patterson was white and Javaeh Jones a child of colour.

Argenti Aertheri
8 years ago

“I bet there’s a bit of racism in all this shit, too: Michael Patterson was white and Javaeh Jones a child of colour.”

Statistically speaking, that makes it quite likely that her mother couldn’t swim. Idk about elsewhere, but Pittsburgh had a push to teach PoC to swim because of how much more often their kids drown because they can’t help (like, at least some of what I saw even recognized the role of class in this — can’t afford swimming lessons or trips to the beach = less likely to know how to swim)

Point: odds are in favor of her mother being unable to help in a way besides alerting people who could swim. Which she did.

Kittehserf
8 years ago

I wondered if that might be the case, Argenti. This happened in Georgia, if that means anything.

Plus of course we can’t have women knowing “I can’t help person X, I need to alert someone who can!” – the very thing emergency services people have pointed out on this very thread, not that trolly would have bothered reading that. Oh no, women are really expected to drown or otherwise die in emergencies: that’s the only way scum like these MGTOW will be happy.