So here’s an interesting chart. Guess what it represents?
A) The membership of the David Duke Fan Club
B) The racial breakdown of the most successful Liberace impersonators
C) The demographics of the Men’s Rights subreddit
Well, ok, that was too easy. It is of course all of the above. I’m guessing. It’s definitely C, at least, as this chart was prepared to show the results of the 2013 Men’s Rights subreddit demographic survey.
Now, you might say, well, isn’t Reddit itself a pretty white place? And you would be right. But the Men’s Rights subreddit seems to be a bit whiter — and a lot less black — than Reddit as a whole, if Quantcast’s estimates of Reddit’s overall ethnic breakdown are accurate.
In other completely non-surprising news, 89% of Men’s Rights Redditors are men. And a lot of them are libertarians. MRAs complain endlessly that we pigeonhole them as a bunch of entitled white dudes. They’re really not doing much to challenge that assumption.
The most important issue to these fellas (and the small minority that aren’t fellas)? Survey says: False rape accusations.
Other critical issues to the Men’s Rightsers include “custody rights” (which is a bit odd because 92% of those surveyed have no kids), “legal discrimination” (whatever that means), “education discrimination” (this is a thing?), and “male disposability.”
“Male birth control” and “paper abortion,” while relatively less important to the Men’s Rightsers, each got hundreds of votes.
I’m surprised “friendzoning” isn’t at the top of the list, but unfortunately it wasn’t one of the choices. I blame misandry.
Why should the free market get a say over whether it’s OK to publish a manual for rapists?
ITS NOBODY’S EFFING BUSINESS WHO SOMEONE WANTS TO BE WITH.
Jesus Christ, man, stop pounding on that strawman! What did it ever do to you?
I’m going to assume you’re being dense rather than disingenuous, and explain the rather obvious point that ‘racist fetishization’ does not simply mean ‘choosing to go out with women of a particular race’. As you should know given your claimed familiarity with it, the manosphere is replete with bullshit stereotypes about how, for example, Asian women are quiet and subservient; the whole ‘boycott American women’ movement (which is, duh, pretty xenophobic on its face) is pretty much based on them. If you don’t see that as racist then I don’t know what the fuck to say to you.
@Hellkell:
“HAHAHAHAHAHA. Oh, you are PRECIOUS.”
O: Thank you! I accept.
O.
I dunno, Kiki. His whole argument boils down to “NO U.”
@Howard:
“Citation?”
O: I’ve posted up the link to the Brian Banks case.
O.
I dunno, Kiki. His whole argument boils down to “NO U.”
Indeed, but the ad hom thing also indicated high levels of teh stupid. So hard to tell!
@Kiki:
“Jesus Christ, man, stop pounding on that strawman! What did it ever do to you?”
O: Nothing, last time I checked.
“I’m going to assume you’re being dense rather than disingenuous, and explain the rather obvious point that ‘racist fetishization’ does not simply mean ‘choosing to go out with women of a particular race’.”
O: OK…
“As you should know given your claimed familiarity with it, the manosphere is replete with bullshit stereotypes about how, for example, Asian women are quiet and subservient;”
O: Last time I checked, they had the right to hold steretypcial beliefs…
“the whole ‘boycott American women’ movement (which is, duh, pretty xenophobic on its face) is pretty much based on them.”
O: Hmm. How would you then explain the movement of Black American Men heading off to Brazil?
“If you don’t see that as racist then I don’t know what the fuck to say to you.”
O: I never said that it wasn’t “racist”; what I said was that they have the right to their preferences and to pursue them, no matter what any of us thinks about it.
Any questions?
O.
O, when you erfer to “Jezebel, Feminist and Feministe,” I assume the second blog you mean is feministing, right? You referred to it several times earlier in this context.
Feministe is mostly Jill. She is indeed white. I think there are a couple of other less frequent contributors who are also white.
I don’t know about Jezebel, though yes the writers I follow there (maybe 3 or 4 people) are white.
But Feministing, well, it isn’t quite as white as you think it is. Go look at the about page:
http://feministing.com/about/
There are 14 women currently on the staff there. They aren’t all white. In fact, whites actually make up less than half the staff. There are 6 whites, 4 blacks, 2 south asians, and 2 east asians.
One of the women on the staff is Zerlina Maxwell. You remember her?
She was in the news a few months back after she got death and rape threats after making some altogether reasonable remarks about rape on Fox news:
http://manboobz.com/2013/03/08/zerlina-maxwell-challenges-rape-culture-on-fox-news-receives-rape-threats-on-twitter/
Feminists rallied around her.
Meanwhile, good old Paul Elam was pounding out an angry screed against her:
http://www.avoiceformen.com/feminism/feminist-lies-feminism/dr-paul-on-men-can-stop-rape/
Oh Christ. I saw ObtuseObsidian pop up in other places. Tedious as FUCK and consistant spammer.
…one instance does not an issue make.
Roe for
Menpeople who produce sperm:The government/authorities/whoever cannot impose restrictions on you removing reproductive material from your own body, right up until the point where it’d able to survive unassisted.
Isn’t that already the situation?
So, Obsidian, your basic position is ‘It’s OK that I hang out with racists, because they have a right to be racist’. Well, whatever floats your boat, I suppose – though I suspect it’ll be a different story once they start being racist towards you personally.
@Kiki:
My whole argument, as it relates to the topic at hand, is
1. I do not deny that there is quite a bit of racism within the Manosphere; indeed I have witnessed it firsthand. Furthermore, I don’t deny for one moment that the Manosphere is overwhelmingly White. Part of my mission is to address this in my own particular way; for example, my blog attracts a sizable Black AND White audience, and my recently launched blog collect project, Just Four Guys, continues in this tradition, where it is common to see participation of Black AND White guys in the comments there.
2. That said, the exact same thing can be said on the (White) Feminist side, and this has a long history that predated the Internet. I mentioned Audrey Lourde for example.
3. I have questioned Dave as to whether Jezebel, Femisting, Feministe, Pandagon, et al, have conducted their own demographic surveys, on the contention that they are likely to be as White, if not Whiter, than the MRA Reddit and other Manosphere venues Dave and others here routinely excoriates.
4. Even taking the blatant racism in the present day Manosphere into account, the stated concerns of MRAs nevertheless have grave import and application to Black Men.
Discuss…
O.
Hmm. How would you then explain the movement of Black American Men heading off to Brazil?
Actually ‘xenophobic’ probably wasn’t the right word to use, because the ‘boycott American women’ assholes like to form idiotic blanket opinions about all women from their own country, rather than another. But if black men are going off to Brazil because they presumably have the idea that Brazilian women are ‘sexy’ or ‘appreciate traditional gender roles’ or whatthefuckever, that would be – guess what? – racist!
But hey, you’ve pretty much just said that you’re cool with racists, so no big,
How the fuck would David know? Go ask those sites. Better yet, there’s a thing called Google, perhaps you could find info that way instead of asking others to do your heavy lifting, which does seem to be your M.O.
Also, I did just point out that most of the 14 staffers (editors and contributors) at Feministing are in fact not white.
I’m kind of busy this morning, but let me just tackle O’s argument that black folks on the whole prefer the flagrant racism of the South to the subtle racism of the North. The three-word rebuttal to that: the Great Migration. Largest internal migration of USians in the country’s history, and it involved black folks leaving the South. I’ve already plugged this book, but to anyone who missed it please read The Warmth of Other Suns if you’re interested in the topic.
Also, I would agree that white women were complicit in the culture that gave rise to lynching black men; I just think they aren’t more complicit and/or responsible than white men.* My argument for feminism has never been that women are better than men. My argument is that women aren’t worse than men, and deserve equal treatment, etc etc.
*Power differentials between men and women at the time complicate this somewhat, so please just see this as a very general statement. It’s a complex subject, and this is a blog for mockery not a peer-reviewed journal. katz is the one running the peer-reviewed journal around here. 😀
Hi Argenti, I don’t comment much but I love manboobz and I think what you are doing is really cool. I think that along with the question about if people feel accepted by their peers it would be cool to have a question asking how accepted you feel by the manboobz community maybe with a one to ten scale and then we could see if people from different demographics eg gender or race feel more or less accepted here?
Obsidiboring is boring. Womb-havers and sperm-havers are different and require different things. Child support does not involve body autonomy or lack thereof so just stop. Just please stop.
In terms of this here poll – Does Hispanic basically just mean Mexican?
Also: ITS SO DAMN HOT IN LONDON IT’S NOT EVEN FUNNY. cough.
daintydougal, no, Histpanic does not not mean Mexican, and implying erases all the different countries and cultures in Latin America.
p.s. to hellkell: I love how many trolls think that you insulting them and telling them to fuck off is an ad hominem. It’s like one of my favorite troll characteristics.
@Briznecko
Gah, I knew that would come across as stupid. I suppose I just meant ‘non European Spanish speakers’, which by the sounds of it is correct?
I blame the heat.
cloudiah: I kind of love it myself.
“Calling me a stupid asshole is a logical fallacy.”
Wasn’t “Roe for Men” the caviar industry’s attempt to market its product as masculine?