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a voice for men actual activism advocacy of violence antifeminism drama kings excusing abuse facebook censoring rape memes the world is ending oh no gross incompetence gullibility hate irony alert misogyny MRA paul elam rape culture rape jokes sexual abuse sexual assault slacktivism the eternal solipsism of the MRA mind

A Voice for Men activates its activists to make asses of themselves over this Facebook thing

For MRAs, driving in circles IS the plan.
For MRAs, driving in circles IS the plan.

So if you’ve ever wondered what sort of activism that Men’s Rights, er, Activists do when they do do activism, take a look at this little ACTION ALERT from A Voice for Men.

You may recall Paul Elam getting all worked up the other day because Facebook, responding to a campaign launched by a coalition of feminist activists and groups, announced it was going to try to do a better job removing “gender-based” hate speech from its site. You know, like this [TRIGGER WARNING] sort of thing.

Naturally, Elam and other MRAs interpreted Facebook’s announcement as the first step in the End of Male Speech on the Internet, or something.

Anyway, now the MRAs are ACTIVATING! AVFM has announced that it’s going after the groups that signed onto the feminist Facebook protest. Because, well, I’m not sure I get why exactly.

Here’s their explanation:

It’s time for action. The AVFM community has scrambled to look beyond the fine print of WAM!’s ultimatum to Facebook and into the signatories. We are finding that some of them are tax-exempt, and even government funded. We now know that government funded institutions have endorsed a harmful double standard that results in the censorship of men.

But, if we discover that even one cent of government money touched WAM!’s campaign, we will be exposing a whole new dimension of hypocrisy.

Uh, ok. I’m just really having a hard time finding the hypocrisy here. If you look at the names of the groups that signed onto the open letter, you’ll find a number of general feminist groups, groups concerned with the representation of women/gender in the media, and groups organized against sexual assault and other forms of violence.

They didn’t sign a petition demanding that all men posting on the internet be banned or, I dunno, kicked in the balls. They signed onto an open letter demanding that Facebook remove

groups, pages and images that explicitly condone or encourage rape or domestic violence or suggest that they are something to laugh or boast about.

That doesn’t seem hypocritical to me. It seems rather in line with what these groups promote.

And the only men who will be censored will be men posting this sort of hateful shit. If women post this sort of shit, they’ll be banned too.

Apparently, AVFM and its “activist” fans are so divorced from reality that they think they’re going to be able to publicly embarrass rape survivor support groups … for standing up against crude, hateful rape jokes on Facebook featuring images of brutalized victims.

Still, at least this sort of surreal, self-defeating activism is better than firebombing courthouses and police stations, as that infamous manifesto posted in AVFM’s activism section so enthusiastically recommends.

EDIT: I forgot the link to the AVFM alert; added it inthe first graf.

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Xen
Xen
8 years ago

Answer fools according to their folly. Are these guys fools or what?

Andrew Johnston
8 years ago

Okay, I see. The MRAs are entering their paranoid phase (“The government’s out to get us!”). It’s only a matter of time before they start accusing each other of being feminist plants, a la the Truthers.

cloudiah
8 years ago

That is such a great cartoon to illustrate this story. Have you been saving that up for just such an event? 😀

They are fractally stupid, activating their flying monkeys to defend the right to make light of rape and intimate partner violence on Facebook.

ec
ec
8 years ago

Just more proof that MRAs care more about hurting women than helping men. If it was the other way around, they’d be campaigning to get images that promote harming men removed, as well. Instead they’re basically admitting that hating women is such an integral part of their movement that banning jokes about raping/beating/killing women would harm their traffic. Do they honestly believe that masking it behind some fake outrage about FREEZE PEACH is going to fool anyone?

@ Andrew Johnson – oh, they do that a fair bit already. There was a troll in one of the recent posts who claimed that everybody on r/mensrights who made unsympathetic comments to a male rape victim was secretly a feminist.

tarnishedsophia
8 years ago

If these guys were really just against policies that are misandric, shouldn’t they try to do something similar like get FB to remove pictures of men/boys getting kicked in the groin or slapped by women? Instead, they get upset that people won’t be able to post disgusting pictures of rape/abuse victims…because it somehow means they are being censored.

Has anyone told them that they’ll only be censored if they post crap like that?

Perry
Perry
8 years ago

MRA’s have shown their true colors. At its core, the movement really is a protest against the fact that they can’t legally abuse women.

coreywrenn
coreywrenn
8 years ago

Gosh, firebombing is one thing, but in that post you were referencing he was advising everyone to go smash the nearest woman’s face into a wall and make her clean up the mess.

auggziliary
auggziliary
8 years ago

I read the pictures that were being posted… What the fuck…
Sometimes me and a few friends do parody rape apologist thinking*, but not like that. There’s nothing satirical in those photos.

*For example, we were once talking about those anti-rape condoms, and we joked about how “Bastard was just asking for it” in the rape apologist tone, since the rapists actually were “asking for it”.

Maude LL
8 years ago

But banning the groups for sex ed and for lactation is just fine, of course.

In any case, their notion of free speech as something that can’t be criticized or removed on private property (such as facebook) is laughable. If facebook decides that allowing group violence against one’s race, sex or gender tarnishes their reputation, that’s up to them (and it’s kind of a no-brainer). I think they’re trying to say that if a petition signatory received government funding, it becomes government “censorship.” I guess political concepts aren’t easy to grasp for everyone.

I dream of a day men’s rights “activists” start working on men’s issues. Their obsession with group hatred of women has become pretty intensively scapegoatey.

MrFancyPants
8 years ago

Poor Paul Elam. Bit by bit, everything he loves is being taken from him.

auggziliary
auggziliary
8 years ago

Honestly I really don’t understand how there are “moderate” MRAs anymore. I have yet to run into an MRA site where they don’t just sit around and say really stupid things about feminism.
Sure you could say that “There are radfems, and there are radical MRAs, not all of us are like that”, but the difference is that the founders and founding websites for the MRAs are… fucking horrible, and I have yet to meet an MRA that tries to stop that shit on there.

auggziliary
auggziliary
8 years ago

Sorry if that was off topic, but I read some article on FreeThoughtBlogs about JudgyBitch defending Jimmy Saville. He criticized her for the obvious reasons, and then said that he wanted her out of the MRA movement. At that point I was like “huh?”, since there’s a lot worse things that come out of the center of the MRA movement…

Shadow
Shadow
8 years ago

@Andrew

The MRAs are entering their paranoid phase

Entering?!!! These dudes can’t enter MRA city without Paranoid Phase passports

cloudiah
8 years ago

It’s not paranoia if the feminazi-controlled govmint really IS out to get you!!!!!!! XD

neuroticbeagle
neuroticbeagle
8 years ago
cloudiah
8 years ago

I apologize for the typo. That should say “guvmint” of course.

Maude LL
8 years ago

@auggz
I’m not sure if I’m misreading you, but are you referring to Avicenna’s blog? He’s a pretty consistent feminist and anti-MRA, with his ‘a voice for me’ posts criticizing AVfM. I read your comment as saying that he’s an MRA kicking her out of the ‘movement’.

But it’s possible that you’re referring to something completely different and that I misunderstood you (I do that sometimes). 🙂

emilybites
8 years ago

Their outrage really is ludicrous. FEMINISTS ARE COMING FOR THEIR POLITICAL MANIFESTOS…sorry, for their HORRIBLE PHOTOS OF DEAD/BEATEN WOMEN WITH EVIL CAPTIONS THAT MAKE LIGHT OF TERRIBLE VIOLENCE!!1!!!

What is freezepeachflavoured about a photo of a badly beaten woman with a lulzy caption? No one is suggesting silencing a political opinion – which a private company is entitled to do, anyway – but while ‘Women should be maimed and killed’ is definitely an opinion, it’s not exactly a political stance.

augochlorella
augochlorella
8 years ago

I’m adoring the car illustration you used here. It makes me really happy.

The Black Fedora
The Black Fedora
8 years ago

@emily

The central issue here is the dishonesty of the feminist lobby. They take a selection of (admittedly disgusting) images that were NOT created by MRA’s but by a group called 4chan. This is not a political organization but a bunch of teenagers out to shock.

The feminists then decide to use these images to suppress the wrong target because MRA’s are making reasoned arguments that some people listen to.

At base it is an admission that the feminists do not have reasoned arguments of their own.

Disgusting.

opium4themasses
opium4themasses
8 years ago

@Maude LL
When there are men’s rightsers who find their way out of the woods and start to fight for the rights of men, they will find most of the feminists were there the whole time.

auggziliary
auggziliary
8 years ago

@Maude LL, Oh… well fuck. Yeah it wasn’t an MRA. In the article it suddenly said something about wanting JudgyBitch out of the MRA movement, however I think I misread, so I assumed that it was some MRA actually calling her out. The comments did also agree with the article but some were using the “alpha/beta” language in a serious manner, so I assumed it was MRA stuff.
Sorry I’ve been struggling reading comprehension lately…

auggziliary
auggziliary
8 years ago

And I’m sad that fedoras are becoming a faux pas thanks to MRAs…

Argenti Aertheri
8 years ago

Um, who, besides the MRM, decided this was about the MRM? The targets of the protest where the groups themselves, they could be created by saints for all it matters. Violating ToS is violating ToS.

The Black Fedora
The Black Fedora
8 years ago

@Argenti

Well this is the implication of writing about it on an anti male rights site is it not?

The Black Fedora
The Black Fedora
8 years ago

@ Argenti

I have already said i support the removal of the images but I wonder if any feminist would support removal of similar material of a feminist flavor?

For me it is all about decency. There is no ‘sex war’.

Argenti Aertheri
8 years ago

Fedora — MRAs decided it was about them and wrote about it on their sites. So, I repeat, who besides them said it was about them?

Oh gods we’ve going to elimate polio, clearly this is an attack on organisms everywhere!

Argenti Aertheri
8 years ago

*does monthly check* 41 cases year to date versus 64 this time last year. Newest cases were mid-May.

auggziliary
auggziliary
8 years ago

@Fedora, Oh my fucking god… David wrote about the MRA’s reaction, you idiot.

What sort of material of “feminist flavor” would be the same as pictures depicting women getting raped???

Radical Parrot
8 years ago

@The Black Fedora:

No. Feminists want the horrible content removed. The MRAs thinks this, like everything else that has happened to anyone anywhere in the history of ever, is all about them. Also, scroll up and keep looking to the right:

Misogyny. I mock it.

I find a lot of it in what’s called the “manosphere,” a loose collection of Men’s Rights, Men Going Their Own Way (MGTOW), and Pickup Artist (PUA) sites. That said, there are numerous posts here that don’t have anything to do with MRAs, or PUAs or any of their ilk.

You’re welcome.

pollydactyl
pollydactyl
8 years ago

@the black fedora
Can you please share some of their reasoned arguments? Also like Argenti said, no one ever said it was about the MRM. They decided it was about them. The MRM basically just admitted that they are all about hurting women rather than helping men.

Argenti Aertheri
8 years ago

I don’t even…would feminists support it if it was a feminist flavor? Let’s assume you meant MRA flavor, and no, feminists don’t support violence so I see no problems here (besides TERfs, but they can go repot a cactus)

Maude LL
8 years ago

@auggz
Yeah, just checking, because I like his blog! When he talks about “western” stuff, he’s not always aware of the language though, because he blogs from India (British-Indian perspective). He was awesome in tackling AVfM trying to associate with Indian MRAs whining about how Indian women are even more privileged and misandric than American women. He showed just what little whining shits they were based on actual evidence.

On topic:
Opium4themasses:
I see your point, we all spend most of our time reading about ‘white knights’ and the oppression of having to pay for dates thinking “that’s what feminist is trying to end, duh.” However, in my little utopia (it’s not going to happen), I think a movement focusing on men to battle gender normativity and the problems these social boxes impose on men specifically would be a good thing. But yes, that’s just a subset of feminist thought/ queer theory.

But first, they’ll have to drop ‘mangina’. 😉

Gametime
8 years ago

Honestly, that MRAs think people calling for the removal of violent images and hate speech is a precursor to the MRM’s pages getting removed is a pretty good indication that there are no “reasonable arguments” to be worried about.

MRAs don’t like the idea of websites banning violent images and hate speech because MRAs truck extensively in violent images and hate speech.

Dvärghundspossen
8 years ago

I think Black Fedora wonders whether we would support a ban on pics making light of MEN getting beaten up and raped. I think that’s what he means by “feminist flavour”. Um, yes, we would.

girlofthegaps
girlofthegaps
8 years ago

Lol, “similar material of a feminist flavor.”

That would be…. what now? Because tbh I can’t really think of anything on par with PICTURES OF DEAD WOMEN WITH TROLLOLOL CAPTIONS that could really be labeled as feminist.

saintnick86
8 years ago

A lot of the “cutesy” misogynistic cartoons that are shared on various pages are as obnoxious as they are offensive. A lot of people like them or even dumb enough to comment – proving they never read a book and listen to too much right-wing talk-radio.

I just unliked a page that had one using a female and male symbols used for restrooms – with one pair having an = between them and the other with a > between. Under the illustrations was “How Men View Equality” and “How Women View Equality”, respectively.

Yeah, ’cause those hundreds of years of women being considered nothing but sex chattel? Lies, all of them. Historians are obviously working for DA MATREEARKEY! Jesus fucking Christ…

Auggie
Auggie
8 years ago

I actually used to think that men getting raped was hilarious before I became a feminist. Then I realized how fucked up that was when someone pointed out that patriarchy can hurt men as well, such as laughing at male rape victims.
(Off topicish)
I think another reason many think male rape isn’t serious is because of homophobia too(and homophobia is related to patriarchy in a sense). Male on male sex is seen as bizarre rather than actual sex. So when a man rapes another man, it’s seen as some prank rather than legit sex.

Dvärghundspossen
8 years ago

I don’t really get misogynistic shit in my Facebook feed, fortunately. What I do get from time to time are women sharing jokes that are degrading towards men. NO ONE I know who’s an explicit feminist does this, ONLY women who aren’t as well-versed in feminism. And I get that it’s a kind of… well, self-defense against patriarchy, to joke about how men are useless and inferior. Still doesn’t make it right. I always call people out on that kind of shit, even though it makes me come out as totally humorless and boring and ruining everyone else’s fun.

Maude LL
8 years ago

Fedora –
The only way your point makes a little bit of sense is if you’re talking about anti-trans feminists (I don’t know if they’d hypothetically support violent transphobic imagery, but their language is quite hateful of transwomen). Not only will you not find any of them here, but they have no power in the mainstream feminist movement. Many mainstream MRA groups are antitrans.

But somehow I assume you’re thinking “Dworkin-Solanas! That character in a Marilyn French novel!” (we all know characters in novels all reflect the authors beliefs and experiences) But hey, if you find ‘feminist approved’ images promoting the rape and physical abuse of men based on their gender, I’d love to see it, so we can organize to denounce them and remove them too.

The most common trope about trivializing the rape of men in society is prison rape (which of course happens to female prisoners too). Incidentally, a lot of MRAs find prison rape to be *hilarious* (John the Otter the latest “famous” MRA I remember to laugh at it). Manboobz brought up the trivialization of prison rape many times, with links to the main organization fighting it.

If you seriously think feminists support gendered violence on men, you’re way down the rabbit hole. You should stop reading the straw feminist hoaxes MRAs keep falling for (the Onion is not a real news site).

On your other point, I won’t be the first to say that this has nothing to do with MRAs, most people have never heard of you guys. The paranoia was born in Elam’s ass after the fact. We are laughing about MRAs thinking it’s about them. It’s not even about men nor women, Facebook decided to be better at banning anyone spreading these images.

Anyway, for what it’s worth, I too am interested in the rational arguments coming from the MRM. Many of us have been looking for that gem for years.

saintnick86
8 years ago

I don’t know how I keep coming across it – even when trying to avoid it as much as possible.

Thankfully, I don’t have the same problem with my female friends on FB. Even if they do make men the butt of the joke – it’s an obviously friendly jest (then again, many of them are admitted feminists to some degree or another). It’s certainly preferable to having to deal with a humorless sexist who thinks a cartoon saying “when men beat women, they’re a monster – when women beat men, they’re brave and heroic” is somehow “hilarious.” Funny that they don’t see to understand any other form of satire or parody. Of course, it NEEDS to involve reveling in self-pity over imagined enemies…

becausescience
becausescience
8 years ago

Since The Black Fedumbass has done nothing but be a disingenous, lying butt-whipe in all his posts, and because his “arguments” are based on things that no one’s even said, and because he’s admitted himself that he’s just here to troll (and desperately try to get a few visitors to his shitty little blogs that nobody reads), I say we should just respond to all his posts with lyrics from 80’s pop songs.

Here, I’ll go first!

For me it is all about decency. There is no ‘sex war’.

Glitter on the mattress
Glitter on the highway
Glitter on the front porch
Glitter on the hallway

– Love Shack: The B-52’s.

saintnick86
8 years ago

Sorry, my comment was a reply to Dvärghundspossen’s. Should’ve specified that.

Fibinachi
Fibinachi
8 years ago

@Black Fedora

I have already said i support the removal of the images but I wonder if any feminist would support removal of similar material of a feminist flavor?

For me it is all about decency. There is no ‘sex war’.

Huh.

Blog:

Just take a look at the relative incomes of men and women under 30 in the UK and the USA.

They are winning.
We are losing.

Hm.

Maude LL
8 years ago

(For the record, I don’t support images of rape and abuse of men “not based on their gender”. The reason I added the gender part is because many will show war images to somehow prove that we support violence against men. Then, in an unrelated post, will rant about women in the military.)

auggziliary
auggziliary
8 years ago

Fibinachi, what is that job thing referring to? Some MRA blog?

cloudiah
8 years ago

cannotfindWMD has figured out our dastardly plan!

The speech policing racket is run by feminists so you won’t be seeing any of that. What you’ll be seeing is all those c*nts from social science actually getting jobs at big social media companies to police language. It’s possibly their master plan. Holy fuck. People need to behave better and soon or they’ll be giving these steady employment, possibly even well paid jobs, instead of having them end up in their rightful place scrubbing floors or similar.

Source: http://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1fj7h5/why_dont_we_just_restrict_that_freedom_of_speech/caasud9

Maude LL
8 years ago

becausescience-
Me-me-me!

@fedora

Previous people always tell me that’s a step too far.
Do you really want to hurt me? Do you really want to make me cry?
I’m prepared to let you go. If it’s love you want from me, then take it away.
Everything is not what you see, it’s over today.

I think this covered most of his argument.

Maude LL
8 years ago

@cloudiah

Yes! The rightful place of women academics with PhD’s is scrubbing floors! Guy on Reddit has figured it out.

We need to adjust our plans. Maybe get post-docs so we can rightfully make Reddit dudes sandwiches?

auggziliary
auggziliary
8 years ago

We need an evil lair. Lets go get pregnant with honest hardworking men and take their child support. The moat and kitty statues will be expensive.

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