So Angry Harry, the dotty old British uncle of the Men’s Rights movement, has a post up vaguely warning that the virus software company Symantec just might soon have some sort of shareholders revolt on its hands because it dared to put a bunch of men’s rights sites on a “hate sites” blacklist, blocking access to them for some users of Symantec’s Rulespace software.
That’s kind of an old whine at this point, but what captured my fancy was this recent discussion about Harry’s article in the Men’s Rights subreddit.
Oh, where to begin with all this? I’m charmed, of course, by the idea that feminism is just ruining things — ruining things! — for all the nice ladies in the tech world. I mean, it’s not like feminists have anything to complain about with regard to sexism amongst male techies. They’re just complainy complainers. Ladies in tech are doing just fine, thanks! Don’t take their word for it. Take the word of some random dude in the Men’s Rights subreddit for it.
But the real treat here is Hamakua’s nightmare vision of an army of secret “imbedded” Anita Sarkeesians infiltrating major corporations and … doing what, exactly? Secretly making videos about sexist tropes in video games in hidden compartments underneath their desks, like that secret nap compartment George had built under his desk at work on Seinfeld?
Beware the stealth Sarkeesians!
(Found this through the AgainstMensRights subreddit.)
‘The number of women in tech is steadily rising’
‘
‘I agree. Women aren’t prospering’
Uh, wut.
http://www.avoiceformen.com/mens-rights/documentary-to-be-filmed-on-mhrm-avfm/
I’d ask if anyone has offered or has the least interest in filming a documentary of the Manboobz faithful, but I know the answer.
yes make an MRA documentary yessss
An email has just been sent out to the production company introducing them to JTO, Dean Esmay, NCFM President Harry Crouch, Tom Golden, TyphonBlue, GWW and Erin Pizzey, all of whom have agreed to participate in the film.
yes i said yes i will YES
(get tom martin sending thought waves get tom martin)
Portal is a relatively low perpetrated violence game as well. Sure, there is violence committed against you, but it tends to be less murder…y.
Oh boy oh boy oh boy! I FINALLY know what I am, thanks to Screaming Fist! I’m a credulous dolt. . .OF THE FEMOSPHERE!!! (cue awesome music). I wonder if I’ll get a sequel…
I’m too tired to be competent, but I’ve played Amentis once, in a Vampire setting. And more or less non-combatted that mess (lots of invisibility and walking through walls)
And the Tremere dude was going to play it enough as a Malk that clan Tremere wouldn’t realize it (which would be hard enough to pull off to make up for the stupid!)
The biggest problem I had with the first part of the Damsel in distress video is that she did not quantify exactly what influence a Nintendo-console exclusive series of games supposedly had on the developement of video games as a whole. It’s a pretty tall claim to make and I feel that she isn’t backing it up at all. Especially since PC games took such a different route compared to console games… but maybe this is one of those US things, like when “comics” automatically means “Marvel/DC trademark character series, superheros only”…
Likewise she didn’t really comment on which grounds she disregarded the games featuring women and girls as characters, which is sort of odd. But maybe I simply can’t remember her expicitly stating that she’s here to point out the problematic rather than the acceptable stuff. Then again, I don’t really remember the critics picking up that glove for real, other than as weak cauistic arguments.
The other bit has already been mentioned on the first page of this comment stream – her analysis doesn’t cut particularily deep. But I feel that that’s the unavoidable result of using tropes as a category of analysis. You really can’t go into any jucy details while using a methodology popularized by the likes of Frazer and Campbell.
Something tells me that j has never played Grand Theft Auto. So racist, but I really love blowing up cars and spend most of my time doing that.
Minecraft is non-racist, but can be violent depending on how you play
The Sims is non-racist and pretty non-violent (though you can brawl with neighbors)
Ok, I play a lot of games where I can just do whatever I want with no objective so…
@SaintNick86
Yeah I see what you mean. The thing that bugged me most about that video was when she was all “lalala lets be positive about this and not so negative and stuff and work together”
First the particular gamers who attacked her don’t want to work together or even compromise. They like their bouncy titties in games and could care less about women as anything but sex objects. Secondly…she’s a friggen critic, that’s what critics do. They analyze why something is overdone, weak or wrong. It sounds like she just wants Anita to say there is nothing wrong with these tropes and call it a day. So yeah, essentially telling her to shut up. I really hate that “you’re just jealous argument too. Its so silly. Sexy female characters have their place and can be fun to play. Personally I liked Tifa better than Aeris because she seemed more down to earth and I could sympathize with her unrequited love for Cloud. The fact that she had a big chest and wore a mini skirt didn’t make me jealous and made me prefer Aeris because of it. Same with Baiken from Guilty Gear. Such a badass character despite ridiculous amounts of cleavage.
Damsels are everywhere, it doesn’t make them bad, it just makes them overused, continues to stereotype women as weak and are there for the hero’s story. They can be likeable and have lots of positive traits but yeah…irrelevant.
Its interesting you mentioned that about geek girls and how many geekier guys lament about how there aren’t enough geek girls and where are they all hiding, then the minute they do show up they alienate them with sexism, silencing and my personal favorite “you’re just a fake geek looking for attention.” I thought they wanted women to share their interests and not “shame” them for it like all women apparently do.
This upsets me a lot because I’ve been a weirdo and a geek my entire life, it’s certainly never made me popular with men and while I personally am lucky to have not been met with hostility (and this is probably more because I don’t interact or go out of my way to meet other geeks much) it’s still angering to see this shit happen today. Frankly, it makes me not want to interact at all, lest I be met with judgement and accusation of being a fake. I know its not all geeky guys, most are pretty great from my experience, unfortunately the ones who are asses are the loudest.
I think I know the argument you’re mentioning…was it thunderf00t? I know he accused Anita of basically wanting no one to save anyone and that she lacks empathy or something. I cant quite remember the exact wording but it was a clear strawman of her argument.
You know how they keep making the argument that male characters have it worse because they are disposable having to face danger to save the damsel? did it ever occur to them that maybe they should actually be agreeing with Anita because the less damsels there are, the less male characters will have to risk their lives to save them since they’ll be able to save themselves! or maybe actually not get kidnapped in the first place! Do they even try to think about this?
same with the whole ranting about how male characters are always killed but female characters aren’t and if they are, there’s an outrage. Well if female characters were portrayed as competent, strong and dangerous with some actual muscle mass, it would feel more like a fair fight and like they would be an actual threat to the protagonist. Women are associated with weakness, that’s why its upsetting when they are beaten or killed. However if female characters actually look like they can hold their own in a fight (so no bikini armor) then it doesn’t seem like the player is killing someone weaker. Someone once linked a video here of a fighting game where a huge bulking male character was punching the female character repeatedly. This female character was clearly not a fighter and it was not a fair fight. She was in a tiny bikini and moaning…its was misogynistic as hell. Who the hell would design a character like that for a fighting game and think its a good idea?
of course I heard one guy argue that women are weak in real life thus it makes sense to portray them like that in games and comics. Because its totally realistic to portray all men as looking like Kratos and having all his strength to boot.
I could go on forever about this topic, I’ll shut up now 😛
Reminds me of the wierd dissonance in the new Tomb Raider Game’s story. At first they tried to make the “weaker”, more “empathic” Lara Croft a selling point, but ultimately she ends up shooting, stabbing and roasting approximately six hundred cannibal sailors over the course of three or four days filled with extended shootouts.
That was one of those moments where game mechanics and level design really clashed with the story they were allegeldy trying to tell.
Ok, so that’s more or less fair enough… but if I were to assert that all women are emotional lunatics, then, when called out, apologise because I didn’t know there were any women in the room (rather than because it’s a false and, frankly, offensive statement) would you not drag me over the coals for such a bullshit non-pology?
I mean, I see your point. I was fairly active on the social.bioware forum through Mass Effect 2 & 3. I have seen the privileged whining first hand:
“Ermagerrd! Why are they allowing gay relationships!?”
“Ermagerrd! Why are they wasting time on Tali romance dialogue when I don’t like her and I’d rather have a mako mission!?”
“Ermagerrd! Why do they even let you play a female character at all!?”
Yeah, some gamers rally around the most ridiculous and self centred of causes… but representing an entire group as negative based on a few, even on most, is still bad. Especially considering the way the MRAs like to misrepresent feminists as all being the very worst strawman available to them.
Yeah, I don’t understand this. I saw a thread on /r/againstmensrights where a guy was complaining that feminists want to do things to his sexist games, and it’s so mean because he faces oppression at the hands of the sporty kids, and he totally agrees that women have it hard, so he shouldn’t have to deal with added variety in games. But elsewhere in the thread he’s complaining about the dearth of “Hwi Norees” in the world. (I’m going to assume he just means women who will like him, rather than women engineered specifically to cater to his particular desires by this.) I don’t understand the mentality there.
1) Tell women they’re not allowed to play with you.
2) Wonder why women don’t want to play with you.
There’s a degree of dissonance there.
(Personally I find the concept of G.I.R.L.s amusing. See, there are no girls on the internet – especially not in MMOs – they’re all Guys In Real Life.)
Reminds me of the wierd dissonance in the new Tomb Raider Game’s story. At first they tried to make the “weaker”, more “empathic” Lara Croft a selling point, but ultimately she ends up shooting, stabbing and roasting approximately six hundred cannibal sailors over the course of three or four days filled with extended shootouts.
I’ve just got the new Tomb Raider, primarily so I can play it with my wife, as it’s one of the few game franchises she has any interest in, and she also went to college with Rhianna Pratchett. So far we’re up to the fourth camp and I have to say that the gameplay doesn’t seem very, well, Tomb Raider-y. Can anyone assure me that we’ll eventually get to do some of the things more traditionally associated with the franchise – inching along vertiginous ledges, pulling off tricky jumps, solving puzzles that involve more than ‘set fire to a bag so the box rises’ – or are we basically playing a stripped-down version of Far Cry 3, but with better graphics (which isn’t saying much, given that Far Cry 3 on Xbox is a fucking eyesore)?
AH! That’s the Video I was talking about Quackers! Thanks! 😀
Oh, THANK YOU for letting me know I’m one of the GOOD ONES.
Not to me, it isn’t.
When I played The Sims, after a while I became bored and tried to find all the way to horrifically murder my characters. But you really have to want it.
Isn’t that what most people ended up doing with their Sims?
(Not a gamer, but that’s what I seem to remember people mostly talking about. Drowning seemed to be popular.)
By the way, there are plenty of non-violent MMORPGs out there. Off the top of my head, Second Life, Habbo, IMVU and a lot of the social MU*s. They all encourage creativity, expression and socializing (and occasionally sexytiming) as the core mechanic, rather than the level/grind/event of the World of Warcraft style fantasy game.
@CassandraSays: I never played The Sims, but I seem to recall that locking Sims away from their toilets was popular with the twelve-year-olds.
Master of Orion 2 can be completed without much violence on the part of the player, but if your ships encounter a wandering space monster, they’ll be destroyed automatically unless escorted by a military vessel, so warfare is necessary.
Civ III is mostly non-violent win conditions, which require beating every other nation in one aspect (Culture, Wealth, Science, or getting to Centauri) by the end of the game, although there is the War ending (be the last Civ standing).
> or are we basically playing a stripped-down version of Far Cry 3, but with better graphics (which isn’t saying much, given that Far Cry 3 on Xbox is a fucking eyesore)?
No, you got that right.The few puzzles somewhat close to what we’ve come to expect from a Tomb Raider game are primarily tucked away in optional areas.
The climbing/jumping areas are nicely designed though, but it’s much, much more of a cover-shooter than a puzzle plattformer.
I always loved the Sims because as a person who loves to write stories I make very complex stories in my head using the sims and the photo feature. I definitely don’t ever get bored with it and could play for days on end if I didn’t have any responsibilities and a better computer. And in the Sims 3 I especially love how customizable everything is. I wish I had a better computer so I could run it more smoothly. It’s system requirements basically force you to get a gaming computer which sucks. I actually wish there was a specific murder component to add to my stories. People had made some really great action hacks (I don’t know what to call them, basically making the sims do more things that couldn’t be written into the game by the manufacturers in order to keep the E rating) for Sims 2, waiting on some for Sims 3.
Thanks for the responses regarding non-combat RPGs. I remember participating in a Civ IV discussion board, and mentioning my preference for no-war games. Nobody was rude about it, but it was clearly baffling to them. “You mean, you just. . . Build stuff? For six thousand years? I’d go insane with boredom.” My personal favorite was when I’d get my Culture rating so high, cities on my borders would revolt and request to join my civ.
Then once I tried playing as an Objectivist civ. Wound up with the smallest population and highest wealth ever. Heh.
I am no good at warfare in the Civ games, or in Master of Orion. I spend too much energy trying to upgrade my cities/colonies, I guess. But then they don’t build anything very quickly if they’re not very efficient.
So what games are Manboobzers currently playing these days?
Rainbow Six 3, GRID, Deus Ex, Splinter Cell, Civ 5, Magical Diary (…shut up, it’s cute), Hitman. and Second Reproduction (also shut up – also cute).
Animal Crossing and Monster Hunter 3 Ultimate have been my universe lately.
If any boobzers wanna friend me, my FC is 2277-6670-5589.