“Zed,” also known as “The Zen Priest,” was one of the originators of the Men Going Their Own Way “philosophy” and is treated as a wise elder by many longtime MRAs.
WF Price of The Spearhead described a compilation of Zed’s writings as “really quite profound as well as a great read” and used to give it out as a bonus for everyone who signed up for his email newsletter. Paul Elam of A Voice for Men laid it on a bit thicker, saying of the man he described as both a mentor and a friend:
[H]is writings have taken him to iconic status in the minds of many men who have been at this for a while, this writer included. This has happened despite the fact that he has eschewed the path of self promotion and opted to speak from behind the persona of an archetype, maybe because of it. Either way, he has wielded a sharp sword from his underworld den, and worn the uniform of a warrior in the battle for sanity between men and women … .
So what kind of fellow is this Zed?
Well, as I learned from a recent thread over on MGTOWforums.com, where he is officially an “elite member,” he’s the sort of person who thinks you should’t bother to save a four-year-old girl from drowning, because then she’ll grow up into a woman, and most of them are just terrible.
The regulars on the forums there were discussing the case of Michael Patterson, a Georgia man who was paralyzed after diving into a creek to rescue a four-year-old girl from drowning, and who has now died after several weeks in the hospital.
While a few suggested that Patterson was a hero, others made clear they wouldn’t have done the same thing themselves. 0kool put it like this:
i know i would never save an adult CUNT….and i know that as sure as i breathe air. however, i would be hard pressed to save a female child knowing what she might have the potential to do in the future. My hat’s off to the guy. Let’s hope his death isn’t in vain and the child doesn’t become a CUNT piece of shit!
Zed, that grand underground warrior for gender sanity, that icon of the Men’s Rights movement, argued the same thing in slightly more restrained prose. In one comment, he warned of the dire possibility that the seemingly innocent little girl you save could grow up to be
another Amanda Marcunt, or Jessica Valenti, or Betty Friedan? Do we think it is worth a man giving his own life to save the life of a woman who will spend it being totally destructive?
In another, he raised the specter of an even more hated figure, at least amongst MGTOWers and MRAs:
Given the evidence around me, it does appear far more likely that a girl will grow up to be another Sharon Osborne – who thinks it is “fantastic” when a woman cuts off the penis of her husband, or the audience of women who cheered that statement – than a woman who contributes much, even to her own family.
I really can’t think of any woman in the public light who the world would be much worse off without.
When a female is in trouble, if I don’t know her, I don’t see her.
This is the kind of timeless wisdom that makes you an icon in the Men’s Rights movement, I guess.
NOTE: Thanks to @taylerlp on Twitter for the tip.
EDITED TO ADD: When I wrote this post, there were 13 or so comments in the MGTOWforums thread; there are considerably more now, including a number from MGTOWers who say they WOULD try to save a little girl. But Zed only doubles down on his position.
Time until blauregen’s mask mask of reasonability slips?
Anyone who has read any MRA “thought” and has any conscience knows they are hateful and full of shit.
Strangely, the So. Much. Data. problem is apparently good for my mental health — I’m too engrossed in this to be depressed! So thanks guys 🙂 Or should I say girls? There are about twice as many cis women here as cis men (and just about as many non-binaries as the other categories combined, whee, there are lots of us!)
Seriously, send pizza. Please.
blauregen, here’s what Straughan said about a very pro-abuse article.
Speaking of those scumbags Fathers for Justice, did you see that one of them vandalised Constable’s The Haywain? No damage done, mercifully, but it’s one more thing to add to the list of “demonstrating they are too irresponsible and self-centred and completely lacking perspective to be trusted with raising snails, let alone human children”.
Have you heard of the good men project? It’s in the sidebar for antidotes for boobery, called “but seriously, what about teh menz?”
I don’t know if I’d recommend GMP. It’s been pretty damn bad recently.
Pizza being made for Argenti!
What toppings u want?
On the plus side I guess at least they didn’t try to kill anyone? On the more negative side, why would anyone want to involve themselves with a movement where not trying to kill anyone in this particular instance is a step in the right direction?
Ozy left the GMT a while back, auggz (zie wrote But Seriously). The whole GMP has turned very MRAish.
I’d suggest looking at what the SPLC (Southern Poverty Law Centre) says of the MRM. It’s identified them as a hate group.
No pizza, sorry, but you can have some soba salad if you can figure out a way for me to deliver it via the magic of the internet.
Cassandra – yeah, it sets the bar pretty low, doesn’t it?
Trying to destroy artworks like that puts them in my “contemptible asshats” folder more firmly than ever.
OT I was looking for pages on the Tay Bridge disaster before, and found one called “Tom Martin’s Tay Bridge page”. O_o. Don’t think it was that Tom Martin, though. It was coherent and didn’t seem to think the disaster was caused by penguin whores.
Pizza mad by a king! Thanks!
And GMP hasn’t tried to kill anyone? Hugo. Fucking. Schwyzer. wrote there last I checked…
Ah, I didn’t know about GMT.
Why did they try to ruin artwork?
Also, this is what Erin Prizzey, a highly esteemed FeMRA among the MRM, gave as advice to victims of abuse from their parents:
http://manboobz.com/2013/04/14/antifeminist-crusader-erin-pizzey-bravely-tells-redditors-that-never-in-the-history-of-the-world-have-men-been-so-unprivileged-if-you-think-about-it/
And here’s more Prizzey horribleness:
http://manboobz.com/2013/04/28/the-feminist-hegemony-will-destroy-your-hard-drive-and-other-things-i-learned-from-erin-pizzeys-return-visit-to-reddit/
Who else agrees that the GMP link should be removed from the “Antidotes to Boobery” list?
I second that motion.
@auggziliary: I am here, because someone on another site mentioned this one. I keep reading because I like David Futrelle’s style of polemics. It is entertaining. I knew of the men’s movement for centuries but only became really interrested in the ideas of men’s rights advocates, when I noticed that they have some positive effects, like bringing the fact that men can also be sexually assaulted into the public consciousness, which seems to have, for example, a good effect on how the US-military handles those cases.
I don’t consider myself either an MRA or a feminist. I try to decide in individual cases which position I agree with.
@CassandraSays: No, not especially. The person was impressed with Girlwriteswhat videos, so I looked into one of it (she is not bad as an orator) and several transcripts on her blog and found her sources lacking, which I told the one who recommended her.
Having dubious sources, is no reason for me to dismiss a person for the purpose of a discussion. It is only a reason to point it out.
Also, not really political/feminist, but I Love Charts doesn’t post bigoted shit and charts! I love charts! (No really, I do, though not so much today as I’m elbow deep in them). Antidotes include straight up distractions? (In which case, the sidebar needs cats)
At this point they’re not much of an antidote. In fact in a way they’re worse than AVFM, since their attempts to seem reasonable make it easier for them to slip under the radars of people who aren’t already tuned in to things like victim blaming.
If all you can see wrong with GWW’s arguments is her tendency not to cite good sources then I hate to break it to you, but you may in fact be an MRA.
Ally, I agree totally. If anything, it should be in the boob roll.
Auggz, it’s the Fathers4Justice or whatever it is in the UK who are going around trying to vandalise art. They attacked the Jubilee portrait of the Queen and now the Haywain. They’re on about custody rights, I think (though my first thought is always, “Yeah, and why don’t you have custody? Wouldn’t be because you a) didn’t bother applying, b) were never much involved with your child, let alone being primary caregiver, c) neglectful d) actively abusive to them or to your wife, would it? Hmm?”
“I knew of the men’s movement for centuries…”
VAMPIRE!!
(My brain, it really is fried huh? Anyone want to make some fried brain stew or something? I’m in the US, never been further than Canada, so it shouldn’t have mad cow…)
“If all you can see wrong with GWW’s arguments is her tendency not to cite good sources then I hate to break it to you, but you may in fact be an MRA.”
Hopefully ze will see things differently after reading that link to GWW commenting on the Necessity of Domestic Violence by Matt Forney.
I can’t help imagining this being said by Jeff Foxworthy.
Blauregen, have you missed the facts that feminists have long talked about sexual assault on men, that MRAs do nothing to support men in any real way (they would rather close women’s shelters than work to build men’s ones) and that their whole cry of “false rape accusations” and wanting rape to be, effectively, off the books as a crime, is all about hating women?
They aren’t out to help men. They pick out crimes against men when it suits them, which is to say, when they can dream up a way of blaming women for it. They’re misogynist and homophobic and racist, and you really, really need to think hard about where you’re coming from if you are overlooking or shrugging off those central characteristics of their “movement”.
These guys upvote someone on the Spearhead who called for baby girls’ voiceboxes to be removed.
These guys are saying right now that little girls should be left to drown.
And yet you think there’s anything worthwhile about them?